Obama is announcing immigration reform ....

a reply to: Aazadan

Welfare benefits, especially food stamps dramatically reduce crime. If we cut off their food support we're going to turn a bunch of docile illegals into criminals as they do whatever they need to, to survive.

We have people living in tent cities and on the streets, many who commit no crimes. Many of these people have fallen through the cracks and couldn't get help because they made a buck or two above the poverty limit which doesn't help them one bit. Many have to decide between life saving medicine or food or rent or whatever and it breaks my heart. And when you see ICE raid companies and then jobs are given to citizens, you can see where citizens needed those jobs all along.

When people think illegals deserve those jobs, what they are saying is that a citizen does not. Why is it that a citizen's family doesn't matter? We cannot say that our own citizens don't matter, because they do.

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: Night Star


We KNOW the Country was built on immigrants. We are NOT talking about immigrants! We are talking about ILLEGAl immigrants

Just because reality matters..
No, Your Ancestors Didn’t Come Here Legally
talkingpointsmemo.com...

As long as there are borders and laws, we must uphold those laws and not pick and choose which ones to follow. It is never wise to allow people to come through without health or background checks.

originally posted by: Night Star
At the expense of a citizen? Yes it's bad. They are citizens of another Country taking a job that a citizen desperately needs to care for his family. Pro illegals will defend illegals at every turn while never acknowledging the fact that citizens are suffering because of them. It's like they don't exist, they don't matter. I have seen with my own eyes American citizens turned away while an illegal was hired instead, not because they were more capable but because the company could easily screw them over.

I always say that I don't wish for anyone to suffer in any way no matter who they are or where they are from. I believe that Countries should look after their own and then if they can help others. But to take away from a citizen and give it to a foreigner who just waltzed over the border or over stayed a visa isn't right. It isn't right for the citizen. It isn't right for the millions trying to come here through the proper channels. You can't just place these people above all others

This happens all the time. The thing is though, as long as we have a substantial illegal population we have to look at them as a group. As a group they'll work the same job for half the wage and that takes a job away from an honest citizen. What are we supposed to do though? We can't deport them because we can't afford it (if we could get the political will) and we can't leave them as a subclass because honest citizens can't compete with that. In a lot of ways the problem with illegals is the same as the problem with prison labor. They both offer workers at slave wages which honest citizens can't compete with.

I'm not pro illegal, I'm just being realistic about the situation. There's really only two things we can do. We need to secure the border, even if that means war with the cartels that are doing the human trafficking and we need to grant amnesty. If these workers are legal, they get certain protections and we can atleast shrink the wage gap that they're using to compete.

a reply to: Aazadan

The thing is that with every amnesty we have had, we ended with millions more coming and hoping for the next one. It has never worked out for us. It has cost us billions of dollars just for schooling alone. It has cost citizens their livelihood. If these illegals were given a warning that within a certain amount of times the jobs would no longer be there for them or the freebies, they would self deport. There was a video of some guy who was going back to his own Country because jobs were getting too hard to find. He said as soon as things picked up and there were more jobs that he would just come back.

We were promised secure borders after the last amnesty and it never happened.

As long as we allow them to work here, accept anchor babies as citizens and offer freebies, there will be no end to this. It has become such a mess and will only get worse.

a reply to: Night Star

I don't disagree with what you're saying but we can address it a different way by actually securing the border. The problem is that securing the border is also expensive. Right now we're more or less letting the cartels do it, and in exchange they can smuggle people/drugs into the US as payment. In order to stop the flow of illegals we need to actually secure it which probably means deploying the military to the border, but there's some constitutional issues with that. Securing a border as large as the Mexican border is not easy, especially when the neighboring country is in no position to assist.

We could try going after people that hire illegals but that's not easy either, when only the employer and employee know that someone is illegal (and even the employer may not know) then how are you going to find them?

Amnesty unfortunately has to happen, but taking steps to ensure we don't need another amnesty also has to happen.

a reply to: Aazadan

I agree with a lot you said, but amnesty never worked and only made things worse and never ends. Frankly, I think we're screwed. LOL