Churches Hiding the Truth

You said, "I do not know why the churches are not telling the people this facts, but is really a problem."

To that I ask, why do you need the churches to tell you anything? You discovered these facts on your own apparently, so perhaps others would come to the same conclusions. If it really is the truth, it should be discoverable by anyone who is earnestly searching.

a reply to: Ellie Sagan

Mattew 7:6

Do not give dogs what is holy, and do not throw your pearls before pigs, lest they trample them underfoot and turn to attack you.

originally posted by: OperationBlackRose
a reply to: OperationBlackRose

Oky, so no one that has any constructive contribution to the subject, only non believers, or people choosing what to believe?

You clearly don't care about truth, only what you want to hear.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Seen this other gem from the op?.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: boymonkey74

No I hadn't, but I see it is cleverly hidden in the religion and theology forum instead of the origins and creationism forum (where it should be even though it is CLEARLY a trollish OP).

a reply to: DISRAELI

Just so. This is the same God who broke man apart into tribes at the Tower of Babel with different languages after all. If he gave us differing languages, then he knows that we will use different words for Him.

Or to use my linguistics/language background:

All language is symbolic. When I type the word "chair" and you read it, you will have an image of a chair of some sort in your mind. Likely that image will attach to impression and memories making your context for chair incredibly rich, and no two people will have exactly the same mental context for "chair" although they will be similar enough that mostly everyone here will get what I mean from the word.

Now, say someone comes along who types in Chinese or Spanish or even Latin. They will use a different set of symbols entirely for "chair" even though if we could see what is going on inside their heads they will have extremely similar mental images and impressions to what the rest of us who recognize "chair" will have. The only barrier is what set of sounds and symbols they use to trigger those mental images which are, in the main, the same.

This same principle will apply when we talk to God as well. We will all have the same mental meaning in our hearts and minds no matter what sounds and symbols we end up using in our speech which is entirely superficial.

originally posted by: FlyersFan

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

originally posted by: OperationBlackRose
In my view, the churches, and church leaders, are hiding the truth from the people.

Serious question - what makes you think they actually know what the truth is?
I kinda doubt they do know.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

Exactly.
It's been more of a cobbled edifice, rooms with collapsing floors - locked off, swept under the carpet...this 'years' model is much better than last 'years' model...we hear a lot of 'pearls before swine', when it's more like cubic zirconians before sheep...

They may not have 'truth', but they certainly can litigate thier truth many times over with uncountable filthy lucre that can buy them the best counsel on earth, rewriting history as they roll out the red carpet of zirconic splendour...

Shame really...

Å99

They won't give you truth! They are Babylon the great! The bible says quite clearly to "get out of her" unless you want to ahare in her plagues. Jesus said religion is a snare and a racket.....He said his father does not live in man made temples......he said where 2 or 3 are agtyered he is there in thier midst. His deciples were wanderers, spreading the good news, not going week after week to the place of bake sales, hallowwen parties and christmas living a cushy life with a huge social life!

The Son's proper name is Jesus H. Christ, God the Father is Hank (that's were the H. originates. The Holy Ghost's real name is Jehosephat, after his uncle.

a reply to: OperationBlackRose

(If I might say, this is a Christian thread. I would really like it is Non-believers did not take part)

NO such thing in a world of such diversity,

What you would like and what happens are usually two different things, one learns that quite a young age I would hope.

I do not know why the churches are not telling the people this facts, but is really a problem.

So do you follow your Christian beliefs or are you helping this so called deception you think you have uncovered?

That is the problem today. Let us create a situation to illustrate my point. If you grow up knowing only the name Lucifer as 'god'. Can you pray to that name, when you are in fact want to pray to the Holy Father and Creator? And if 'Lord" is only a label, how sure are you the corrects 'Lord' is listening to you and will answer you prayers?

I take it the answer is a big NO if you think the creator is so fallible and not omnipotent and omnipresent as the holy books describe.

What matters is not a name but a persons belief, if one believes they are praying to the one and only God then that One and only true God is listening no matter what the person praying calls them.


This is a christian only thread, Jesus, If you are Christian have more faith in GOD than you do.

Please entertain some of my thoughts on your topic:

Churches, for the most part are a place for people to start on their path to knowledge. If you join a church, whether officially or unofficially, you have identified yourself as a seeker.
Many churches are a device used to garner power and wealth by selling something most cant quite figure out for themselves. As a result, people can be easily led away or towards the truth depending on how enlightened their chosen leader truly is, or the nature of their true intent.
Churches have been turned to nefarious purposes by demented souls over the history of mankind.
Most churches have nothing to hide because they are selling the same sorry excuse for the "Word of God" that they started with. No enlightenment there, just regurgitation.
There are churches that hide their true purpose from the flock so to speak. Many offer very good educations along the way, but if you never think for yourself it will become indoctrination instead of enlightenment.
No one knows if the truth they are buying is the truth they were seeking unless they follow their hearts.
If you seek the truth then you are capable of finding it. If along the way you are misled it is no conviction of you or your mental capacity. The sin is done by the beguiler; the sheep that follow the shepherd over a cliff are guilty of nothing more than faith.
Faith is the belief in something better, more promising than what you have, what you know. It is the hope that there is something better over the next horizon that keeps you climbing the hill.
Knowledge is the end of the journey. Knowledge is when you have figured "it" out. Whether by chance, trial and error or simply being gifted with the answer. You will know when you have found what you are seeking by the feeling that comes over you, the joy of discovery and the light it brings to your countenance.
There are seekers and there are founders.
There are true leaders of men and there are men who are willing to lead you anywhere for the power it gives them and the wealth they seek.
Religion is interchangeable with politics. The only difference is the goal in mind. One seeks to control and guide you during your physical life, the other during your spiritual life. Both will tell you how to think and what is best for you. Both will threaten you with fines(penance) or imprisonment(damnation). Both are vile, hurtful things that only accomplish enhancing the differences between people or Peoples. Both lay down the rules for you, knowing the same rules do not apply in their own chambers.
Hypocrisy is the root of most evil. If you allow it to exist unchallenged it will fester and grow.
The choices you make in your life determine how far you will make it on your path to enlightenment.
You cannot be saved by baptism or confession.
Baptism is a formal commitment to your religion, it is ceremonial and means nothing without the commitment in your heart. You can find this same commitment without going through the song and dance. In fact, the latter is a more sincere form of commitment.
Confession is an acknowledgement of wrongdoing. It is not a reset of your soul or a get-out-of-jail-free card.
No one can forgive your sins except the person or persons injured by your actions, words or deeds.

I could go on, but this is the point where you need to think for yourself.

Follow your heart. Let your mind be open and receptive. We all seek the same thing, even those that claim not to be looking.

You will find your path.

Blee

a reply to: OperationBlackRose

Even the feasts of today. Everyone is keeping feasts like Halloween, Valentines day, Christmas, and other. But where do we have the right to keep Pagan feast. The Scripture says that we should keep only 7 feast, His Feasts. I do not know why the churches are not telling the people this facts, but is really a problem.

I don't think that the many denominations are deliberately misleading people. I do believe that most people actually believe they are the rightful interpreters of scriptures. I also believe that the Torah was given to certain people such as the Hebrews. I don't believe that Torah was given to all people from the onset. In order for Torah to be your mindset you must adopt the Hebrew belief in its entirety. I do read the OT and I accept the historical portion along with the generalization of the prophets but I do not adopt Torah as a religion. Torah was a covenant between God and the Hebrews.

If you look closely at the Hebrew people themselves you will then understand that not all Hebrews accepted Torah in the same manner. You have sects in Hebrew theology as well as in gentile theology. The Sadducees were not in agreement with the Pharisees and the Essenes were not accepted by either of the others. At least that is the way they were at the time of Christ Jesus. So in respect to all, they were as divided as gentiles are today and in fact are just as divide today as they were then. Yet they all claim that they are the rightful of Torah. Today the Jews have conservative, reform and orthodox movements. Movements is just a play of word which is the same as denominations. The entire outcome is that Torah is viewed differently today by groups the same as over two thousand years ago.

As the Christ Jesus came upon the scene He ushered in a new covenant of which most gentiles base their denominations. This new covenant of Jesus is altogether different theology than that of rabbinic theology. The entire concept is likened as between day and night. Now out of this new covenant we have (God only knows) hundreds of denominations or concepts of the intent and workings of this new covenant. It's mind boggling to say the least.

Now I do believe that some of this is power and monetary gain but not all is centered around power and money. Some is simply ignorance of the biblical literature. As far as the feasts and liturgy are concerned the gentiles are supposed to have been unified with the Jews into one spiritual concept insofar as the covenant of Jesus is concerned but I certainly don't see that happening as yet. The feasts of the old covenant are given to those who adopt this covenant but not to the new covenant which rejects the old covenant. Jesus is the new covenant and He is still rejected by the mainstream Judaic authorities. The secular holidays are not actually feast days but I do agree with you that they are pagan.

So you mention the Torah and wanted to just provide you this information. I'm a very spiritual person and was religious about a decade ago until I further researched to topic extensively. Within the Hebrew written "Five Books of Moses" also going by the name of "Pentateuch", in addition to the Torah were borrowed and heavily altered from their Egyptian Tarot roots. One should note that the Torah is an anagram of Tarot.

This OP, is most observed within the example of the Tarot being a 78 card pack sold in many stores and used for fortune telling.

The Tarot set consists of five suits which are: the wands or rods of fire, the swords of air, the cups of water, the pentacles of earth, and the trump of quintessence or ether. The trump suit was omitted from the standard deck of playing cards, and all that remains of the trump is the Fool card, which was kept as the Joker. All of these are elements of the human soul and the message of the Tarot aside from its divination capabilities is the Magnum Opus, which leads to physical and spiritual perfection and immortality. All of this was borrowed and then altered upon entry into a fictitious history of the Jews, which has nothing to do unfortunately with spirituality.

The Jewish Talmud instructs the Jewish people to destroy Gentiles and enslave them, as "YHVH" in reality is the Jewish people.

Quote from the Talmud - Sanhedrin 58b. If a heathen hits a Jew, the Gentile must be killed. Hitting a Jew is the same as hitting God.

The false and fictitious Jewish God or Yaweh was used to replace the names of many Gentile/Pagan Gods.

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: OperationBlackRose

Jesus is the english translation for Yehoshua.

Here is a thought. Why should you translate n name? A man named Bill in England will still be Bill in the rest of the world. Whether he goes to Italy, Germany, Congo of Iraq. And why is the name Yoshua still in use today? I comes from the Name Yehoshua, so why was that name not translated into something like 'Josus'?

originally posted by: FlyersFan

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

originally posted by: OperationBlackRose
In my view, the churches, and church leaders, are hiding the truth from the people.

Serious question - what makes you think they actually know what the truth is?
I kinda doubt they do know.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

Serious answer. I ask them. I ask them 5 questions, whether I know them or not.

1- Do you know that 'Lord God' is not the real name, but Yahweh is?
2- Do you know that 'Jesus' is not the real name, but Yehoshua is?
3- Do you know that in the 'New Testament' it clearly states the we should keep the Torah?
4- Do you know that we are commanded to keep the seven feast of Yahweh (Passover, Unleavened, First-fruits, Pentecost, Trumpets, Atonement, Tabernacles) ?
5- If you know all of this, then why do you know teach this to 'your people'?

Here is a truth that they seem to hide from themselves!
The bible clearly states that a women's vow is made void if the husband doesn't approve!
Giving your heart to God is a vow is it not??
Women are commanded to obey their husbands.
So well women are only "saved" if their husband's approves of the arrangement!
So why do the christians go door to door inviting women and children to church? Shouldn't they be talking to the men?
Why do they keep telling women if they don't want a baby they shouldn't be having sex? Shouldn't they be talking to the men??
Why do they bast women for the way they dress? Shouldn't they be talking to the men???

a reply to: OperationBlackRose

"They" don't 'KNOW' that is why 'they' attend a Church™... So 'they' cannot provide 'TheTruth' because 'they' do NOT KNOW 'it'... 'TheTruth' is something that will never bend/break that is what makes it 'true' A rifle barrel is 'true' when it is straight..

You are seeking 'TheTruth' from folks who "believe", 'feel', "thought" and KNOW trumps these each, every time. The only constant in Life is "change" Yet 'TheTruth' does NOT.

I noticed You only wanted Chris†ians to respond? The blind leading the blind....

I noticed You're using Jesus (again)? When He instructed those to veer from the Church™ "They" killed Him and pinned it on His bff, Judas. Does Judas have a Gospel? If "Yes" what does that read? Didn't Jesus say 'You ARE TheChurch™'? Then why would You 'go to Church™? You're already there.. Let the hypocrites go once a week or more if'n they 'feel' guilty... See? if they KNEW they weren't 'guilty' what then?

Who let the Dogma out who, who?

I'd ask the Ones who don't need a "rule book" what they think...

Best of luck in Your search...

namaste

a reply to: OperationBlackRose

here is a fact Bill is not a proper name it is a shortened version of the Name William.
and as for the many different ways is spelled and pronouned here is a list.

GENDER: Masculine USAGE: English PRONOUNCED: BIL [key] Meaning & History Short form of WILLIAM. This spelling was first used in the 19th century. The change in the initial consonant may have been influenced by an earlier Irish pronunciation of the name.
VARIANTS: Wil, Will, Willie, Willy
DIMINUTIVES: Billie, Billy
FEMININE FORM: Willa
OTHER LANGUAGES: Wilhelm, Willahelm (Ancient Germanic), Gwilherm (Breton), Guillem (Catalan), Vilim, Vilko (Croatian), Vilém (Czech), Vilhelm (Danish), Wilhelmus, Willem, Jelle, Pim, Wil, Willy, Wim (Dutch), Vilhelmo, Vilĉjo (Esperanto), Villem (Estonian), Vilhelm, Viljami, Jami, Vilhelmi, Vilho, Vili, Viljo, Ville (Finnish), Guillaume (French), Wilhelm, Willi, Willy, Wim (German), Vilhelm, Vilmos, Vili (Hungarian), Vilhjálmur (Icelandic), Uilliam, Liam, Uilleag, Ulick (Irish), Guglielmo (Italian), Vilhelms, Vilis (Latvian), Wöllem, Wullem, Wum (Limburgish), Vilhelmas (Lithuanian), Illiam (Manx), Wiremu (Maori), Wilkin, Wilky, Wilmot (Medieval English), Vilhelm (Norwegian), Wilhelm (Polish), Guilherme (Portuguese), Uilleam (Scottish), Viliam (Slovak), Viljem, Vili, Vilko (Slovene), Guillermo (Spanish), Vilhelm, Ville (Swedish), Gwilym, Gwil, Gwilim, Gwillym (Welsh)

shortened

Bill Billy Will Willy, Willie Gui Guille (Spanish) Memo (Mexico, Costa Rica) Yam

as you can see not all spelled the same and defiantly not pronounced the same.
the name/ word Jesus is a transliteration and not a translation, i used the wrong term earlier. the difference in transliteration and translation are shown below in the wikis.

Transliteration is the conversion of a text from one script to another.[1] For instance, the Greek phrase "Ελληνική Δημοκρατία" 'Hellenic Republic' can be transliterated as "Ellēnikē Dēmokratia" by substituting Greek letters for Latin letters. Transliteration can form an essential part of transcription which converts text from one writing system into another. Transliteration is not concerned with representing the phonemics of the original: it only strives to represent the characters accurately. Thus, in the above example, λλ is transliterated as 'll', but pronounced /l/, and η is transliterated as 'ē', though it is pronounced /i/ (exactly like ι) and is not long.
Transliteration

Translation is the communication of the meaning of a source-language text by means of an equivalent target-language text.
Translation

no where in the bible old or new testament, have i read that God or Jesus say we have to call upon his name in Hebrew only.
i would think god would know a persons heart if they were calling on him, and that even if someone changed a word as to trick them He would still know that your calling on him and not some false god. do you think God is that small, and cannot tell when people are speaking from the heart.

another thing, how do you explain,

New American Standard Bible Mark 16:15
And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.

i don't see teach them Hebrew first and then tell them the good news. he knew people would understand in their own language better than trying to learn another first then hear the Gospel.

Any religious leader who hides anything can be considered to be a person who does not have faith. Hiding and or manipulating the scriptures is an admission to the falseness in your religion by it's very leadership. God does not need mortals to sensor his word not even the Pope. Christianity is founded on Hippocratic lies and half truths. So are the others.

It has gotten so bad in Catholicism that many Catholics now believe themselves to be judges and somehow superior to others which is a sin that sends you to hell just as fast as adultery or prostitution. Catholics no longer teach they now police which is a sin. Francis is attempting to right that wrong but unless he is followed by a like minded Pope his work will go undone.

Only when all the truths are allowed to be known will we know the word of god. We have the word of Constantine currently.