The Case for Reforming Criminal Background Checks for Employment

How do all the people that dont make bad choices in life succeed?

I and all my peer group have clean records and we are all doing well , i mean how is that possible if those with records are harder workers then us with clean records?

I see nothing wrong with giving someone a second chance if they earn that second chance.

Just because someone gets arrested because they were driving drunk then 2 months later gets arrested for stealing from a store isn't doing anything to earn their second chance. Now in comparison someone that 10 years ago got arrested and hasn't done anything since then and has shown they have tried to turn their lives around has earned that second chance i think.

No one held your, not directed at anyone specific, hand to the fire and said "be a selfish fool and drive drunk" You made that choice and while I think you deserve every right to a second chance it just shouldn't be given but rather earned.

a reply to: onequestion

Actually I directly referenced the OP, and background checks in general. And business in general. And rights of business owners. And employment of felons. Hiring practices. Second chances. All of which pertain to the OP.

You can't post an opinion, ask a question, respond to some opinions (with your own opinion), then tell other people who's opinion you don't like that they can't comment. Sort of defeats the whole idea of discourse.

I understand both sides. Obviously some jobs require very strict checks. It used to be just felonies, now every little thing disqualifies you. I threw my ex out of the house for having an affair. I ended up with misdemeanors. Many warehouses won't even take misdemeanors. I think it is ridiculous and shouldn't be one blanket policy. There are many great workers stuck in cr@p jobs, but I guess that is those employers loses.

My personal favorite of all of this, is the credit check.


WTF does does my personal credit history have to do with a potential employer making a decision based on whether or not they want to hire me to perform a service for them?

Do they really give two flying craps about the fact that both of my two divorces caused me to go into bankruptcy, or have had IRS problems as a result? What right is it of theirs to determine employment suitability based off of such facts? Does having a bad credit history mean I'd be somehow unable to perform at a satisfactory or above level in my area of expertise?

If anything, getting and holding a job would be my priority so as to clean such things up.

Wouldn't that make me a potentially BETTER employee?


- NF

You will be surprised if/when the labor pool dries up what companies will be willing to overlook.

Second, third, etc chances will abound.

Still....it is their business who they choose to hire.....within Federal and State hiring laws that is

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Shamrock6
God forbid we give people a second chance.

What about the people who have done no harm to anyone else? You want to put the people who play by the rules on the same playing field with those who have cheated in life? Those people stepped on and abused other people in a mad dash to get ahead, and thus put those people behind, there is no justice for those who are victimizer when the victimized gets the same chance as them in life. If you want that, we are no different than cavemen. Civilization has rules for a reason.

a reply to: chuck258

Worst perspective ive read in forever.

Forever.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Shamrock6
God forbid we give people a second chance.

The system must remain rigid beyond what is humanly
possible. If we allow people to serve thier sentence and
then take the path of the straight and narrow. That might
be seen as a crack in the concrete damn, so to speak. Why
that might even pave the way to provisions in car and home
loans. Banks can't allow people to be human beings instead of
robotic slaves to the roof over thier head until they die.

The fact is there is something terribly wrong with this world!
Isn't there!

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: liejunkie01

Before I tear your position and post apart let me ask a question that is anecdotal.

How did you support yourself through college for two years?

When I get home I'll finish my response.

I worked nights at the job where I worked for 12 years. Work nights and school 5 days a week for two years. Welding Technologies.

I took advantage of the Pell grants and one student loan.

I am still schooling at college two nights a week. I get up and leave my house at 5:30 am and two nights a week I do not get home until 10:30 pm. HVAC and sheetmetal.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: chuck258

Worst perspective ive read in forever.

Forever.

Let me elaborate more on my viewpoint. I do not believe felons should be given a free pass, even out of prison. They were put in prison because stepped on other people and decided they weren't going to play by the rules and likely got ahead because of it. If a person saves up for 3, 4 months for that TV or Xbox then why can't the same person who steals it immediately afterwards do the same? Them deciding to once again set that Xbox and TV owner back who worked so hard to get it and getting ahead at the expense of another citizen has used up his second chance. Prison is his punishment, his debt to society is repayed by him being removed from the first pool of applicants that is full of honest hard working decent people who have decided to play by the rules for the better of civilized society. We have already seen by multiple accounts of users on this very topic of felons who have managed to set their lives straight. It would not be hard for a felon to serve his sentence, Then, in combination with out a background check simply lie about what he has been doing for the last 5 years. Then bam, you have a person who completely ruined another's persons hard work, gotten ahead dishonestly because of it, got room and board for 5 years and now you want him to get out as if nothing happened? What?!

The only compromise I might give is if after maybe 5 years or so that NON felony crimes be ommited from background checks, maybe things like drunk in public, disorderly conduct or simple assault coming from a night of drinking. But when you commit a crime that is of the felonious nature, well, they are called felonies for a reason.

So next time, how about you elaborate on your viewpoint instead of just bashing mine. True debate might not be your strong suit, but just like the felonshere who have managed to get themselves straight, I'm sure if you give it some effort you can too.

a reply to: onequestion

Yep it's a big problem. So are things like Manpower and those dumb job places that basically steal from you.

Even a couple of non-traffic citations can get in the way of getting a job. It's pretty ridiculous.

Sounds like these people should get a good criminal defense lawyer like Anthony Cotton ^_^

a reply to: rukia

Oh god dont even get me started on staffing agencies and illegal immigration impact on construction.

There is really no such thing as reformation or second chances in most places of employment. They see that box checked YES to the question: "Have you ever been convicted of a felony?" and your application or resume is filed rigfht into the trash.
And they wonder why recidivism is so high...

What choice does a person have?
You tell them to stop breaking the law, find a living honestly, then most places dont hire felons, and alot of states like Florida, do NOT ALLOW felons to even hold a professional license.

What choice does a person have?

The number of people on high horses in this thread is absolutely staggering. You paint those with a checkered past with such a broad stroke, and don't understand that good people do make mistakes. By that logic, do you believe they deserve to be hounded for the rest of their lives over something like that?

I want to go on record here as having said that certain crimes should have a longer shadow than others, but by no means should these individuals be "S.O.L." for the rest of their lives.

Also, I don't believe anyone should be "forced" to do anything, it is their business and they have the right to run it the way they want, so be it. But that doesn't make it right. You can't really look at someone on paper, no matter where the paper came from, and decide you know everything there is to know about them.

a reply to: phinubian

I think that background checks and CREDIT CHECKS although there is a logic for having them, do not in themselves deter or fully help identify the risks of hiring certain individuals that might cause harm to a company, it has been proven that just as many people that pass these very checks cause damage, it's been proven by security clearance as well when you look at some of the spies at the highest levels that have have betrayed their position, agency and country.

It's easy to keep check on ex-offenders or re-offenders due to their documented history. But I always say it's the ones whom haven't got a record they ought to be watching more closely - amongst them are the really clever ones that have no documented offending history because they have never been caught.

originally posted by: QuantumEcho
The number of people on high horses in this thread is absolutely staggering. You paint those with a checkered past with such a broad stroke, and don't understand that good people do make mistakes. By that logic, do you believe they deserve to be hounded for the rest of their lives over something like that?

I want to go on record here as having said that certain crimes should have a longer shadow than others, but by no means should these individuals be "S.O.L." for the rest of their lives.

Also, I don't believe anyone should be "forced" to do anything, it is their business and they have the right to run it the way they want, so be it. But that doesn't make it right. You can't really look at someone on paper, no matter where the paper came from, and decide you know everything there is to know about them.

Completely agree.

The ignorance of people is astounding.

a reply to: QuantumEcho

Good people do make mistakes. It's not a business owner's responsibility to make things right for them, though. A poor decision on one person's behalf doesn't shift responsibility to rectify that to somebody else.

Maybe a business owner has passed up good people who are willing to work hard for them because of their past. That's the business owner's prerogative.

I don't think it would be fair to business owner's to apply the broad brush the other direction and say they're not allowed to look at the background of whomever has applied for a job with them. Not all convicts are scum of the earth. I, for one, get that. But I don't think its fair to force business owners to ignore anything that a person doesn't tell them in an interview or on the application.

I wonder how many with felonies, not misdemeanors, have degrees, or even GEDs for that matter.

I honestly dont believe there are many college grads with felonies, sure there are a few but not many.

Employers want to know who they're hiring, I dont blame them. You could be as smart as they come, but if you're a proven thief, well....

a reply to: oldetimehockey4

honestly dont believe there are many college grads with felonies, sure there are a few but not many.

I honestly don't believe you are serious, are you?

If you are than you seriously need to take a step down from that pedestal of yours and educate yourself, outside of the little bubble you have created.

originally posted by: oldetimehockey4
I wonder how many with felonies, not misdemeanors, have degrees, or even GEDs for that matter.

I honestly dont believe there are many college grads with felonies, sure there are a few but not many.

Employers want to know who they're hiring, I dont blame them. You could be as smart as they come, but if you're a proven thief, well....

I check this thread for comments like this when i need a good laugh.

I think whats happening is that all of the fluoride, cow products, and sugar just crush human brain power.