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How do YOU deal with skeptics?

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posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 11:14 AM
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I'm a believer in the idea that we have been visited by intelligent extra terrestrial beings (or EBEs) for thousands of years, if not more. I also believe that our governments have already made contact with these beings and are possibly working together trading humans (alien abductions) for advanced tech. I feel that there is enough evidence of this out there from credible sources (see www.disclosureproject.org...) that should convince any semi-intelligent person to atleast begin to believe there's "something" unexplainable going on be it aliens from another world or not. As a matter of fact i believe we as humans have that already, but it's all being held away from the public. It all seems like it's right there in front of us, only thing we're lacking is an official disclosure or hard solid evidence for undeniable proof. Not to mention the government probably has agencies dedicated to making sure their policy of plausible denial lives out and that UFO witnesses and researchers that come close to being able to prove anything are destroyed and/or discredited.

What really urks me though is the hard core skeptics that refuse to believe anything of the sort. Be it that it goes against their religion to believe, it just doesnt make sense to them at all, or that they just fear believing it to be truth. I think the majority of skeptics fall into the later category. I as an individual am a person not afraid to discuss what's on my mind in front of anyone, even the subject of UFOs and aliens. Just so happens that it's for the most part in front of a skeptics in an attempt to raise awareness of the potential conspiracy the government has been hiding from us...or just because it interests me and i enjoy discussions on the matter. On a regular basis i get laughed at, ridiculed and made fun of. I know there's a lot of people that frequent this forum that probably experience and feel the same things as i do and i was wondering how do you deal with it all. Do you think it's best to just not discuss this sort of thing with known skeptics? Or do you think the subject is important enough to try to convert skeptics into believers. It gets frsutrating, it almost seems as though these skeptics wouldnt believe anything even if they did indeed have proof.




posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 11:19 AM
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Just let them....
They are not at the same level as you are...just "choose" to whom to talk about subjects like that, it really hurt to be laugh at, I know



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 11:30 AM
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Originally posted by Amelia
Just let them....
They are not at the same level as you are...just "choose" to whom to talk about subjects like that, it really hurt to be laugh at, I know


well, i do not agree with that, its not about being on "different levels". When it comes to aliens, i am skeptical on some of the alien information. The stories during the BC times are interesting because it makes you think maybe we were visited, especially the find in the indus valley that shows signs of nuclear fallout during the BC times. At this current moment in time, i dont think aliens are visiting us.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 11:33 AM
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Do you think it's best to just not discuss this sort of thing with known skeptics?


No. It should be discussed. It's important.

I don't think "convert" is a good word though.

Instead, just make sure they are aware of the evidence for it, show them the evidence, and let them continue to decide for themselves. Eventually, they'll logically conclude that there is something to all of this...once they see the one thing that really makes it all "click" together for them.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 11:37 AM
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I can't tell you how I deal with skeptics, because I don't often get into arguments with them.

But I do know that they are pretty easy to deal with, once you learn their dirty little secret. They are so tied into this "logic" and "evidence" and "data" thing that all yhou have to do is to give them the hard evidence of UFO visitation (don't waste you time on fuzzy photo fakes, but the real evidence) and they will fold like a cheap suit.

That's all you need. To shut up a skeptic, just show him evidence. It works every time!



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 11:53 AM
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How do I deal with skeptics?

1. I probe them to see if they are open-minded about the issue they are skeptical about, if they are not. I ignore them. There are more productive ways to spend your time and energy; like talking to a wall.

2. If they are open-minded, I then probe them to see if they can intelligently deal with the data, if they cannot, I will try and reason, but if they are beyond reason. I ignore them.

3. If they can intelligently deal with the data, I then probe them to see if they can arrive at the logical and reasonable conclusion, if they cannot, I will try and reason, and continue trying as there is some hope yet, but if all fails. I ignore them.

Generally I just ignore them. I rarely meet skeptics that reach stage 3. Most skeptics, and one has replied in this topic, are at stage 1.

[edit on 13-12-2004 by Indigo_Child]



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 11:56 AM
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As a skeptic, I'll offer my opinion and my advice.

When talking to folks like me stay calm, coherent, and sane. Seriously. Most of the folks we deal with who are proponents of alien contact are, well, nuts. Not "I believe something off of the mainstream" nuts, but Francis E. Dec Esquire crazy. So keep your cool, and understand that at least part of our skepticism comes from dealing with folks like that before. Remember that if we're willing to discuss it with you, we're at least open to the idea.

Second, don't take the skepticism personally. I've seen a lot of people, here and elsewhere, get quite agitated when questions about their theory are raised. We're not saying that you're a bad person for believing what you do, but that we see some flaws. Sometimes these "flaws" are simply concepts that you've been exposed to for so long that you take for granted, but are new to other people (Think "Dulce." Most people interested in alien contact will at least have heard the name, but it's very far outside the mainstream.). In this case, the questions aren't even a real flaw in your theory, just in its presentation.

Third, to be honest there are a lot of scam artists out there just waiting to take advantage of your hopes. Some prey on those who are looking to make a fast buck (Nigerian money scam, anyone?), others on your need for personal contact (many of the scams targeting the elderly), and others on your need for a more exciting world (aliens/end-of-the-world/etc). This doesn't mean that all people promoting, for example, theories of alien contact are scammers, just that it isn't safe to initially assume the're legit.

To take this out of the context of ATS a bit, to hopefully take some of the emotion out: I'm a martial artist. I've been so for almost 2 decades now. Still, every time I move and look for a new school I approach every school with a very skeptical eye. If you've ever looked into martial arts, you'll have noticed that there's a lot of people out there promising a lot of things, and they can't all have the One Perfect Ancient Revealed Martial Art™. Most of them, in fact, are full crap. My skepticism is a tool to cut through the BS and to find a good school.

In the same way, I have skepticism for anyone making grand claims. I'm not unwilling to believe what you have to say, I'm just unwilling to throw everything away on the hope that, this time, you've got the Truth™.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 12:13 PM
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Show evidence, what evidence?



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 12:14 PM
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Gazrok, i agree debating the topic with evidence is definitely the best bet...and i have gotten some skeptics to second guess what they previously believed but it just happens to be that i end up running into a lot of as Indigo_Child said "level 3 skeptics".

Off_The_Street, yeah seems like skeptics always go back to the logic thing. What i mostly hear from logical skeptics is that while they think the universe is infinitely vast and it's indeed almost mathematically impossible that Earth is the only world sustaining life, it's hard to believe intelligent alien beings have travelled and visited Earth of all places. They just dont think we're lucky mathematically.

Also, like Whiskey Jack noted about the scam artists. Yeah, there's a sh1t load of them out there and they really ruin it for the credible sources of information on the phenomena. Because the majority of cases do turn out to be bogus it makes people not bother investigating the cases that truly deserve attention, this really irritates me and adds fuel to the skeptic's arguements. Shame on them.

Some good advice here though. From your replies i have started to lean towards wanting to ignore the skeptics that are not open minded to discussion at all. Before i would be persistant but now i'm learning to not be as much. There's only so much you can do after presenting them with all the credible evidence you can muster up and they still wont even hear it.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 12:19 PM
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Why is the word skeptic being thrown around like it is a bad thing? I personally would rather be the extreme skeptic than the extreme believer.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 12:39 PM
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I'm sorry if i'm not wording this right Jonna. I dont think there's anything wrong with being skeptic...as long as you're open to the ideas presented to you if they're backed by credible evidence. It's when i present credible evidence in a discussion and still get laughed at is when i get annoyed by skeptics, or if there is no other easy way to explain what's being discussed and still get the same old "dust on the lens" or "ball lighting" or "camera zoom function glitch". If anything it's healthy to be skeptical at first. I too am skeptical when i first hear a new story about an unexplainable sighting or encounter, but after reading two or more credible sources on the story and hearing multiple witness accounts i have to start assuming something else is going on. Not that i automatically believe it's aliens, but that it's something we dont understand but need to. I never jump straight to the explanation being super natural, only when all scientific explantions have been exhausted do i consider it to be something extraordinary. It's quite arrogant to assume we as humans have all the answers about everything that goes on, some things are out of our realm of knowledge and need to be investigated. These ways of approaching unexplainable phenomena seem to make the most sense to me and all too often do i see people not using them and just writing them off as bogus or natural behaviors in nature.

[edit on 13/12/04 by Meteor_of_War]



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 12:45 PM
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Pictures or video...
I'm always skeptical of those...

But the countless stories thru the ages is whats interesting.
Artwork from the past showing things that was rumored in the 50s.

That'll make you think... but then again... I always look for something
if possible to support what I know... if not... I'll let it float.

Then again... most people dont belive something if they dont see if...



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 02:04 PM
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Most skeptics, and one has replied in this topic, are at stage 1.


Don't go there, or I'll bring up Billy "Ray Gun"...



Show evidence, what evidence?


How many times must we go over this lesson?

EVIDENCE is NOT the same thing as PROOF

We have PLENTY of evidence, as we've already gone over in another thread (photos, video, gun camera footage, government documents, alleged government documents, eyewitness testimony, expert eyewitness testimony, etc.)

We don't have PROOF, but to say "what evidence?" shows an unwillingness to look at what's there....



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 02:13 PM
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Hmm...i think Frosty's post portrays a perfect example of the kind of skepticism i've been dealing with lately.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 02:18 PM
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Now, to say there is not other civilizations out in the vastness of space is truley Ignorant, but The idea of them traveling here to probe us thats a whole different story! There are some aspects of abduction cases and sightings that can be explained but there are a few that they cant debunk. But iam not gonna rant and rave on this subject "b/c frankley my dear i just dont give a damn"


[edit on 13-12-2004 by PanzerDiv]



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 02:33 PM
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Would you really want everybody to think aliens existed?

All that'd mean is that later down the road, you won't get to say "HaHa, told you so!"



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 03:26 PM
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If you believe it, and the other person is willing to listen, then keep talking about it.
I do the same thing with the Jehovah's witnesses who talk to me, trying to show them my reasons for being an atheist.

And no, I do not believe in what you say about the abductions, etc.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 03:53 PM
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Generally when I come across someone who is sceptical of an idea that I am a proponent or supporter of I try to listen to their reasons for scepticism and see if their reasons are enough to make me sceptical. I also try to explain my position or conclusions as best i can and see if they will process the information correctly or if they find any of it interesting.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 04:13 PM
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If they are willing to debate the the Issue, then I shal ldo so with them, and reach some sort of agreeable conclusion. If they are not, I shall just let them have their beleifs.

Showing them firm evidence would be great. But if I ever got firm evidence I would take it to all the news networks over here and post it up on ATS first thing. The world should know if we ever get any. Then all the cover-ups will (hopefully) be show to us and the truth shall emerge. Or i'll get kidnapped, one of the two.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 04:33 PM
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In most cases skeptics are those who have made their minds up from limited sources and won't even look at the evidence or proof that continues to come in. They have a tendency to blow off the whole idea and call those who have seen or been abducted, crazy people or frauds.

Personally, I think the skeptics and the believers are right. Yes both are right, this is a conspiracy inside another conspiracy. I can say there are alien abductions taking place and also say there are no aliens visiting us. Isn't it a contradiction to say both, most may think so, but it's not because most don't see what the "aliens" really are.

So everyone is right and everyone is wrong. You guys just need to find the truth.

Deny Ignorance

Ycon



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