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USA Freedom Act bill DEAD ! ...for now

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posted on Nov, 18 2014 @ 11:57 PM
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The US Senate failed to get the 60 votes needed to break a filibuster and move forward with the USA Freedom Act, which would have placed significant restrictions on the way the National Security Agency's conducts surveillance domestically.

i see this as a short victory !


enior Republicans said stopping the surveillance would benefit enemies of the United State, including Islamic State militants, according to Reuters.

"God forbid that tomorrow we wake up to the news that a member of ISIL is in the United States," said Sen. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.), according to the Huffington Post. If the NSA cannot track phone calls, he said, "that plot may go forward -- and that would be a horrifying result."

"Let's not have another repeat of 9/11," added Sen. Dan Coats (R-Ind.).


please ! , "terror" " taking away your freedoms one false flag at a time ! "




However, Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.) said there has been no evidence to suggest that the NSA's surveillance program prevented a terrorist attack on the US.

"If this was important to stop ISIL, ISIL never would have started," he said.

The bill, now effectively dead for this year, would have stopped the NSA from collecting the phone records of millions of Americans who are not suspected of any crime. The reforms are unlikely to be reviewed when the new Congress convenes in January, but the controversial surveillance program will most likely be debated next year as Congress decides whether to renew the Patriot Act, which serves as the foundation for the NSA's activity.


good point Sen.Patrick Leahy !




If passed into law, the bill would have placed metadata records – information such as the time a call was made and the duration of the call, but not the actual content of the call itself – in the possession of telephone companies instead of the NSA. If intelligence agencies wanted access to the data, they would have to seek approval from the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISA).

The bill would also allow public advocates to participate in Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISA) proceedings. Additionally, the government would be required to disclose FISA opinions and statistics about the extent of domestic spying activities, though these could be withheld if they posed a risk to national security.



meh... i am still glad they didn't pass the bill , although i am sure most of us has already been profiled and stored away on some computer somewhere lol ....

so what are you thoughts on this ATS

Glad the bill didn't pass?
or sad the bill didn't pass ?

i would like to see some pro and con positions on this ! cause i don't really know much about the bill


you can read more HERE

Walsh
edit on 19-11-2014 by Walsh because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 12:36 AM
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As most know I stand with Sen. Wyden on this.


Interesting to see other replies.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 01:10 AM
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a reply to: Walsh

So OP you are against liberty and freedom.......Did you even understand what this bill was about? The PTB won by this bill not passing.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 01:17 AM
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originally posted by: SubTruth
a reply to: Walsh

So OP you are against liberty and freedom.......Did you even understand what this bill was about? The PTB won by this bill not passing.


no no , i am not against liberty and freedom . but as far as i understand this bill gives the NSA the right to spy on Americans but that the data would have to go through a third party (court) before the NSA could use it ?



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 01:41 AM
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a reply to: Walsh



This bill was in fact trying to gain back some liberty and freedom OP. The patriot act already ripped a huge hole in the fabric of liberty this bill was trying to sew it back together a little bit.


It is good to understand what you are talking about before posting a thread.......I know that sounds harsh but it is the truth.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 01:52 AM
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What they have set out to do they will do regardless of political turbulence along the way. When other things fail, enter the false flag or other overriding pretext. It seems they have a whole plethora of potential special fx to start the final cycle. Not one thing is reliant on the US Government they are impotent, they couldn't protect their own "freedom", totally useless, pawned, bought, a brothel, a puppet show, as good as done. They are now part of the distraction play with the rest of the global national governments being governed mostly by super-corporate global finance powers assisting Anglo-American empire expansion regardless what happens to the nation-state.

The more indebted, middle class broken and profiled and surveillanced America becomes, the better for the global empire expansion which is the overall goal. All the national powers are in some variation of the same stranglehold.
edit on 19-11-2014 by 4444Winds because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 01:55 AM
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a reply to: Walsh



Also Op I wanted to add TPTB gained.... well we actually lost most of our liberty with the Patriot Act. Truth be told the constitution should out trump this illegal law but apathy and fear rule our country at this point. If you give up liberty for safety you will have lose both.



DHS has a standing army at this point and the laws preventing the military from being used on American soil mean nothing because of this simple fact. Hitler did the same exact thing keeping the SS for mostly homegrown problems.



A framework has been built, what it will be used for in the future depends on who has control of it. Imagine a man like Cheney or Rumsfeld gaining control over this framework................Progressives have gained control of our country using fear and apathy.
edit on 19-11-2014 by SubTruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 01:56 AM
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originally posted by: SubTruth
a reply to: Walsh



This bill was in fact trying to gain back some liberty and freedom OP. The patriot act already ripped a huge hole in the fabric of liberty this bill was trying to sew it back together a little bit.


It is good to understand what you are talking about before posting a thread.......I know that sounds harsh but it is the truth.



like i stated , i don't know much about the bill , that's why i presented it to ATS to get some Opinions.

and i disagree with what you are saying , the bill would have allowed the NSA to take more data




If passed into law, the bill would have placed metadata records – information such as the time a call was made and the duration of the call, but not the actual content of the call itself – in the possession of telephone companies instead of the NSA. If intelligence agencies wanted access to the data, they would have to seek approval from the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISA).


so basically its giving them the "OK" to take an monitor data ?

BS ! it all needs to stop ! , its not ok ! , bills like this always some kind of backdoor fine print to them ..

just saying
edit on 19-11-2014 by Walsh because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:01 AM
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a reply to: Walsh




so basically its giving them the "OK" to take an monitor data ?

No. Without the phone company "monitoring" the data there would be no phone service at all. Do you know how the cellular system works? Do you know how the phone company bills you?

The bill said that the data belongs to the phone company and not the NSA.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:03 AM
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originally posted by: 4444Winds
What they have set out to do they will do regardless of political turbulence along the way. When other things fail, enter the false flag or other overriding pretext. It seems they have a whole plethora of potential special fx to start the final cycle. Not one thing is reliant on the US Government they are impotent, they couldn't protect their own "freedom", totally useless, pawned, bought, a brothel, a puppet show, as good as done. They are now part of the distraction play with the rest of the global national governments being governed mostly by super-corporate global finance powers assisting Anglo-American empire expansion regardless what happens to the nation-state.

The more indebted, middle class broken and profiled and surveillanced America becomes, the better for the global empire expansion which is the overall goal. All the national powers are in some variation of the same stranglehold.






Kinda hard to follow but I get your points. I would like to add this is not just a western issue......Oligarchies control many countries including........Russia,China,Europe,India,Middle East,Mexico.......Many others.


The progressive mindset is the root cause of tyranny and control. When the rights of the masses out weigh the rights of the individual tyranny will follow. Democracy is a lie for the young and foolish and this is why the founding fathers of America broke the pattern and made a Republic ruled by law. Many people do not even understand what the difference between a Republic and a Democracy are.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:06 AM
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a reply to: Walsh

OP the NSA is recording and storing everything in a new center out in Utah. This law just like Phage posted would put some stop gaps into the system.




Op gets it now......Good.
edit on 19-11-2014 by SubTruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:08 AM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Walsh




so basically its giving them the "OK" to take an monitor data ?

No. Without the phone company "monitoring" the data there would be no phone service at all. Do you know how the cellular system works? Do you know how the phone company bills you?

The bill said that the data belongs to the phone company and not the NSA.



right, and they would have to go (FISA) in order to collect any data right ?

i might have misread that clipping , for some reason i was under the impression that it was give the NSA more "rights" to collect data .

so , in other words it would give them a green light just as long as their actions were monitored and overseen by a court .

my stance is that i the whole domestic spying should be stooped period . and with a bill like this , it will continue ...



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:10 AM
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originally posted by: SubTruth
a reply to: Walsh

OP the NSA is recording and storing everything in a new center out in Utah. This law just like Phage posted would put some stop gaps into the system.




I am starting to think this OP has some reading comprehension issues or is trolling. If it walks like a duck........And it quakes like a duck........Just saying.


essentially giving them the "OK" to spy ? when in reality they need to be passing bills in order to shut down the spying period .

this bill just allows them to do it , its basically a controlled burning



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:12 AM
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a reply to: Walsh

And just for the record OP I can understand why you thought this was taking away liberty.......When I hear names like Patriot or freedom acts I think anti-liberty right away also.




The patriot act name sounds like it should be upholding liberty not tearing it apart and then taking a dump on it.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:14 AM
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a reply to: Walsh



i might have misread that clipping , for some reason i was under the impression that it was give the NSA more "rights" to collect data .

so , in other words it would give them a green light just as long as their actions were monitored and overseen by a court

You still might be missing it. Under the bill (had it passed) the NSA would have to have obtained court authority to obtain the records from the phone companies (a warrant, more or less), not to collect the data themselves. It would also have provided more open access to the activities of the court itself.


edit on 11/19/2014 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:15 AM
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originally posted by: SubTruth
a reply to: Walsh

And just for the record OP I can understand why you thought this was taking away liberty.......When I hear names like Patriot or freedom acts I think anti-liberty right away also.




The patriot act name sounds like it should be upholding liberty not tearing it apart and then taking a dump on it.


boy do i feel dumb , to late to edit my OP :/



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:20 AM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Walsh



i might have misread that clipping , for some reason i was under the impression that it was give the NSA more "rights" to collect data .

so , in other words it would give them a green light just as long as their actions were monitored and overseen by a court

You still might be missing it. Under the bill (had it passed) the NSA would have to have obtain court authority to obtain the records from the phone companies (a warrant, more or less), not to collect the data themselves. It would also have provided more open access to the activities of the court itself.



well , Shoot .... wtf , its like a double edged blade ... dammed if you do dammed if you don't .

i understand fully now , thanks for enlightening me . i totally misread that whole news clipping .

i thought we had a victory today boys....

i should have known it was to good to be true .

i just feel like this will some how end up covering the NSA ass somehow this bill...
all they need is some shady judge to buy out.

wish they would pass a bill to stop the domestic spying .

thanks Phage once again for enlightening me . and to the other fellow subTruth.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:26 AM
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a reply to: Walsh

I think you read it wrong. The NSA already collects and stores the data unconstitutionaly and the bill would make it so the phone companies who already retain the data because they need it to provide service, would not have to give it up for mass collection like the NSA does without a court order. Right now the NSA just takes everything because apparently all of the citizens in the United states are terrorists or will be soon enough. So this bill was actually something you want to get behind if I understand your views correctly.



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:29 AM
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wait now ....





WASHINGTON -- Rand Paul, a leader of the libertarian wing of the Republican Party, helped kill a bill meant to rein in the National Security Agency. Huh?

The USA Freedom Act, sponsored by Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), received 58 votes on Tuesday night -- two short of cloture, the magic number in the Senate that allows a bill to proceed to an actual roll call.

The 40 Republicans and one Democrat who voted against cloture mostly did so because they thought the bill went too far. Paul also voted against NSA reform -- because, he said, it didn't go far enough.

Paul said he voted against the bill because it would have extended the Patriot Act provision that allows the NSA to search Americans’ phone records. He has consistently opposed the Patriot Act, passed in the wake of the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

Leahy’s bill extended the provision’s expiration to June 2017 -- as a compromise, in order to change the law to stop the NSA from holding onto phone records. Under Leahy’s bill, that duty would have been handed off to phone companies. The companies' records could only have been searched with a surveillance court's order.

While Paul said he “felt bad” that the bill failed, because it “probably needed my vote," he also claimed the country was "one step closer to restoring civil liberties," because the Patriot Act provision's expiration date will not be extended.


so this bill would have extended the provisions of the original patriot act ?



posted on Nov, 19 2014 @ 02:30 AM
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It would be amazing though, if we never even had to have this conversation in the first place because our elected officials actually read the God damn constitution or had the balls to challenge those that think they have the right to collect innocent citizens information with absolutely no just cause.

Soon enough people will realize they've been duped into this and the entire system will collapse.



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