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spiritual trolling: sinning, behaving badly and doing despicable things as a way to gain enlightenme

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posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 02:52 PM
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spiritual trolling: sinning, behaving badly and doing despicable things as a way to gain enlightenment

I have been contemplating the connection between evil, sin and enlightenment for more than a year now. But I got some new ideas today that I'll share here. I'm not at all saying any of this is true, it's just thoughts that I have, and that I don't necessarily hold as my own opinion.

OK, let's start with Jesus.



Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions. Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.


Everybody likes nice people, employers like nice people, people with high social skills and high emotional intelligence. Being an asshole is an efficient way to stay unemployed. Right there we can see something interesting. Jesus says you should give away your possessions if you want to have treasure in heaven. I just said that being nice is a sure way to do well on the job market. So let's say that you were to behave not nicely and humbly, but instead in a way that was sure to turn people against you, sure to create a negative reaction in people towards you. Chances are your possessions would go the same direction as your friends and job offers.

Another example. Let's say that you are a person who is behaving relatively righteously. People around you view you as righteous and you yourself might view yourself as fairly righteous. And then you start behaving badly. All the religious people distance themselves from you. When you were clinging onto the notion of yourself as being righteous that was an ego behavior. When now you see yourself behaving badly and you see some people treating you differently, like distancing themselves from you, it works as a tool for you to distance yourself from your ego, or from yourself.

Let's say you care about your reputation. This is either fear of losing your possessions, which I addressed above. Or it is ego in some other way. You fear rejection, or you fear something else. If you really got rid of your ego altogether wouldn't you then be able to be the most despised person on the planet and still love yourself, still be detached from yourself? Wouldn't it in fact be a very efficient way to decrease your ego to behave in a despicable way?

Let's say you are on a forum and people say mean things to you and this offends you. You being offended is a result of your ego. Wouldn't an efficient way to decrease your ego be to go online and say all kinds of things that are sure to turn people against you? And to then ride through all the response and in the process learn to love yourself and be detached from yourself?

Or let's say you don't take showers for a full week and then go to the barber, stinky and with greasy hair. And you sit through all the looks and whispers behind backs and all the humiliation of knowing exactly what you are doing. If you live in a place small enough for this to damage your reputation for life, the effect is even greater.
edit on 001130Wed, 05 Nov 2014 15:00:27 -0600201427pAmerica/Chicago2014-11-05T15:00:27-06:0030 by introspectionist because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 03:08 PM
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a reply to: introspectionist

Isn't that the fight club method of destroying yourself in order to find yourself?



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 03:23 PM
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there is no path to spiritual enlightenment.



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 03:26 PM
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I believe some yogis call that the left hand path. It's a short cut



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 03:32 PM
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originally posted by: Nechash
a reply to: introspectionist

Isn't that the fight club method of destroying yourself in order to find yourself?
Interesting. I don't know, I haven't watched that movie yet. I heard something about some mystery religion or something where they did all kinds of nasty things, might have been something related to the idea I'm writing about.

I have experienced this myself to some degree, which is why I write about it.


originally posted by: nukedog
I believe some yogis call that the left hand path. It's a short cut
Interesting.
edit on 331130Wed, 05 Nov 2014 15:33:08 -0600201408pAmerica/Chicago2014-11-05T15:33:08-06:0030 by introspectionist because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 03:39 PM
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a reply to: introspectionist

Just think of it like Sherlock Holmes. Once you've crapped on everything to the point that you have no attachments and you've destroyed yourself to the point that you have no self-pride, whatever remains; however broken it might be, is that which is most truly you. So, the life you build going forward from that point is going to be built on a firmer foundation than the false world of double speak that most people are guided by.




posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 03:43 PM
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I have also wondered if the elite have something similar to this in their plans for all of humanity. Like for example deliberately creating an oppressive system because of the humiliation that being oppressed brings with it. In a book on Freemasonry they talked about how in the military the first training is about breaking down all pride. I haven't finished the book, but that sounds like it might be something the elite are doing to the masses, for a spiritual purpose, which might be similar to the idea I talk about in this thread. Another thing that comes to mind is liberalism and how that might affect the behavior of people.
edit on 001130Wed, 05 Nov 2014 16:00:09 -0600201409pAmerica/Chicago2014-11-05T16:00:09-06:0030 by introspectionist because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 03:50 PM
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originally posted by: Nechash
a reply to: introspectionist

Just think of it like Sherlock Holmes. Once you've crapped on everything to the point that you have no attachments and you've destroyed yourself to the point that you have no self-pride, whatever remains; however broken it might be, is that which is most truly you. So, the life you build going forward from that point is going to be built on a firmer foundation than the false world of double speak that most people are guided by.

I have experienced something like that, although there probably is some left to destroy.



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 04:05 PM
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a reply to: introspectionist

If chemo killed all the cells, then we wouldn't call it a cure. ;p Use it as an illustration and follow the bread crumbs to their ultimate conclusion. For those stuck in a soul-crushing life at a dead end job surrounded by plastic mask wearing people you secretly hate, you don't even have to move into an abandoned house and wipe out everything to emulate this lesson. Just face yourself. Look at the truths you normally shy away from. Use your pain to guide you, not to pull your hand away like an animal, but to confront it and to truly unravel why it is agonizing for you.

Once you realize that you aren't ashamed because you hate your job, but because your father wouldn't love you unless you were a hard worker, it moves the power back into your own hands. Screw other people. They already have their own lives to live, why should they to get to live vicariously through yours as well? Examine every narrative in your head and decide if you want it to be there. If it is something you do not favor, if it is something you don't agree with, rip it up by the roots, shut it down, and eliminate its influence from your life.

This is the beginning of freedom. This is the beginning of intentionality and of becoming a subject over reality instead of being an object of it.

The trick from that moment forward is no longer a war with the world, but a war with yourself. Will you become conceited or will you maintain the understanding that you are just another joker in a deck full of pretenders? This brain isn't you. This brain is a tool. We are more than this sack of flesh, this life of smallness, and once we realize that, we can finally begin to engage in the puppetry of the self, which is our first truly creative act.

From there, try to walk the middle road between narcissism and self-loathing. These are tricks of the ego, and his sole goal in this life is to bind you here and drag you down into death along with him.



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 04:22 PM
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originally posted by: introspectionist
Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions. Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

I believe Jesus is referring to how someone with a large number of possessions will have a harder time accepting sacrifices in their lives, giving up on earthly possessions and not making them their focus. It requires much more faith to abandon all that you have knowing that you will be provided for, rather than to be poor and give up little. It's a simple lesson in faith. I recently had a situation where I was called to give up something valuable to me, and I felt as though I was being called to do so, but I hesitated and it ended up costing me later on. Turning away from what you've been given is a difficult thing for sure, but you must remember where it came from in the first place.



Everybody likes nice people, employers like nice people, people with high social skills and high emotional intelligence. Being an asshole is an efficient way to stay unemployed. Right there we can see something interesting. Jesus says you should give away your possessions if you want to have treasure in heaven. I just said that being nice is a sure way to do well on the job market. So let's say that you were to behave not nicely and humbly, but instead in a way that was sure to turn people against you, sure to create a negative reaction in people towards you. Chances are your possessions would go the same direction as your friends and job offers.
Ah, but there are many assholes who are currently employed as well. I don't think it makes a spit of difference to shrewd employers whether butterflies follow you wherever you go or if you make kids cry by being near them, if you have something to offer to the employer, you have a good chance of getting hired anyways.



Another example. Let's say that you are a person who is behaving relatively righteously. People around you view you as righteous and you yourself might view yourself as fairly righteous. And then you start behaving badly. All the religious people distance themselves from you. When you were clinging onto the notion of yourself as being righteous that was an ego behavior. When now you see yourself behaving badly and you see some people treating you differently, like distancing themselves from you, it works as a tool for you to distance yourself from your ego, or from yourself.
This is a very unfair generalization. That depends entirely on what group you surround yourself with. I know if I started pimping whores around town, and my fellow brothers and sisters in the parish heard about it, they'd more than likely attempt to convince me to cease and desist, not ignore it and avoid me.



Let's say you care about your reputation. This is either fear of losing your possessions, which I addressed above. Or it is ego in some other way. You fear rejection, or you fear something else. If you really got rid of your ego altogether wouldn't you then be able to be the most despised person on the planet and still love yourself, still be detached from yourself? Wouldn't it in fact be a very efficient way to decrease your ego to behave in a despicable way?
I'll tell you what I'm afraid of; I'm afraid of a society that just doesn't care, a society that no longer respects its own humanity and values human life about as much as a candy wrapper blowing down the street. I believe this can easily be accomplished simply by adhering to the very principle you now present; efficiency. Why bother thinking on a problem when you can simply take a pill, pull a trigger, pay a doctor, or do the wrong thing because it's easier? There's a reason why doing the right thing isn't easy. It wouldn't be worth a red cent if it was. Doing the wrong thing teaches nothing more than what we already know: it spreads misery, causes pain, sadness, and death. What could possibly be learned from that? You can learn a lot more from other people than you can learn from yourself.



Let's say you are on a forum and people say mean things to you and this offends you. You being offended is a result of your ego. Wouldn't an efficient way to decrease your ego be to go online and say all kinds of things that are sure to turn people against you? And to then ride through all the response and in the process learn to love yourself and be detached from yourself?
Going out of your way to cause trouble for others doesn't sound like enlightenment. Being a disagreeable asshat won't teach you anything more than to continue on that path in some misguided attempt at humiliation. There will be plenty of opportunities for that in life, no need to seek it out.



Or let's say you don't take showers for a full week and then go to the barber, stinky and with greasy hair. And you sit through all the looks and whispers behind backs and all the humiliation of knowing exactly what you are doing. If you live in a place small enough for this to damage your reputation for life, the effect is even greater.
Self destruction should never be sought out. That is an insult to the many gifts we are given and all that we learn from each other. This is a regression of understanding, not an advancement of it.



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 04:29 PM
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There does appear to be two side to this coin. Which the end results really amounts to, is way beyond my feeble brain and that is an understatement.

It is interesting in this particular "reality" that it is a MUST to become financially secure and the more the merrier. Yet righteousness is to be meek and give to others. Talk about an oxymoron!

It's also interesting to note that rich ("enlightened") men write what is right or wrong. That is certainly worth considering. The contrary are silenced and ridiculed.....so there's that.
edit on 5-11-2014 by Rosinitiate because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 05:49 PM
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Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.


An idea I can fathom also from such words attributed to Jesus is the effective use of fear to keep the religious faithful in a mental thought-form state of lack and poverty, therefore manifesting such utilising one's own creative will, which works out great for the ruling 'elite' slave-masters who bear most of the influence in the world with their generationally inherited wealth to oppress the 99 percentile in decision making.

Just to consider another side of the coin..I do not believe that wealth and humbleness/integrity with good will in heart need to be considered mutually exclusive on a spiritual level.
edit on 5-11-2014 by Neoleon because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 07:35 PM
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I've gone through a period lately of really inflating my own ego, trying to be as arrogant as dark elves are, even going so far as to give myself the title "His Supreme Arrogance", I don't know why.. felt lika a fun idea, some kind of psychological exercise, or I'm just really into dark elves right now.

Maybe it's a good thing though, exposing darker parts of myself to the light of consciousness. I suppose it's better than being in denial about some part of yourself.

I've delved into darkness for years now but this arrogance thing is a new development.. ahh well, I guess I'll see where it leads.

(The arrogance thing, it's all in my mind though.. I don't live it out by torturing kittens or anything)




posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 09:29 PM
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a reply to: introspectionist

Usually... being a nice guy will get the bad ass bastards make use of you.
Being a bad ass dick usually gets you in a leading role of society.
I takes social skills and friends to get around societies lower class masses. Only an abusive dick can really develop their attitude in less crowded area, where people don't want to get you even more on the edge.




Or let's say you don't take showers for a full week and then go to the barber, stinky and with greasy hair.


What !? Both our grandparents probably took an actual shower less often then you have weeks in a year. their parents probably even less. The French upper class put make up on and worn wigs to hide away the infections from parrasites and wounds they had from living a life of very poor hygiene. For human standards all around since the Indus Valley people, pre-dating ancient Sumer.




Let's say you are on a forum and people say mean things to you and this offends you.


Feeling offended comes from only two sourced. One someone thinks you are inferior, which is most likely the result of a role you play in society.
Two. You actually feel offended because you know it is true.

So when either of the options is the case, you should stop and think about your situation, create a solution that solves the inferiority inside, make it go away.
Correct a false prejudice point of view by showing you are better then that surpass that point, making you an equal in society.

Living in the past getting offended by stuff you aren't experiencing in your life today, makes you a willing and actual inferior person to who you actually are today...
What you harvest is very depending on the seeds you seed. Investing energy will make the issues grow and your harvest disappointing... if you keep seeding negativity.

Turning from a reliable righteous man in an insane loon probably makes you loose friends faster then you can say woohoo,but no worries, even when are are gone, you might learn to know a few new ones you would have never got to know.

Losing everything you had might be an eye opener for many people who take everyday life for granted, and being filthy rich might get you even a better perspective.

I don't think it's a bad thing for anyone to learn how life is like, when you have to start from sqratch with nothing more then the clothes you are wearing.
But that is my opinion.



posted on Nov, 5 2014 @ 10:29 PM
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a reply to: introspectionist

Counting the things that I think, counting the amount of repression that I exhibit, my real self would be an outcast if I did not want to earn money, have, hopefully, good repute, and a comfortable lifestyle. In an innate sense, it is what I reject, however, logically, I know that this civilisation would not support me if I were to "let go" and I would end up somewhere that I did not want to be. We are human, and we can perceive consequences for our actions, it's what distinguishes us from animals that are all sense and reaction, as opposed to thought and cognition.


edit on 5-11-2014 by SystemResistor because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 6 2014 @ 02:07 PM
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originally posted by: nrd101
there is no path to spiritual enlightenment.
no? why should I believe you? I keep hearing similar things, and I remain unimpressed. For one thing the word enlightenment seems to be very vague and can mean quite a few different things.



posted on Nov, 6 2014 @ 02:27 PM
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My personal opinion is that you do get more friends and are more successful with jobs and life in general if you are an asshole and perverted than if you are sensitive, spiritual, nice and humble. But it's a bit of a mix and I don't fully understand it. It is possible to lose friends and jobs by being an asshole. I am surrounded by popular brutes all day, myself being a very sensitive introverted person with no friends.

It was interesting to read the replies, although I got the sense some didn't really reflect upon the idea or the idea I tried to convey wasn't communicated across. Anyway, I always get something out of writing on forums.

ETA: I probably have something like schizotypal autism, so I've always been alienated anyway, and had trouble understanding people, but I think it's a gift.
edit on 321130Thu, 06 Nov 2014 14:32:39 -0600201439pAmerica/Chicago2014-11-06T14:32:39-06:0030 by introspectionist because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 6 2014 @ 04:07 PM
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a reply to: introspectionist

Being yourself is far more rewarding than trying to blend in with the crowd. How can you truly understand who you are if you seek to imitate everyone else? There is a difference between understanding yourself and getting by in the world though. Growing up, I never really felt like I understood how to be a human. I feel as though most of what I am now was learned behavior. I kept trying to seek out who I was in the world because I didn't know what I was supposed to be. It was like I was a mirror and imitated what I saw on TV, heard from other people, and learned over the years from various influences... always trying to figure out who I am. Still not sure what that is, but I'm slowly figuring out what pleases me, and what does not. You'll figure out the right balance eventually.

What I've found is that honesty isn't always the popular opinion, and speaking out against something wrong is becoming ever more difficult as you are derided and put down for it due to the prevailing opinion being against you. I view it like wading across a great stream, will you be swept away in it, or will you cross it with your beliefs in tow? I feel this is how one truly finds themselves, challenged against the forces of the world, tested in the crucible of pressures we constantly endure. Since you posted a bible quote in the OP, I have another for you:


originally posted by: Psalm 66:10-12
“10 For you, O God, tested us; you refined us like silver. 11 You brought us into prison and laid burdens on our backs. 12 You let men ride over our heads; we went through fire and water, but you brought us to a place of abundance.”

Like coal, we are stressed without end until we become like a diamond, hardened to the realities of the world, strengthened by all that we have endured. In the end, we become far more valuable and beautiful than when we began. That is what it means to endure and to succeed. How you get there is entirely up to you. Just bear in mind that the easy path is not always the correct one. You get to see a lot more on the long, windy road.



posted on Nov, 6 2014 @ 11:38 PM
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a reply to: Septimus

As for being compressed like coal that resonates a lot with my observations. I wrote about how I think oppression is the growing pains of the soul. I definitely believe that the least evolved people are the most extrovert and emotionally intelligent and that the more you evolve the more introvert, sensitive and chronically depressed you get. Evolved people don't procreate. Anyone who gets children is a brute who must keep evolving. And I also think that happy, emotionally intelligent people are useful idiots who serve as a tool to enlighten the miserable and disturbed, the former group being blind and the latter having eyes.

www.jewishencyclopedia.com...

This is Gentiles, agents, proles, Christians, Muslims, neurotypicals, useful idiots:



This is God's chosen people, Jews, Neo, Bernard, Winston, autistics and paranoid schizophrenics:




edit on 461130Thu, 06 Nov 2014 23:46:15 -0600201415pAmerica/Chicago2014-11-06T23:46:15-06:0030 by introspectionist because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 6 2014 @ 11:41 PM
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Embrace the dark side...feel it's power.
Mahahaha Mahahhahahaaa (evil laugh to fade.)




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