Did Obamacare Sink the Democrats?

originally posted by: tavi45
a reply to: Jaellma

It is typical. I've never seen a single right winger on here admit any sort of blame. Republicans are perfection incarnate. If Democrats didn't exist we'd be in a utopia apparently.

Watch this:

It is typical. I've never seen a single left winger on here admit any sort of blame. Democrats are perfection incarnate. If Republicans didn't exist, we'd be in a utopia apparently.

See how that works? And the thing is that it sounds just as plausible.

originally posted by: tavi45
a reply to: xuenchen

"The balance of power and checks & balances apparently has been restored"

You mean the checks and balances removed under Bush with the Patriot Act are being restored? I don't remember seeing anything about the Patriot Act being removed.

I have to laugh everytime someone brings up the Patriot Act.

Hey ?

Read all about the ACA's 'datahub'.

Obamacare data hub looms as privacy threat: Column

Then lets jump in the wayback machine and read all about the FISA Act from Carter:

Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act

Then 'flash forward' to the Clinton Era:

Omnibus Counterterrorism Act of 1995

And then let's read what this guy said:

CNET reported in 2008: Months before the Oklahoma City bombing took place, Biden introduced another bill called the Omnibus Counterterrorism Act of 1995. It previewed the 2001 Patriot Act by allowing secret evidence to be used in prosecutions, expanding the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act and wiretap laws, creating a new federal crime of “terrorism” that could be invoked based on political beliefs, permitting the U.S. military to be used in civilian law enforcement, and allowing permanent detention of non-U.S. citizens without judicial review.* The Center for National Security Studies said the bill would erode “constitutional and statutory due process protections” and would “authorize the Justice Department to pick and choose crimes to investigate and prosecute based on political beliefs and assocLink

What Biden wrote the 'core' of the Patriot Act ? Aint that the VPOTUS ? YEP!

So do tell what 'checks and balances was removed under GW ?

Crickets.

Thanks to that 'freedom, privacy loving' current potus now when people sign up for that super duper most glorious 'affordable' healthcare :

The Federal Data Services Hub (Hub), a component of the health insurance exchanges created by Obamacare, connects seven different government agencies and establish new access points to the sensitive personal information of the American public.

GO team blue!!!

a reply to: ketsuko

Doesn't actually work both ways. That's one reason Democrats don't get as much done. They disagree amongst themselves as they search for a solution. Republicans have that team mentality where they just all get on board the same horrible idea no matter what their personal view is. And it's true they never admit they were wrong.

My god, the last republican president gave us an attack on American soil, a war on false Intel, and tanked the economy on his exit... And republicans started blaming Obama day 1. That's an amazing theater of willful ignorance and denial. And now they pretend "hopefully we'll see an end to gridlock" as if that hasn't been their intention all along.

Republican mindset is a very unique ignorant stance. Shockingly out of touch.

a reply to: tavi45

Typical hey let's hear what Barney Frank says:



Here's another one:



One more:



So how is it the rights 'fault' ?

a reply to: neo96

Good videos nobody can deny



Democrats "springing" into action !!

Boy ing ing ing ing

a reply to: AlienView

With some of the most absolute bonehead Republicans, like Louie Gohmert re-elected, I don't think Republicans are thinking about anything.

a reply to: neo96

So the Patriot Act didn't get signed in under Bush?

originally posted by: xuenchen
a reply to: StoutBroux

I think Nancy hasn't read the election results yet.

"You have to vote before you can see what we will do to you"

Nancy's something else entirely. If she weren't able to raise so much money for the Dems, they would've s#it canned her a long time ago. It's her *persuasive* manner.
I just read where she called to congratulate (Dem) winners and firmly let them know she will be casting her name in for re-election. As the article said, she rules with an iron fist.

a reply to: tavi45

Even bother reading the links earlier ?

Because the government was already doing it's 'thing' before the GD Patriot Act.

originally posted by: tavi45
a reply to: neo96

So the Patriot Act didn't get signed in under Bush?

Clinton caused 9/11.

He forgot to kill Bin Laden.

They thought for sure Al Gore was a shoe-in for 2000.

Their plans went awry.

Can you imagine what that Patriot Act would have looked like with Gore in the White House !!

How come nobody has mentioned the new policical party controlling the Republicans - The Tea Party. If there was ever a Republican willing to agree with Obama on anyghing the Tea Party did all it could to prevent it. And who is the Tea Party billed aa a grass-roots movement? Guess who planted the grass? Right, the Koch Bros. who probably own the grass, the land and any building that might be on it. Green grass for the super-rich. The Tea party grass roots champions of vested interests. Some old cliches are still true Democrats stand for big government and Republicans [especially Tea party Republicans] stand for big money. And yes maybe Romney was right when he accidentally said 47% of the population would not vote for him because they are in some way receiving money from the government - So the Republicans have the other 53% to work with and if they can shrink or eliminate [by any means] that pesky 47% of the population that is receiving government money they can expand their power base. And don't worry about the Tea party, you can count on them, even if they have to close down the government [as they recently recommended during the last budget debate] they are willing to do so - The Koch brothers do not need Obamacare, Social Security or any other government program - the'll just create and pay for their own government.

Call the left wing Democrats socialist all you want - But please tell when Laissez-faire capitalism becomes Fascism

Happened in Germany in the 1930s but No, it can't happen here in the USA in 2014 can it

a reply to: xuenchen

Can you imagine what that Patriot Act would have looked like with Gore in the White House !!

Pretty much like it does now.

After all another one from their party wrote it.

And here we can see who voted YEA on it.

educate-yourself.org...

Lots of familar names that start with the letter D.

From Biden, to Reid, to Clinton. to Shcummer. to Feinstein etc.

But, but, but, but it's 'Bush's fault' !!!!!

I wonder why if the PA was so 'bad' why the left wasn't the party of 'no'.

a reply to: neo96

I agree entirely that Democrats were involved in the creation of the Patriot Act. My problem is that you say "democrats did it" and pretend Bush wasn't involved.

How about I do the same thing with the hated Obamacare?


"When today’s Republicans rage against the individual mandate in the Affordable Care Act, it’s useful to recall this was their idea as well.

In 1989, Stuart M. Butler of the conservative Heritage Foundation came up with a plan that would “mandate all households to obtain adequate insurance.”

Insurance companies loved Butler’s plan so much it found its way into several bills introduced by Republican lawmakers in 1993. Among the supporters were Senators Orrin Hatch (R-UT) and Charles Grassley (R-IA). Both now oppose the mandate under the Affordable Care Act. Newt Gingrich, who became Speaker of the House in 1995, was also a big proponent.

Romney’s heathcare plan in Massachusetts included the same mandate to purchase private insurance. “We got the idea of an individual mandate from [Newt Gingrich] and [Newt] got it from the Heritage Foundation,” said Romney, who thought the mandate “essential for bringing the health care costs down for everyone and getting everyone the health insurance they need.”

Now that the essential Republican plan for healthcare is being implemented nationally, health insurance companies are jubilant."

billmoyers.com...

So are you saying that the president is solely in charge or not? You can't give Bush a pass on the Patriot Act and then call Obama the devil for ACA. No Republicans voted on it because it was part of the propaganda needed for these recent elections.

The ACA was a Republican model. It was not a handout to poor people. It was a handout to insurance companies. Believe the propaganda if you want.

Democrats and Republicans are both puppets. I just wish one of you right wing people would admit it even once.

a reply to: tavi45

hysterical.

clever tactics.

a reply to: tavi45

One last time If you hate the Patriot Act then you should hate the ACA

FOR THE SAME GD REASONS.

When shoppers apply for health insurance through the forthcoming state-based Obamacare exchanges, the online system will verify each applicant's information by pulling in data from more than half a dozen federal agencies ranging from the IRS to the Peace Corps. It will know who you are, how much money you make, and whether or not you're in the United States legally.

How Obamacare's 'privacy nightmare' database really works

And that isn't counting the lefts voter database:

If you voted this election season, President Obama almost certainly has a file on you. His vast campaign database includes information on voters’ magazine subscriptions, car registrations, housing values and hunting licenses, along with scores estimating how likely they were to cast ballots for his reelection.

Privavy what stinking privacy

Once again I laugh when the PA is brought up a decade plus LATER.

Because they clearly are IGNORING a hell of a lot.

And that famous background check for gun owners.

That is one hell of an invasion of privacy, actually.

a reply to: xuenchen

I'm learning from the pros

a reply to: neo96

So you agree both the Patriot Act and ACA are garbage? Then why can't you just admit Obama is no worse than Bush . Or that Bush was bad? Or Obama isn't the worst president ever.

I just want a single concession from any of you.

I much, like the Democrats I'm identified with will constantly admit wrong, try to compromise, find common ground. Unlike the Democrats I will call out bs when I see it.

So you wanna shows that you're your own man and not just a slave to your party? Act like you're not a Republican for 2 seconds and concede something, anything.

Just say it, "Bush was a bad president"

a reply to: neo96

"One last time If you hate the Patriot Act then you should hate the ACA "

I hate both. I hate corporate shills and their fascist laws. I just don't think Obama should take all the blame. It's pure propaganda and wildly oversimplifying things. Just like when you pointed out Bush wasn't the sole author of the Patriot Act.

a reply to: tavi45

Still missing the point.

Let me say it another way.

Now the rest of the country knows how gun owners have felt since 1934 with the passage of the NFA.

And the following laws since.

Since gun owners were this countries first 'terrorists'.

a reply to: neo96

Which point am I missing? I'm pretty sure I got your point 100% loud and clear.

I think you're not missing mine but ignoring it. Why can't you accept even the tiniest smidgen of culpability on behalf of Republicans? By your account they are so perfect they must be literallly angels sent down from god to save us.