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So where is all the cellphone movie footage if we're visited so often?

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posted on Jan, 9 2015 @ 06:26 PM
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a reply to: tanka418

Nice post Tanka.




posted on Jan, 9 2015 @ 06:36 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: tanka418
Again lots of words but you appear to avoid sharing your perception of evidence with regard to aliens and such like.
I am interested to learn what your benchmark standard of evidence is for such claims?


I employ a system based on Bayesian Inference. I demand a very high probability typically greater than 78%, with a confidence level greater than 93%. Its all rather mathematical. the best part is that any of these "hypothesis" may be updated at any time simply by applying new evidence.

But the evidence itself; the can be no "benchmark"...evidence will take what ever form it desires, there is nothing we can do about that except be open and observant.



posted on Jan, 9 2015 @ 06:47 PM
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a reply to: tanka418
Urm...ok


*Edit*
...and your opinion/description of 'evidence' regarding aliens/UFO's is?
edit on 9.1.2015 by grainofsand because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 9 2015 @ 06:52 PM
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a reply to: tanka418

It is testable...in that we can examine the evidence and make intelligent decisions based on a "testable" reality
I like that. We want to test for aliens. So what would you test and how would you test it? Oh, and Happy New Year.



posted on Jan, 9 2015 @ 09:23 PM
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It does seem very strange that in this day of cameras in everyone's shirt pocket, when the cameras are able to record every little thing that happens, why don't we have footage of alien encounters?

My theories are

1) They EMP out all the electronics in the area of the visitations
2) We are so insignificant in the sea of intelligent creatures in the universe, that we're not worth visiting. Also, even the earliest radio waves have barely made it out of our solar system at this point, so what's the likelihood that someone nearby (in universal terms) is at a similar stage of technological development where they'd want to listen?

I don't think it's unlikely that we haven't been visited because there's no life out there, I think it's unlikely because we're so insignificant that why would anyone bother?

After all, if something of insignificance is at the back end of a field a few acres across, we wouldn't even bother to walk over there and check it out.

Why would you go millions of miles to check out an insignificant planet in an insignificant part of a galaxy that's in an insignificant part of the universe, when there is nothing of significance to see once you get there?



posted on Jan, 10 2015 @ 10:46 AM
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originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
a reply to: tanka418

It is testable...in that we can examine the evidence and make intelligent decisions based on a "testable" reality
I like that. We want to test for aliens. So what would you test and how would you test it? Oh, and Happy New Year.



So...you want to test for "Aliens", eh?

So what are the properties f an "alien", and how do you identify them?

You see I don't know the answer t that, neither do you, or any one else...

So...we test for what we know. Those properties that we can identify and understand, and catalog any anomalous results. It is after all the "unidentifiable" we are looking for, so we keep very god "track" and record everything...that is what a database is used for. After some time we can begin to analyze the collected data..."mine" the database.

IF, our research gets this far; there will be may "wondrous" things "pop out of our data (that is the nature of a database) and then we may decide "what" we are really looking at.

My point is that IF we are looking for the "unidentifiable", then we absolutely MUST test virtually everything, since anything can be the evidence we need, and when we "test" we test for everything possible. And, YES! even that old photo from ISS that everyone "thinks" is just a reflection!

When we do this kind of analysis there will be many things that, taken aloe, my have little meaning, but may also add up to something significant IF taken in the proper context. For instance a person with DNA that indicates they aren't related to any other person on Earth...

And then of course; we don't jerk our knee and think we understand something that we have not actually applied our protocols and procedures to...like so many seem to like to do around here. (and I'll be one of the first to admit some degree of "guilt" on this account).



posted on Jan, 10 2015 @ 10:50 AM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: tanka418
Urm...ok


*Edit*
...and your opinion/description of 'evidence' regarding aliens/UFO's is?


Again;

Evidence is ANYTHING that can provide greater understanding of something.



posted on Jan, 10 2015 @ 12:17 PM
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originally posted by: tanka418
Evidence is ANYTHING that can provide greater understanding of something.
Ah I see, thank you. So that would include the testimony of others then, as that's pretty much all we have to go on with aliens/UFO's. All reported crop circles can be reproduced by humans, same with cattle mutilations.
Nobody has presented any UFO parts ever (or let me guess, the men in black silenced them), and touching on your 'person with DNA that indicates they aren't related to any other person on Earth' example, there is no record of such a discovery ever being made. Add to that the lack of multiple footage filmed by the billions of cameras in the world, and a similar lack of #ufoinsky (etc) flurries of tweets by multiple people viewing the same 'event' it would seem your database must have limited data to go on.

I am pleased for you if you are a believer, but while conclusions are drawn solely on witness testimony alone it remains solely a position of belief, belief in the story of other people. I remain unconvinced.

...oh and as an aside, if there is ever an impressive unexplainable multiple sighting of UFO's in the city of a developed nation any time soon then it will be twitter/facebook where you will see it first, not ATS.



posted on Jan, 10 2015 @ 01:48 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: tanka418
Evidence is ANYTHING that can provide greater understanding of something.
Ah I see, thank you. So that would include the testimony of others then, as that's pretty much all we have to go on with aliens/UFO's. All reported crop circles can be reproduced by humans, same with cattle mutilations.
Nobody has presented any UFO parts ever (or let me guess, the men in black silenced them), and touching on your 'person with DNA that indicates they aren't related to any other person on Earth' example, there is no record of such a discovery ever being made. Add to that the lack of multiple footage filmed by the billions of cameras in the world, and a similar lack of #ufoinsky (etc) flurries of tweets by multiple people viewing the same 'event' it would seem your database must have limited data to go on.



Actually, it appears you don't "see", and have misunderstood everything I said...sad!

Though, yes "testimony" of others, or rather reports of empirical observation...
You mention crop circles, yet fail to take into account any of the scientific data that has been reported on them. You continue to think that any crop circle can be created by anyone...quite simply; not true. Are you aware of the cellular changes that sometimes occurs to the crops?

As for my DNA example...I don't believe you would accept or even make note of such an event...though it has actually happened...simply because, like most other real data on the subject, it is "outside" your comfort zone and thus somehow "not real"...kind of like all the other data you ignore.



I am pleased for you if you are a believer, but while conclusions are drawn solely on witness testimony alone it remains solely a position of belief, belief in the story of other people. I remain unconvinced.



Where on Earth did you get; "conclusions are drawn solely on witness testimony alone". There is a vast amount of other data to use. But, you need to understand something; Everything you know is based heavily of "conclusions drawn/based solely on witness testimony alone". Take for example; your "formal' education.




...oh and as an aside, if there is ever an impressive unexplainable multiple sighting of UFO's in the city of a developed nation any time soon then it will be twitter/facebook where you will see it first, not ATS.


Actually there was one; though, back in the 1950's


edit on 10-1-2015 by tanka418 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 10 2015 @ 02:14 PM
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originally posted by: tanka418
Are you aware of the cellular changes that sometimes occurs to the crops?
I'm not aware of any credible scientific research to support your claim.


As for my DNA example...I don't believe you would accept or even make note of such an event...though it has actually happened...simply because, like most other real data on the subject, it is "outside" your comfort zone and thus somehow "not real"...kind of like all the other data you ignore.
So where is all this 'data' you speak of? Youtube? Got a reliable source for this amazing event where someone has been shown to have non-human DNA? I'm excited to be enlightened.


Where on Earth did you get; "conclusions are drawn solely on witness testimony alone". There is a vast amount of other data to use.
What data? Anomalous radar signatures? Dots in the sky?
I am not convinced, and if your claim of 'vast amounts' were so then it would be easy for you to present it here. It would also be easy for me to find it as we have access to exactly the same search engines as each other for our 'research'.



...oh and as an aside, if there is ever an impressive unexplainable multiple sighting of UFO's in the city of a developed nation any time soon then it will be twitter/facebook where you will see it first, not ATS.



Actually there was one; though, back in the 1950's

Wow, only one 'event' in the last 60 odd years, what a pity I wasn't around then. Guess I'll just have to resign myself to reading stories about single individuals claiming events in remote places at night. Lol.
edit on 10.1.2015 by grainofsand because: Typo



posted on Jan, 10 2015 @ 02:19 PM
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a reply to: tanka418

So what are the properties f an "alien", and how do you identify them?

You see I don't know the answer t that, neither do you, or any one else...

Scdfa does



posted on Jan, 10 2015 @ 09:26 PM
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a reply to: grainofsand

What about the videos from Mexico in the 90s?



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 12:51 AM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
I'm not aware of any credible scientific research to support your claim.



Then I submit that either you are not paying attention, or have unreasonable notions about evidence.


So where is all this 'data' you speak of? Youtube? Got a reliable source for this amazing event where someone has been shown to have non-human DNA? I'm excited to be enlightened.


I never said there was "non-human" DNA, I said DNA not related to any Terrestrial...huge difference there slim. Unfortunately you are not ready for this data, and while the old presentation is still available, it is being re-worked with new, supplemental data, we should prolly hold off on presenting it again...



What data? Anomalous radar signatures? Dots in the sky?
I am not convinced, and if your claim of 'vast amounts' were so then it would be easy for you to present it here. It would also be easy for me to find it as we have access to exactly the same search engines as each other for our 'research'.


There can be a wealth of data in "anomalous" radar signatures, seriously, it would probably blow your mind...but, then again; Radar is kind of primitive, so we shouldn't expect too much.

Ya know right here on ATS are some data collections that are in excess of 150 Gig...but, I guess that data isn't up to your artificial standards...I know it isn't up to mine...I demand certain standards in how the data is organized, the kinds of data types used, the overall schema of the dataset...I bet you have no such standards do you ... by the way; these are the only kinds of "standard" you can apply to unknown data.


edit on 11-1-2015 by tanka418 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 07:57 AM
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originally posted by: tanka418
Unfortunately you are not ready for this data

I stopped there and burst out laughing

Not ready for the data? Lol, what, does one need to be an enlightened being or something now? Are you one of the chosen ones? Do I need to be softened up psychologically, or brainwashed a little first before such a fragile human brain as mine can cope with this paradigm shifting data?!
I suggest that you have nothing of substance to support your claims, and I believe that to be so because you curiously refuse to present it here on ATS.
Not ready for the data? ...that's the funniest reason I've heard so far for a believer refusing to present evidence in support of their wild assertions, brilliant.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 08:30 AM
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originally posted by: wjgesq
a reply to: grainofsand

What about the videos from Mexico in the 90s?

They seem to either be debunked or the jury is still out. Either way it appears that 20 years later and with the explosion of camera ownership such events have become rare or non existent. I find that curious.

Here's an ATS thread which discusses the 90's vids you mention: Mexico City UFO footage - 1997...was this officially debunked?



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 11:51 AM
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originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: tanka418
Unfortunately you are not ready for this data

I stopped there and burst out laughing

Not ready for the data? Lol, what, does one need to be an enlightened being or something now? Are you one of the chosen ones? Do I need to be softened up psychologically, or brainwashed a little first before such a fragile human brain as mine can cope with this paradigm shifting data?!


Well, first of all; that was probably a bit ill-advised...however;

I feel I must stand by the "not ready" comment. You would need to have a bit more education, and more importantly, an appreciation for scientific procedure, protocol, and data analysis. At present, you seem to lack the required skills to properly analyze data that is clearly outside you areas of knowledge.

Seriously man, what will you say when all I do is post a bunch of numbers?

Are you truly ready for something like that? What will you say when I state the "probability" is "X" or "Y"? I'd bet the farm you would cry foul at the very first hint of that kind of evidence, yet, it is and would remain the best you can get.

So...no...not yet; I'm thinking of releasing that data soon anyway, in a bit easier format for y'all to understand. So, you can just be a bit patient.

Also; do you know the difference between a "believer" and an "experiencer"? You should learn that difference, its very important. Because you see...I'm not a "believer", I am an experiencer; One who has experienced these things a bit more "first hand" that most would find comfortable. I understand that you will not accept my account, and that is actually your problem...I kind of feel sorry for those who can not accept empirical observation as valid data...you do know what "empirical observation" is right? The foundation of modern science.


edit on 11-1-2015 by tanka418 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 12:20 PM
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originally posted by: tanka418
I feel I must stand by the "not ready" comment. You would need to have a bit more education, and more importantly, an appreciation for scientific procedure, protocol, and data analysis.
I hold a Bsc in Environmental Chemistry, apologies, I didn't take the optional aliens module.

At present, you seem to lack the required skills to properly analyze data, that is clearly outside you areas of knowledge.
I've Googled the same as you have. You do not have access to a repository of information related to aliens/UFO's. It is rather premature of you to make assertions about my skill level or ability to analyze data when you have no knowledge of my life experiences or education.


Seriously man, what will you say when all I do is post a bunch of numbers?
I will ask you what the numbers represent and then look critically at your claims. Isn't that obvious?


Are you truly ready for something like that?
Of course, why wouldn't I be? Are you special or something, perhaps a beautiful and unique academic snowflake who alone can understand your data?


What will you say when I state the "probability" is "X" or "Y"? I'd bet the farm you would cry foul at the very first hint of that kind of evidence, yet, it is and would remain the best you can get.
I would look critically at the case you present and also at the sources of your data. That is surely the logical course of action.


So...no...not yet; I'm thinking of releasing that data soon anyway, in a bit easier format for y'all to understand. So, you can just be a bit patient.
I look forward to scrutinising it.


Also; do you know the difference between a "believer" and an "experiencer"? You should learn that difference, its very important. Because you see...I'm not a "believer", I am an experiencer; One who has experienced these things a bit more "first hand" that most would find comfortable.
You believe you experienced it. That is your perception.


I understand that you will not accept my account, and that is actually our problem...I kind of feel sorry for those who can not accept empirical observation as valid data
Your claims with no supporting evidence is not valid data.

...you do know what "empirical observation" is right? The foundation of modern science.
Of course, but your unsubstantiated assertions and refusal to provide a scrap of evidence aside from "I have data" is rather telling, so no I do not regard your claims as empirical evidence.

...now do you want to share your data/evidence/whatever to support your assertions, or continue sidetracking with "You are not ready for the data" Lol.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 07:10 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
I hold a Bsc in Environmental Chemistry, apologies, I didn't take the optional aliens module.


So not much math or data sciences then...


I've Googled the same as you have. You do not have access to a repository of information related to aliens/UFO's. It is rather premature of you to make assertions about my skill level or ability to analyze data when you have no knowledge of my life experiences or education.



Yes it is a bit premature to make assertions about your education and experience; however, from the way you talk, the manner in which you seem to regard this data, it seems save to conclude that you have some serious issues with this kind of data. You appear to make assumptions that are not valid, and from what I've seem are almost quantum leaps without ever investigating the reality of the events/objects.





I will ask you what the numbers represent and then look critically at your claims. Isn't that obvious?



No actually it seems more likely that you are prejudiced toward what ever data is presented. The antagonistic pragma is not in any way warranted here, and is more likely counter productive.



You believe you experienced it. That is your perception.


Is your education just your "perception"? Just as that was a real experience for you, the events of my experiences were also real. They had real physical effects at the time not only upon my person, but on my environment as well.

Anyway, enough of this foolishness. I find your ideas, concepts, and attitudes toward data to be rather counterproductive, error prone, and conducive to allowing One to lie to themselves about the reality of the Universe. We shall just have to disagree about the essential nature of the All, and let time sort things out.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 07:22 PM
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a reply to: grainofsand

Here is a bit of video you probably missed...both in the seeing, and in the understanding.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

This thread talks about an UFO seen on ISS cameras. As with most stuff from ISS many thought "reflection", others thought "ice crystals", and some even thought ET.

Now, here is WHY you don't ignore evidence because it doesn't meet your standards...This video shows a unique event, and until now hasn't been done. This video was the launch of a small satellite, and was perhaps one of the coolest things I've witnessed recently.

Just saying; you can't dismiss evidence until you evaluate it!



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 11:33 PM
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a reply to: grainofsand




...oh and as an aside, if there is ever an impressive unexplainable multiple sighting of UFO's in the city of a developed nation any time soon then it will be twitter/facebook where you will see it first, not ATS.



Actually, you saw it first in the Washington Post and the New York Times, because it already happened, in the city of Washington D.C., which I believe is in a developed nation, is it not? A fleet of flying saucers (alliteration!) hovered over the white house for three days. It was witnessed by thousands and reported across the country.

No need to tweet it.




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