It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Is there an organized effort to undermine the Aliens and UFOs forum?

page: 10
94
<< 7  8  9    11  12  13 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:13 PM
link   
a reply to: ZetaRediculian




The folks that you think are "undermining" the topic are the ones that are probably telling you the truth. The folks that are telling you what you want to hear are just telling you what you want to hear.


It works both ways. Some skeptics will accept any ridiculous explanation even when more than 1 trained eyewitness can corroborate what they had seen. For example, skeptics want to easily explain away the yellow, blue and red light that 6 trained military observers witnessed during the Rendlesham Forest incident as coming from a light house. The last time I checked, light houses don't give off red or blue lights let alone a yellow light. Not only taking that into consideration, one of the military personal physically touched the vehicle that was hovering low on the ground in the forest.

So people who have actually researched and compared UFO incidents for years are actually supposed to believe these explanations as being true? Give me a break. I also have a tropical island in Alaska to sell if you want to believe that one.

The JAL incident is just another compelling UFO incident where trained pilots observed a UFO following their aircraft. The entire incident was picked up on radar from tower observers. These are just two of many other incidents that simple explanations just don't cut it. I see it as more of a concerted effort to sway the public from asking questions and to keep the UFO topic as a tongue and cheek news story.




posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:18 PM
link   
a reply to: AboveBoard

Oh thanks.

Where I come from flagged threads are bad.

This place is truly the twilight zone



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:26 PM
link   
a reply to: duaneology

I think calling attention to that effort in play is a very good way to combat it. I have noticed, also, some kind of link between certain issues with people who also claim to have had a UFO encounter. I think it comes with the territory of plausible deniability with what someone else called the "flat earth society." Once you claim that contact, you can expect harrassment on many levels. Are you familiar, of course, with the story of Paul Bennewitz?



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:29 PM
link   
a reply to: tetra50

I'm not familiar with Paul Bennewitz.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:32 PM
link   
a reply to: Tangerine

"Do let us know when you get some actual testable evidence."

As I've stated before, anything that is "officially denied" relies on a sliding-scale when it comes to "proof" - testable or otherwise. And that it usually boils down to a power game to keep the UFO/ET phenomenon under wraps, so the "proof" morphs continually.

And for those who consider well examined government documents as "proof", here are a few sites you can visit:

majesticdocuments.com...
MAJESTIC DOCUMENTS
Includes "document authentication".

www.dia.mil...
DIA "FOIA ELECTRONIC READING ROOM"
Scroll down to "Other" and open the second file for:
"Documentation containing information relating to Unidentified Flying Objects. (UFOs)"

But the public is getting smarter all the time, especially with the Internet. And all TPTB are really accomplishing is driving "public trust in government" into the ground. I mean, something like 90% of Americans think there is more to the Kennedy Assassination than we've been told.

So by all means, stay warm and cozy in your snark and total refusal to acknowledge the obvious, Tangerine. Good men have died to get this proof before the public. So don't worry, you'll never be in their league ...

vaticproject.blogspot.com...
MANY UFO RESEARCHERS HAVE DIED UNDER MYSTERIOUS CIRCUMSTANCES



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:34 PM
link   

originally posted by: duaneology
a reply to: tetra50

I'm not familiar with Paul Bennewitz.





You should watch Mirage Men. I heard its on Netflix these days.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:34 PM
link   
a reply to: duaneology

In a few years if you are still a member here, you will be saying what I am saying right now, to someone like you.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:37 PM
link   

originally posted by: duaneology
a reply to: tetra50

I'm not familiar with Paul Bennewitz.




I suggest you look up his story. Here: "Driving Mr. Bennewitz Insane, author Phillip CoppensLINK
It should throw some light on my post, and your OP…..
tetra



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:38 PM
link   
a reply to: rigel4

Zero proof? Ever listened to any of Richard Dolan's presentations? Where he goes over the plethora of military and government documents related to this phenomenon?

Even the culmination project bluebook, a known debunking effort from the air force, left over 5% of sightings to be unexplainable. And they were using swamp gas and reflections etc. to try and explain/justify a decent part of their sightings.
Has anyone here actually seen swamp gas?

There is plenty of documentable evidence that the phenomenon has been studied by the government and is a legitimate phenomenon, and a lot of circumstantial evidence as well as first hand accounts that the phenomenon continues today.

Plenty of good videos on youtube mixed among the garbage. Try looking at some of the videos that don't have that many views, you will be pleasantly surprised.

Look up Phil Schneider on youtube if the videos are still there. Gave like 4-5 talks about underground bases and how he helped construct a few, talked about aliens in a few of the bases and an alien firefight, talked about the government and how he was fed up and that's why he was coming out with the info. About a month after his last talk he was found dead in his home, strangled with piano wire. Body showed significant signs of torture. Ruled a suicide.
edit on 10/21/2014 by smarterthanyou because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:45 PM
link   
a reply to: mirageman
I think, as well, there are people who simply have memories that they can't make congruent with their perception both of time and reality. I think this is a real problem for people who have had some kind of contact. Trying to make sense of that cognitive dissonance, and real memories that just don't fit, regardless of some kind of scientific evidence.
Anecdotal evidence counts for me, anyway, regardless of the science. If this is some kind of simulation overlay we live within, it certainly makes a lot more sense. And one memory may not be any false than any other, if that is the case….
Or someone or something is attempting to shift consciousness by using human minds and perception. I think this may be quite likely. And this forum and what people report, seems to support that.

But there are people that have a need to assert that only their perception empirically of things is the truth, when that may be quite a more nebulous thing….
tetra



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:46 PM
link   
You will get used to it op, and will know the users whom jump in immediately to shut and close off a thread which is outside of our current cultural thinking. However i come to this sight and pick and choose what i want to believe.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:47 PM
link   

originally posted by: MKMoniker
a reply to: Tangerine

"Do let us know when you get some actual testable evidence."

As I've stated before, anything that is "officially denied" relies on a sliding-scale when it comes to "proof" - testable or otherwise. And that it usually boils down to a power game to keep the UFO/ET phenomenon under wraps, so the "proof" morphs continually.

And for those who consider well examined government documents as "proof", here are a few sites you can visit:

majesticdocuments.com...
MAJESTIC DOCUMENTS
Includes "document authentication".

www.dia.mil...
DIA "FOIA ELECTRONIC READING ROOM"
Scroll down to "Other" and open the second file for:
"Documentation containing information relating to Unidentified Flying Objects. (UFOs)"

But the public is getting smarter all the time, especially with the Internet. And all TPTB are really accomplishing is driving "public trust in government" into the ground. I mean, something like 90% of Americans think there is more to the Kennedy Assassination than we've been told.

So by all means, stay warm and cozy in your snark and total refusal to acknowledge the obvious, Tangerine. Good men have died to get this proof before the public. So don't worry, you'll never be in their league ...

vaticproject.blogspot.com...
MANY UFO RESEARCHERS HAVE DIED UNDER MYSTERIOUS CIRCUMSTANCES



What, specifically, is "obvious" that I refuse to acknowledge?



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 05:55 PM
link   

originally posted by: Vrill
Ive noticed the same thing with the UFO/Alien forum. Some of the attacks on the posters posting a UFO thread are outrageous and downright ridiculous. Its ok to debunk, but its another thing entirely to attack someone and their post using venom and belittling words.

If you're not interested in UFOs and its lore, then don't post in that section or read the threads there. If you're a skeptic and someone who does not believe in the stuff, then again, do not post in that section or read its threads. Otherwise, all you're doing is running people off from this website who came here looking for stuff that interests them. In this case, its UFOs. Yeah, there are people out there who believe in Aliens and that Aliens have visited earth. Who are we to judge?

There are many topics and sections on this ATS website/forum that I do not care for or believe in. I don't go posting in those threads calling the OP a liar and a hoaxer...or a nut job and whatnot. So I avoid those posts/sections. You should do the same.


Skeptics shouldn't post? May I suggest that those of you of that opinion start a church where you meet privately rather than posting on ATS where topics are open for comment and discussion. Skeptics are interested. We're simply not gullible enough to confuse claims with facts. Debunkers are another matter. Don't confuse them with skeptics.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 06:00 PM
link   

originally posted by: smarterthanyou

Zero proof? Ever listened to any of Richard Dolan's presentations? Where he goes over the plethora of military and government documents related to this phenomenon?

Even the culmination project bluebook, a known debunking effort from the air force, left over 5% of sightings to be unexplainable. And they were using swamp gas and reflections etc. to try and explain/justify a decent part of their sightings.
Has anyone here actually seen swamp gas?

A look at national security issues--especially as regards the cold war--should be essential when approaching this topic.


There is plenty of documentable evidence that the phenomenon has been studied by the government and is a legitimate phenomenon, and a lot of circumstantial evidence as well as first hand accounts that the phenomenon continues today.

Plenty of good videos on youtube mixed among the garbage. Try looking at some of the videos that don't have that many views, you will be pleasantly surprised.

Doesn't mean they are extraterrestrial though, right?


Look up Phil Schneider on youtube if the videos are still there. Gave like 4-5 talks about underground bases and how he helped construct a few, talked about aliens in a few of the bases and an alien firefight, talked about the government and how he was fed up and that's why he was coming out with the info. About a month after his last talk he was found dead in his home, strangled with piano wire. Body showed significant signs of torture. Ruled a suicide.

See, this is why some of us get a little flustered with those who read some, but fail to research. Schneider wasn't "strangled" with piano wire and the "significant torture" assertion is not supported. And, imo, I'd take the "firefight with aliens" story with a grain of salt.


edit on 21-10-2014 by The GUT because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 06:00 PM
link   

originally posted by: FearYourMind
Ice crystals pulsate, stop and change direction in space. They just have a mind of their own I guess. Jim sure knows his ice crystals.


When was the last time you observed ice particles IN SPACE IN ZERO GRAVITY...so you know that the movement observed is "not possible"? Did you ever see ice particles float in space in zero gravity?

(As for the Tether incident in general..it amazes me how many people [incl. in this video] are still saying it's "disc-shaped objects with a notch", because it cannot be more clear to me that it's very tiny particles OUT OF FOCUS. You even see that it's out of focus when the camera focuses clear on the tether....where, at the same time, the tiny "drops" or what it is all of a sudden magically "become discs". IT'S RIGHT THERE ON FILM. Only someone entirely lacking a basic understanding of optics would not see that and claim it's large discs with a notch.
To add to this, the notches even have been proven/explained as coming from the optics of the camera used, 100% satisfactory explained/debunked. The fact alone that the notch is always at the same position should could also give you a hint. But of course you can simply ignore those points and continue saying it's UFOs, disregarding a whole ton of evidence speaking against it. IE: Waste your time with something which has long been explained. Yawn.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 06:10 PM
link   
a reply to: The GUT
But don't you think that along with this topic, there's plenty of prentenders of purpose to debunk everyone else who may be totally sane and truthful? In other words, they are there in an organized effort to make it all look like fruit from the poison tree, when it may not all be that way.
tetra



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 06:19 PM
link   
a reply to: ZetaRediculian




The folks that you think are "undermining" the topic are the ones that are probably telling you the truth. The folks that are telling you what you want to hear are just telling you what you want to hear.




originally posted by: WeRpeons
It works both ways.

Yes, confirmation bias is confirmation bias.


Some skeptics will accept any ridiculous explanation even when more than 1 trained eyewitness can corroborate what they had seen. For example, skeptics want to easily explain away the yellow, blue and red light that 6 trained military observers witnessed during the Rendlesham Forest incident as coming from a light house. The last time I checked, light houses don't give off red or blue lights let alone a yellow light. Not only taking that into consideration, one of the military personal physically touched the vehicle that was hovering low on the ground in the forest.

I am pretty familiar with the Rendlesham case and your retelling isn't really accurate. Thing is there is a recording and a transcript that can be referenced. only one person saw a red light and he was corrected that it was yellow...on tape. and then it looks like you are confusing other lights from different nights. People can certainly make up their own minds but it helps when the info is accurate.



So people who have actually researched and compared UFO incidents for years are actually supposed to believe these explanations as being true? Give me a break. I also have a tropical island in Alaska to sell if you want to believe that one.

people should make up their own minds based on real information. Skeptics don't always get it right. I always double check.




The JAL incident is just another compelling UFO incident where trained pilots observed a UFO following their aircraft. The entire incident was picked up on radar from tower observers. These are just two of many other incidents that simple explanations just don't cut it.

Those were 2 cases I followed closely. In the case of JAL, there are transcripts from cockpit recordings and formal interviews that were conducted soon after the incident. Both cases are hyped up by UFO sites and UFO documentaries. Once you dig into the real documentation, you find out who is really trying to get one over on you.


I see it as more of a concerted effort to sway the public from asking questions and to keep the UFO topic as a tongue and cheek news story.

Funny thing is that when I ask questions, the first folks to try and shut me up are not the skeptics.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 06:20 PM
link   
a reply to: The GUT

You sir/ma'am Gut are my favorite forum poster of all time in the history of the Internet. It was your Jaques Vallee thread that brought me here.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 06:27 PM
link   

originally posted by: tetra50
a reply to: The GUT
But don't you think that along with this topic, there's plenty of prentenders of purpose to debunk everyone else who may be totally sane and truthful? In other words, they are there in an organized effort to make it all look like fruit from the poison tree, when it may not all be that way.
tetra


You and possibly some others generalize people.
As so many times pointed out already, not any debunker is a "paid shill" or debunk or is skeptic because of evil intent.

As for me, I actually think genuine seeming witness accounts are amongst the best cases, when "average people" see something truly unexplainable and you can feel/see that they tell the truth from the way they report. That being said, even then OF COURSE I try to find a rational explanation...or I am also not hesitant to point things out.

A good example would be a good number of people who report seeing triangle craft at night, and most of the time when you dig deeper you find they in-fact "merely" saw three lights. I don't know about you, but for me it makes a difference whether someone says they saw a real,solid shape/craft...or someone who saw three lights and actually never saw a solid shape. In the first case, the guy REALLY saw a shape, in the second...the "giant craft" was only an assumption but he didn't really SEE it.



posted on Oct, 21 2014 @ 06:35 PM
link   
a reply to: duaneology
The real kicker is when you have sightings yourself and come to the conclusion that self experience changes everything and most likely the U.F.O. phenomenon involves and interacts with every single one of us on a deeper level that a lot of us do not have the courage to face and prefer to dismiss it.
I have been into this stuff for close to 2 decades and i feel it has a lot to do with spirituality,it is very sophisticated and massively complex and is so much more than Aliens visiting the Planet in nuts and bolts crafts.

Most people switch off if you mention this stuff or think you need certifying but the more you investigate the more you understand the truly raving tin foil hat wearers are the knee jerk debunkers and sceptics whether they are paid to do it or not they are working against humanity and ultimately themselves.



new topics




 
94
<< 7  8  9    11  12  13 >>

log in

join