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A question for everyone regarding immigration

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posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 01:46 AM
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originally posted by: Metallicus
No. It wouldn't change my mind.

The people broke our laws and illegally invaded our country.


Pretty sure those of the First Nations would say the same thing buddy.




posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 01:47 AM
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a reply to: Daedal

Now you are just playing the part of troll. I won't bite. To me it is inhumane to take a child away from his or her home and not teach them anything, refuse to follow laws teaching them its okay to break them, and essentially set them up to fail, and then because of individuals that have some movie like mentality that the crazy species of humans are in anyway humane to begin with can be expected to practice humanity...bad word to begin with...just a shame.
edit on 11/23/2014 by DJMSN because: correction



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 01:51 AM
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a reply to: DJMSN

I do troll, but it's on a boat. Perhaps you don't like my response.

I'm merely responding to your posts and others, no more no less. And l didn't take the thread off topic, others did.

And l did ask a few posts ago to stay on topic.

edit on 23-11-2014 by Daedal because: edit



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:06 AM
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a reply to: Daedal

I'm aware. I don't know how to answer your question.

I don't have a problem with the amnesty that was just granted, so I don't think I'm qualified to say if it would change my mind if we deported someone that would have changed the world.

I don't think the question you posed is actually fair. It assumes too many things in a very dynamic situation. So would letting them stay somehow inhibit children here with the same potential for changing the world? Would it have a very drastic effect on our economy, on our healthcare system and school systems? Are two geniuses actually worth more than a ton of children with adequate schooling? I can do this forever. Are children from foreign countries with parents that need to immigrate somewhere else going to be bright, one could argue that genetics would say no, that parents wouldn't need to move if they were bright because they would have done better in their own country.

You want me to forgo all that and just give a snap answer? Yes, 5 million people are worth it if two of their children could dramatically (and I mean DRAMATICALLY) change the world for the better. I don't like giving that answer, but I get what you're going for.

I don't think geniuses are just born, and I think they would be recognized. Someone with that potential would probably get here or to another place with prestigious schools either way.

I really feel for illegals. I can't imagine what it would be like to want so badly to leave my country. I want everyone on this planet to have safety, food, shelter, clean water, access to medical care, a future, a feeling of pride and purpose, and education. I really want that. And more. I want people to be happy.

Here's the problem. There are 45,000 homeless people in NYC alone. There are kids that can't eat. There are untold numbers of my fellow citizens that struggle to pay rent, to pay for medicine and groceries. Letting more people come into a country that is clearly doing a crap job of affording basic human rights to all it's citizens is a shameful and horrible idea. You help your neighbors first.

When I stop seeing people sleeping on the street and begging for food, let more people in. When I stop seeing people drowning in debt to pay for health costs, let more in. When all the children drifting through foster care find a permanent loving home, let more in.

We need to fix our home before we invite guests, and that breaks my heart for a number of reasons.
edit on 2320141120141 by Domo1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:08 AM
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a reply to: Daedal

Fair enough...I took a low blow at you first without even realizing it, and I never took it off topic, just a bit passionate about the subject. I honestly think its a train wreck shot from the hip which all of politicians do instead of actually addressing the problem which are bad laws.

If we need to fix something broken we fix it, not just wave a magic wand and expect it to work out. Mr. Obama is guilty of wand waving more than most without weighing the consequences. I do believe the majority of immigrants will be productive and help shape our country but its going to be a rough road to get there...and a very expensive one...but one thing he can look forward too is the ACA is finally going to have people enroll.



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:11 AM
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a reply to: Domo1

Thanks for your reply. I appreciate your honesty.

Best regards.



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:12 AM
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a reply to: Daedal

If such people ARE in the mix of those 5 million then they have NEVER been needed more in their countries than now. The only way to SOLVE this is for their home countries to start providing and taking care of them. It REALLY is on them. The solution is dependent on them, not us.

The fact is that 5 freaking MILLION people who broke the law to get here are not the sort of people I want in my country. Especially in those numbers.

To be cold and logical about it....I want 5 million of MY PEOPLE to be better taken care of. We deserve the fruits of our labor and that of those who came before us with US in mind.

I am glad everyone is so loving, but its worthless if you dont start loving the ones at home first. Its fake and BS.

We dont deserve this as a country. We dont deserve yet another smack in the face and yet another insult to us. We have been through enough.....its time the American people were cared for....

This is all a ploy to buy future votes. Thats the worst part.

I am starting to hate the left...and maybe thats the point.


edit on 11 23 2014 by tadaman because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:19 AM
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originally posted by: Domo1

originally posted by: VictorVonDoom
a reply to: Daedal

If you have two people who are going to change the world, why would they have to be in the United States? Maybe they would have better opportunities in another country. Maybe being in the US is a hindrance to their world changing mission. I haven't seen a lot of "world changing for the better" stuff coming out of the US lately.


Oh please. Being in the US is going to give anyone an advantage when you compare Mexico.

Some little genius tucked away in a crapass Mexican city is going to have a much better education and a much better chance of succeeding here.



What about Britain? France? Canada? The Vatican? China? Japan? Lots of countries have many fine educational opportunities. Then there is the opportunity to do the work. Will someone in the US provide the world with a better solution to GMO crops? Not if Monsanto has anything to say about it. Do you see the US becoming a leader in solar technology, or producing a cheap substitute for oil?

The US may be the go-to country if you want to be a lawyer, a soldier, a government employee, a business leader, or a prisoner. But world changing innovation doesn't seem to be our strong suit anymore.



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:26 AM
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originally posted by: auroraaus

originally posted by: Metallicus
No. It wouldn't change my mind.

The people broke our laws and illegally invaded our country.


Pretty sure those of the First Nations would say the same thing buddy.


Maybe if it were 500 years ago you could ask them and your comment might actually be relevant.

Also, please keep your condescending "buddy" references to yourself. I am not your "buddy".



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:26 AM
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What if coming to the US prevented them from changing the world for the better? What if they came to the US and became someone worse than Stalin? Any hypothetical future possibility doesn't change the fact the US has immigration laws and if you believe they need to be changed the correct way is to do it through congress.

Congress is responsible for crafting laws in a representative Republic as laws are too important and complex to be made by a single man. There needs to be debate and enough representatives of the people who agree with the proposed changes before changes are made. Hypothetical situations might be fun and make a good episode on star trek or the twilight zone but in the end we live in the real world where we don't know the future.
edit on 23-11-2014 by john452 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:33 AM
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originally posted by: Metallicus
Maybe if it were 500 years ago you could ask them and your comment might actually be relevant.

Also, please keep your condescending "buddy" references to yourself. I am not your "buddy".

But they would actually probably say the same.



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:34 AM
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originally posted by: auroraaus

originally posted by: Metallicus
No. It wouldn't change my mind.

The people broke our laws and illegally invaded our country.


Pretty sure those of the First Nations would say the same thing buddy.


Yes and would you want what happened to the first nations people to happen to the people living in America today? Personally I wouldn't wish that on any peoples and if anything it highlights the need to have immigration laws and to enforce them.



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:37 AM
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a reply to: john452

What if they just serve mc donalds for the rest of their lives and the world and THEIR countries miss out on one of their important minds.

Its insulting on one hand to think that they cant make it in their "crap" countries. Its insulting on the other hand to 5 million of our poorest and most needy citizens to help others when we still have people starving in our country who dont get educated and dont get health care, and dont get a road to the American dream everyone is whoring out.

If we can commit to 5 million poor people from other countries why cant we take those same committed resources and help our own people first.

We dont deserve it? Our poor we send to wars, that we forget about in our slums, that we profit off with drugs and ravage as prostitutes, that we send to prison for trying to eat, that we forsake to the streets in winter....they dont deserve that help FIRST?

If its about morality, tell an American impoverished child that he will eat government cheese for the rest of his life because the next elections are so important that we have to put his needs aside. That we have to make that government cheese that much worse because we need to feed 5 million more mouths now.

Do you guys realize what 5 million people will cost? Do you realize what propping up 5 million of our poorest would do for our country?

5 million people....Its a drop in the bucket considering the BILLIONS that need to improve the conditions at home in their home countries for a difference to be made. Its an ocean of good for our people if we truly have the money to throw around.

I think we have earned it. We have served the world faithfully and now, we really are in times of need. Our country is poor people. Dont be fooled because we have more millionaires. In order to have more upper wealth like we have the rest below them need to be poorer. Arent you poorer? Thats true for the rest of the country too. Things are getting much worse for our kids and families and you want to play high morality NOW and take in other peoples responsibility so you feel better? Dont you feel like crap for dividing our country like this and forsaking us to worse conditions still?


edit on 11 23 2014 by tadaman because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:44 AM
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a reply to: tadaman




Arent you poorer?

No. Been doing steadily better for 20 years or so. Slowed down some in the past year but poor? No.
Not a millionaire either.
edit on 11/23/2014 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:46 AM
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originally posted by: tadaman
Its insulting on one hand to think that they cant make it in their "crap" countries...

Our country is poor people.

So what are you arguing about?



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:46 AM
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a reply to: Phage

SO happy phage.

Good for YOU.

Are you REALLY going to tell me that we are not worse off now as a country financially than before. REALLY.

I usually leave you be because you are relentless and I dont care to entertain you.

Not with this. If you want I will stomp this out with you for the next 12 hours.

lets go.


edit on 11 23 2014 by tadaman because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:46 AM
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a reply to: daskakik

what dont you understand. Start with that.



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:47 AM
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a reply to: tadaman

Thank you for asking.



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:47 AM
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originally posted by: tadaman
what dont you understand. Start with that.

Start with what?



posted on Nov, 23 2014 @ 02:48 AM
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a reply to: daskakik

What are you asking.




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