Taxation Must Go Global

a reply to: wayforward
Good luck with this OP. I gave up trying to explain to anyone why income taxes are unconstitutional and tyrannical.

Originally, the feds were to support themselves on tariffs and sales tax among other constitutional taxation that involved NO income taxes, but in 1913, they pushed through "ratification" of the 16th amendment, giving them license to extort the American peoples income.

a reply to: ladyinwaiting
Thanks for the detailed description of your agreement, but you are missing all the important information. So, here are some honest questions. What was the date you entered into your agreement? Since it was the most important decision you've ever made aside from perhaps marriage if you are married, I expect that date should be memorized. In what place did you enter into the agreement? I imagine if I made an agreement like that, I would want to visit Washington DC and seal it with a handshake.

Of course every serious agreement in today's world is done with a written contract. Do you have a copy of your signed written contract? If so, please summarize the text. If I ever agree to pay taxes, I'll definitely keep a copy of the contract in a safe place.

Lastly but very importantly, a good agreement can only happen when a party has at least some negotiating power. Did you negotiate you tax agreement or was it imposed on you from a class of people, named "government workers", with more rights than you? If it was imposed then you should consider trying to consider instead supporting other organizations with more respect for your needs and try to avoid supporting the one that has no respect for your needs.

Thanks for the detailed description of your agreement,

Glad to be of service.

So, here are some honest questions. What was the date you entered into your agreement? Since it was the most important decision you've ever made aside from perhaps marriage if you are married, I expect that date should be memorized.

Might be the most important decision you've made (or not made), but it came naturally to me. I learned at an early age what my country was like, and what was expected to maintain it. Don't mind a bit.

In what place did you enter into the agreement? I imagine if I made an agreement like that, I would want to visit Washington DC and seal it with a handshake.

Now that's special! Never thought of that.

Of course every serious agreement in today's world is done with a written contract. Do you have a copy of your signed written contract? If so, please summarize the text. If I ever agree to pay taxes, I'll definitely keep a copy of the contract in a safe place.

Lol! Of course I do. You mean you don't? How are you staying out of jail. Oh wait, let's see, you are either very, very poor, and need every nickel you can get your hands on, OR you work on Wallstreet.

Personally, I was born an American citizen, and upon my first job,(wrapping Christmas gifts in a department store during the holidays when I was a freshman in college) I had the knowledge that certain monies would be removed for taxes.

Lastly but very importantly, a good agreement can only happen when a party has at least some negotiating power. Did you negotiate you tax agreement or was it imposed on you from a class of people, named "government workers", with more rights than you? If it was imposed then you should consider trying to consider instead supporting other organizations with more respect for your needs and try to avoid supporting the one that has no respect for your needs.

Ya know, we elect people who negotiate these things for us. I vote. Do you? Or do you also find that immoral?

originally posted by: wayforward
me
me
my .

That's what it sounds like reading your post.
I for one, don't mind paying taxes, and I'm even happy that part of my tax take goes towards welfare, education and the health system. We're all in this together, so best we try not to be selfish.

There sure is a lot of Stockholm Syndrome shining through in this thread for a group that hangs it's hat on "denying ignorance." :/

a reply to: aorAki

ME wanting to spend MY money on the charity programs of MY choice, is actually generous. You wanting to forcibly pry money from my hands to support wasteful corrupt government welfare programs is just as selfish, or more selfish if you are on welfare. People often vote to give them self "free" (expensive) money at the polls. That is selfish.

Socialism is equally selfish as capitalism. In both cases, you have a group of people who believe they have the right to use the money for their own purposes. In socialism, you believe you have the right to spend any money I am carrying, and in capitalism, I believe you have the right (and not me) to spend the money you are carrying. In both systems, you have greed. Under capitalism greedy people have an opportunity to hoard their wealth. In socialism, greedy people have an opportunity to be welfare leeches and contribute nothing to society.

Generous rich people often work to avoid the tax collectors because they believe they know people who can spend the money more wisely for the benefit of the poor. I believe YOU have the right to give money to the people of YOUR choice. I simply want the same in return, which I do not believe makes me selfish at all. I want YOU to spend YOUR money how YOU see fit. You. You. You.

a reply to: SilverStarGazer

If you choose to believe that, you go right ahead. Why is it so hard to believe that there are people who genuinely want to progress, and that means progression for everyone. I wish there was a way to see a break-down of where an individual taxes go. I think you'd be shocked at how very little goes towards the "social programs".

Just this, and I will leave this thread.

If you travel the world at all, you visit places where you know you'd never want to live. When you get home, you have a burst of appreciation for we have here. I want to pay my share to keep it. It's important.

a reply to: wayforward

For once, I agree to OP 100%.

The 0% tax rate would leave it to central bank to fix the financing of public services - equalling a basic level of inflation. But also, taking off from current commercial banks the right to print money - these would need to lend it from the central banks. Too much of public waste, and inflation will kill the economy - so there is a natural control function.

originally posted by: ladyinwaiting
a reply to: SilverStarGazer

If you choose to believe that, you go right ahead. Why is it so hard to believe that there are people who genuinely want to progress, and that means progression for everyone. I wish there was a way to see a break-down of where an individual taxes go. I think you'd be shocked at how very little goes towards the "social programs".

Keep being happy with the bare minimum and that's what you'll keep getting. Social programs and things that actually could do some good are way overshadowed by things like the military industrial death machine and bailouts. They also are mismanaged and are full of money wasting red tape. Think you're paying for infrastructure? I advise people to take a look at the piss poor grades our roads, bridges, etc have. Things are falling apart and they aren't being repaired.

I'm all for supporting things we need as a country. This current system of taxation by force to pay for stuff we don't want is asinine. America is being bled dry and it's not by accident. I refuse to believe that this is the best way just because our dear gov-daddy says so.

a reply to: wayforward

watching something by Kerry Cassidy recently and she said in passing that an international tax is definitely on the agenda. So if someone is talking about it now it means that the sheeple screen is starting to go up.

originally posted by: wayforward
a reply to: olaru12

I am willing pay for exactly what I use which would be roads and bridges (1% to 3% of what tax money goes for?) and national forests (1% of what tax money goes for?). So, are you going to have me put in jail for paying for exactly what government services I use and no more? Because that would be 96% less than the bill I'm sent?

No police sounds nice. See thefreethoughtproject.com... for what actually happens with no police force. I live in a rural area and therefore a fire department is of minimal value to me. I could do without it without any difference. Japan has gone without a military for decades. Switzerland is a great example of how a military is run... maybe if the US adopted the Swiss model I would actually want a military force in my country.

Erm JAPAN do have a military they just call it a defence force! Plus a weak Military has been more trouble than it's worth for them as its neighbours have started causing trouble and the have to rely on the USA

a reply to: learnatic

The first step towards international tax was actually just a few days ago, with an international tax treaty named "the Multilateral Competent Authority Agreement", which was a treaty among 51 to 93 countries (there were different levels of agreement). That treaty includes nearly every "tax haven" country except for the USA (which is by far the #1 tax haven for people outside the US), the Cook Islands, and Panama.

People with offshore tax avoidance strategies seem only mildly unconcerned and mostly unaffected, but it does lay the groundwork for future changes. There is only one way any of this is possible, which is control over the money system. Countries can be excluded from the SWIFT transfer system and other banking systems which is devastating to some of them.

www.oecd
.org/tax/exchange-of-tax-information/conventiononmutualadministrativeassistanceintaxmatters.htm

a reply to: olaru12

Do you use the infrastructure that taxes pay for like roads, bridges, schools, National forests,

Infrastructure is the government's responsibility to provide. Those things can easily be paid for by raising tariffs on foreign trade.

FAA

Useless government bloat that should be abolished. Just like the majority of government departments.

Or, better yet, those of us that do not want to use the services offered by government corporations like the FAA or the DOE, should not have to pay for them.

If you want to send your children to state ran schools, good for you. You should have the right to make that choice. Those of us that do not want to, should not be forced to fund those institutions through taxation.

law enforcement and the military

Law enforcement would be a lot less expensive if we got rid of about 90% of the useless laws that we have in place.

And if Police Officers want money for their job, they can always host bake sales.

There should be no standing military in the US. There should be no distinction between citizen or soldier. It is your responsibility to defend your life, your rights, your family, your property, and your fellow countrymen. Placing that burden on someone else is irresponsible.

Everyone in the US should be in a militia, and every citizen should be a soldier. And no, we should not be paid for it, and we should be supplying ourselves with the equipment that we need.

Letting others pay your fair share is also a kind of theft and immoral as well.

I don't send my daughter to public school, and yet I am still forced to pay for it. Where is my right to choose??

a reply to: ladyinwaiting

It's an agreement.

I never agreed to it, I was forced into it. People before I was born created these laws, I had no say in the matter.

a reply to: aorAki

That's what it sounds like reading your post.
I for one, don't mind paying taxes, and I'm even happy that part of my tax take goes towards welfare, education and the health system. We're all in this together, so best we try not to be selfish.

My next door neighbor is very poor. I don't really feel like helping him out myself, so I'm coming over to your house and I am going to forcibly take your belongings to give to him.

"If you're selfish, you will try to fight me," said the pirate. "We're all in this together."

Most people don't mind paying some taxes. What we mind is government waste of OUR hard-earned dollars.

How would you like to bust your butt at a job you dread going to everyday, but you do it because you have to feed your family, pay bills, save for college for your kids, strive to put a little aside for a family vacation every now and then....you get the picture.

Then you find out that some government bureaucrat spent $30,000 on a toilet seat!

2013 stats: $36,986,404,949 wasted tax-payer $$$!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here is a partial list

WASTE: Capitol Gift Shops, Hair Care, Sleep Classes and Excessive Printing waste WASTE: $76 Million To Round Up Wild Horses - $76,000,000 waste WASTE: $7.8 Million On Department Of Interior Conferences - $7,800,000 waste WASTE: Department Of Interior Expanded Use Of Sheep Counting Drones waste WASTE: $10,000 DOJ Pizza Party - $10,000 waste WASTE: $11 Million On Luxury Private Jets For DOJ Political Appointees - $11,000,000 waste WASTE: $100 Million On DOJ Conferences - $100,000,000 waste WASTE: $1.5 Million For Hollywood TV Shows - $1,500,000 waste WASTE: $165 Million Unused Prison - $165,000,000 waste WASTE: $3 Million To Boost Bike Clubs - $3,000,000 waste WASTE: $3 Million In Taxpayer Money To Lobby For Soda Tax - $3,000,000 waste WASTE: $1 Million For Urban Gardening - $1,000,000 waste WASTE: $7.5 Million To Promote Free Pet Neutering - $$7,500,000 waste WASTE: $235,000 Spent On Massage Therapy, Kickboxing, Kayaking, And Zumba - $235,000 waste WASTE: $400,000 To Promote “Pickleball” - $400,000 waste WASTE: $11 Billion In IRS Faulty Refunds - $11,000,000,000 waste WASTE: $3.3 Billion Lost In Unemployment Fraud - $3,300,000,000 waste WASTE: $1 Million For Empty Bank Accounts - $890,000 waste WASTE: $8 Million PR Contract To Promote Obamacare - $8,000,000 waste WASTE: $1.1 Million Puppets - $1,188,382 waste WASTE: Oil Paintings For Obscure Officials - $400,000 duplicativespending DUPLICATIVE SPENDING: Diesel Emissions waste WASTE: Improper food stamp payments - $4,500,000,000 waste WASTE: Motorsports museum - $300,000 waste WASTE: Corporate welfare for world’s largest snack food maker - $1,300,000 duplicativespending DUPLICATIVE SPENDING: Financial Literacy regulations REGULATIONS: Oil and Natural Gas Sector: New Source Performance Standards, EPA - $1,500,100,000 duplicativespending DUPLICATIVE SPENDING: Information Technology Investment Management (Personnel Assignment Management) regulations REGULATIONS: Oil Spill Prevention, Control, and Countermeasure for Milk, EPA - $143,000,000 waste WASTE: Taxpayer-funded tour boat - $3,300,000 regulations REGULATIONS: Mandatory Reporting of Greenhouse Gases, EPA waste WASTE: Identity thieves steal billions from IRS - $3,900,000,000 regulations REGULATIONS: Commodity Options and Agricultural Swaps, CFTC waste WASTE: Black liquor tax loophole - $268,000,000 waste WASTE: Medicaid audit program costs more than it saves - $30,000,000 regulations REGULATIONS: Regulations Governing the Performance of Actuarial Services, Joint Board of Actuaries regulations REGULATIONS: Standards of Performance, New Stationary Hospital Incinerators, EPA waste WASTE: Faulty FEMA calculations lead to unnecessary building replacement - $75,400,000 waste WASTE: Taxpayer dollars fail to reform struggling schools - $7,300,000 waste WASTE: Overseas vacations for athletes - $5,500,000 regulations REGULATIONS: Community Forest and Open Space Conservation Program, Forest Service waste WASTE: Taxpayer-funded booze - $99,000 regulations REGULATIONS: Response to Petition From New Jersey Regarding SO2, EPA regulations REGULATIONS: Definition of Solid Waste, EPA - $57,900,000 duplicativespending DUPLICATIVE SPENDING: Unmanned Aircraft Systems (Aircraft) regulations REGULATIONS: Notice of Arrival on the Outer Continental Shelf, Coast Guard regulations REGULATIONS: Confidentiality Determinations, Greenhouse Gas Reporting Rule, EPA regulations REGULATIONS: Implementation of New Source Review for Particulate Matter, EPA regulations REGULATIONS: Softwood Lumber Research, Promotion, Consumer Education, Agricultural Marketing duplicativespending DUPLICATIVE SPENDING: Information Technology Investment Management (Promotion Rating)

originally posted by: wayforward
a reply to: ladyinwaiting
Thanks for the detailed description of your agreement, but you are missing all the important information. So, here are some honest questions. What was the date you entered into your agreement? Since it was the most important decision you've ever made aside from perhaps marriage if you are married, I expect that date should be memorized. In what place did you enter into the agreement? I imagine if I made an agreement like that, I would want to visit Washington DC and seal it with a handshake.

Of course every serious agreement in today's world is done with a written contract. Do you have a copy of your signed written contract? If so, please summarize the text. If I ever agree to pay taxes, I'll definitely keep a copy of the contract in a safe place.

Lastly but very importantly, a good agreement can only happen when a party has at least some negotiating power. Did you negotiate you tax agreement or was it imposed on you from a class of people, named "government workers", with more rights than you? If it was imposed then you should consider trying to consider instead supporting other organizations with more respect for your needs and try to avoid supporting the one that has no respect for your needs.

Do you work for an employer? If so, when you agreed to the employment you filled out and signed a W-4 form stating what taxes you would pay and how many exemptions you were claiming.

There's your written contract.


Do you own your own business? If so you submitted a business license application and/or a DBA application.

There's your written contract to pay all applicable taxes.

If you do not want to pay taxes, you are NOT required to work for someone else, and you are NOT required to own your own business.

As far as a Global Tax goes.....it would just be another gigantic slush fund for the powers that be.

Just look at the gazillions of dollars that have been poured into so-called third world countries by other industrialized countries to improve their health care systems, their infrastructure, their educational systems. And after decades and decades, what do you see? The same 'ol same 'ol. Where does all that money go? Who manages those funds?

Haiti is a prime example. Where did all the money go?

originally posted by: LewsTherinThelamon


My next door neighbor is very poor. I don't really feel like helping him out myself, so I'm coming over to your house and I am going to forcibly take your belongings to give to him.

You don't need to forcibly take them as I have already willingly offered them. If you don't feel like helping him out, that's fine, but remember that your taxes have already contributed to providing a hand up, so that we can work towards diminishing poverty and selfishness and aim for community and engagement.