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''The matrix of all matter'' - Reality or Fantasy?

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posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 08:44 PM
Please bear with me for a moment while I explain my perspective,
before I ask you a question.

I know it is easy to use ''god'' as an explanation for the mysteries that surround us, for the things we do not understand, but the deeper I delve into our so called fabric of existence, the more I start to see the possibility of consciousness being the predominant factor in our universe as a viable answer to the bigger questions.

Although I have always been an agnostic atheist, I now find myself being drawn towards pantheism, not by bibles or new age gurus, but by looking at science and nature.

Maybe atoms, molecules, abiogenesis and evolution are not the cause of life, maybe they are a means, because one could say that these things seem to be driven by an intelligent force.

Now this could simply be wishful thinking, helping me to deal with my perhaps meaningless existence and my inevitable death, but how could it all be nothing more than a random occurrence, and still hold so much intricate beauty, defying entropy? How could nature be so full of mathematics and geometry?

''All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter.'' - Max Planck

''I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness.'' - Max Planck

''My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.'' - Albert Einstein

''Every one who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe, a spirit vastly superior to that of man, and one in the face of which we with our modest powers must feel humble.'' - Albert Einstein

''There is something very real and mysterious, which we all call God, but the images of God we all hold are different and inadequate.'' – Carl Jung

''One could build a very strong case for the plausibility of the existence of God on purely rational grounds.'' – Francis Collins

"I find it as difficult to understand a scientist who does not acknowledge the presence of a superior rationality behind the existence of the universe as it is to comprehend a theologian who would deny the advances of science." - Wernher Von Braun

"A commonsense interpretation of the facts suggests that a superintellect has monkeyed with physics, as well as with chemistry and biology. The numbers one calculates from the facts seem to me so overwhelming as to put this conclusion almost beyond question." – Fred Hoyle

''I was fortunate enough to recognize, via quantum physics, that all the paradoxes of this field could be solved once we take into account consciousness as the basis for all existence. I recognized that consciousness is the primary form of reality. A higher reality exists over our material cosmos which consists of consciousness energy.'' – Amit Goswami

''The goal of physics we believe is to find an equation perhaps no more than one inch long which will allow us to unify all the forces of nature and allow us to read the mind of God.'' – Michio Kaku

So what seems more likely? Chance or design?

edit on 23-12-2014 by Skaffa because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 08:50 PM
a reply to: Skaffa

Umm, both chance and design.

Nothing is wasted.

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 09:01 PM
I read your post S&F .. I would like to pass on a small book in PDF for you to delve into if you choose .Briefly what it shows is some of the basic numbers we see in nature ,. The author describes this as brush marks of God in his creation .It's basic structure and even some of the meanings we can get from understanding it .ie. the number 9 is the final number so no matter what you multiply it by your answer will always add up to 9 ,, But after going through the numbers in nature he goes into the numbers in scripture .He shows these numbers on the service ie. 13 bad kings and 7 good kings . He then goes into the geametria of the letters and words used in both the new and old testaments .ie the word for amen in both greek and hebrew has a geametria of 999 . enjoy a reply to: Skaffa

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 10:41 PM

originally posted by: chr0naut
a reply to: Skaffa

Umm, both chance and design.

Nothing is wasted.

Now there is truth for you.
Put that in the ole mental recorder.

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 10:57 PM
This may sound contrived and obtuse but a lot of my beliefs stem from mathematics and geometry, I care not to go into great depths regarding my beliefs but only will follow upon you findings. There is a creationist. Whether it be a spirit of some sort or something else, there is. By something else, it could mearly be something as simple as sound. Vibration is caused by waves, light travels in waves, economy flows and ebbs, nearly everything comes and goes in waves. Obviously in our dimension they are 3-dimensional waves, but they could readily expand beyond that. By studying cymatics, it is easy and visibly shown that sound and nature form life, a geometrical pattern. I myself have the flower of life tattooed on my body for my own reasons.

In one of my "distorted" yet to be concluded by "scientists" beliefs, sound and vibration were the driving forces that created the entire universe. Imagine the Big Bang and the sound that would be produced. People say that sound is unheard in a vacuum. Ok, well space is not a vacuum, there are particles, olecules, and matter that exist within this absence of oxygen that can transmute information. The first lines of Genesis kind of plays into it.

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

From this, it is simple to see that sound and vibration of God's command existed before even light. Even thought before light. Light travels faster than sound. But i believe, that sound must have laid construct to the vibrational cosmos before anything can exist. There must be a form present to allow light to exist. The simple creation a vibrational field allowed all other matter to exist, which is why all matter has it's own vibration. All matter has it's own sound, it's own music if you will. Music is one of the greatest artforms still explored by our existence, above visual pictures, music and sound are seen as more important and everlasting. TV and Cinema would be nothing with out the sound that accompanys them, however, Bach, Mozart, bethoven, The Beatles, Pink Floyd, etc can inspire images out of nothing with only sound. Sound creates life, it's own vibration. Vibration even effects the way water forms into snow crystals, effects the way a brain functions, effects memory, etc. Sound is a field that exists beyond us, almost another diesion among us, and the waves that carry among it are able to give and alter life. i can elaborate if asked, start a thread if necessary, but for the sake of this, I end on this minor note.

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 10:57 PM
a reply to: Skaffa

Could one lead to another?

Could design lead to chance? Aka giving those created free will
Could Chance lead to Design? Such as but not limited to, maybe the first thing ever created that was "live" is what we know as God, Brahman, or whatever you want to call the highest superior being.

I always had an odd thought about the second one, because if God was the Wisest wouldn't he have been around the longest?
Everyone's heard that argument, "Well if God created everyone, who created God?" That's why I always like to juggle around the idea of chance leading to design.

I doubt anyone will truly know until they die

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 11:02 PM
a reply to: iDope

Vibrations play a massive part in the possibilities of the Universe

What if the Universe is just a really big tuning fork, enciphering why vibrations have such a large impact upon everything

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 11:14 PM
a reply to: AudioGhost

it very well could be, sound determines emotions, the patterns of sand and water and molecules. I'm sure each Terrrestrial planet compared to the Gaseous planets has their own vibrational form, and only certain ones are able to "sustain" certain types of lifeforms. But the question I have yet to answer, whom or what allows the tuning fork to keep vibrating? And what I was trying to get at, was that how Einstein suspected that gravity dips around large masses like planets and stars, why couldn't this field of "empty" space be constructed by vibrations? The entire Universe has sound, each planet their own no matter what gasses make up their atmosphere. It's hard for me to explain readily in the mental state I am in, but more or less, space was constructed out of sound, and the "Aum" "Ohm" or "Hum" as always existed in the background, a way to transmute sound, light, life, distance, thought, etc. It's like a higher dimensional consturct that formed the space we exist in, and on this planet Earth, we have used countless instruments and voice to become "intune" with our own vibrations in which we can produce, and yet we do not know ourselves. Much like we know more about our moon and Mars than we do our own ocenas.

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 11:25 PM
a reply to: iDope

Gravity is very weak and doesn't make much sense, that's what I've read from Michio Kaku, keeping physicists from making a unified theory; if there is one at all. The sun makes low vibrational sounds but they don't reach out that far. Gravity, solar systems, hold together like disks (if their are other types then I stand corrected) Maybe Gravity is the holder of the tuning fork, without gravity there would be no base, no foundation. Keeping all of the material in line would create opportunities for the fork to vibrate and create.
edit on PM00000023282014231120143431 by AudioGhost because: forgotten word

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 11:49 PM

So what seems more likely? Chance or design?

From my point of view and a theory some of us seem to be working on.

Depends on if the change was designed from the beginning or if it evolved thru space time.

Lets assume that there is a probability field existing around us that controls where all quanta (particles) will exist and that all quanta is energy in one form or another. This field can change in location and space time and should be monitored like you monitor and measure earth weather or space weather.

I will give you two example of where humanity has observed the field. The quantum slit experiment that is a experiment that measures the current probability field at that specific place and time.
Carl Jung seeing the quantum reality of the probability field on the conscious level. Seeing the glitch in the matrix who is controlling the reality around us.

You can play around with the field if you want to. Creating a cause and effect entanglement is possible even with just the body and the conscious bending the field to create a synchronicity to send information to another place in space time by storing and releasing energy in the body that will effect the field. Storing energy or increasing the energy flow thru the body will sometimes be referred as vibrating the body on a higher level of awareness since the body feels like it is moving (due to the energy pulsating) even when you seem to be still to the outside observer. A person with a differently calibrated third eye would be able to see the energy flow if calibrated correctly.

Some Siddhas have known about this a long time but we are at a stage in human evolution where what the great thinkers observe with their minds can be measured with scientific equipment.

edit on 24-12-2014 by LittleByLittle because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 23 2014 @ 11:51 PM
a reply to: AudioGhost

What if vibration dealt with consciousness? I don't know what type of vibration each planet including our own emmits, I don;t know what vibration Earth transmits into the cosmos either. But the fact that there is a vibration, a sound unheard by our ears, yet driving life, and even determining physical features of such life even here on earth (patterns of spirals, hexagons, stripes, five fingers and toes, fractals, coral, etc).

I have never heard of planets not revolving around it's parent star in anything other than a disk shape, no matter it's elliptical, But what does the sun revolve around? The Galactic Black Hole? And that Black Hole? Is there a center to all gravity in the Universe?

If you snap your fingers in mid-air, the sound travels equally in waves in all directions. True? Something allows those waves to travel. What is it? Air? Oxygen? Hydrogen? In space we don't hear sound. But I guarentee a device can be constructed to hear sound in space if a person to snap their fingers and that device were to be place near enough to hear it. It is only because our ears are devised to hear i n certain fashions. Have you ever hear sounds transmitted through water with your own ears? head under water and someone speaking, it sounds much different, and yet watter and air are not htat much different. Space is much different, but two asteroids colliding in space IMHO will create a sound, it only needs something beyond our ears to hear is, as we are develeoped to hear in this environment, not space. For that reason I think sound contributes greatly to the reality we are in.

I am not religious and hold no factions, and yet it is always "The Word of God" never anything else, word and not pictures, not mental telepathy, nor anything else. Word and sound are the driving forces to what holds us and all matter together, by the vibrations of each.

just like yelling positive words to a child will make them cry, and quitley telling them to die slowly will make them smile, it's all vibration.

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 12:23 AM
a reply to: iDope

From my point of view: It is all energy in one form or another since vibration is a by product of stored energy.

You can think of it like there is holes (some flat some deep) in a flat surface where energy(that flow like water) can be stored when the energy is flowing out. Since the energy cannot stick on the flat land it will equalize to only be in the holes. But a the same time the surface change shape ans the holes appear at different places in space time since the energy effects the surface.
Energy flows to holes to create equilibrium->The Energy changes reality around itself changing the shape->Energy/Vibration flows to holes to create equilibrium.

The deep holes will be the highly energized states where much energy can exists/"be stored". With the help pf energy you can create new holes in the surface where energy will be stored.

edit on 24-12-2014 by LittleByLittle because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 12:38 AM
Cause and effect (Causation)... This is the philosophical foundation of the entire Scientific Method. It's the hidden "Primary Assumption", which makes all manner of scientific inquiry work. And it works BEAUTIFULLY. So well, that even scientists forget it's based on an assumption. You even get Atheism from that. But there's the irony - if we take that Primary Assumption, and work backwards to the beginning... There should be nothing, logically speaking. If "effect" is our universe, then "cause" is... ... ...
(dog barks in the distance)

Suffice to say the logic is broken. Theoretical physicists have to resort to whacky theories of colliding 4-dimensional membranes nested in some 5-dimensional manifold creating a big bang in both 4-d manifolds, but of course that's just moving the goalposts. Then it's proposed that "time" itself was created by the Big Bang, but that's a sort of cop out - it's what you'd call an "ad hoc" theory, since it's attempting to explain real phenomena with baseless speculation. And it's non-falsifiable, making it unscientific in a technical sense.

What's left... One solution that I can think of. Causation must be wrong. 

Check out this video by the one and only Jacques Vallee (well known to ATS for his unique perspective on UFOlogy, but his mighty intellect bursts into whatever field he touches) It's not about God, or creation, but rather the fundamental nature of consciousness, and a theory of how synchronicities can arise.

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 12:40 AM

''There is something very real and mysterious, which we all call God, but the images of God we all hold are different and inadequate.'' – Carl Jung

This my experience of it. There is definitely something there, but what it is you cannot name. The name is not the thing, only direct experience will do it.

Most Religions fail with the idea of an old man with a beard, this short sighted outlook on the unexplainable actually put's people off. The mysterious nature of (God) is what will make life forever vibrant and enjoyable. If he was an old man with a beard we would probably just get bored with him after a while.

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 02:22 AM
a reply to: Skaffa

That's the best part about it, there is no math or geometry outside of our discourse. It's why we do not find any number or perfect circle anywhere in nature, save for perhaps in our scribbles and books. The same is with consciousness, purpose, intelligence, meaning, and other abstract notions. They simply aren't there until we posit them there, and they exist only in our propositions.

Neither chance nor design, for these concepts encompass nothing about reality.

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 10:14 AM
a reply to: the2ofusr1

Although I don't think I can believe in a personification of god, after skimming through, this does seem interesting, I'll take a deeper look when I get the chance.

a reply to: iDope

This is most likely true, the frequencies of the universe hold infinite potential, and they could very well be the ''matrix'' we're speaking of, but the way matter is so ''in tune'' with them, it almost seems too perfect, which leads me to think this might be another means instead of a cause.

However, I don't think sound in a vacuum is possible, we would've known by now if this was the case.
How can particles transmit frequencies when they are no longer physically connected?
My guess is that these frequencies do not consist of sound as we know it, maybe we should consider it more along the lines of a force like magnetism or gravitational waves, ripples in space time.

a reply to: LittleByLittle

Hence why I focused on life and didn't include the big bang as a possible means, the matrix might have been the result instead of the cause, albeit it would explain a few things if it wasn't.

And quantum physics does seem to point towards the existence the matrix, but our knowledge of the field is still lacking, I don't think I can put much faith in it yet.

a reply to: Son of Will

This is what initially got me thinking about it, causality never really explains the ''how'' because in the end, it always lacks a true cause. Unfortunately this will probably always be the case, even if the matrix were real. It's an unavoidable paradox no matter how we put it.

Thanks for the vid, I'll watch it when I get home.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I would have to disagree, nature seems to always follow strict guidelines, comparable to a form of code if you will.
The Fibonacci sequence and the golden ratio for example can be found everywhere in nature.
Of course mathematics and geometry are our interpretations, our inventions, but that does not take away from the fact that they are perfect at describing nature, which leads many to suspect design over chance.

''The "great book" of the universe is written in the language of mathematics'' - Galileo

It seems obvious that nature has certain mathematical underpinnings, and it does have an inherent purpose, namely survival, reproduction, only the question remains whether or not survival has purpose.

edit on 24-12-2014 by Skaffa because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 10:38 AM
The whole of reality is based on the quantum instant of Now, the permanent fact that Now exists and/or existed, and the requirement that once something becomes existent it must do or be whatever is possible for it to do or be to remain uninterruptedly existent until it can no longer maintain that uninterrupted existence.

Everything - and I do mean everything - can be tied directly to this very simple basis.

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 02:54 PM
a reply to: NorEaster

Right, but this doesn't really answer the question.
Do you think there could be a driving force behind all this or has everything always been completely autonomous?

posted on Dec, 24 2014 @ 06:37 PM
a reply to: iDope

Aum" "Ohm" or "Hum" as always existed in the background, a way to transmute sound, light, life, distance, thought

What if in the beginning there was white noise, and out of the void all was distilled. I like your thinking.

Reminds of Genesis where the creator created out of the void.

posted on Dec, 25 2014 @ 01:54 AM
a reply to: Skaffa

I believe that all conditions can be met:

Consciousness can come about by chance.
Consciousness can spawn other consciousness.
Consciousness can manifest reality.
Consciousness can experience reality.
Realities can spawn chaotically.

edit on 25-12-2014 by SystemResistor because: (no reason given)

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