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Does instant information exchange violate the laws of light?

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posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 08:24 PM
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This idea had me thinking. If I send a message via the electromagnetic spectrum, it follows that the code will travel at the speed of light. But if I had a solid rod that stretched from here to the other side of the galaxy, and pushed and pulled it to form a code like Morse. Then it figures that the moment I pushed one end the other end would displace immediately. Thus sending the message faster than the speed of light. Does it follow then, is there anything in the Universe connecting everything else that will act like a solid?. It struck me that that the fabric of"Space time" Itself might be the candidate.

It follows that something connects everything, somewhere down at the quantum level, some latest research shows that the human heart will react before a threat is perceived by the conscious mind. In fact it will react to a threat before the threat happens. Which seems way out, that an organ of the human body is actually perceiving future events, by definition successfully predicting the future threat. Live cells taken from the human mouth, will behave instantly, at a distance if the donor site is traumatised as if they were still in place. If the connection is "Space Time" Then it might answer some of the anomalies. For instance, why is it that we never see, the ghost of a caveman, from the far past, which seems that the memory of them in our perception of time is to distant to matter, or when perceiving the hull of a flying saucer, it could be from the near future. If part of the human body like the heart can be shown to be precognitive. Then why not under certain circumstances cant the rest of the human body. Because in this the human heart can be said to be reacting physically as if the future event is in its sphere which obviously has an extended timeline, as some basic form of protection for the user.




posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 08:32 PM
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a reply to: anonentity

Supposing such a rod were to be placed and survive the hostility of space, then yes it could be "faster than light".

But it wouldn't and couldn't. Your thoughts just did that you know. Reached the end of the Galaxy.

I wonder a lot: if people at a stop light all paid attention and let off the brake at the same time the light turned green then everyone could roll forward at once.

That will never happen either.



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 08:42 PM
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originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: anonentity

Supposing such a rod were to be placed and survive the hostility of space, then yes it could be "faster than light".

But it wouldn't and couldn't. Your thoughts just did that you know. Reached the end of the Galaxy.

I wonder a lot: if people at a stop light all paid attention and let off the brake at the same time the light turned green then everyone could roll forward at once.

That will never happen either.



but you digress, have these scientist , just been laying about taking the P*&^^

www.dailymail.co.uk...



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 08:50 PM
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what exactly is instant information? if two people had the same thought at the same time exactly the same to the last detail is it an original idea or quantum entanglement at work



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 08:56 PM
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Einstein IS right.....as much as I try to research and read about his work....from what I can see of my own opinion I can say this.....Einstein is absolutely right. his equations equate to this dimension to this world to this earth this dimension. Thats why he didnt agree with the quantum entanglement concept and he labeld it as spooky action at a distance. the point is his math is right FOR THIS DIMENSION. Think about it. Think about dimensions


-Alien



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 09:31 PM
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a reply to: anonentity

No. The movement from one end of the rod to the other would propagate at the material's speed of sound. You could actually observe the movement of the far end (if you had a super thought experiment telescope) before the movement propagated the length of the rod.

Think of it this way: When you push on the atoms at one end of the rod, each of those atoms pushes against its neighbors and then those atoms push against their neighbors and so on as the force of the push moves through the object like a wave.
edit on 2014-12-16 by theantediluvian because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 09:37 PM
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originally posted by: Brotherman
what exactly is instant information? if two people had the same thought at the same time exactly the same to the last detail is it an original idea or quantum entanglement at work


The old saying "Timing is everything" seems to hold true especially for this discussion. Its starting to sound like the whole Universe is quantum entangled. If this is so time must be involved as well, because in this Universe there cannot be instant information sharing, because time and the speed of light is involved ,but down in quantum land, it happens. Which seems to suggest quantum land is a blurry place where the physical laws of this Universe start to change. Probably along with dimensions, if time is involved which obviously it is.



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 09:43 PM
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originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: anonentity

No. The movement from one end of the rod to the other would propagate at the material's speed of sound. You could actually observe the movement of the far end (if you had a super thought experiment telescope) before the movement propagated the length of the rod.

Think of it this way: When you push on the atoms at one end of the rod, each of those atoms pushes against its neighbors and then those atoms push against their neighbors and so on as the force of the push moves through the object like a wave.


I wasn't suggesting that such a physical rod could exist, just using it as an analogy for the means of the instant transfer, of information, which seems to exist in the quantum state. But might possibly work in this way, if it was the fabric of Space time, that acted as a connecting medium.



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 09:59 PM
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originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: anonentity

No. The movement from one end of the rod to the other would propagate at the material's speed of sound. You could actually observe the movement of the far end (if you had a super thought experiment telescope) before the movement propagated the length of the rod.

Think of it this way: When you push on the atoms at one end of the rod, each of those atoms pushes against its neighbors and then those atoms push against their neighbors and so on as the force of the push moves through the object like a wave.


Weird, I was going to use the sound analogy as well.


OP: This was the underlying contention Einstein had with Bohr and his colleagues, the Copenhagen 'school'. Einstein actually conceded his position years later.
edit on 16-12-2014 by gorsestar because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 16 2014 @ 10:22 PM
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originally posted by: anonentity

originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: anonentity

No. The movement from one end of the rod to the other would propagate at the material's speed of sound. You could actually observe the movement of the far end (if you had a super thought experiment telescope) before the movement propagated the length of the rod.

Think of it this way: When you push on the atoms at one end of the rod, each of those atoms pushes against its neighbors and then those atoms push against their neighbors and so on as the force of the push moves through the object like a wave.



I wasn't suggesting that such a physical rod could exist, just using it as an analogy for the means of the instant transfer, of information, which seems to exist in the quantum state. But might possibly work in this way, if it was the fabric of Space time, that acted as a connecting medium.



Well if you are just going to go and change the rules of the universe to suite your hypothesis then I guess anything is possible. But if you are asking about what is really possible, if your magic solid rod does not exist then neither does "instant solid rod propagation of information". Do you have any evidence that something analogous to a solid rod exists? Shouldn't a hypothesis be derived from... something?

edit on 16-12-2014 by CraftBuilder because: of grapes.



posted on Dec, 17 2014 @ 09:14 AM
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originally posted by: anonentity

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: anonentity

Supposing such a rod were to be placed and survive the hostility of space, then yes it could be "faster than light".

But it wouldn't and couldn't. Your thoughts just did that you know. Reached the end of the Galaxy.

I wonder a lot: if people at a stop light all paid attention and let off the brake at the same time the light turned green then everyone could roll forward at once.

That will never happen either.


but you digress, have these scientist , just been laying about taking the P*&^^

www.dailymail.co.uk...

I was trying to show that thought can travel "instantly" at the "speed of thought". In this dimension it is impossible to do that. You get a 'glimpse of the "next" dimension by thinking but can't actually go there physically. You have to die first.

Then your consciousness can be everywhere and every when at once. Think of the hypercube or better "Hypersphere".

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The stop light thing was just an attempt at humor. And that daily mail link has it wrong. "We" don't predict the future, "we" are allowed to see it. The "pre" physical response is the approach to our being by the entity that will reveal the events to be. The conduit being through ones soul. The "shivers up the spine" tingling beforehand is the physical response to the spirit activity within us. The two are linked.
edit on 17-12-2014 by intrptr because: additional



posted on Dec, 17 2014 @ 09:27 AM
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Any information that travels faster than light probably wouldn't violate causality, but as it stands right now it's on the fringes of scientific research. It could be theoretically possible to transfer information faster than light via quantum entanglement, but it has not been demonstrably proven yet.
edit on 17-12-2014 by ScientificRailgun because: Spalling end gremmar



posted on Dec, 17 2014 @ 09:30 AM
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originally posted by: anonentity
Then it figures that the moment I pushed one end the other end would displace immediately.


Actually it will not. The atoms of the rod have a kind of elasticity. The interaction of an iron atom with the next one cannot travel faster than light.



posted on Dec, 17 2014 @ 06:45 PM
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originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: anonentity

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: anonentity

Supposing such a rod were to be placed and survive the hostility of space, then yes it could be "faster than light".

But it wouldn't and couldn't. Your thoughts just did that you know. Reached the end of the Galaxy.

I wonder a lot: if people at a stop light all paid attention and let off the brake at the same time the light turned green then everyone could roll forward at once.

That will never happen either.


but you digress, have these scientist , just been laying about taking the P*&^^

www.dailymail.co.uk...

I was trying to show that thought can travel "instantly" at the "speed of thought". In this dimension it is impossible to do that. You get a 'glimpse of the "next" dimension by thinking but can't actually go there physically. You have to die first.

Then your consciousness can be everywhere and every when at once. Think of the hypercube or better "Hypersphere".

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The stop light thing was just an attempt at humor. And that daily mail link has it wrong. "We" don't predict the future, "we" are allowed to see it. The "pre" physical response is the approach to our being by the entity that will reveal the events to be. The conduit being through ones soul. The "shivers up the spine" tingling beforehand is the physical response to the spirit activity within us. The two are linked.


I agree with what you are saying, its probably the mind that is quantum linked to the general Universe which hasn't much differentiation, except that we are defined within it. The two slit experiment, is where the mind and matter meet. It has to be where just observing changes the outcome. Physicality makes our bodies limited, but the payoff is that it also defines us. You are right when you say when the physical laws of time and space, no longer exist for us. We would have to be everywhere at once, it figures when the time speed equation is removed. But it doesn't mean that we would be any less than what we are, as our mind already exists outside of the physical universe, and our body over a lifetime has been replaced many times.

So if the above is true, instant communication is possible, but only mind to mind, where dreams are involved it would suggest that individuals can communicate, but the information might be lost at the level of physicality or at best poorly remembered .Because the information has to be rearranged to fit the model existing in this time space reality, from one that hasn't the same constraints.



posted on Dec, 17 2014 @ 07:57 PM
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a reply to: anonentity


So if the above is true, instant communication is possible, but only mind to mind, where dreams are involved it would suggest that individuals can communicate, but the information might be lost at the level of physicality or at best poorly remembered

Access to the memory is poor but the hard copy is there. Thats why our brains are so big and start empty. Everything we see, hear and experience (even in sleep) is recorded and stored in our brains. Like security cameras at the mall every thing , every sound, every 'corner of the eye' event is there. A lifetimes worth.

We may not remember it all but its there. So is everyone else's.

So be good for goodness sake and if you can't, say your sorry.

I don't really know of this because I haven't been there yet. Just musing.



posted on Dec, 17 2014 @ 08:36 PM
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Its called quantum tunneling or teleportation.

The desire to get there allows the object to get there as is it isnt really anywhere, but instead its everywhere at the quantum level.

Look at it this way your counsiousness creates all of the reality of space time aand objects in dream then allows you to experience it as your individual self seperate from thae entire universe you just created due to your perception.

In the same way we see the world in our waking state all is one yet due to our limited perception or ego we see things from our own point of view.

As to quantum tunneling information across the universe its something we all do wether we are aware of it or not.

The speed of light is not faster than counsiousness which pervades all equally at all times.

Think of it this way the "BIG BANG" exploded out moving everything faster than the speed of light, and we are still moving through space In other words, scientists speculate our galaxy still hurling through space at 2.7 million MPH (4.4 million KPH) even though it feels like you are sitting still. We may even be going faster than the speed of light if we consider our speed in relation to orgin point known as the BIG BANG.

Another example is that scientists have detected that there is a mirror universe of our own which reverses all time back into the singularity meaning at no time is anything ever not one with the BIG BANG.

This process is said to repeat for every universe infinatly.

So sending a message anywhere in the universe is possible through quantum tunneling because all is one in truth, only our perception of time and space give us the false reality that we are moving through it, the double slit expiriment tells us that.






posted on Dec, 17 2014 @ 09:52 PM
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a reply to: theantediluvian

Excellent point.

You can see this in an arrow released from a bow. The arrow stacks or undulates because the the back of the arrow start moving before the front.



posted on Dec, 18 2014 @ 03:31 PM
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A rod of some sort or whatever you want to use for this...how much would it weigh? Could something like that even be moved?

I mean it would weigh much more than the earth even more than the sun. I wonder how one would go about moving it.

And not only that. Whatever it is it will stretch and contract as you try to move it back and forth. You would likely have to move your end at least tens of thousands of miles each way just to get it to budge on the other end.


-Alien



posted on Dec, 18 2014 @ 07:30 PM
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originally posted by: Alien Abduct
A rod of some sort or whatever you want to use for this...how much would it weigh? Could something like that even be moved?

I mean it would weigh much more than the earth even more than the sun. I wonder how one would go about moving it.

And not only that. Whatever it is it will stretch and contract as you try to move it back and forth. You would likely have to move your end at least tens of thousands of miles each way just to get it to budge on the other end.


-Alien


It was only an analogy, to suggest if such a thing were possible and their was no bending and flexing of the rod the exchange would be instant. Then I added that "Space time" might be a very good candidate for the hypothetical rod. "Time" being the operative word because if something occurs instantly the physical laws operating in our physical Universe would no longer apply. Because all the laws in this Universe apply to matter. In the double slit experiment, where an observers consciousness, can change the photon from a particle of substance to a wave, which has no substance except energy.Then its consciousness that has changed the outcome, since we hypothesised that our consciousness exists outside of the physical Space time continuum. This has some serious outcomes. If conscious observation can change the outcome of the double slit experiment, then their is a good possibility that our consciousness and the photon are quantum linked, if this is so. Then its reasonable to suggest that our consciousness could very well be linked to everything else.

Then at some time when we no longer have a body, we are then free of the physical laws that operate in the physical world, but our mind which has always operated free of these constraints, could be in an interesting environment. As we already know the mind/ brain duality constructs reality, subject to the physical laws within linear time which is a necessary construct for dealing with informational chaos. I suggest that a physical state in linear time is necessary, to have a mind capable of dealing with the future environment. Where time and distance no longer exist, which is just beyond the particle state of said Photon when it turns into a wave at the border of the next reality, where consciousness is the rule.

Where Alien ships can be said to exceed the speed of light, and time slips, ghost sightings , along with the other myriad of exigencies, OOBES, near death experiences etc. might very well occur at the border of the two realities.



posted on Dec, 18 2014 @ 11:52 PM
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originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: anonentity

No. The movement from one end of the rod to the other would propagate at the material's speed of sound. You could actually observe the movement of the far end (if you had a super thought experiment telescope) before the movement propagated the length of the rod.

Think of it this way: When you push on the atoms at one end of the rod, each of those atoms pushes against its neighbors and then those atoms push against their neighbors and so on as the force of the push moves through the object like a wave.


Interesting! So even rigid materials like steel, or diamond, would twist like a big piece of Laffy Taffy, when a rod of the material being rotated or otherwise moved is long enough? With a ripple between the old and new position moving down the rod at the speed of sound??

Astounding!



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