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The Bible was written before 70 AD and here is why..

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posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 03:53 AM
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That would be it...


That just doesn't make sense though. If every single time I saw a homeless person I gave them every dollar that I had, how would I provide for my family?




posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 03:55 AM
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a reply to: graphuto

Why does it?

The church I attend always feeds the congregation that BS...

"We break your rules every day"... the doctrine of "total depravity"... what a mess

That is the result of Pauls teaching.... Your debts are paid right?




posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 03:56 AM
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originally posted by: graphuto


That would be it...


That just doesn't make sense though. If every single time I saw a homeless person I gave them every dollar that I had, how would I provide for my family?


Oh give me a break...

the fact that you have a family means you can spare a dollar...

IF anything you should likely be thankful for the blessed life you lead




posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 03:58 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

Dude I'm not trying to play the victim or anything here, so I don't know where you're coming from with the "oh give me a break." I'm not talking about giving some dude a quarter and then feeling good about myself, and my sacrifice. I'm talking about "oh, sometimes I'll just give this dude all the cash I have." I'm asking a serious, practical question about how to live my day to day life. You said that the line is there, on the days when you don't give the guy any money. And by the way, I am definitely thankful for my blessed life.

Surely you can see the reason for my confusion here.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 03:59 AM
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a reply to: graphuto



That just doesn't make sense though. If every single time I saw a homeless person I gave them every dollar that I had, how would I provide for my family?


But the bible teaches the same:

"Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again. And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise. For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them. And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same. And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again. But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil men." - Luke 6:30-35

It's something that's supposed to be practice so that you can be more generous - and yes - this verse IS inspired because God is Love and this verse is of Love which means that it is inspired of God.
edit on 27-10-2014 by arpgme because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:00 AM
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You guys are ignoring the real world, practical example I've put forth :

If I literally give the homeless guy all of my money every time I see him (which is every single day), then how can I live a life and provide for my family?



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:02 AM
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a reply to: graphuto

Did I not just say Love is Selfless?

read Luke 6

I've already asked if you know the sermon on the mount... thanks for clearing that up...

Jesus said give to every one that asks of you... Right?

And who said Give the homeless ALL your money?!!? *facepalm*


edit on 27-10-2014 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:04 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

So to hell with my family, I'm supposed to give all of my money to a homeless guy? Is that really what you're saying? You said that's where the line is. On the days I don't give money to the homeless person I see. Obviously this is just an example, and in no way am I saying this idea of yours only applies to giving money to homeless people. Do you see what I'm saying though? If I know to do good, and do it not, is it not sin? How does one lead a practical, productive life if their salvation is dependent on doing everything they possibly can for others? You wouldn't have time for anything else! I say it's not possible. If you've perfected this, and can honestly say that you've made yourself destitute in your love for others, then I'll get behind your "Love Only" and "Work your way to heaven" doctrines. As far as I know though, only 1 man in the history of the world accomplished that. And he wasn't just a man, he was God.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:04 AM
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a reply to: graphuto

Giving also includes giving to your family, so no, you don't have to give all your money to the homeless guy.

"But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil men." - Luke 6:35

It's something that's supposed to be practiced so that you can be more generous (charitable/loving).
edit on 27-10-2014 by arpgme because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:11 AM
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originally posted by: graphuto
a reply to: Akragon

So to hell with my family, I'm supposed to give all of my money to a homeless guy? Is that really what you're saying? You said that's where the line is. On the days I don't give money to the homeless person I see. Obviously this is just an example, and in no way am I saying this idea of yours only applies to giving money to homeless people. Do you see what I'm saying though?




You're just being obtuse... no one is buying their way into heaven... Do you think you can bribe the judge??? LOL

Please read what I just said... Or what Arpgme said...

its not just about giving to homeless people... its about how you deal with those who cross your path in this life

Its about helping those who need it... giving to those who have less then you...

Imagine you have 5$ for lunch in your pocket, and you happen to run across a man in the street who hasn't eaten in 2 days... who NEEDS that 5$ more?

YOU could probably do without a lunch... where as this person might be relying on a simple gift from a caring individual for survival...

In Those cases... I promise you... IF you believe in Jesus... and even if you don't

HE is watching...

edit on 27-10-2014 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:15 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

I'm not being obtuse. I made a specific point to say that "in no way do I think this idea of yours only applies to me giving the homeless guy money" I'm pretty sure that's the opposite of being obtuse. It was a disclaimer saying "I know this is going to sound obtuse, but hear me"

I see the broad spectrum that you're trying to demonstrate but this still stands :

How does one lead a practical, productive life if their salvation is dependent on doing everything they possibly can for others? You wouldn't have time for anything else! I say it's not possible. If you've perfected this, and can honestly say that you've made yourself destitute in your love for others, then I'll get behind your "Love Only" and "Work your way to heaven" doctrines. As far as I know though, only 1 man in the history of the world accomplished that. And he wasn't just a man, he was God.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:17 AM
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a reply to: graphuto



So to hell with my family, I'm supposed to give all of my money to a homeless guy?


Giving also includes giving to your family, so no, you don't have to give all your money to the homeless guy.



If I know to do good, and do it not, is it not sin? How does one lead a practical, productive life if their salvation is dependent on doing everything they possibly can for others?




If you've perfected this, and can honestly say that you've made yourself destitute in your love for others, then I'll get behind your "Love Only" and "Work your way to heaven" doctrines.


But this verse teaches the importance of giving without expecting a return:

"But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil men." - Luke 6:35

This is very important according to this verse. Your reward is to be a child of The Most High. You have to do the work in order to get the reward. You have to sow in order to reap.

"Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away. Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect." - Matthew 5:42-46

This doesn't mean that you ARE perfect at being loving, but it does mean that you are supposed to be showing an effort through your works to improve.


edit on 27-10-2014 by arpgme because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:20 AM
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a reply to: graphuto

Again... get your nose out of Pauls writing and learn his words...

And he said unto his disciples, Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat; neither for the body, what ye shall put on.

23 The life is more than meat, and the body is more than raiment.

24 Consider the ravens: for they neither sow nor reap; which neither have storehouse nor barn; and God feedeth them: how much more are ye better than the fowls?

25 And which of you with taking thought can add to his stature one cubit?

26 If ye then be not able to do that thing which is least, why take ye thought for the rest?

27 Consider the lilies how they grow: they toil not, they spin not; and yet I say unto you, that Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.

28 If then God so clothe the grass, which is to day in the field, and to morrow is cast into the oven; how much more will he clothe you, O ye of little faith?




posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:21 AM
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So basically, we get an "A for effort" ?



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:23 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

I'm familiar with that scripture. I understand it. What I'm saying is :

Show me someone who has done it, aside from Jesus. Do you work for a living? You know, so you can have a place to live and paid bills. If so, aren't you taking thought for tomorrow, oh ye of little faith?

That wasn't really an answer on how to live a practical, productive life in the modern world, while at the same time having to work your way to heaven.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:24 AM
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a reply to: graphuto

If you love and give being merciful, you get the reward of being called The Children of The Most High (Luke 6:35).



Show me someone who has done it, aside from Jesus.


It's not about being perfect automatically, it's about working towards being perfect.

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect." - Matthew 5:48
edit on 27-10-2014 by arpgme because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:29 AM
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originally posted by: graphuto
a reply to: Akragon

I'm familiar with that scripture. I understand it. What I'm saying is :

Show me someone who has done it, aside from Jesus. Do you work for a living? You know, so you can have a place to live and paid bills. If so, aren't you taking thought for tomorrow, oh ye of little faith?

That wasn't really an answer on how to live a practical, productive life in the modern world, while at the same time having to work your way to heaven.


Yet again... You're so drowned in Pauls word that you deny anything else...

no one is buying their way into heaven...

Its not a debt that can be paid, nor is there a price of admittance as Paul will have you believe...

sigh
edit on 27-10-2014 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:29 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

Then, again, how do we gain eternal salvation? You've made it clear that not everyone receives it. You're saying it's dependent on all the works we do. Isn't that a price for admittance, or debt to be paid? If not, then what does "dependent" even mean, in that context? I've asked again and again for a real world example of how, exactly, to accomplish this, while simultaneously living a life...We see people in need all around us. If all we did was works, we'd be destitute, and not able to help anyone with anything....

I'm really not trying to be difficult, I swear. We've finally reached a place in the conversation where we're actually (gasp) conversing!
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:36 AM
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originally posted by: graphuto
a reply to: Akragon

Then, again, how do we gain eternal salvation? You're saying it's dependent on all the works we do. I've asked again and again for a real world example of how, exactly, to accomplish this, while simultaneously living a life...We see people in need all around us. If all we did was works, we'd be destitute, and not able to help anyone with anything....

I'm really not trying to be difficult, I swear. We've finally reached a place in the conversation where we're actually (gasp) conversing!


Do as he asked of you... He came as the example of how we are to live our life...

WE know nothing of him but what is written... Thus he gave the answer here.... HIS words ARE LIFE

HE told us to learn from him... and the spirit would teach us the rest...

51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

52 The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?

53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.

56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.

57 As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.

58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.

59 These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.

60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?

61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?

62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?

63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.



posted on Oct, 27 2014 @ 04:37 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

His example was to make himself destitute for the sake of others, and eventually die. That's what everyone has to do for salvation? Doesn't seem like anyone will make it. Sucks. My past page of posts here has nothing to do with Paul. I'm trying to work with what you're giving me.
edit on 27-10-2014 by graphuto because: (no reason given)



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