It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Jesus Vs Yahweh sorta

page: 4
6
<< 1  2  3    5  6 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 12:31 PM
link   

originally posted by: Cuervo

I'm sorry but I've yet to hear a Christian successfully consolidate YHWH and Jesus without dragging Jesus through the mud. To say that Jesus is YHWH is to say that Jesus commanded his flock to rape, murder, and infanticide entire peoples. I would never say that to a Christian. Instead, I would rather tell a Christian that I don't believe that Jesus and YHWH are the same. At all.


Of course not. Because you're the one setting the goalpost. We've got someone who doesn't understand anything about the Bible telling a Christian that they're wrong regarding the God of the Bible. Good stuff. There is no such thing as Jesus without God = YHWH = Elohim. Why is it that saved people don't have a problem with God, yet unsaved people do? Why exactly is that? Do you also go to physics majors and argue with them about math that is way over your head?

God never commanded rape or murder, but he did command the wiping out of entire peoples that were all exceedingly wicked and evil. I don't see the problem. Here are a few reasons that they were ordered to destroy entire peoples :



Unlike us, God knows the future. God knew what the results would be if Israel did not completely eradicate the Amalekites. If Israel did not carry out God’s orders, the Amalekites would come back to “haunt” the Israelites again and again. Saul claimed to have killed everyone but the Amalekite king Agag (1 Samuel 15:20). Obviously Saul was lying…just a couple of decades later there were enough Amalekites to take David and his men’s families captive (1 Samuel 30:1-2). After David and his men attacked the Amalekites and rescued their families, 400 Amalekites escaped. If Saul had fulfilled what God had commanded him, this never would have occurred. Several hundred years later, a descendant of Agag, Haman, tried to have the entire Jewish people exterminated (see the book of Esther). So, Saul’s incomplete obedience almost resulted in Israel’s destruction. God knew this would occur, so He ordered the extermination of the Amalekites ahead of time.

In regard to the Canaanites, God commanded, “However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them — the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites — as the LORD your God has commanded you. Otherwise, they will teach you to follow all the detestable things they do in worshiping their gods, and you will sin against the LORD your God” (Deuteronomy 20:16-18). The Israelites failed in this mission as well, and exactly what God said would happen occurred (Judges 2:1-3; 1 Kings 11:5; 14:24; 2 Kings 16:3-4). God did not order the extermination of these people to be cruel, but rather to prevent even greater evil from occurring in the future.


At this point in time, God was calling Israel to himself to be a holy people. To lay all the groundwork. So that he could later bring forth Jesus Christ. What would we know of Jesus if Israel had been destroyed, or tainted by false religion and idol worship, etc...

If those strict laws had not been in place, they wouldn't have been able to thrive and survive, and keep intact the word of God, over the course of about 2 or 3 thousand years...

It may seem like a round about and in-effective way to you. You might say something like "Why didn't God supernaturally do what he needed to do without killing anyone?"

Thing is, God doesn't really like to mess with our free will. It happens from time to time, but it's pretty rare. I believe he has great respect for our free will, and does what he needs to do with and around mankind and their freewill.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)




posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 03:24 PM
link   
a reply to: borntowatch




I believe as a matter of faith that Jesus is part of the Trinity, God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.


Yes. From the foundation of the universe, this was true. We cannot disagree that we learn of the Father only in the New Testament. This is a fact. We cannot disagree that the Father has a Son. This is a matter of fact from the New Testament. We cannot disagree that the Son of God was the template for everything that exists. Colossians 1 outlines this. We cannot disagree that there is a feminine aspect to God's image (Ruach Elohim). This is a matter of fact from the linguistics of Genesis 1 and the very mother of the Aleph Mem (strong water). She was over the waters in Genesis 1. The Son comes from the same template as our own families. God works in patterns.

The creation of Yahweh is fallen. Is there a disagreement on this point? Blood was shed on the cross for the remission of sins. Again, this is what God demanded on Genesis 9. Again, this is why Yahweh had to be the one and one one that could do the task. He created the snake. Genesis 3 makes this evident. When baptized, Jesus received a blessing from both the Spirit (Dove / Peace) and the Father (Love and acknowledgement of the status of Son). What is unclear about God requiring this of the one that made the Snake? He must defeat his enemy. We all create our own enemy in life. Defeating it is salvation from it. We can't do it. Yahweh must be the one that kills it out in himself first. It's the pattern we follow to develop. In the end, we are Yahweh (Body / Church) with the one that overcomes as the head. Again, it's all in the Word.

I can't see a single place that we disagree.
edit on 27-10-2014 by AlephBet because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 03:50 PM
link   

originally posted by: borntowatch

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: borntowatch



No and yes
God is love and gave us free will to use, not abuse.


Then it isn't free-will.

free - not under the control or in the power of another; able to act or be done as one wishes.



Yes it is free will, to operate within or outside of the law.God gave us freewill and also the law, we operate by choice to act within or outside the law

Maybe I dont understand your position in its entirety.
Even in Eden, we had the choice between obeying and disobeying.

Disobeying the law brings judgement and exclusion. Judgement.


Free will - God does not intervene. (there are exceptions) He rules over heaven, earth and hell and all in heaven and hell do obey his EVERY command. He allows free will not only to man but also those in heaven and hell. Legal rights in heaven and hell - they must be obeyed. His will be done, in heaven, on earth and in hell - something that we do not understand it its entirety. ALL demons and angels obey God's commands.

Mankind can disobey God's law but it comes with punishment.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 05:07 PM
link   
About free will. Let's look at the story of Moses and the Plagues of Egypt. Every time God tells Moses to go ask Pharaoh to let his chosen people go, he hardens Pharaohs heart against him. This obviously manipulates Pharaohs free will to choose and because his heart was hardened against the Lord he denies Moses. Then God proceeds to punish him for it and one of those punishments included killing all the first born of Egypt.

And what about the strong delusion where God bluntly says he shall make those who don't accept his love and truth, believe lies. Followed by their damnation.

Just what kind of racket is the big guy running?

As for rape, he may not have directly commanded it. But throughout the Old Testament the spoils of war included taking the virgin women as wives. Do you honestly think these woman wanted to be in any sort of relationship with men who destroyed their homes and people? Of course not! Would you?

Is Christianity unique? Zoroastrianism.



Some scholars believe that key concepts of Zoroastrian eschatology and demonology influenced the Abrahamic religions. On the other hand, Zoroastrianism itself inherited ideas from other belief systems and, like other "practiced" religions, accommodates some degree of syncretism.



In Zoroastrianism, Ahura Mazda is the beginning and the end, the creator of everything that can and cannot be seen, the Eternal, the Pure and the only Truth. In the Gathas, the most sacred texts of Zoroastrianism thought to have been composed by Zoroaster himself, the prophet acknowledged devotion to no other divinity besides Ahura Mazda.

Sounds a lot like the alpha and omega, eh? Indeed, if you do some comparative religions studies you will find many things that you may have previously thought were unique to Christianity. Virgin births/divine conceptions, being born under a star, deaths and resurrections, miracles, ascensions to a heaven, and second comings. These things are scattered throughout religious beliefs. In case you're thinking that maybe they stole those concepts from Christianity, that is not always the case. They can all be found in older religions in one form or another.

So if Christianity is true,


The earlier Gods and heroes existed and had these traits, rendering Jesus run of the mill and uninteresting in a long line of Gods. Or, somehow the earlier stories are myths, but not Jesus, and God in creating this Jesus story lacked any imagination. -Don Baker (in Atheist Experience #798)


I think the stark differences between tribal war porn God and love thy enemies as yourself God is because they are man made. More or less. I'm not saying there may not have been a historical Jesus whose life was embellished.
edit on 27-10-2014 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 06:20 PM
link   

originally posted by: DeathSlayer

Free will - God does not intervene. (there are exceptions) He rules over heaven, earth and hell and all in heaven and hell do obey his EVERY command. He allows free will not only to man but also those in heaven and hell. Legal rights in heaven and hell - they must be obeyed. His will be done, in heaven, on earth and in hell - something that we do not understand it its entirety. ALL demons and angels obey God's commands.

Mankind can disobey God's law but it comes with punishment.


Yeah well I am sorry, I dont really understand what you mean...at all.

The Lords prayer states that we request Gods will "be done on earth as it is done in heaven" suggesting that Gods will is not done on earth at this time.
This does not remove Gods sovereignty, it just means God in His sovereignty has removed His complete authority from our will.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 06:46 PM
link   

originally posted by: WakeUpBeer
About free will. Let's look at the story of Moses and the Plagues of Egypt. Every time God tells Moses to go ask Pharaoh to let his chosen people go, he hardens Pharaohs heart against him. This obviously manipulates Pharaohs free will to choose and because his heart was hardened against the Lord he denies Moses. Then God proceeds to punish him for it and one of those punishments included killing all the first born of Egypt.

And what about the strong delusion where God bluntly says he shall make those who don't accept his love and truth, believe lies. Followed by their damnation.

Just what kind of racket is the big guy running?



I can understand your position, throw in a little Ephesians and Romans 9 and you get a picture suggesting what you say is verry accurate.
Sadly for us English speaking people the bible was written in languages that can play tricks on us.

The word needs to be studied and taken within its context, there is a raging debate in relation to that issue, Gods hardens Pharaohs heart 4 times, is Pharaoh responsible for the other times.

israeliteindeed.wordpress.com...


Some scholars believe that key concepts of Abrahamic eschatology and demonology influenced the Zoroastrian religions.

enjoy



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 07:39 PM
link   
a reply to: borntowatch




The whole point of the Old Testament is not to say how wonderful the tribe of Israel was, it explained how poorly Israel acted, most of the time.
The Old Testament makes Israel look evil, except very few redeeming actions by very few people, occasionally.


I thought the whole point of YOUR thread was to talk about how wise and wonderful Yahweh is/was.

I say any god that orders his people to do his killing for him is an evil god. Any god that tells his people that, as a reward for doing his killing, they will receive worldly wealth and sexual pleasure, is an evil god.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 07:51 PM
link   

originally posted by: AlephBet


Yes. From the foundation of the universe, this was true. We cannot disagree that we learn of the Father only in the New Testament. This is a fact. We cannot disagree that the Father has a Son. This is a matter of fact from the New Testament. We cannot disagree that the Son of God was the template for everything that exists. Colossians 1 outlines this. We cannot disagree that there is a feminine aspect to God's image (Ruach Elohim). This is a matter of fact from the linguistics of Genesis 1 and the very mother of the Aleph Mem (strong water). She was over the waters in Genesis 1. The Son comes from the same template as our own families. God works in patterns.


Yeah mostly on this.
Though I accept the feminine side of the Trinity I am some what reluctant to identify the Holy Spirit as feminine. The Holy Spirit is aspirit as such, so I cant see a feminine quality as clearly.



originally posted by: AlephBet
The creation of Yahweh is fallen. Is there a disagreement on this point?


Yes fallen and caused by man, evil came in to the world, so a law had to come in to the world to guide man.


originally posted by: AlephBet
Blood was shed on the cross for the remission of sins.


Yep


originally posted by: AlephBet
Again, this is what God demanded on Genesis 9. Again, this is why Yahweh had to be the one and one one that could do the task.

Yes only God could do it, what exactly, I am a little confused about what it, the task is.


originally posted by: AlephBet
He created the snake. Genesis 3 makes this evident.

Yes God created the serpent, it doesnt mean the serpent was created evil, maybe the serpent chose evil.


originally posted by: AlephBet
When baptized, Jesus received a blessing from both the Spirit (Dove / Peace) and the Father (Love and acknowledgement of the status of Son).


Yep, 100%


originally posted by: AlephBet
What is unclear about God requiring this of the one that made the Snake?

Yeah a little confused on this point also, I cant comment as I am unsure your position


originally posted by: AlephBet
He must defeat his enemy.

God has no enemies, God is not threatened by anything, satan is the enemy of humanity



originally posted by: AlephBet
We all create our own enemy in life. Defeating it is salvation from it. We can't do it. Yahweh must be the one that kills it out in himself first.

Our enemy is sin, what separates us from God. We dont create our enemies, sin entered the world at the fall. Its already there/here.
We cant defeat it, at all, ever. Jesus could not defeat it for us, He could defeat it for Himself, then offer Himself as the atonement.
Yahweh never had sin, He was a judge, dispensing justice
Where is the sin in Yahweh


originally posted by: AlephBet
It's the pattern we follow to develop. In the end, we are Yahweh (Body / Church) with the one that overcomes as the head. Again, it's all in the Word.


I am not Yahweh, I have sin, I cant defeat it. Death will bring an end to sin in my life, only death, Christ though covers my sin.
I cant see how we the Church/body is Yahweh



originally posted by: AlephBet
I can't see a single place that we disagree.


Hope this helps you understand my position.

With respect
mg
edit on b2014Mon, 27 Oct 2014 20:42:34 -0500103120141pm312014-10-27T20:42:34-05:00 by borntowatch because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 08:12 PM
link   

originally posted by: windword
I thought the whole point of YOUR thread was to talk about how wise and wonderful Yahweh is/was.

I say any god that orders his people to do his killing for him is an evil god. Any god that tells his people that, as a reward for doing his killing, they will receive worldly wealth and sexual pleasure, is an evil god.


It is supposed to explain the link between Yahweh and Christ, but YES it is also to explain how wise and wonderful He is.

I am somewhat surprised you think that a God organising people to carry out justice is brutal.
Do you bemoan the death penalty, soldiers fighting in a just cause?

Now please explain if you dont mind the worldly wealth and sexual pleasure. I dont see it so clearly as you do.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 08:41 PM
link   
a reply to: WakeUpBeer

Did you not read the story?

Pharoah hardens his own heart first. Also, do you not remember Pharoah ordering the killing of all the Hebrew male babies? Finally, God gets sick of him, and hardens it for him. God is like that. There is a point a person can come to where it's too late for them. If you reject God, and reject God, and reject God, he finally says "Fine, have it your way."
Then he hardens your heart and mind, making it impossible to believe. Like it or lump it, this is what the Bible teaches about the character of God.

This is also the reason that Jesus spoke in parables :


10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?

11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:

15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.


This verse ALSO implies "faith alone" theology. Apparently if you believe and understand, you'll be healed. God didn't want these specific people healed.

edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 08:57 PM
link   
a reply to: borntowatch



Yeah mostly on this.
Though I accept the feminine side of the Trinity I am some what reluctant to identify the Holy Spirit as feminine. The Holy Spirit is aspirit as such, so I cant see a feminine quality as clearly.


This will require your linguistic study into Ruach and Aleph Mem.



Yes fallen and caused by man, evil came in to the world, so a law had to come in to the world to guide man.


As I have argued, man was devoid of knowledge to make the determination. Before possessing the knowledge, the one that beguiled man is responsible. Revelation makes it abundantly clear, as I'll show you in a minute, that Satan is the Snake.



Yes only God could do it, what exactly, I am a little confused about what it is.


The Father of Love and Yahweh in the Old Testament do not match. Elohim (Father) made it clear that if blood was shed, the one responsible would then have his blood shed by men. Why by men? Yahweh (SON) had to atone for his choices in the OT. Elohim made it clear. DO NOT SHED BLOOD. Who caused the shedding of blood in the OT? You can simply read the first murder of Abel. Yahweh selected the animal offering over that of the land. Elohim had prohibited the eating of meat by only giving the produce. By honoring Abel, he sent Cain into a rage. As hard as Yahweh worked to keep Israel in a state of war, he could have worked to avoid the bloodshed that he KNEW would happen. Who is all knowing here? From this point, nothing but blood and war. Yahweh even brags of teaching man warfare. Men only live long enough to begin to know the truth. Yahweh had no excuse.



God has no enemies, God is not threatened by anything, satan is the enemy of humanity


Read ATS. I have tried to argue this from your perspective many times. The more I know, the less I can defend Yahweh. Who created the snake in the garden? You know the answer, but do you recall this:

Revelation 12

The great dragon was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

Why does the entire book of Revelation deal with death and the one it come by? Again, Adam did not create this mess. He is the one that is the host for the Lord of Hosts. We are playing host to a Spirit here. Don't forget this.

Does the Head rule the body? Then we are the body (Church) motivated by its head. Man has little choice in this destiny of Elohim. It's locked. It's older than our collective memories. Answering why is a memory removed from us.



Our enemy is sin, what separates us from God. We dont create our enemies, sin entered the world at the fall. Its already there/here.
We cant defeat it, at all, ever. Jesus could not defeat it for us, He could defeat it for Himself, then offer Himself as the atonement.
Yahweh never had sin, He was a judge, dispensing justice
Where is the sin in Yahweh


Correct, which is your reason to answer the question about Yahweh truthfully. Have you read scripture? Start with Judges 19 and end at the last chapter. Ask if Yahweh was reasonable to the virgins. As if he was leading without sin, or if the leaven had leavened the whole loaf.

What is the loaf?

1 Corinthians 10

15 I’m talking to intelligent people. Judge for yourselves what I’m saying. 16 When we bless the cup of blessing aren’t we sharing in the blood of Christ? When we break the bread aren’t we sharing in the body of Christ? 17 Because there is one loaf, we are one body, although we are many individuals. All of us share one loaf.

Can you separate the loaf (body below) from the seed of its creation? We are the images of the one creating us. What you see in man is what image it came from. Until we are holy, the image that created us has not been made holy. The Father IS holy, as is the Mother. The Son must be made holy, or unleavened. It's the entire story of the Mother and Father's work to raise a son. Sin is leaven and necessary to make bread rise.



I am not Yahweh, I have sin, I cant defeat it. Death will bring an end of sin in my life, only death.
I cant see how we the Church/body is Yahweh


You can't until he does. It's the last enemy between us and death. The Snake. Who created the snake?

You are made of seed (so is bread). You are one loaf and we are many. We are the Son of God's body. Again, have you read scripture? Read 1 Corinthians 10 - 15. This is basic theology.


edit on 27-10-2014 by AlephBet because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:05 PM
link   
a reply to: AlephBet

Your entire premise implies that you have to know ancient greek and hebrew to understand the Bible. So everyone for the past 400 years is just S.O.L. right? I don't buy it.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:14 PM
link   
a reply to: borntowatch




Now please explain if you dont mind the worldly wealth and sexual pleasure. I dont see it so clearly as you do.


Are you kidding? Do you really want me to post all the Old Testament ## about raiding cities, killing everyone except the virgins women, and taking all the cities wealth (booty) to divide up?

Really? Just say so, and I'll go get the passages and post them for ya.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:25 PM
link   

originally posted by: graphuto
a reply to: AlephBet

Your entire premise implies that you have to know ancient greek and hebrew to understand the Bible. So everyone for the past 400 years is just S.O.L. right? I don't buy it.


Luther had to read the Bible for all its worth before he could see the false actions of the Priests. His thesis was well written, with proper attention to details like proper names and punctuation. Yes. It's helpful to know a few things if you want to know more. The more you know the more you can know. The King hides it so you can find it.

Proverbs 25:2

It is the glory of God to conceal a matter; to search out a matter is the glory of kings.

Hermes from the Corpus Hermeticum

Nous is a Prize - A Prize Hidden in Nature

From the thread I just linked to:

"" 3. Reason (Logos) indeed, O Tat, among all men hath He distributed, but Mind not yet; not that He grudgeth any, for grudging cometh not from Him, but hath its place below, within the souls of men who have no Mind.

Tat: Why then did God, O father, not on all bestow a share of Mind?

H: He willed, my son, to have it set up in the midst for souls, just as it were a prize.

4. T: And where hath He set it up?

H: He filled a mighty Cup with it, and sent it down, joining a Herald [to it], to whom He gave command to make this proclamation to the hearts of men:

Baptize thyself with this Cup's baptism, what heart can do so, thou that hast faith thou canst ascend to him that hath sent down the Cup, thou that dost know for what thou didst come into being!

As many then as understood the Herald's tidings and doused themselves in Mind, became partakers in the Gnosis; and when they had "received the Mind" they were made "perfect men". " "



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:26 PM
link   
a reply to: AlephBet

Why did it take him so long to figure out? I would have written them off when I saw statues of Mary and Jesus inside the cathedrals.

Your stuff is really out there. Super esoteric and requires so much "reading into" ideas. Your theory is the first I've seen of its kind. We've had the English Bible for 400 years, and you're the first person to "figure it out?"

I don't believe it.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:30 PM
link   
a reply to: windword

Post as much of it as you'd like. Your opinion on what and why God does does not change anything. He ordered the Israelites to destroy wicked, idolatrous people. It's not like they were just going around destroying people for no reason other than the virgins and wealth. To even say such a thing is dishonest in light of the very chapters and verses you're pulling from. In fact, some of these nations were so wicked that God didn't even allow the taking of their virgins and animals. He wanted them gone from the face of the earth.



20 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Again, thou shalt say to the children of Israel, Whosoever he be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn in Israel, that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones.

3 And I will set my face against that man, and will cut him off from among his people; because he hath given of his seed unto Molech, to defile my sanctuary, and to profane my holy name.

4 And if the people of the land do any ways hide their eyes from the man, when he giveth of his seed unto Molech, and kill him not:

5 Then I will set my face against that man, and against his family, and will cut him off, and all that go a whoring after him, to commit whoredom with Molech, from among their people.

6 And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people.

7 Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the Lord your God.

8 And ye shall keep my statutes, and do them: I am the Lord which sanctify you.

9 For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.

10 And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

11 And the man that lieth with his father's wife hath uncovered his father's nakedness: both of them shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

12 And if a man lie with his daughter in law, both of them shall surely be put to death: they have wrought confusion; their blood shall be upon them.

13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

14 And if a man take a wife and her mother, it is wickedness: they shall be burnt with fire, both he and they; that there be no wickedness among you.

15 And if a man lie with a beast, he shall surely be put to death: and ye shall slay the beast.

16 And if a woman approach unto any beast, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the woman, and the beast: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

17 And if a man shall take his sister, his father's daughter, or his mother's daughter, and see her nakedness, and she see his nakedness; it is a wicked thing; and they shall be cut off in the sight of their people: he hath uncovered his sister's nakedness; he shall bear his iniquity.

18 And if a man shall lie with a woman having her sickness, and shall uncover her nakedness; he hath discovered her fountain, and she hath uncovered the fountain of her blood: and both of them shall be cut off from among their people.

19 And thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy mother's sister, nor of thy father's sister: for he uncovereth his near kin: they shall bear their iniquity.

20 And if a man shall lie with his uncle's wife, he hath uncovered his uncle's nakedness: they shall bear their sin; they shall die childless.

21 And if a man shall take his brother's wife, it is an unclean thing: he hath uncovered his brother's nakedness; they shall be childless.

22 Ye shall therefore keep all my statutes, and all my judgments, and do them: that the land, whither I bring you to dwell therein, spue you not out.

23 And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore I abhorred them.

edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)


These are some of the wicked things that all of these nations were doing :

Sacrificing children to Molech (A false God)
Adultery
Beastiality
Sodomy

God had every right to destroy them. Like I said earlier in the thread, at this time God was calling Israel to himself to be a holy and set apart people so that he could lay the groundwork and bring forth Jesus Christ. If they hadn't followed these rules strictly, they would not have been able to preserve the Word of God for thousands of years, and the world today would know nothing of God and Jesus Christ.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:30 PM
link   
Double Post?
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:48 PM
link   

originally posted by: windword
Are you kidding? Do you really want me to post all the Old Testament ## about raiding cities, killing everyone except the virgins women, and taking all the cities wealth (booty) to divide up?

Really? Just say so, and I'll go get the passages and post them for ya.



No I am not kidding, I guess my point was vague
Are these people killing for the sake of sex and worldly wealth or for other reasons.
You make the context sound like the reasons were based on lust and greed as opposed to justice and defence from a violent and evil people.

Can you prove that the motivation was based on lust and greed, is that a better question?

See when ISIS falls, if they do, will the US have more access to Mid East oil.
What should happen to the spoils of war, leave them where they lay, maybe another people will take them, create another faction, another army, another war.

As for the women, slaughter them, this wasnt a war, it was a judgement against an evil people.
Can you understand the difference between a war where prisoners are taken and a judgement where justice is served.
I understand that you dislike Gods justice, irrespective your opinion, God is the judge and His justice is served upon the people who have earned His wrath.

I accept what happened because I believe God knows better than me, doesnt mean I like it or understand the brutality. I understand the cause and the ramifications.

See, I became a Christian to avoid righteous justice.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:49 PM
link   
He wouldn't be able to prove such a thing. See my post above outlining exactly why God destroyed these nations.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 09:49 PM
link   
Also wanted to add to this taking of virgins thing :

They weren't raping them or anything sick like that. They took them to be wives. Maybe they didn't necessarily want to be wives to the Israelites that just destroyed their nation. But their nation had just been destroyed. All of the men killed. Cities in ruins. Farmland laid to waste.

I suppose the "better" thing would have been to just leave them there, helpless and alone, right?
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
6
<< 1  2  3    5  6 >>

log in

join