It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Pope Francis - "All Animals Go To Heaven"

page: 2
7
<< 1    3  4 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 11:37 AM
link   

originally posted by: Dimithae
if the Catholic church doesn't believe that animals go to heaven,then why do they have blessing ceremonies where the priests bless all the people's animals?

Priests bless everything ...everything from pets to houses to farm fields to boats to whatever. That doesn't mean that the church believes any of that goes to heaven. The official church teaching has to do with intelligence and choice. Honestly I think this is an OLD understanding of animals and we have learned that critters such as dogs and elephants and chimps and dolphins, etc etc etc do indeed have emotions and memories, etc etc.

Anyways, straight from an official Catholic source - EWTN

A question that comes up frequently is whether people will see their pets in heaven. Now the Catechism of the Catholic Church does not directly address this question. But it does hold principles which lead us in the direction of an answer.

One principle is that all living things have a soul. Here soul is defined as what makes an organic body live. Now when any living thing dies, its soul is separated from its body. In the case of plants and animals the soul goes out of existence. But in the case of man, the soul remains in existence because it is a spiritual or immaterial thing. Consequently, it differs from the souls of animals in two important respects. First, it is the seat of intelligence or reason. For this reason a man is held responsible for his actions in a way that animals are not. Secondly, the soul is immortal. A thing which has no physical parts cannot fall apart or be poisoned or be crushed or be put out of existence. For this reason the souls of the saved will always be aware of themselves as enjoying the vision of God for all eternity. This enjoyment will be the result of having chosen to act on earth in such a way that one did the will of God rather than one's own will. And the souls of the damned will be aware of themselves as never attaining this vision of God because they have shown by their lives on earth that they did not wish this vision but instead preferred their own will.

In the light of this essential difference between human beings and animals, it would seem that we would not see the souls of our pets in heaven for the simple reason that they do not have immortal souls and are not responsible for their actions. They do not have the intelligence which allows them to choose either God's will or their own will. There is, then, an incomparable distance, say, between the soul of the sorriest human being who ever lived and the most noble brute animal that ever walked the earth.


I am of the opinion that critters have life energy and that life energy doesn't disappear but instead changes. Prior to getting sick (autoimmune) I had decided I was going to go on a karmic diet .. eating nothing with a face .. but before I could get started on it I had autoimmune kick in and I found I couldn't go on the diet. If dogs and cats are with us in the afterlife, so are all the beef steers and the chickens and the lambs and the fish that we have eaten. And I'm thinking they may be a bit ticked off at being slaughtered and eaten.




posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 12:01 PM
link   
This is the funniest post I've seen in a long time.

a reply to: GENERAL EYES




posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 12:53 PM
link   
What would they want as an afterlife if givin a choice?

Seems silly to believe that an animals version of heaven would include humans. unless...



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 01:26 PM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan

why do you think it's against church teaching? Do you have any excerpts that say so?

Personally I do not think that animals have souls, or at least the kind that humans have.

I would like to some day see my pet bunny again though.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 01:32 PM
link   

originally posted by: Kharron
I firmly believe that there is other life out there in the universe. If that is true then did Jesus incarnate and put on a show for each inhabited planet? And does each planet have its own heaven, or do we all go to one big shared heaven?
The more I think about religion the more it falls apart.


When they made up those stories about heaven they didn't even know that earth was a planet, or the shape of the solar system, they just called the sky ''heavens''(7). Now they are twisting everything to fit our knowledge and understanding.


originally posted by: borntowatch
This pope will say anything to get attention, the media whor....best I dont say that I think.
Animals go to heaven?
Thats going to get him a lot of love from followers and atheists alike.
When is he actually going to do something other than talk?


Yeah, like a crusade or something


originally posted by: SaturnFX

As far as going to heaven, well, all things were heavenbound..mankind however screwed up (ate from the tree of knowledge) and now is required to do all sorts of works and accept Christ and all that to be allowed back in heaven at death. other animals and stuff have not done this, therefore none of that stuff is required.


Then why the animals were also expelled from heaven, and have to die here alongside with man?
And why aren't snakes supposed to also accept christ, in order to get into heaven. aren't they also guilty?
And why did god bothered with the tree of knowledge, since he already knew mankind would screw up?
Why did he created them in such way, that they would screw up?
Ok, sorry I'll stop....



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 01:55 PM
link   

originally posted by: backcase
why do you think it's against church teaching? Do you have any excerpts that say so?

Read the thread. I posted Catholic Church teaching on page 2.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 02:43 PM
link   
I think Pope Francis is really great. He's giving Catholics a really awesome new name. I think he's doing really good things.

Honestly. I do think animal have the same life after death as humans do, whatever that happens to be. If there is a God, and a Heaven, I think that animals would go there. Animals are like children. Innocent. The only crime SOME commit is like... Mauling people to death. But when it comes to wild animals, it's instinct. And when it comes to domesticated animals, they are either trained to be aggressive, or it's the way they are bred.

They don't commit crimes, or sin... So why not? And for those who believe animals don't have a soul... Maybe YOU don't have a soul. Or you've never had a pet.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 03:21 PM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan

Meh,

I think its all part of Agenda 21, to discourage the masses from eating meat. The guilt trip of how many acres of land its takes to feed an animal as opposed to the benefits of vegetarianism. Like how they have set aside huge tracts of national parks for the sake of our descendants. But it will be a playground for the super wealthy only.

I have no trust of any leaders.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 03:45 PM
link   
a reply to: Emerald53

BS

You don't know If there even is a heaven let alone If animals can go there.
No one does.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 05:32 PM
link   
For all of those Christians who Believe in The Bible but not agreeing with this Pope:

If you believe The Bible to be the 100% inspired word of God, then you believe that Jesus had The Holy Spirit and through The Holy Spirit he chose Peter who also had the Holy Spirit and could be trusted to lead his church, right?

If this is true, that means that Peter, with The Holy Spirit chose the next pope filled with The Holy Spirit and could be trusted, who chose the next pope, who chose the next pope, and so on, so if The Holy Spirit is 100% perfect then even this pope today is speaking 100% from God

(unless of course not 100% of The Bible is inspired by God)

A general response to the idea that "all animals go to heaven":

In heaven, you are not in the Flesh but in The Spirit, you don't hunger, and if God's Law is "love thy neighbor as thyself" then that is fully obeyed there (no eating/killing each other - only eternal life), so it makes sense how animals (including sharks and tigers) can be in heaven.


edit on 10-12-2014 by arpgme because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 06:55 PM
link   
a reply to: GENERAL EYES

The dueling Church bulletin boards (or whatever they're called) are great. Thanks for posting them. Why would anyone even want to go where dogs aren't allowed?



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 06:57 PM
link   

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: Emerald53

BS

You don't know If there even is a heaven let alone If animals can go there.
No one does.


Of course, but the test question reveals a great deal about the responders. Don't you agree?



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 07:13 PM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan

I wouldn't want to go anywhere there were no animals. I believe I'll see my pets again in heaven.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 07:28 PM
link   
a reply to: suz62

Plus I want to eat lots of meat without putting on any weight.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 07:40 PM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan


Can all creatures go to heaven? And if the pope actually said it, what does that mean for the Catholic church? Or do you think the pope was just being nice to a child who lost a pet and the tabloids are blowing it up? I'm thinking the last one - that he was just comforting a young person who had lost a pet. But what are your thoughts on 'all creatures' in heaven? And if all creatures go to heaven, does that mean that when you reach the afterlife you'll be confronted by hundreds of beef-steers and thousands of chickens all looking at

Great question FlyersFan,
I realize that it is not Christian, Judaic or Islam doctrine but in The Old Testament Pseudepigrapha - James H. Charlesworth, Volume 1 --

2nd Enoch [J] it is written --
"And just as every human soul is according to number, so also it is with animal souls. And not a single soul which the Lord has created will perish until the great judgment. And every kind of animal soul will accuse the human beings who have fed them badly."

2nd Enoch [A]
"For the Lord made man the (lord) of all his possessions. Over them there will be no judgment for every living soul, but for (that of) man alone. For all the souls of the beasts there is in the great age a single place and a single paddock and a single pasture. For the souls of the animals which the Lord has created will not be excluded until the judgment. He who grazes the souls [of the beasts] badly commits iniquity against his own soul."

Then there are commentaries of both A and J which are quite lengthy. I realize that this is not accepted scripture by most but is given for thought. The Jews had great care in sacrifice so that an animal would not suffer, or so I have read.

I was not aware that the pope had ever contemplated that issue.



posted on Dec, 10 2014 @ 08:38 PM
link   
a reply to: Tangerine

Amen. I know for a fact that I wouldn't go anywhere were animals won't be.



(short version below)

Twilight Zone - The Hunt (synopsis)




posted on Dec, 11 2014 @ 12:10 AM
link   
a reply to: boymonkey74

I certainly know there's a Heaven, so do you. Heaven is outer space. What we don't know is whether or not entities dwell in them, or if they're the entities from the Bible. Well you don't know that part, I know that entities dwell in them, I know they're from the Bible.



posted on Dec, 11 2014 @ 12:48 AM
link   
a reply to: Emerald53

No you don't know you are guessing.
Outer space?.....ok lol.



posted on Dec, 12 2014 @ 12:31 PM
link   
a reply to: boymonkey74


No you don't know you are guessing. Outer space?.....ok lol.

There are some reputable scientists who do believe that this universe is expanding at a great rate. I don't really know that to be a fact or if that is theoretical but if it is true then there must be something for the universe to expand into. Don't you think? Another understanding would be that the universe is a closed existence and it is expanding within itself. In other words it may have unfinished existences that are now being self created.

In either case how would the universe be a closed existence? Where did it come from? Where did the thing or things come from that would make the universe and how could the universe be made without an outside source that would have had to exist in order to make it? And at last, just who and where would that outside source be?

Perhaps Emerald 53 is right on target? Before ridicule maybe there is more to all of this than any pf us realize.



posted on Dec, 12 2014 @ 07:19 PM
link   
a reply to: arpgme


If you believe The Bible to be the 100% inspired word of God, then you believe that Jesus had The Holy Spirit and through The Holy Spirit he chose Peter who also had the Holy Spirit and could be trusted to lead his church, right?

Depends upon what bible you are accepting and what interpretation you believe to be true. Most all protestant denominations interpret Matthew 16:16-19 differently than does the Roman church.

Mat 16:16-19
(16) And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. (17) And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. (18) And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. (19) And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Not meaning to stir the pot because this matter is a highly contested subject. As Jesus died the first Jewish Christians were the founders of the first Christian congregations and the high priest of this Christian movement was James the Just. James was the brother of Jesus and held the high priestly office of Christianity for well over three decades. He was then murdered by the opposing Jewish factions. Peter and the rest of the apostles taught and preached in this first synagogue but Peter was not the foundation of this movement. It was more than a decade later that Peter and Paul both were found preaching in Rome. Even then there is evidence that there were Christian synagogues already established in Rome before their appearance. After the extermination of the Jews in 135 CE by Hadrian we then see Roman Christianity emerging from the spoils. I will not argue the matter. Only speculation.



new topics

top topics



 
7
<< 1    3  4 >>

log in

join