It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Is there an organized effort to undermine the Aliens and UFOs forum?

page: 8
94
<< 5  6  7    9  10  11 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 12:24 PM
link   
well there is certainly one guy who has the seeming authority of a
concerted effort. He's been doing it for 25+ years.
he protests way too much. So when he shows up on a thread I take special notice.




posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 12:31 PM
link   

originally posted by: OrionsGem

originally posted by: PhoenixOD
a reply to: OrionsGem



But what are skeptics, believers and everyone in between supposed to do


See this is one of the flaws to your thinking right here, many skeptics ARE believers.


No flaw at all, someone who is a skeptic and a believer (I am both) Would fall into the "everyone in between" part of my statement. Please read more carefully.

OG


You set them up as diametrically opposed categories which define the full range when they are not and do not.

Please write more carefully.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 12:34 PM
link   

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: OrionsGem

originally posted by: PhoenixOD
a reply to: OrionsGem



But what are skeptics, believers and everyone in between supposed to do


See this is one of the flaws to your thinking right here, many skeptics ARE believers.


No flaw at all, someone who is a skeptic and a believer (I am both) Would fall into the "everyone in between" part of my statement. Please read more carefully.

OG


You set them up as diametrically opposed categories which define the full range when they are not and do not.

Please write more carefully.


Ah I see what you mean..You still got the gist of it didn't you? Feigning ignorance is not an argument either. How about discussing the rest of my post instead of picking one sentence?

OG
edit on 10-21-2014 by OrionsGem because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 12:57 PM
link   

originally posted by: OrionsGem

originally posted by: SkepticOverlord

originally posted by: OrionsGem
So first hand witness testimony is not acceptable in a UFO or Alien encounter from your perspective is that right?

It's not ideal. When I was doing interviews at the 2011 International UFO Conference, I met and spoke with quite a few people who claimed to have contact experience (slightly less than a dozen). In each case, they confessed to having gone to UFO conferences, and purchased books about UFO's, prior to their claimed contact experience. To any researcher, this puts a lot of doubt on a lot of stories.

Also, here's my interview with Stanton Friedman: video.abovetopsecret.com, he thinks skeptics are important to UFO research.


It may not be ideal. Ideal would be little green men landing on the white house lawn and giving free saucer rides.

But what are skeptics, believers and everyone in between supposed to do in a field such as this where ALL WE HAVE is witness testimony?

As Ive said before, there may NEVER be any hard testable evidence of UFOs or Aliens existing.

What we have is skeptics and debunkers screaming for evidence, which simply does not exist at this time.

And on the other hand, the folks who choose to believe in the ET presence are labeled as blind believers, closed minded individuals who live in a fantasy world, believing in fairy tales.

Since when has this field become so polarizing?

Why cant I choose to believe some cases, and label others as a hoax? Why are we being forced to choose between option A and option B?

I personally believe in the existence of ETs and their vehicles, but that is due to several encounters during my childhood which solidified this "knowing" that its real. This DOES NOT mean that I believe every BS you tube video that's posted, or every story from an alleged govt "insider"

Now if I shared my childhood encounters here, which were very real to me indeed, it would be considered witness testimony, which is ALL I HAVE.

I would then be accosted by people swarming the thread saying things like
"extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" Give me a break!

Asking me for hard evidence which does not, and may NEVER exist this field is pointless.

So I ask you, if skeptics and debunkers accepted the fact that hard evidence may never be presented, then what method can be used to verify the authenticity of an alleged encounter??

We seem to be going in circles over and over again in this forum, its become highly predictable and is stagnating;

We cant ride this "proof or it didn't happen" merry go round forever.

Thoughts?

OG



What is it that you want to see here?

Seriously.

Complaining about what you see or read here at ATS, I understand. But then, why not offer what YOU think people should be doing?

For example: what kind of responses do you want people to make to threads? Do you simply want everyone here to be "Yes" people and blindly take everything they see and hear and accept it? Do you wish only for people to star and flag your post and leave it at that? Do you wish no one to ask questions about it at all?

If so, then ATS certainly is not the place for you or others that want things to be like that here. Try GLP, they pretty much ban anyone that dares to ask questions or have any doubts.

If on the other hand, you just want civilized conversation, discussion and even debate, and accept that people will question things, ask for proof, or sources, then that is what you will get here.

IF and this is a big IF, IF you and others feel that there is an organized attack against you, others, or this forum, then use the ALERT button. Take time to compose your complaint to the staff. Use links to posts and threads. Present you case to the staff. They WILL look into it, because Forum Gangs are against the TCs.

Is anyone calling you or others names and insults? Use that ALERT button. The staff will respond. Sometimes it might take a little while, but they will take action.

Someone is derailing your's or someone elses thread? Again, hit that ALERT button. The staff will look into it, and if someone is derailing the thread, there will be a warning and posts removed.

What the staff won't do is: remove someone's post if they are simply questioning things. Not unless their post is full of insults, anger, hate, etc.

The mods on here do not sit and read through every forum thread. They can't. There are way too many. They depend upon people like you and me to click on the ALERT button and let them know.

But if no one does, and they don't see it, they can't help stop a thread from being derailed, members being insulted, or bad behavior in general.

No reason why any topic here on ATS should go that way. Not when there are ways to complain about it directly to the staff.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 01:16 PM
link   
I dont derail nor discredit threads; I am NOT a skeptic, I believe ET is out there 100%, but not EVERY LIGHT in the sky is an alien ship.
As searchers for truth, you MUST rule out ALL manmade and natural occurrences before saying its ET. If you dont do that, then you are a huge discredit to yourself and the UFOlogy community.
Yes I know its frustrating to see a video of a UFO be picked and pulled apart, only to find out it was an insect or man made object or straight out hoax, but thats how we filter out the real stuff from the nonreal stuff, and get closer to the truth.
As far as 'govt disinfo agents' go, I think thats just how people rationalize being told what they have is false, deliberately hoaxed or misidentified, so its easier to call them a disinfo agent then face their OWN truth.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 01:40 PM
link   


Is there an organized effort to undermine the Aliens and UFOs forum?


That's what it's there for.




posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:02 PM
link   

originally posted by: HomerinNC
As far as 'govt disinfo agents' go, I think thats just how people rationalize being told what they have is false, deliberately hoaxed or misidentified, so its easier to call them a disinfo agent then face their OWN truth.


what's funny is when people accuse others of being 'govt disinfo agents' because they are questioning ideas or stories who's only source seems to be 'govt disinfo agents'



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:03 PM
link   

originally posted by: MKMoniker
a reply to: ZetaRediculian

"Well there is some very ambiguous evidence that is being pushed rather hard by The History Channel for ratings I guess."

There is nothing "ambiguous" about the evidence for UFOs/ETs. If you really delve into the topic, instead of being just a cursory-shill, the "evidence" for UFOs/ETs is overwhelming:

1) Why are there stone pyramids all over the world? "Simultaneous inventions" doesn't fit, since these pyramids are also connected to civilizations with abrupt and profound "new knowledge."

2) Why do so many of these abrupt-civilizations have such an interest in astronomy and especially certain distant constellations, like Orion? This is far more than just a "marking of the seasons." Our Moon Phases do that better.

3) How do you explain away ancient cave paintings of humanoids in spacesuits, when primitive man was not into "fiction", but recording what they really saw and experienced?

4) How do you explain all the religious paintings in the Middle Ages with discs/UFOs in the sky overhead? Some even alluding to the fact that Jesus, although born on Earth, was really an Advanced Soul from off-planet? (And his virgin-birth was similar to the abduction phenomenon today, or implantation of fertilized eggs in a female host.)

Like I said, the proof IS here. And the only inconsistencies are natural misunderstandings based on all the different ETs interacting with Earth. And the deniers/debunkers/shills over-arching efforts to explain away UFOs/ETs - which are often more ridiculous and convoluted than just admitting that something was an ET-craft!


You're starting with the conclusion and then tailoring "evidence" to fit it. You have zero testable evidence proving that stone pyramids were created by ETs.

"Abrupt civilizations"? Interest in constellations? Uh..constellations are in the sky and ancients spent more time outdoors than modern humans do. It's human nature to be curious about that which you see and to make up stories about it or study it and reach conclusions. You're seeing things and making up stories and reaching conclusions -- incorrect ones but, nevertheless, stories and conclusions. You seem to assume that ancient humans were ignorant sots who simply grubbed for tubers and grunted. Paying attention to the change of seasons, especially predicting them in advance, meant the difference between life and death.

There are no ancient cave paintings of "humanoids in space suits". There is prehistoric art depicting shamanic transformation figures recognizable to relatively modern indigenous cultures as such. The notion that a civilization or civilizations so advanced that they could travel from one planet to another would use the space suits worn by Buzz Aldrin is as ludicrous as the notion that they would wear Elizabethan clothing. The notion that primitive humans weren't "into fiction" is also ludicrous. What do you think religion is based on?

That which you call "religious paintings in the Middle Ages with discs/UFOS in the sky overhead" are religious paintings with traditional (for that time) symbolic icons of the sun and moon "witnessing" the birth and crucifixion of Christ. A little research into art history would have taught you that. Unfortunately, you get your art history from "Ancient Aliens".

Do let us know when you get some actual testable evidence.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:16 PM
link   

originally posted by: lme7898354
The history of reporting anything to do with ufo's has become the subject of ridicule. People are afraid of being labeled a nut case for reporting or saying anything publicly about the subject. In my mind the best way to hide something is right out in plain sight. The disinformation spread by governments have made it a subject many shy away from.

The fact remains that throughout time mankind has reported strange things in the sky that cannot be explained away as natural phenomenon. I don't think anything will change unless ET lands on the parking lot at the mall, then there would be no denying the truth. The other problem is a lot of so called experts always want to sell you something on the subject which makes it hard to sift thru the truth tellers and those out to make a buck.


It's become a subject of ridicule because of the plethora of nut jobs mixed in with those with a serious interest and the ability to reason critically. The nut jobs get most of the publicity and when a non nut job reports something s/he gets dumped into the same tainted pile.

As for disinformation, I have no doubt that various facets of the government use it for their own agendas. But it seems clear to me that, rather than discouraging the belief in UFOs, most of it is designed to encourage belief in UFOs and manipulate the nature of that belief. Which is more likely to get your attention, a box that is opened in your presence so that you can see the contents or a box that you're allowed to glimpse, aggressively prevented from opening, and told contains nothing or is explained away with an absurd claim such as, "There's nothing in it except a carrot"?

I am not claiming that unidentified flying objects don't exist. I am suggesting that various groups have a vested interest in manipulating what you believe they are.

Your point that nothing will change until ET lands in the mall and then the truth will be known presupposes that UFOs are piloted by extraterrestrials which you claim to be "the truth". I wonder who wants you to believe that and why. Have you ever asked yourself that question?
edit on 21-10-2014 by Tangerine because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:19 PM
link   
a reply to: aynock



...ideas or stories who's only source seems to be 'govt disinfo agents'


Precisely.

And let's not forget the temporal-lobe epileptics of all sorts and types.


edit on 21-10-2014 by Bybyots because: . : .



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:23 PM
link   
a reply to: Tangerine

It could be argued that the "plethora of nut jobs" are part of the disinfo crowd. A great deal of nonsense is posted making it easy for the whole kit & kabootal to be dismissed as crack-pottery.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:32 PM
link   

originally posted by: duaneology
a reply to: Tangerine

It could be argued that the "plethora of nut jobs" are part of the disinfo crowd. A great deal of nonsense is posted making it easy for the whole kit & kabootal to be dismissed as crack-pottery.



I think that some of them are part of the disinformation crowd and others who aren't quickly get in line. Again, I'll use religion as an example. A couple people claim to have had vision and suddenly many others make the claim. Have they actually had the same vision or are they highly susceptible to suggestion?



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:39 PM
link   
a reply to: Bybyots

it's certainly one of many factors to be considered



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:45 PM
link   
In the information age, it's increasingly difficult to stop information from getting out. Therefore, polluting the airwaves/internets with cheap and obvious hoaxes lessens the credibility of any genuine artifacts/stories. It's called disinformation. Especially on a conspiracy forum, it's easy to become jaded. No matter how many documentaries you force me to watch, it will never be definitive truth for me. I need to see it for myself.




posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 02:47 PM
link   
a reply to: aynock



it's certainly one of many factors to be considered


Considering the *report produced by Project Condign, I don't think that it is going to be possible to move the conversation forward any longer without contending with the all pervasive role that the temporal-lobes play in this most profound and ancient of human experiences.

But that's just me.



*Check out "working papers" 24, 25

Here, better yet, this thread just came up at ATS...

Sir Francis Chichester Recounts His 1931 Sighting - Earliest UFO Report On Film?

Now, if I were to say, "Hey, sounds to me like 'Ol Frank Chichester had an ocular migraine", one might just brush that aside as a "skeptic" reaching for straws.

That is, until one realizes that plenty of pilots are having perfectly reasonable conversations about dealing with this phenomenon of the human brain...

www.pilotsofamerica.com...

Visual migraines vs. FAA Medical question.

...all the time.


edit on 21-10-2014 by Bybyots because: . : .



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 03:34 PM
link   
a reply to: Bybyots

This is really good stuff. I could add a few more common brain spasms to your list and after we look at all the possible ways in which our brains flatulate, people would be wondering how we function as a society. But we do.

eta: sounds like 'Ol Frank Chichester was remembering something 34 years later. Perhaps a memory that took on a life of its own?
www.nybooks.com...
edit on 21-10-2014 by ZetaRediculian because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 03:34 PM
link   
lol OP, you're kinda funny! Sadly you'll see these people in divers forums and video portals.

The annoying part is that most of them are not even debunking anything. And most people who read their comments will jump on their side...

You know there is a reason why people say that something can be 'hard to believe' because it is a lot easier to not believe things.
While I agree that there is no real proof of aliens on earth There is more than enough evidence of unexplainable flying objects.

You know there has to be something to it when even atronauts are hinting at E.T life...



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 03:54 PM
link   

originally posted by: Eagleyedobserver
lol OP, you're kinda funny! Sadly you'll see these people in divers forums and video portals.

The annoying part is that most of them are not even debunking anything. And most people who read their comments will jump on their side...

You know there is a reason why people say that something can be 'hard to believe' because it is a lot easier to not believe things.
While I agree that there is no real proof of aliens on earth There is more than enough evidence of unexplainable flying objects.

You know there has to be something to it when even atronauts are hinting at E.T life...




You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little f'ed up maybe, but I'm funny how, you mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to f'in amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 03:55 PM
link   
Ive noticed the same thing with the UFO/Alien forum. Some of the attacks on the posters posting a UFO thread are outrageous and downright ridiculous. Its ok to debunk, but its another thing entirely to attack someone and their post using venom and belittling words.

If you're not interested in UFOs and its lore, then don't post in that section or read the threads there. If you're a skeptic and someone who does not believe in the stuff, then again, do not post in that section or read its threads. Otherwise, all you're doing is running people off from this website who came here looking for stuff that interests them. In this case, its UFOs. Yeah, there are people out there who believe in Aliens and that Aliens have visited earth. Who are we to judge?

There are many topics and sections on this ATS website/forum that I do not care for or believe in. I don't go posting in those threads calling the OP a liar and a hoaxer...or a nut job and whatnot. So I avoid those posts/sections. You should do the same.
edit on 21-10-2014 by Vrill because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 03:57 PM
link   
a reply to: duaneology

You know, its just the way you tell a story...its just funny



new topics

top topics



 
94
<< 5  6  7    9  10  11 >>

log in

join