A question about the classified payload on the NROL-35 Launch from Vandenberg AFB on 12-13-14

a reply to: Sammamishman

Fire: Missile launches (SBIR)
Earth: Optical satelite capability
Air: Signals

I got to see the launch from my home in Los Angeles, including the separation...

I'm still at a loss to wrap my brain around the flight path I witnessed, seeing as Vandenberg AFB is to my north, by like 90miles or so, how did i watch this thing go from apparently WSW in the sky to SSE? it was friggin awesome to say the least and actually inspires me to learn more math.

but how common is a launch path like that? it seemed to be heading over mexico...

a reply to: DigitalJedi805

I was at Vandenberg for that launch, with "front row seats" just a few miles from the pad. Countdown and fueling began on schedule even though there was only a predicted 40-percent chance of acceptable weather conditions at launch time. The launch director had already delayed liftoff by 24 hours due to the fast moving storm that drenched California. This proved to be an excellent decision. The rocket lifted off into mostly clear skies, with mild temperatures and light winds, just as the the trailing edge of the storm system crossed the coastline. As a night launch of an Atlas V with four solid-propellant boosters it was a truly spectacular sight (and sound!). The Atlas was visible through booster separation and staging before disappearing over the cloudy horizon. Two NRO public affairs representatives present at the viewing site refused to provide any details on the nature of the payload, but most analysts believe it is one of a new generation of signals intelligence collection spacecraft. It may carry other sensors as well.

a reply to: balanc3

It depends on the orbit it's being put into.

originally posted by: Sammamishman
a reply to: dezertdog

i was also trying to find the significance of the lady, the purple hair (seen on the mission patch and the poster) and the trident.
So far I've only made a connection to Ursula (from The Little Mermaid), Nue Houjuu (a Japanese video game character that had the ability to hide an objects true identity), and Andromeda (from Marvels Guardian) that had the ability to see deep under water.

If I had to guess I would say Hecate. The purple and the Alchemy symbols would make sense.

originally posted by: Shadowhawk

I was at Vandenberg for that launch, with "front row seats" just a few miles from the pad. Countdown and fueling began on schedule even though there was only a predicted 40-percent chance of acceptable weather conditions at launch time. The launch director had already delayed liftoff by 24 hours due to the fast moving storm that drenched California. This proved to be an excellent decision. The rocket lifted off into mostly clear skies, with mild temperatures and light winds, just as the the trailing edge of the storm system crossed the coastline. As a night launch of an Atlas V with four solid-propellant boosters it was a truly spectacular sight (and sound!). The Atlas was visible through booster separation and staging before disappearing over the cloudy horizon. Two NRO public affairs representatives present at the viewing site refused to provide any details on the nature of the payload, but most analysts believe it is one of a new generation of signals intelligence collection spacecraft. It may carry other sensors as well.

I'm sure that was a hell of a show - I saw separation, stage 2, and what Looked like a push through the atmosphere in amazing clarity - strangely enough, I couldn't hear a thing, and I'm only up in SLO - maybe a 45 minute drive. I can generally hear launches from VAFB if I'm in the '5-Cities' ( 35 minutes away from VAFB ), so I was surprised not to that evening. Especially with it being an ATLAS-5.

originally posted by balanc3:
I got to see the launch from my home in Los Angeles, including the separation...

I'm still at a loss to wrap my brain around the flight path I witnessed, seeing as Vandenberg AFB is to my north, by like 90miles or so, how did i watch this thing go from apparently WSW in the sky to SSE? it was friggin awesome to say the least and actually inspires me to learn more math.

but how common is a launch path like that? it seemed to be heading over mexico...

About sums up my feelings and the secondary question I had in all of this - I saw a SSW flight path ( went and grabbed my compass to be sure ) from where I was on my front porch, and to me it looked like a b-line for Mexico, just like you're saying.

My assessment is that this is just them shooting for an orbit over the southern hemisphere; or somewhere right along the equator, but none the less it was a little strange to see out of Vandenberg.

Vandenberg ( correct me if I'm wrong Zaphod - but I think this is still the case ) is the only base on the west coast that can launch geosynchronous - and generally they'll do so straight out over the pacific; if not for safety in the potential case of a failure, then seemingly to attain the aforementioned geosynchronous orbit. I'm not positive if that assessment of the 'standard' from VAFB is right - but to see something heading out from that base on a path other than the one I'm used to seeing was ... unsettling, I suppose. And then I couldn't figure out what it was carrying... I was hovering over my bug-out and intent on the skies waiting for a gaggle of fireflies to start breaking through the atmosphere.



Thanks for everybody's input - Zaphod, you never fail us brother. If anyone hears anything else about it I'm sure I'll be interested.

a reply to: DigitalJedi805

Polar orbit. That's the best reason why it went that way.

As far as I know, for now at least all geosynchronous launches are out of Vandenberg.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: DigitalJedi805

Polar orbit. That's the best reason why it went that way.

As far as I know, for now at least all geosynchronous launches are out of Vandenberg.

Suppose that makes sense. Thanks Zaph.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: DigitalJedi805

Polar orbit. That's the best reason why it went that way.

Another site claimed a Molinya orbit was likely. It said signals intelligence & missile launch detection over N hemisphere is most likely.

As far as I know, for now at least all geosynchronous launches are out of Vandenberg.

Wouldn't you want that to be an Eastern launch direction to get maximum momentum?

originally posted by: Imperium Americana

originally posted by: Sammamishman
a reply to: dezertdog

i was also trying to find the significance of the lady, the purple hair (seen on the mission patch and the poster) and the trident.
So far I've only made a connection to Ursula (from The Little Mermaid), Nue Houjuu (a Japanese video game character that had the ability to hide an objects true identity), and Andromeda (from Marvels Guardian) that had the ability to see deep under water.

If I had to guess I would say Hecate. The purple and the Alchemy symbols would make sense.

Yes, certainly.

www.theoi.com...

Hecate translation: "Worker from Afar"

Hecate is the daughter of the Titans Perses and Asteria. She is the Greek goddess of magic, sorcery, witchcraft, crossroads, trivial knowledge, and necromancy.

Trivial knowledge is what fills up the NSA's huge data centers.

Yes sir, we have intercepted 19 more petabytes of porn and applying our secret squirrel extractors to look for terrorism messages. So far we have heard threats to slay cute felines but our best analysts think this is a false positive.

originally posted by: Sammamishman
a reply to: dezertdog

In the poster, these are alchemical symbols. The bottom triangle symbolizes fire, while the middle one is for Earth and the top one is air.

As for it's significance, I don't know.

en.wikipedia.org...

Although associated with other moon goddesses such as Selene, she ruled over three kingdoms; the earth, the sea, and the sky. She had the power to create or hold back storms, which influenced her patronage of shepherds and sailors.

Communication with submarines?

Anyway, Hecate symbolism in antiquity is also associated with a triple-faced/body representation. Along with the trident in the patch, I think it means it's a triple-mission craft(s), which explains its heavy weight: integrate multiple systems so that total cost is less.

Found this link about it. Not much, but a little.

As for the less sound from launch someone mentioned can probably be attributed to atmospheric conditions affecting it.

This is a pretty good read too

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: cmdrkeenkid

.....The newer ones are capable of doing more than just watching for launches.

Careful there Zaph, bud, a bit TMI. The canary is looking a bit dizzy in this thread, we wouldn't want the poor thing to be "pining for the fjords" now would we?

a reply to: DigitalJedi805



Lompoc ???

a reply to: Krakatoa

Been too long since some feathers were ruffled. Gotta keep em on their toes.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: Krakatoa

Been too long since some feathers were ruffled. Gotta keep em on their toes.

Uh oh....

a reply to: Krakatoa

No, if I ever feel the need for a new identity, there will be a lot of very sore jaws from bouncing off tables.

a reply to: mbkennel

Launching due East does maximize the momentum transfer from the Earth's rotation, and is a good idea IF you are going into a low inclination orbit--such as a geosynchronous orbit. It maximizes the amount of mass you can launch with a given launch vehicle. This launch was going into a high inclination orbit so the direction of the Earth's rotation was relatively insignificant.

Normally, orbital launches out of Vandenberg head southeast, parallel to the coast so that when the first stage burns out,it drops into the ocean. This particular launch was almost certainly paralleling the Mexican coast, not crossing over Mexican territory until after the first stage dropped. After that point, launches have been known to execute dogleg turns to the east, if necessary.

Launching to the west out of Vandenberg is almost never done if you're going to orbit, since it would result in significantly less mass to orbit than if you launched to the east. The only reason to do this would be if--for some reason--you needed an orbit that was going from the east to the west instead of the more usual west to east and you were willing to pay the penalty in launch mass. This is why virtually all national security payloads going into low inclination orbits are launched out of Cape Canaveral.

They DO launch to the west out of Vandenberg into suborbital trajectories, such as for testing warhead delivery accuracy at Kwajelein.