It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Do you live as Jesus did?

page: 2
4
<< 1   >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 07:26 PM
link   
a reply to: ketsuko

What was disrespectful about my post? All I said was that he/she was deflecting. You thinking it was disrespectful is the reason I prefaced it like I did. I didn't mean any disrespect but I had feeling it would be taken as such.

And again, just because you're "covered in his blood" (that sounds a bit Satanic to me), that does not mean you live or walk as he did. The verse I cited says that living as he did is a requirement if you claim to live in God. Committing sin is not living or walking as he did.




posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 07:36 PM
link   
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

the blood is the water



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 07:37 PM
link   
i live the way i want to live,jesus...adam and eve whatever you want to believe.

i have seen no evidence to make me believe any of it.

we live,we die,what you do in between is up to you,not convinced it makes any difference.



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 07:58 PM
link   
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

I posted this awhile back, you may enjoy it.

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 07:59 PM
link   

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
The verse I cited says that living as he did is a requirement if you claim to live in God. Committing sin is not living or walking as he did.


The way I understood it when I was a Christian goes like this. Christ is the sinless, perfect Son of God. Who was sacrificed for all of our sins. By living and walking as Christ we strive to be like him. Christ is the example we all seek to reach. No, we cannot be sinless like he was supposed to be. But he cleansed us of sin. When we make mistakes and sin, and recognize our faults, and are truly repentant we pray and ask for forgiveness. There is no "get out of sin free" card, because God knows your heart, and whether or not you truly feel conviction for your wrong doings. When you are forgiven, that sin debt is cleared. Can someone be sinless like Christ? Not in the same sense.
edit on 20-10-2014 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 09:02 PM
link   
a reply to: WakeUpBeer

This theology contradicts Jesus' own words.


Matthew 6
14 For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.


He was stating that as an absolute, there is no mention of believing in a sacrifice for sins only to forgive others to be forgiven. Why would God forgive our sins through our own forgiveness then throw in a middle man that requires faith and belief?

The only sacrifice that needs to be made is our pride when we feel hate toward one another. Forgiving someone is letting go of your pride and being humbled. The least (most humble) shall be the greatest in the Kingdom.

And I agree with you that Jesus wasn't sinless, but he was free of sin debt through his own forgiveness of others. Yes we all get angry sometimes, even Jesus, but as long as we forgive others we are also forgiven and "sinless".



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 09:06 PM
link   
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
You're trying to complicate something that is very simple. At the same time, you're trying to understand something that many xtians don't even understand in full. I won't go into the full explanation, because I don't feel like typing an essay tonight. Disraeli, Ketsuko, and others have already tried to give you the simple answer to your inquiry. I don't blame them for not going full out. Why should they for those who aren't going to accept or understand it anyway?

To live as Jesus lived is simply to seek and do the will of the Father(God). If you spend your time as a xtian doing that, you will live as Jesus lived. Read the rest of the epistle, and put the verse you are reading in context...
1John 2...

But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. My little children, I am writing you these things so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father--Jesus Christ the Righteous One.



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 09:13 PM
link   
a reply to: Klassified

Thank you and WakeUpBeer, you've both helped me to understand what I was missing. You are right, I was complicating it, but not intentionally.


Thanks for clearing that up for me guys.


Also, apologies to DISRAELI and others for my stubborness.

edit on 10/20/2014 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 09:25 PM
link   
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
No problem. Glad I(we) could help. These verses in John's epistles are often misunderstood until one takes the epistle as a whole, instead of trying to pull a verse or two out of context. The new testament, whether one reads it from the perspective of believer or unbeliever, still has to be taken as a whole. Otherwise, it becomes impossible to understand.

Note though, that not all xtians believe the same way. What I give you will be more from a fundamentalist perspective, because that's what I used to be. Someone like "adjensen" would see it more from a Catholic perspective. I always try to let the text speak for itself. The best way to do that is, keep verses in context with the rest of the new testament.


edit on 10/20/2014 by Klassified because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 09:36 PM
link   
a reply to: Klassified

I usually try to do just that but sometimes I forget myself. I should have and do know better.


I guess I understand it a little differently. Jesus being our advocate is a reference to his teachings on forgiveness, so that if you forgive others' sins against you then your sins will also be forgiven by God.

My own understanding got in the way I guess.

edit on 10/20/2014 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 09:42 PM
link   

Do you live as Jesus did?


I try. And fail every day.

But the next day I try again. And fail again.

But I still try.



posted on Oct, 20 2014 @ 10:00 PM
link   
Johns letter are “packed” with poetic metaphor so much so it is very easy to twist everything he says into a doctrine when he is obviously just “stating” something he "knows" poetically.You are correct there is much confusion of what John meant and most of what is believed is “only” according to Christian doctrine(all 30,000 and counting sects).

Anyone trying to “live” by the words of Yahoshua or even the disciples as “doctrines” is in for a world of hurt and utter confusion and abysmal failure.People have been burned at the stake because they didn’t “”live” up to a doctrinal standard of what the “religious” believe John said.

Without the poetry(and definitely without the false religious doctrine) John is obviously “stating”...... what you do should be in accordance to what you are........It has NOTHING to do with Christianity or being a “Christian.John was neither a Christian or believed in Christianity nor was one of the founders.He was fighting against the hypocrisy of the religious sects that were forming by pervereting what Yahoshua and the disciples said.

He called these perverted religious fanatics "antichrists”….which means …in place of the anointing.They were what became Christians and are those whom twisted what the Apostles wrote and “proclaimed” into the doctrine of mens religion.Yahoshua nor the disciples started a new religion Christianity.... the “antichrists” did…and they are still here and more prevalent than ever!!(2 billion out of 6 billion people and counting).Yahoshua also spoke of them coming to warn the disciples.

Many will come “in my name” saying they are “christ” and will deceive many”.

That applies to only one group of “many”…Christianity.However the fact is Christians will NEVER believe this even though John and Yahoshua spoke accurately of them. 1John 2 is simply stating those that “live” in contradiction of what Yahoshua did(live a non religious life…which is the meaning of sinless) do not “know” Yahoshua (which means the creator God is deliverance from Hades…the realm of death AND the realm of imperception which is a persons Belief System religion).

John himself was “simply” proclaiming Yahoshua did NOT live a religious “life” at all nor did he follow the doctrines of men.The disciples had been “forgiven”which means freed from bondage(not pardoned of guilt) they were no longer bound by “their religion” which the “core” was Judaism.They were the only ones “given” to know the mystery of the Kingdom of their heavens( rule over their religious nature which is “sin”) yet even they did not live in a constant state … it was a process.

Thick headed religious Simon-Peter was still kow towed to Judaism years later.It took the most religious screwed up man who ever lived (Paul) to show him what he was doing.Then the creator had to give him a vision of the foolishness he still believed.John was only stating Truth by proclaiming, which is what Yahoshua said he would do.He was not establishing some religious doctrines which Christianity has made his writings into.Even the Gentile unbelievers see the folly in that.Christians can’t even live up to a faint shadow of the very few things written of Yahoshua.

If anybody is to “live”as Yahoshua did they will not have a religious bone in their body or religious thought in their mind.




edit on 20-10-2014 by Rex282 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:15 AM
link   
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Sometimes I believe what is sinful needs to be redefined, outside of what various denominations of Christianity believe...

It seems to me, its quite hard to "sin" when one lives with love in his/her life

He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.




posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 03:12 AM
link   

originally posted by: WakeUpBeer
(but what defines a sin?).

The definition of sin that I have evolved and am working with (see my thread on "Original Sin revisited") is "Out of alignment with the will of God". This is talking about the state of existence "Sin", rather than any individual acts which might be labelled "sins".
If Jesus was never out of alignment with God's will, then Hebrews is justified in calling him "without sin".



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 07:50 PM
link   

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Sometimes I believe what is sinful needs to be redefined, outside of what various denominations of Christianity believe...

It seems to me, its quite hard to "sin" when one lives with love in his/her life

He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.



How can the one who claims to be bound to sin, Original Sin, claim to be bound also to the one without sin?

A kingdom divided against itself cannot stand. What is bound on earth is bound in heaven. If sin has bound you how can you enter heaven?

The concept of Original Sin, bound to sin, keeps the congregation and their teachers far away from the Light.



posted on Oct, 22 2014 @ 09:35 AM
link   
a reply to: sacgamer25
The answer to your question is in the significance and symbolism of baptism.



posted on Oct, 22 2014 @ 10:27 AM
link   

originally posted by: Klassified
a reply to: sacgamer25
The answer to your question is in the significance and symbolism of baptism.



Baptism is for repentance, which biblically means to turn away from Sin.

The baptism of John was cleansing Isreal of it's. PAST SINS to make way for the Messiah who was without sin. The Christ is the one who TAKES AWAY the sins of the world.



2 Peter 1

9 But whoever does not have them is nearsighted and blind, forgetting that they have been cleansed from their PAST SINS.

10 Therefore, my brothers and sisters, make every effort to confirm your calling and election. For if you do these things, you will NEVER STUMBLE, 11 and you will receive a rich welcome into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.


The one baptised not by water but by the Holy Spirit,


1John 3:9
No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.

1 John 5:18
We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the One who was born of God keeps them safe, and the evil one cannot harm them.


You can believe in Original Sin and be bound to Sin.

Or you can believe in the Holy Spirit and the Light will guide you away from all sin.

You can believe the actual words of the bible that I am putting here for you. Or you can believe a convoluted church dogma of Original Sin.

Christ was without sin, the call is to be like him.

A bath can't clean your conscious and free you from sin. There is only one baptism, the one who comes after John to baptise with the Holy Spirit. And anyone who has been baptized by Christ is a son of God, who will not continue in sin.



Bible John 13

6 He came to Simon Peter, who said to him, “Lord, are you going to wash my feet?”

7 Jesus replied, “YOU DO NOT REALIZE NOW WHAT I AM DOING BUT LATER YOU WILL UNDERSTAND.”

8 “No,” said Peter, “you shall never wash my feet.”

Jesus answered, “Unless I wash you, you have no part with me.”

9 “Then, Lord,” Simon Peter replied, “not just my feet but my hands and my head as well!”

10 Jesus answered, “THOSE WHO HAVE HAD A BATH NEED ONLY WASH THEIR FEET"; their whole body is clean.


Those who have been baptized INTO ORIGINAL SIN, need only wash thier feet to be baptized INTO THE HOLY SPIRIT, WHO IS WITHOUT SIN.


edit on 22-10-2014 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 22 2014 @ 10:56 AM
link   
a reply to: sacgamer25
See there. You answered your own question. You didn't need any help from the heathens after all.



posted on Oct, 22 2014 @ 04:05 PM
link   
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Jesus did not sin, but according to which religion? Not The Jewish (Old Testament) one.

Working on The Sabbath is a sin
but Jesus chose to heal people anyway.

A women who commits adultery must be stoned to death
but Jesus let her go.

Old testament says "show no pity: a life for life, eye for eye and tooth for tooth"
Jesus specifically said not to follow this but to forgive instead.

Jesus led a life of forgiveness instead of revenge. The certain Jewish sects saw him as a blasphemer and sinner.

It is absolutely possible for someone to leave their old life in order to live a new life led by Forgiveness (The Spirit), but as long as they believe it's not possible, then they will probably not even take the effort to do so.


"Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love." - 1 John 4:7-8

Jesus tells us specifically how to be The Children of God:

"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect." - Matthew 5:44-48

You reap what you sow, you get what you give. What goes around comes around. If you forgive then you will be forgiven. Forgiving others changes your reaction towards others. This is the exit from karma.

"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:" - Luke 6:37

"For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." - Matthew 6:14-15



new topics

top topics



 
4
<< 1   >>

log in

join