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Chris Matthews: C’mon, you’re crazy if you think Al Qaeda’s going to stop torturing if we do

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posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 01:29 PM
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Via the Daily Caller. He’s right, but … I’m not sure anyone, up to and including nutty Joan Walsh, is claiming otherwise. (If Al Qaeda ends up ratcheting down the barbarity, it’ll be because of lessons they’ve learned from ISIS, not from the U.S.) On the other hand, opponents of EIT do frequently say that we need to set an example for the rest of the world in renouncing torture and I’ve never understood that argument either. Who are we setting an example for? Which countries are going to change how they handle terrorists because Dianne Feinstein released the CIA report? Don’t we count on other countries to stick with enhanced interrogation for our own rendition purposes?


Gasp! Chris Mathews said what ?



There are defensible reasons to oppose EIT. You can oppose it as being immoral, regardless of what intelligence gains might be had from it. You can oppose it for being too dangerous of a slippery slope, a special concern now that Obama’s expanded drone warfare to include jihadis with American citizenship. You can oppose it because it produces bad information under duress, something that’s certainly true in some cases but not as universally true as anti-EIT absolutists insist. You can even oppose it, a la Joe Biden, because it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside to do so, the left’s own version of American exceptionalism.


Yes there are.

BUT:



I don’t really see how you can oppose it as a way to influence other countries, though, except as a minor piece in a propaganda chess game. Renouncing CIA torture won’t stop Vladimir Putin from getting rough with his own prisoners but it will undercut him a bit if he argues that he’s only doing what the United States enthusiastically does to its own detainees. “Not enthusiastically!” we can now say. So, yay. Besides, the propaganda value in having global media revisit this old subject is much greater to someone like Putin than the propaganda loss he’s suffered in having Senate Democrats — who tolerated these practices for years before it became an issue for their base, of course — declare that America is sorry and will never do it again. For instance, here’s how the report is playing on a much-followed Twitter account devoted to Iranian propaganda:





Oh yes the propaganda gift for two bit terrorists around the world.

Especially when they IGNORE their own dirty little secrets like.

Evin prison section 209.

www.mojahedin.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

BUT:

U.S. Says Rendition to Continue, but With More Oversight


WASHINGTON — The Obama administration will continue the Bush administration’s practice of sending terrorism suspects to third countries for detention and interrogation, but pledges to closely monitor their treatment to ensure that they are not tortured, administration officials said Monday.


Handing the enemies of the state a propaganda windfall. Throwing them under the bus, and expecting them to 'help' us fight the 'war' on terror!

That is some 'Badge of Honer' as Biden claims.

Biden: Release of torture report is 'badge of honor'

Back to the original article.

I had no idear that Chris Mathews was a torture 'apologist' as some people say.

Anyhow found these links interesting, and decided to 'share the wealth'.

edit on 10-12-2014 by neo96 because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 01:57 PM
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He must of completely lost that tingle down his leg.

This is the first time I agree with him.

Strange comment for that boot licker.


+1 more 
posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:10 PM
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a reply to: neo96

I hold myself and, as an extension, my government to higher standards than I hold criminals.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:20 PM
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originally posted by: AgentShillington
a reply to: neo96

I hold myself and, as an extension, my government to higher standards than I hold criminals.


I understand where you are coming from, but it isn't really 'our' Government. Maybe you meant that you can identify with it, but I don't see them as representing me or my values.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:25 PM
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a reply to: Metallicus

I didn't say "our" government. I said "my" government.

You can shirk blame all you want, but we as a nation elected and continue to elect some real losers.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:27 PM
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Looks like MSNBC is setting up a re-programming agenda for the upcoming Democrat/Obama scandal exposures.

That alone will put torture to the test.






posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:31 PM
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What he says is absolutely correct. If we stop torturing people today, Al Qaeda isn't going to suddenly have a change of heart. But the U.S. should be an example to other nations and groups to how people should act, even in times of war, there are lines that shouldn't be crossed.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:31 PM
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a reply to: neo96


You can oppose it for being too dangerous of a slippery slope, a special concern now that Obama’s expanded drone warfare to include jihadis with American citizenship.


What? Torture is a "slippery slope"? To what? What is next? All-out fascism?



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:32 PM
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a reply to: neo96

Piss off Chris, you effin facist. Of course they aren't going to stop just because we do. Let's be morally better than them for goodness sake.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:33 PM
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a reply to: AgentShillington

That was hilarious considering our government is ran by nothing but criminals.

It's damn right laughable to expect them to 'turn over a new leaf.

Especially when they have already said rendition will continue.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:43 PM
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a reply to: ColCurious

Speaking for myself I would rather have a bucket of water thrown in my face compared to a hellfire missile shot at me.

Even more so since American citizens are getting droned now with the presidential 'kill lists'.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:48 PM
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To those that are pro torture, yeah who cares if terrorist were tortured.

But do you really trust giving the goverment such power?

Oneday your goverment could pick you up and torture you.

Torture you lije the 26 innocent victims the CIA admitted to accidently picking up.

When you do away with due process and human rights innocent people will get hurt and likely the goverment will turn its powers on you.


So really neo what would you do? You seem quite adimant that this report should not have been released.
You are anti goverment yet you support the goverments right to torture?
edit on 10-12-2014 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:48 PM
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a reply to: neo96

But you agree with torture... how can you condemn the government as criminal when you rather consistently agree with what they do?



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:53 PM
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originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: ColCurious

Speaking for myself I would rather have a bucket of water thrown in my face compared to a hellfire missile shot at me.

Even more so since American citizens are getting droned now with the presidential 'kill lists'.


Water boarding is a bucket of water in the face?

Hoe old are you? 10? Or are you Dick cheny himself?

Thats got to be the dafted missinformed comment Iv seen on ATS for a while.


Im sure if the CIA picked you up by mistake, denied you due process and tortured you, i bet you would be singing a diffrent tune!


edit on 10-12-2014 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:54 PM
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a reply to: Kali74

The solution is simple.

Don't want tortured don't become jihadists.

Besides it's the mere action of getting caught of alive is the true 'humilation','duress' or whatever.

Their goal is to die in 'battle', and become martyrs.

But once again.

Rendition, aka torture is going to continue.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:57 PM
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To those who are acting like their 10 and not even bother READING the supplied material.



WASHINGTON — The Obama administration will continue the Bush administration’s practice of sending terrorism suspects to third countries for detention and interrogation, but pledges to closely monitor their treatment to ensure that they are not tortured, administration officials said Monday.


www.nytimes.com...

'Torture is bad' but were gonna do it anyway' !



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:58 PM
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a reply to: neo96

Don't want jihadists, don't create them.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: neo96

Us humans that are against torture don't condone it period, regardless of any politicians or pundits BS opinions or assurances.
edit on 12/10/2014 by Kali74 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 03:01 PM
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We will just contract it out to people better at it than we are.

Just because I don't happen to agree with it.

Doesn't mean they are going stop....Ever



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 03:02 PM
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originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: neo96

Us humans that are against torture don't condone it period, regardless of any politicians of pundits BS opinion or assurances.


Guess that makes the current administration 'inhuman'.

Because it's not going to stop.



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