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What Exactly Did Jesus Mean When He Used The Term "Generation" ?

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posted on Nov, 7 2014 @ 04:28 AM

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33
a reply to: zardust

Everything you point out about the 1st century and it's generation is true, but Matthew 24 and the other mirror gospel accounts point to secondary major fulfillment.
This concept of double prophecy is shaky at best. Unless you are speaking of a literal fulfillment in time and a fulfillment in the Spiritual then yes I would agree. But the idea that this waits a future fulfillment on earth, along with a hodgepodge of other supposed end times events is like I said shaky at best.

For example Matthew 24:14 talks about the message being spread around the world then the end comes, in the first century that world would encompass all the territories Jews lived in even beyond the geographical area of Judea basically the Roman Empire, it did not include North & South America for example.

And Paul said that he had preached the gospel to the whole world, you are correct when you say that for the whole world would be "known" territories. But why do you then deny that fact as the reference for the statement "preach to the whole world"

Also what end was coming, for gentiles there was no end, it was of no matter to them really.
The secondary major application of that scripture would come much later and this time it would be truly global this "end" coming would matter to every human on the planet this time. So I fully understand what you are saying, but major and minor prophesies that have duel use were used by Jesus. This also applied to "Generation" too.

Again I don't believe this is so, where is the evidence? And why would it be truly global when the words used are as you say about the territories known. Mainly when "the land" was used it was meaning Israel. "Heaven and Earth" meant the temple and the land of Israel.

Also Jesus compared it to Noah's day, which was a global event.

unless it was a local flood, or a reworking of the Gilgamesh epic, or their version of the local flood hero's. The word used in Genesis for earth again means the local land, it could have meant the Levant, or the Nile valley, or the Tigris/Euphrates Plain, but to those folks a few weeks journey in each direction was "the world". Taking a literalist approach to the OT (and much of the NT) leads to a god committing genocide on millions of innocent people. Since Jesus is the exact image of the Father, you need to square that act with his character, which looks nothing like the monstrous god that f-ed up and had to kill all his kids. Man brings death and destruction to the table (and blames it on God), not God as revealed in Jesus

posted on Nov, 7 2014 @ 09:56 AM
a reply to: zardust

So you are basically saying the "last days" including the "generation'" aspect prophesies in the gospels only apply to the first century up until 70 AD.
I have to disagree, all studies, and most Christians understand these things had a future application too.
However some verses after 70 AD mesh well with what Jesus said, for example the horsemen of Revelation ( see chapter 6). What they would be doing mirrors what we read about in what Jesus said, but this is written AFTER the end of the Jewish "Last Days".
All of Jesus words were of use to both Jews and future Gentiles that would be converting to Christianity. And they would have to have value after 70 AD too.

posted on Nov, 7 2014 @ 02:12 PM
a reply to: Blue_Jay33

Just because the masses think its correct doesn't make it so.
There have been some things assumed by many, often based on faulty translation or modern thinking being pasted onto ancient writings. This is an example of one, and this is a very important word because multiple false doctrines are based on the mistranslation of this word. The word is Aion

New American Standard Bible
As He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?"

King James Bible
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

G165- Aion is where we get our word Eon from or Aeon Flux

This word is one of the most abused words by the principalities and powers to foist on unsuspecting masses the poisonous doctrine of eternal conscious torment, aka hell. It also props up the equally harmful dispensationalist teachings of "end times". Now I'm not saying there is nothing future to come. But this passage at hand, and the many that are considered automatic are wrong… IMO.

The KJV, a machination of the state a major player here in the corruption of the good news among all men, and the fear of impending doom from an angry and vengeful god. You will find the absolutely ridiculous doctrinal leaps that the KJV and its spawn produce if you do a study of Aion and its other forms Aionos.

Translated as "forever and ever (how can there be more than forever? is ever like a super long forever?), NEVER, Age, World. When age actually fits for each and every use. But this changes some precious American doctrines (yes these doctrines of the end times are pretty much only in American Fundamentalism/Evangelicism).

Ok done with my rant, you can investigate for yourself. But needless to say the word used here is "Age", and really should never mean "world". So if you start with that in mind then what age are we talking about? I believe Jesus is talking about the Mosaic Age. The age of the Law. The Law being called the power of death later by Paul.

This was shown when the new law (of the Spirit in flames of Fire) was given on the feast of Pentecost in the upper room. The OT version was when they received the stone law at Sinai on Pentecost. "I will give you a heart of flesh and replace your stoney heart, I will write the law on your hearts".

Did you know that the Israelites weren't supposed to spend 40 years in the wilderness, they actually made it to the Jordan but didn't cross over, so they had to wander for 40 years. In the same way the Israelites could have chosen to "cross over" after the new law was given but instead they persecuted the body of Christ, his disciples. They were given 40 years of wandering to match the 40 years in the desert. (now any future expectations come in here for me, as the 40 years may also correspond to 40 jubilees aka 2000 years, but that is another thread, so I'm not completely opposed to the concept).

What did we see happen in 70 ad? The Heaven and Earth of Israel was completely destroyed. The temple and all its services have never functioned since, and shouldn't. There should never be a third temple built because you and I and the entire creation are the temple. "Don't you know you are the temple of God", "A living temple of stones jointly fitted together". "The kingdom of heaven is inside you".

This is what Jesus spoke about that those with eyes to see and ears to hear would understand. That "out there" religion and rituals have no meaning. Paul said those things were Types and examples for us on whom the end of the ages have come. And also "it is not the spiritual that came first but the natural" and he compares adam, the man of dust, the Christ the man of heaven. Again calling him a type of the one who is to come. John calls Jesus the Logos infleshed, tabernacling amongst us/in us. "Christ in you is the hope of glory".

For me, the ages pertain to an inner working of man. Starting from Genesis to revelation the ages refer to the formation of the new man in you and me. Jesus showed the eunuch that all scriptures were about him. And Paul said this "just as Christ is, So are YOU in the world". We are the body, the word made flesh. "unless a seed falls to the ground and dies it won't bear much fruit". He fell into our ground, we adam the old man, adam which means red dirt.

The mystery that was hidden in worlds past? No, AGES past
is the formation of the one new man, the two becoming one flesh (head and body/Christ and church), Christ in you the hope of glory. (check out the word musterion/mystery). This mystery is the working of righteousness in us. The consummation of the ages according to 1 Cor 15 is God being all in all. "After Christ has subjected all things to himself (yes everything is not yet subjected), then Christ subjects himself the God and Father, then God is all in all". Btw this word subjection is the same word Paul uses for wives being subject to the husband as the bride is to Christ. This is not Sharia law, but loving surrender to the arms of love. The same subjection that Christ makes to the Father.

Jesus spoke in parables, and much is lost on us not realizing that, or understanding what the symbols stand for. Again its not that I see no future fulfillment, but the lightning flashing across the sky is speaking of something that happens in each one of us as we are illuminated to the truth that we are the word made flesh (Jesus lives in you right?).

16Therefore from now on we recognize no one according to the flesh; even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him in this way no longer. 17Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things (old man/ law of death) passed away; behold, new things have come. 18Now all these things are from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation, 19namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

Also the word used in Matt 24: for peoples or tribes of the earth, almost exclusively means the tribes of Israel. Again their outward religion based on the law was a dead man walking. We still carry that dead man around when we subject ourselves to the religious mind/carnal mind.

The future fulfillment is in us, will it have an outward manifestation, absolutely, but the way that will look I believe to be very different from what many are saying. John, Paul, and the writer of Hebrews especially speak of the transition from outward to inward, from fleshly to Spiritual. Heck look up "flesh" and 'spirit" that is a very enlightening word study.

Shalom and thanks for the polite discussion

posted on Nov, 7 2014 @ 10:52 PM
a reply to: Blue_Jay33

I haven't read many post so I don't know if I am being redundant, but I believe it was referring to the generation that saw the rebirth of Israel in 1948.

In Matthew 24 Jesus gives us a huge sign as to when he return shall come and its after the abomination of desolation. The people Christ told to flea were from Judea(Israel). Third clue is that he mentions a Sabbath which means observant Jews will be living in Israel.

The parable of the Fig Tree was Jesus's way of telling us that when he saw all the things he mentioned we would know "summer was near"(Christ return). The Fig tree is the last to bud in the Spring, so when it begins to have leaves one knows summer is close.

Jesus never tells them that Israel will cease to be and then come back in 2000 years, but the OT clearly shows this to be the case.
Deut 4
27 The Lord will scatter you among the peoples, and you will be left few in number among the nations where the Lord drives you(Scattered)

Deut 4
30 When you are in distress and all these things have come upon you, in the latter days you will return to the Lord your God and listen to His voice. (Returned)

Deut 28
63 It shall come about that as the Lord delighted over you to prosper you, and multiply you, so the Lord will delight over you to make you perish and destroy you; and you will be torn from the land where you are entering to possess it. 64 Moreover, the Lord will scatter you among all peoples, from one end of the earth to the other end of the earth; and there you shall serve other gods, wood and stone, which you or your fathers have not known.(Scattered)

Deut 30
4 If your outcasts are at the ends of the [d]earth, from there the Lord your God will gather you, and from there He will [e]bring you back.(Returned)

Deuteronomy 30:1-10 summarizes eschatological events. They will be brought home, their enemies will be blighted, and their covenant with God restored.

Cross reference :
Ezekiel 38-39
Zechariah 12:10
Isaiah 65:17-25

Isaiah 11
In that day the Lord will reach out his hand a second time to reclaim the remnant that is left of his people from Assyria, from Lower Egypt, from Upper Egypt, from Cush, from Elam, from Babylonia, from Hamath and from the islands of the sea

Amos 9:14-15
I will bring back my exiled people Israel; they will rebuild the ruined cities and live in them. They will plant vineyards and drink their wine; they will make gardens and eat their fruit. I will plant Israel in their own land, never again to be uprooted from the land I have given them,” says the LORD your God

This happened in 1948. You said there was no way to know how long a generation was. A biblical generation was considered 70, maybe 80 years(Psalm 90:10 ; Isaiah 23)

There is a lot more detail here:

posted on Nov, 8 2014 @ 12:51 AM
a reply to: zardust

I concede the majority are not always right, as you mentioned "hell" for example.
But if you want to get into the Greek aspect that same Greek word is used in Jesus final words to his disciples in Matthew 28:20

Rendering of the Greek word ai·on′ when it refers to the current state of affairs or features that distinguish a certain period of time, epoch, or age. The Bible speaks of “the present system of things,” referring to the prevailing state of affairs in the world in general and the worldly way of life. (2Ti 4:10) By means of the Law covenant, God introduced a system of things that some might call the Israelite or Jewish epoch. By means of his ransom sacrifice, Jesus Christ was used by God to introduce a different system of things, one primarily involving the congregation of anointed Christians. This marked the beginning of a new epoch, characterized by the realities foreshadowed by the Law covenant. When in the plural, this phrase refers to the various systems of things, or prevailing states of affairs, that have existed or will exist.

The previous verse specifically talks about spreading the gospel around the world, tie that back to the proclamation of Matthew 24:14 they are clearly linked. This verse (Matthew 28) clearly goes beyond 70 AD, (just read the later books of the bible) and it uses the same Greek word as used in Matthew 24.

You also choose to ignore the Revelation parallel.
Understanding parts of the bible means pairing up various bible passages and linking them by events happening during the same time period.
I appreciate your diligent study of Greek, but to say the prophesies of the gospels are strictly limited to the first century up until 70 AD, is frankly a massive error in understanding.
edit on 8-11-2014 by Blue_Jay33 because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 8 2014 @ 09:19 PM
a reply to: Blue_Jay33

Actually you connected to where I was going next
I didn't get into Revelation because I ran out of time. Lets start with the prologue, this opening is pretty much overlooked by all dispensationalists, and also the understanding of what revelation is especially in the meta-narrative of the NT.

1The Revelation[G602] of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to shew unto his servants, even the things which must shortly come to pass: and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John; 2who bare witness of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, even of all things that he saw. 3Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of the prophecy, and keep the things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

Before I go into the word Revelation, I want to point out 2 things.

1. The time is at hand, (not 2000 years later)
2. of things which must shortly come to pass

I didn’t mean to write this giant long post, but I did, so sue me ☺ OK I’d like you to consider a couple concepts and repeated phrases. We find the words Revelation, Mystery, Hidden, Veil, Ages
I’ll state my thesis then I’ve provided a small portion of the texts that support this position.

The word Revelation is a word picture. It speaks of removing of the veil of flesh, which was symbolic of the veil being torn in the temple when Jesus’ body was torn (Heb 10:20). This veil is the carnal mind, the mind of the beast, the religious mind, the mind of Adam/Earth/Earthy/Demonic. The Mystery that was hidden from ages past is that you and I are the temple, and that God is not coming back. He never left. The one who was , and IS, and is to come. The mind of man seeks for outward signs, but the Kingdom of Heaven is inside. The prophecies are about the Son of God being born/unveiled in and through you, me, and the rest of creation. This same concept is spoken of over and over and over throughout the entire bible, but this was unknown to the prophets of old, and to the PROFITS of now. We are living in the land of Confusion/Babylon…”come out of her MY PEOPLE”. This wisdom was hidden in a mystery, and is not comprehended by those without ears to hear.

[2Co 12:1-3 RSV] 1 I must boast; there is nothing to be gained by it, but I will go on to visions and revelations[G602] of the Lord. 2 I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven--whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows. 3 And I know that this man was caught up into Paradise--whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows--

What did Paul learn in the 3rd heaven? I’ve started with this because of the concept of the picture, the temple was the center point of all things Judaism. The third heaven was the Holy of Holies, and the veil that was of Babylonian design separated it from the 2nd heaven—the Inner court.

lets look at these other usages of G602 apokalupsis (Revelation)

[Luk 2:32 RSV] 32 a light for revelation to the Gentiles, and for glory to thy people Israel." this pretty much sums up the message, as the unveiling of the light (the logos in-fleshed, God in his tabernacle---US)
[Rom 8:19 RSV] 19 For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God; Sons, plural, not Jesus coming down on the clouds
[Rom 16:25 RSV] 25 Now to him who is able to strengthen you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery which was kept secret for long ages
[Eph 1:17 RSV] 17 that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the knowledge of him,
[Eph 3:3 RSV] 3 how the mystery was made known to me by revelation, as I have written briefly.

The light is revealed, as on the Road to Damascus (and also the road to Emmaus), this is in opposition to flesh and blood, or doctrines of men

[Gal 1:11-12, 16 RSV] 11 For I would have you know, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not man's gospel. 12 For I did not receive it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through a revelation (g602) of Jesus Christ. ... 16 was pleased to reveal (g601) his Son to me (the word to is en, which is IN, God unveiled His Son IN me), in order that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not confer with flesh and blood,

Here is G601 which is where G602 comes from, the word is broken down for us here as apo=away, and G2572=hide/veil, or UN-Veil

[Mat 16:17 RSV] 17 And Jesus answered him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven. (what is revealed? that Jesus is the Christ/the divine Logos, and this→ the Revelation from The Father is what Jesus builds his church on)
[Gal 3:23 RSV] 23 Now before faith came, we were confined under the law, kept under restraint until faith should be revealed.
[Eph 3:5 RSV] 5 which was not made known to the sons of men in other generations as it has now been revealed to his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

In my last post I spoke of Flesh and Spirit, in the above sections I've highlighted in Red, the workings of the mind of man aka flesh and blood. This is in contrast to Revelation that comes by the Spirit. In Johns Revelation he was "caught up in the Spirit, on the Lord's Day" this isn't an ordinary Sunday, but "the day of the Lord" (This also is representative of Entering the Holy of Holies). So we have the Revelations In, Of, and By the Spirit, and these are in opposition to the doctrines of the Mind of man, or the Religious order… The Law (of sin and death, of bondage, of corruption, remember it is the power of sin).

So we have these things being Revealed in the Spirit, or From the Father in Heaven. These things are hidden from the wise. The parables that Jesus spoke in.


posted on Nov, 8 2014 @ 09:38 PM
a reply to: Blue_Jay33

Here is every usage of Hidden G613 Apo-Krupto, Krupto is a cognate of Kalupto G2572 Veil that is what Unveil(G601 and G602) stems from. So in the following passages the word Hidden has the meaning of veiled.

[Luk 10:21 RSV] 21 In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, "I thank thee, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to babes; yea, Father, for such was thy gracious will.
[1Co 2:7 RSV] 7 But we impart a secret and hidden wisdom of God, which God decreed before the ages for our glorification.
[Eph 3:9 RSV] 9 and to make all men see what is the plan of the mystery hidden for ages in God who created all things;
[Col 1:26 RSV] 26 the mystery hidden for ages and generations but now made manifest to his saints.

The mystery was hidden or veiled. Where do we find the veil in the OT typology????? Between the Inner court, and the Holy of Holies. Heb 10:20

by a new and living way which He inaugurated for us through the veil, that is, His flesh,
Check out the usage of the word Mystery

We also see a veil over Moses' face. Sorry for pasting a whole chapter, but I'm underlining Old order/flesh/death and bolding New/Spirit/Life

2You are our letter, written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3being manifested that you are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.
4Such confidence we have through Christ toward God. 5Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, 6who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

7But if the ministry of death, in letters engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the sons of Israel could not look intently at the face of Moses because of the glory of his face, fading as it was, 8how will the ministry of the Spirit fail to be even more with glory? 9For if the ministry of condemnation has glory, much more does the ministry of righteousness abound in glory. 10For indeed what had glory, in this case has no glory because of the glory that surpasses it. 11For if that which fades away was with glory, much more that which remains is in glory.

12Therefore having such a hope, we use great boldness in our speech, 13and are not like Moses, who used to put a veil over his face so that the sons of Israel would not look intently at the end of what was fading away. 14But their minds were hardened; for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ. (UN-Veiled) 15But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; 16but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.

When the veil is removed=Revelation we are transformed(this is the word transfigured) into the same image.

The Revelation is the UnVeiling of the Secret that was hidden in plain sight. The Jews were expecting a warrior messiah to come and defeat their literal enemies. They even thought that they could help the messiah along by inciting violence. “The kingdom of heaven suffers violence”, “the kingdom of heaven does not come by outward observation” “the kingdom of heaven is inside”. This was missed by the wise of the day, they had their outward religion, with their literal Rambo messiah that would wipe out those filthy gentiles. And they tried to force Jesus to become their warrior king. And they are still trying to bring about the kingdom of heaven by force. And think that Jesus is going to come and kill a bunch of His brethren. But this was all symbolic of us overcoming principalities and powers of the air-- our minds. (See Col 1:21 below)

I included verses 15-20 below to show the tabernacling of Christ in all creation, which follows up with my point which was to reference the fact that we are alienated in our minds, which is the veil of flesh, the carnal mind, or the cherubim veil, or the veil lying over Moses' mind/face.

Col 1

15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. 17He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. 18He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything. 19For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him, 20and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.

21And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds, 22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach— 23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

You mentioned something about the gospel needing to be spread all around the world, I think Paul proclaimed that true.

I'm going to end this dissertation with my favorite passage from the bible.

Isaiah 25

6The LORD of hosts will prepare a lavish banquet for all peoples on this mountain;
A banquet of aged wine, choice pieces with marrow,
And refined, aged wine.

7And on this mountain He will swallow up the covering which is over all peoples,
Even the veil which is stretched over all nations.

8He will swallow up death for all time,

And the Lord GOD will wipe tears away from all faces,
And He will remove the reproach of His people from all the earth;
For the LORD has spoken.

9And it will be said in that day,
“Behold, this is our God for whom we have waited that He might save us.
This is the LORD for whom we have waited;
Let us rejoice and be glad in His salvation.”

edit on 8 11 2014 by zardust because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 9 2014 @ 05:37 PM

originally posted by: MichiganSwampBuck
a reply to: Rex282

I like your take on this Rex282. Really trying to understand what you have written here.

So if Jesus wasn't the political savior Christ of the Jews, and warned the early believers that he wasn't this Jewish Christ, and this generation refers to a kind of people that are blind to this fact, then who was Jesus anyway?

I apologize for the late reply

Yahoshua is the son (the seed) of the Father the creator God.He is the anointing(the anointed one).The Jews through religious extrapolation of what was written by some prophets….. believed there was a ”savor” like King David that was to come to extract revenge on their oppressors and set up a earthly Kingdom with them in the hierarchy. This Jewish mashiach was not “the son of God” he was a man.

The prophets did not even “know” who they were alluding to(they definitely were not fully alluding to Yahoshua) This doctrine of men of a coming conquering “mashiach”was co opted by the Christians.Yahoshua never claimed to be the Jewish mashiach.The only time it is written of being revealed(unveiled) was to Simon Peter when Yahoshua asked who do “you” say I am and Simon Peter said that Yahoshua was the son (the seed) of the creator God the anointed/christ (the power/life of the creator God).Yahoshua told him flesh and blood(the prophets) did NOT reveal this to him but the creator God the Father did.

originally posted by: MichiganSwampBuck
a reply to: Rex282
Was Jesus as he saw himself? Who did he say he was if he wasn't the Christ that his Jewish followers thought he was?

He was either the most insane person who ever lived(because he was completely deluded) or yes he knew who he was and he knew he wasn’t who everyone else believed he was.When he asked the disciples who the people though he was they said a prophet but they did not believe(nor know) he was THE mashiach.The Jewish leaders thought he could be the mashiach but they did not want him to be that’s why they plotted and successfully had him executed.

Yahoshua proclaimed one thing..the coming of the Kingdom of the creator God realm for ALL of mankind(and creation).He did this because he was Hamashiach …The christ..the anointing (the power/life) of the creator God.THAT is the crux of the Good News to ALL of mankind and creation.They will be “delivered/saved” from Hades..the realm of death and imperception to LIFE.That is what the “name” Yahoshua means.He was literally his name.He knew EXACTLY who and what he was and it was NOT the Jewish messiah nor the founder and establisher of a “new religion” Christianity.

A significant aspect of his name (deliverance) is to deliver(freed from bondage) mankind FROM their religion NOT to make a new and better one(no such thing).That’s what “forgiveness of sins” is.Forgiveness means freed from bondage because mans “nature” is religion which is “sin”(imperfection..missing the mark of maturity).

The Israelites and Jews had it ALL wrong(they made a God in their own image) and so do the Christians because they have done the same thing except now they have made the son of the creator God ..”the creator God”(which is false) and made a “God” in their own image..It is the epitome of RELIGION.

Fortunately for Christians (and everybody else) their God is not the creator God at all.The creator God is not a capricious homicidal monstrous maniac that says they love you out of one side of their mouth then DEMANDS you love them back(with free will) or they will TORTURE you for an infinity of time for punishment.That is clearly an insane heinous creature created in the religious carnal mind (satan) of man.

If that God is the creator God eat drink and be merry for tomorrow you will be in the hands of the most monstrous creature ever with no means of escape.It is worse then your worst nightmare come true.Fortunately all of that religious belief is the biggest lie ever perpetrated born of the Father of lies…the religious carnal mind of man…satan.

Yahoshua is not only delivering man from the realm of death (to the realm of LIFE) it is also delivering man from their religious carnal mind(the realm of imperception) satan.This “satan” is mankinds biggest enemy(themselves) it is the Father of ALL religion born of the “fruit”(the seed) of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.It is man “living” in the “heavens”(ouranos) of their mind.The religious carnal mind has anthropomorphized it and turned it into a being/entity yet it is ALL in the mind.Yahoshua said satan had no place in him and thats what he meant he was completely free of any religious dogma at all because he KNEW the Father.

Man creates a God in their religious carnal mind(satan) and makes it in their own image.They then “perceive” all of life through their BS religion where THEY are God and THEIR will be done in THEIR heavens as on earth(their body).It should be plain to see mans religion does not understand anything that Yahoshua did or said.They “bent” EVERYTHING to their religion.They took what Yahoshua said and made it into what they “call” a prayer(when it was not at all) and are blinded to what Yahoshua “proclaimed” (stated as truth)

“Our Father who is IN the heavens[Yahoshuas mind] perfect is YOUR name. Your kingdom has come([Yahoshua] YOUR will be done on earth([mankind] as it IS in your heavens.”

Yahoshua was making a profound statement of truth and religion turned it into dogma(religious prayer).;The point is Yahoshua IS The christ (Hamashiach) and is NOT the Jewish conquering mashiach nor the “christ” of Christianity or christ consciousness of blah blah ….or, or, or….any religious doctrines.

The christ is the son/seed…the anointing the power/life of the creator God.The seed was sown in the physical realm to produce LIFE and that’s exactly what it will do with ZERO help(belief in faith of BS religion) by anyone or anything.

edit on 9-11-2014 by Rex282 because: (no reason given)

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