Trillion Dollar Conspiracy... 9/11 Mounting Evidence...

a reply to: Jchristopher5

Name ONE steel framed building that had suffered heavy damage and burned that DID NOT collapse. Just one.

a reply to: samkent

Let's assume you're right. So, the trusses gave in and fell down, which in turn made the exoskeleton and columns cave in. But this leaves even more questions (I don't expect you to answer them, merely observing): if you're right and the firemen know about the risk of using trusses up to the point they even refuse to go into a building with that kind of roof - how come nobody sounded the alert when the WTC's were build? Surely firemen were involved in stuff like checking the fire-resistance of construction and materials.

Also I find it quite hard to believe that a construction solid enough to support elevators and stairways would cave in just like that. I'd expect at least a significant part of the central core to remain standing. When the towers were build, they first created the core (which stood on itself) and then put the exoskeleton in place, So, the central core CAN stand on its own without the support of the exoskeleton.

Now, about your theory w/regard to the hot metal which you think might be caused by the wind that blew into the building converting it into a furnace: yes, that is possible. But only if there is sufficient fuel. Which there was not, we can see black smoke and later on even people standing where the fires had been. Also, architects that build high rise building are very aware of that effect and pull off various tricks to reduce the chimney effect.

Of course, neither of your theories explains why WTC7 fell. No trusses there. No exoskeleton either.

originally posted by: cardinalfan0596
a reply to: Jchristopher5

Name ONE steel framed building that had suffered heavy damage and burned that DID NOT collapse. Just one.

Look here, for example.

a reply to: ForteanOrg

None of those buildings suffered the damage that WTC 1, 2, and 7 suffered. And I will point out that your cite, shows the Madrid Windsor Building in Spain. The Windsor, burned for hours.....and suffered a partial collapse of the steel framed upper levels arrested ONLY by the concrete transfer slab on the 17th floor.

So, you post a steel framed building that partially collapsed from fire alone.....and again I ask, show me one heavily damaged, steel framed building that was burning and did not collapse.

a reply to: cardinalfan0596
The One Meridian Plaza Libery tower, in Philadelphia, which caught fire in 1991 and burned for hours. Firefighters were unable to control it. It burned much longer then the twin towers, only to cease when sprinklers went off on the upper floors. It did NOT collapse on the day of the fire.

By February 26 city officials had determined One Meridian Plaza was not in danger of collapse.[11] There was structural damage to horizontal steel beams and floor sections on most of the fire damaged floors. Under extreme fire exposure the beams and girders sagged and twisted and cracks appeared in the concrete floors. However, the overall structure was stable and able to support the weight of the building. Thermal expansion of the steel frame caused some of the granite panels to be dislodged from the building's facade.[1] The streets and buildings around One Meridian Plaza were closed and cordoned off.[11] The 20-story Morris Building and several three-story shops behind One Meridian Plaza on Chestnut Street were damaged by falling debris and sat unused for years until they were demolished in 2000.[12][13] The neighboring Girard Trust Building, then called Two Mellon Plaza, experienced extensive water damage forcing the closure of the building. A bank in the building reopened a month later but the rest of the tower remained vacant for years.[14][15] The roads around the building were closed for months after the fire, including a portion of two of Philadelphia's major streets, Broad and Market.[2]

The Liberty building only collapsed its own footprint when it was intentionally demolished months later.

I will go back to my original point and turn this around. Name ONE steel framed building, besides the three in NY on 9/11, which collapsed into its own footprint due to fire.

originally posted by: ForteanOrg
a reply to: samkent



Also I find it quite hard to believe that a construction solid enough to support elevators and stairways would cave in just like that. I'd expect at least a significant part of the central core to remain standing. When the towers were build, they first created the core (which stood on itself) and then put the exoskeleton in place, So, the central core CAN stand on its own without the support of the exoskeleton.


.

They didn't "first create the core, which then stood by itself."
Do you REALLY believe this?

The whole tower was created a few COMPLETE floors at a time. They would build some floors, Then move up the self climbing cranes and build a few more COMPLETE floors.

This is why I don't agrue this crap anymore, this will get ignored and the next bs theory will be brought up. Like no planes, steel vaporizing energy weapons, mini nukes...............and on and on.

I will believe that yes, 4 planes flown by 19 hijakers, brought down 3 towers and part of the pentagon on 9/11, until it is PROVEN otherwise.

And posts like I replied to here DO NOT help the ct side. Please gain a little KNOWLEDGE before exposing the lack of to all.

Did our government know? Maybe. Are there things we don't know that went on that day? probably.

But come on now..............

originally posted by: Jchristopher5
a reply to: cardinalfan0596


I will go back to my original point and turn this around. Name ONE steel framed building, besides the three in NY on 9/11, which collapsed into its own footprint due to fire.

OMG It DIDNT collapse from fire alone, and please check out the unique plans with the trusses for the towers.

Show me another TRUSS framed tower like the twin towers that held up to a fire AND damage like they did.

There aren't any.

Common sense AND knowledge is the path to your answers.

a reply to: Jchristopher5

Ah, we move the goalposts. The Meridian, was damaged as a result of the fire. WTC 1 and 2, had high speed airliners slam into them. WTC 7, had WTC 1 fall into it, carving a 20 story hole out of it and obliterating the southeast corner of the building. So, my question still stands.

originally posted by: Jchristopher5
Name ONE steel framed building, besides the three in NY on 9/11, which collapsed into its own footprint due to fire.

None of the buildings that collapsed on 9/11 collapsed into 6their own footprint.... why post such rubbish?

a reply to: cardinalfan0596

I didn't move any goalposts. You asked for ONE example of a steel frame building that didn't collapse with a fire. I have you the one example. The other examples are every other steel framed building. Ever.

Now, as far as the airliner argument you do have that to fall back on, for the twin towers. But, you don't have that for building 7.

Building 7 is the only steel framed building, ever, that collapsed into its own footprint solely due to fire (so, one not having an airliner smash into it). It free fell for 2 to 2.5 seconds, which is seemingly impossible without demolition. It's building owner is quoted as saying it was "pulled" or demolished. You watch the video and it's obvious that it was demolished.

But, the the official lie says if collapsed due to fire. You, and the rest of the gullible public, buy into every ridiculous official explanation. And you call those who see through this horrid mess as the crazy ones!

The only thing that makes me more angry is that our government would participate in such a conspiracy against its own people.

a reply to: Jchristopher5

No, I said this

"Name ONE steel framed building that had suffered heavy damage and burned that DID NOT collapse."

You keep forgetting that all three of those buildings were heavily damaged, THEN they burned, THEN they collapsed. Still waiting for an example of a building that has suffered that kind of heavy damage, burned and did not fall.

originally posted by: cardinalfan0596
a reply to: Jchristopher5

No, I said this

"Name ONE steel framed building that had suffered heavy damage and burned that DID NOT collapse."

You keep forgetting that all three of those buildings were heavily damaged, THEN they burned, THEN they collapsed. Still waiting for an example of a building that has suffered that kind of heavy damage, burned and did not fall.

How do you define "that kind of damage"? I don't have examples of buildings hit by 757s as that is very unusual. Both twin tower buildings were said to fall in a pancake fashion.

Building 7 was not hit by a plane, yet fell on 9/11. No other steel frame skyscraper has collapsed, before or since, when not hit by planes.

You argue in circles and never address my points. If you want to prove me wrong then explain how building 7 came down, when not hit by a plane.

a reply to: Jchristopher5

And you keep missing that WTC 7, was CLOBBERED by WTC 1 as it fell. Why is that? The FDNY reported massive damage to 7 caused by 1's collapse.

originally posted by: Jchristopher5
The coincidental missing $2.3 trillion

What missing @2,3 trillion? Who exactly said it was missing?
and the crash into the area of the pentagon where the budget analysis were working.

The footprint of the crash into the pentagon was like that of a missile, not a 757. Doesn't match at all.

Wrong, a 7857 makes a very good match, then there is the 757 engine, 757 undercarriage, all the DNA from the passengers on Flight 77.... all matching.

No good and clear video of the crash,

Why should there be?

in spite of it being the most protected airspace in the world.

Your evidence for that silly claim is what exactly?

There is more.

Yes, we know your have more nonsense!

the reason donnie rumsfeld was at the capiyalbuilding that day was the same reason he was there the day before trying to explain 2 trillion dollars missing from defense department coffers

originally posted by: proteus33
he was there the day before trying to explain 2 trillion dollars missing from defense department coffers

Except he never said the money was missing.... in fact the only people who claim the money was missing are truthers!

Let me just clear this up right away.

You see... all of these "truthers" seeking the "truth" have allot to gain. First of all, people like Richard Gage are making millions of dollars, and buying yachts left and right due to their 911 videos selling billions of copies--people still haven't figured out how to torrent them yet. Secondly, every single person spewing the OS is false is getting rich, AND it's benefiting them enormously. Just think about it, people who speak out about 911 are hailed as hero's and everyone loves them. They usually get a huge raise at work, and promotion. It's SICKENING.

Next, Building 7 is something allot of people like to use to attempt to prove 911 was some sort of "conspiracy." If you hadn't noticed, building 7 was on fire. Steel framed buildings are falling over left and right due to fire, EVERY DAY.

Furthermore, the government has ZERO reason to lie to the people. When has the government every lied about anything? NEVER. Also, every single government official is 100% trust worthy. This can't be debated. So any official committee they would have created to investigate this would be 100% impartial and have ZERO reason to fabricate anything.

All of this craziness about ties to different people is a clever ruse. OBVIOUSLY we we're attacked because "they" hate us. America is the GREATEST country in the world. We're like 41st in quality of living, and 36th in healthcare. Last time i checked their is a "1" in those subset of numbers. Meaning #1, DUH! No wonder they hate us! Hater's gonna hate!

So all of these truthers need to stop perpetuating this propaganda. It's rude to the families and victims. You don't honor the victims and hero's by attempting to solve their murder and bring justice. You honor them by ignoring the evidence and NEVER EVER talking about these events which CANNOT BE ARGUED. Period. EVER.

a reply to: v1rtu0s0

USA!! USA!! USA!! USA!! USA!! USA!!!

originally posted by: stosh64

originally posted by: ForteanOrg
a reply to: samkent



Also I find it quite hard to believe that a construction solid enough to support elevators and stairways would cave in just like that. I'd expect at least a significant part of the central core to remain standing. When the towers were build, they first created the core (which stood on itself) and then put the exoskeleton in place, So, the central core CAN stand on its own without the support of the exoskeleton.


.

They didn't "first create the core, which then stood by itself."
Do you REALLY believe this?

The whole tower was created a few COMPLETE floors at a time. They would build some floors, Then move up the self climbing cranes and build a few more COMPLETE floors.

This is why I don't agrue this crap anymore, this will get ignored and the next bs theory will be brought up. Like no planes, steel vaporizing energy weapons, mini nukes...............and on and on.

I will believe that yes, 4 planes flown by 19 hijakers, brought down 3 towers and part of the pentagon on 9/11, until it is PROVEN otherwise.

And posts like I replied to here DO NOT help the ct side. Please gain a little KNOWLEDGE before exposing the lack of to all.

Did our government know? Maybe. Are there things we don't know that went on that day? probably.

But come on now..............

Occam's razor

People would do well to listen to stosh64. But hey, when do people ever do what's good for them?

a reply to: IntastellaBurst

When we come for them they wont know whether to cry or soil themsevles but be sure they wont do one thing : fight back.

You really expect them to just sit somewhere we can come to them any time we please? That's practically inviting ingrates and peasant and common folk to their doorstep. they are far too clever to leave themselves so vulnerable. they want to be in a position where they can know your life story before you ever guess their names. See you coming from a mile off and have the scene scripted from lights to curtains before you even enter stage right.