Should students have business administration in highschool instead of college?

originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

By that logic why not extend the school day to 8 hours?

A summer break gives older kids who a graduating within a year or two a chance to work full time and get that work experience. Younger kids get a break to actually be kids.

That may be how it is used now....but that isn't why we have summer breaks.

Summer breaks are so children can work the family farms during the growing seasons. Back in the day if those kids would have had to go to school year round, parents wouldn't have sent their kids to school (claiming hardship).

Very few families own farms, and it is a tradition that has outlived any real usefulness.

I have a kid graduating college this year, and another one graduating high school next year. I would pass out from surprise if more than 10% of kids really made good use from their summers, as you are describing.

Well, lets look at this another way. How many hours should kids spend in the classroom? Lets look at Finland. They start school two years later, they have virtually no homework, there is virtually no testing, they get 3x as much recess, and their school day is two hours shorter than ours. Despite all of that they are completely kicking our ass in education. Alternatively we can look at the Asian approach to schooling that the US is moving closer and closer to which involves long days, even longer days of homework, and extremely high standards. In math and science they're beating us too but in anything involving the ability to think rather than regurgitate facts they really aren't very good.

Slightly off topic, but I want to share a related experience I had today as I chose to eat dinner on campus, and ate with some friends of friends. They consisted of a Japanese foreign exchange student, two Tunisian foreign exchange students, and a foreign student from Egypt. It put the educational opportunity I take for granted in a whole new light. I am quite busy with my classes/work and by every metric am a well performing student including being at the top of my class, but the truth is I consider myself a slacker. The reason I do that is because I compare myself to these foreign students and when I am off taking breaks like reading this website, or writing down an idea, or working on the structure for my future business. They are at a desk or a couch rereading the classwork. They work their entire lives to get one of a handful of ultra competitive foreign student visas with the US Visa always being the most highly coveted, and then they bust ass here like people I have never seen. They attend every class, and arrive on time every day. They get perfect marks on tests (I'm actually competing with the Egyptian right now for the top grades in the two classes we share (math and programming) in each we're the top two students with less than 1% separating us both), and their work is always handed in on time, in full, and always perfect. I wish more students in the US could do that. These are some very driven people.

However, bringing this story back on topic, these people are very good at learning, to be fair I'm pretty darn good at learning too and a certified genius but they do what I cannot. If you tell them to do something they will learn how to do it, and then they will reread the documentation over and over until they can perform that specific task to absolute perfection. The problem happens when you change it slightly, they lose all concept of how to handle the problem. They have to start again from the basics, build it up, and see what changed, then they need to learn how to apply a fix. They have no creativity or ability to improvise and that's a symptom of using pure memorization as a teaching tool

When it comes to cultures those who learn to think and apply select generalized knowledge to specific circumstances are in much better position than those who apply specific knowledge to specific circumstances. That is why Finland is #1, the Asians are also beating us, and we were in the middle of the pack. I've spent a long time in college now, when I'm done this will be my 5th and final degree so I've seen it first hand plenty of times: American students are apathetic. The manta most of them preach is "C's get degrees" and every weekend is an excuse to take substances that render them unable to remember the weekend.

More than a shift in what our schools actually cover, we need a shift in culture.

a reply to: Aazadan

I worked in mental health in the 90's, and recall the Patients Bill Of Rights that Bill Clinton put forth. I remember how obvious it was that all patients, being individuals, should receive individualized care. That means individual treatment plans, etc. Because, as was recognized, humans are not cookie cutter.

In schools, however, we ignore that obvious logic. Instead we embrace standardization. To a degree that school is all about studying to pass a standardized test. There is no individualized lesson planning. Not even in the slightest. Until you get to pick a couple of electives in secondary school.

Point being: you are spot on in that post.

I don't think school should be work. If you are having to labor at it, you aren't enjoying it. If you're not enjoying it, you aren't engaged with it. And if you aren't engaged with it, you are wasting your time. I've done some corporate training ("adult education"). In raising 2 boys I am convinced that we should approach children in similar ways. Namely: WIIFM. Yes, future benefits are abstract to kids. But there is something to be said about learning to delay gratification at an early age. Regardless, it doesn't have to be sold to a student in the context of the future. You just have to be creative to make them think something is in it for them at that moment. With kids, "fun" is about as good a motivator as you get.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I agree with the basic accounting classes and I'd throw in being able to do their personal income tax would be a good lesson plan to (though one that threatens my livelihood). One of the things that frustrate me a whole lot as an accountant is what the average person does with their money. Concepts like calculating how much interest is on a credit card and what it does to the cost of a purchase would be integral.

Ethics could be good as well though would probably send a number of manufacturers into a bit of a fit as business ethics does cover a whole lot. It sounds like a misnomer but that was actually the class that really hammered out the inherent issues within capitalism and where the human portion needed to kick in to correct those issues.

Developing soft skills would be good as well. I know that one of my 12 year old's classes did involve some soft skill learning. As far as the stats go, they should be able to do that with the math that they learn in high school right now and they do also learn some basic statistics. Same with the communication--those they should be learning in middle and high school already. If a chunk are coming out without those capabilities in your area, maybe sending a letter to the local school district is in order.

Much of the basic stats, soft skills, and communication skills stuff is something that my youngest has already learned in humanities. In fact, one of her assignments last year was to write a letter of complaint to a company about a faulty product in such a manner that they could not tell that it was a. a kid writing it and b. warrant a good response.

I think in the 1st grade the children should learn how to work a job,either by earning a small allowance or events as rewards.
That way they can see what life is like and better adapt to it than WE have.
Probably on COMPUTER anyway.