#GamerGate (the consumer revolt that won't go away)

Gamergate started over a pissed off ex-boyfriend slamming his ex-girlfriend by basically calling her a slut. It has since evolved into one of the most embarrassing debacles and examples of misogyny in gaming history and makes me ashamed to be a gamer.

Cracked interview with Zoe Quinn

a reply to: TrueBrit

Good single player games still come out. Many are even AAA too. The Uncharted series comes to mind. Assassin's Creed (at least the first ones, I can't stand the new one). The JRPG industry is still going strong and those games are LOOOOONG; especially if you want to 100% everything.

I've learned to just ignore the stuff that doesn't appeal to me and focus on the stuff that does. People get so upset when an industry goes in a direction they don't like. But so what? It happens everywhere. The music industry has evolved and changed over time. Movies, same thing. Why should video games be any different? That doesn't mean that stuff you will like isn't coming out though. You just have to be more selective and discerning about choosing what you spend your money on.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Let's not forget, that Quinn girl is an idiot though..

Depression Quest is most certainly NOT a 'game'.

And none of this should have been important, except she managed to sleep with half the staff at Kotaku, so that made it news worthy..

Can we go back to the days where the biggest problem in gaming was the de-scaling from 1080p to 480p for console gamers?

PS..

PC GAMING MASTER RACE FTW..

~Tenth

I think the only MMO I've ever played for any length of time was Eve Online.....

Now there's a Multiplayer game where "Trolling" is the standard, hehehehe.

Played it for years, then stopped. It was sucking up way too much of my time, I had to depend on other people, and eventually, just got bored silly with it.

I've tried other MMOs here and there, and while the eye candy can be good, and playing with friends can be fun, the crux of it for me is: I play a computer game for entertainment, enjoyment, and to escape the real world for a while.

If I want to socialize, I have a lot of friends that I can go see in person, hang out with and do real things in the real world with.

When I sit down at the computer to play a game, I want it to be at my pace, what I want to do, and go where I want to go as much as possible.

Single player games do that for me. MMOs.....not so much.

There's a puzzle I want to solve...so I get to solve it. Not someone else in my group. There's a bad guy to take down, I want to do it. Not someone else that I'm playing with.

If I want to chat with friend, their's always Skype, Facebook or the phone....or even jumping in the car and going to see them.

My wife is the same with her games she plays (except FB games.....which are like an addictive drug for her, heh). My son Josh likes to play single player, or sit with me while I'm playing something. My older sons and daughters tend to do the MMOs more however.

Nothing wrong with MMOs though. They are what they are, and are just right for many. But for some, like me, just not my cup of tea.

a reply to: tothetenthpower

Who cares who she slept with? That's the whole point! I don't care if she is an idiot or not. I don't care if what she created can be considered a game (for the record it most assuredly IS a game, just because you don't consider it a game doesn't make it so). This whole issue is a giant double standard on women and is insulting.

Go read that Cracked article I just posted. Do you think that those actions are acceptable? This poor girl's PARENTS have been harassed. I don't care what issues may or may not be real with this debacle, it ALL started from misogyny and ALL traces back to it.

From what I've been reading.

I don't see this as a good thing.

waxy.org...

Calling someone out for crappy journalism is one thing.

Threatening to ruin someones life is another.

I don't agree with any of this.

originally posted by: eriktheawful
Now there's a Multiplayer game where "Trolling" is the standard, hehehehe.

I've never played EVE since the description alone sounds too archaic/nerdy to me, this is why I am having so high hopes for Elite Dangerous and (possibly) Star Citizen, although the latter will probably only become a GIANT money grab fest.

Point is, the often heard comments that trolling etc. is actually "encouraged" in EVE, believe it or not, has a certain appeal to me. I would prefer a virtual world with trolls and gankers over playing alone any time. At least it means SOMETHING IS HAPPENING...and to be honest, trolling, ganking, exploiting whatever....can be fun : )

(In the same way as it was fun, eg. in WoW to go into enemy territory and troll/gank/kill others...or get killed for that matter. Point being..it's a living world where you can interact with others in infinite ways

>>
the crux of it for me is: I play a computer game for entertainment, enjoyment, and to escape the real world for a while.

If I want to socialize, I have a lot of friends that I can go see in person, hang out with and do real things in the real world with.
>>

I can't understand those arguments. Because playing in a virtual world where there also others for me extremely increases entertainment, enjoyment and actually the impression to spend time in another "real" world.

As for "negative" things in "social" games, say, the eternal guild drama or trolls in chat etc....there is always ways to ignore them...and (now talking about WoW)..this world is so large that you can well choose to spend the next week(s) alone doing your thing without "having to" do anything with others.
(Of course, for me, doing quests or events together with mates IMHO was always way more interesting and more fun).

I also don't understand your argument that "if you want to socialize you can do it in the real world". This is of course correct, but why not also in a game world?

Many people (actually the majority!) we "know" are people from all over the globe, starting with former friends from back in the states...or people in Norway, Sweden and wherever...and while you play a MMO extensively...you form relationships with those people. Say if they are members in your guild etc.

For me, the social aspect of those games (that is, the positive AND negative!) actually *makes* the game, without them it would be dull.

That being said, there are (some) games I also enjoy SP...for example the last Tomb Raider etc...and Far Cry 3....but those games worth playing get increasingly more rare.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Honestly? I don't believe a word out of this girl's mouth.

I've been following it closely enough on Tumblr and other places to know what this is about. The whole debate this started about women in gaming is ridiculous.

Bioware is NOT being sexist by not having playable female characters if their story does not call for one. Neither is any other developer for that matter.

Video games have absolutely no place in a discussion about gender equality and rights. Besides, about half of all gamers are women now.

it ALL started from misogyny and ALL traces back to it.

No, this is what the Tumblr Social Justice Warrior crowd turned this into. She had people code a 'game for her', got upset when it didn't do well at all and when her dirty laundry was exposed by those she wronged, she claimed misogyny.

It's ridiculous.

If she had left it alone and not gone online and made a complete mess out of herself, none of this would have happened. She's an attention seeking little brat and got what she wanted.

~Tenth


ETA: here's the thing.

If you use your GENDER and sex as a means to get something and then people tell other people, that's NOT misogyny.

Being a gamer myself and being lucky enough to have grown up with the first gaming systems following through to where we are today I can honestly say that I NEVER listen to what the mainstream reviewers are stating about the games.

I always jump onto you tube and look at actual user reviews.

But this goes beyond just games... If ever I am in the market to buy anything I would always research the user reviews.

It's common sense stuff really, no need to campaign against the corruption...

Korg.

a reply to: monkofmimir

It's really annoying. The rational people are angry because of the sheer despotism being displayed by the "feminists."

The arguments from the pseudo-feminists can be summed up as "I don't like it when women are sexy in video games, so we totally need to ban those kinds of games. Or make the developers write storylines that only I enjoy."

These people do not understand the concept of a free market--don't like a product? Don't buy it. Or make your own and compete (even better).

But these progressives are authoritarians in disguise.

originally posted by: Korg Trinity
Being a gamer myself and being lucky enough to have grown up with the first gaming systems following through to where we are today I can honestly say that I NEVER listen to what the mainstream reviewers are stating about the games.

I always jump onto you tube and look at actual user reviews.

But this goes beyond just games... If ever I am in the market to buy anything I would always research the user reviews.

It's common sense stuff really, no need to campaign against the corruption...

Korg.

I couldn't have said that any better myself

I find this whole argument a ridiculous waste of brain power, seems like that should be common sense but I guess not.

a reply to: tothetenthpower

And here we go. I avoid this discussion like the plague. I've already outlined my opinion here and you aren't going to change it. Especially with a link to a website with the domain, avoiceformen.com.

But hey let's go over some information real quick about this. You say you distrust everything this girl says, but this guy, Eron Gjoni, wrote a fricking manafesto where he just bitches about her forever. And THIS guy is more trustworthy than her?

But hey here is a recent interview with the guy where he basically says that he'd do it all again but doesn't like the harassment. That wishy-washy answer only spells out one thing to me. The WHOLE interview is like that too.

And even as he won’t distance himself from GamerGate, Gjoni won’t quite take responsibility for the terrifying harassment that women have faced as a result of “thezoepost,” donwplaying its significance: “The scale is actually not that large. And gender doesn’t seem to be what sets off those harassment bouts, political ideology does.”

He can't even take responsibility for the rampant misogyny associated with this issue. The guy is a douche bag, and I REFUSE to stand behind what this issue represents.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Oh I dont' trust the complaints of a hurt lover either, don't get me wrong. The both deserve each other.

I'm not stating that there isn't any misogyny that was brought out, obviously there was.

It's been blow way out of proportion though and she along with the others within the realm of 'gamergate' are just feeding the fire more and more.

~Tenth

a reply to: NoRulesAllowed

Eve is about pretty much all about: How much can you make another player cry. People REALLY get off on taking out other players, many of whom have invested real world money and time in the game, only to see it falling apart or being taken from them, many because of betrayal or back stabbing.

It's a dog eat dog game, and the number 1 rule in Eve is: Trust No One.

As for the other things:

You have people that are socialites. They can not do without friends or people around them. This isn't a bad thing, just the way many people are. They want to be surrounded by friends and family all the time. Real life, and virtual life.

I'm not one of those people. There is a very good reason I live in the woods far out from the city. Because there are many times I don't want to be around others all the time.

Put it another way: been gaming since the early 1980s. Most games that I played for literally decades were single player games, because there was no internet. Multiplayer back then meant you had a party with friend over, or your family playing on a console game of some sort (Sega let's say), or hanging around the computer playing Myst.

It wasn't until the early 2000s that MMOs started to get going really good, and of course it took off and people went banannas over them.

Me? Nah. Again: I'm playing again because it's about ME playing a game. I'm pitting my wits against whatever the software developers have designed. Because that is what I've been doing with gaming on computers since 1982.

I've done the whole MMO thing. It's all about drama queens. It's all about friends or family getting mad at you (or vice versa) because someone didn't do what they were suppose to do. It's all about ganging up on someone. Or it's all about having someone else tell you want to do.

When I play alone, it's me, myself and I. If something goes wrong, I only have myself to blame. If something goes right, I can pat myself on the back because I figured it out all on my own.

If I'm in the mode to play with friends, and pretend to be other people trying to do a quest, I'll play some D&D with them. Only hardware required are dice, pencils and paper.

No lag. No buggy software. No communication problems.

Hell, even if the power went out, just light some candles and keep playing.

But again: this is ME. I know others love to play MMOs. My adult kids play all the time and they have a lot of fun, and I'm happy for them.

But those aren't the computer games I grew up with. So more than likely that's a big factor for me.

a reply to: tothetenthpower

Well when your whole social justice issue STARTED over a scorned lover (who happens to be an asshole) posting a bunch of stuff that rings true to misogynists, then your social justice issue has been tainted in hypocrisy from the start. It's doomed to fail and won't get the desired effect even if the issues that has grown to encompass are true. It's just too easy for the opposition to dismantle it as a case. I certainly want nothing to do with it and have recognized the corruption in gaming journalism since Electronic Gaming Monthly was a magazine in its heyday.

But then again, there is collusion and corruption in ALL journalism. It's public knowledge that corporations will pay either a third party company or sometimes the review site directly to write positive reviews about their products. This is nothing new. So I can understand the desire to change things, but gamergate is the wrong answer.

a reply to: tothetenthpower

If you use your GENDER and sex as a means to get something and then people tell other people, that's NOT misogyny.

Best qoute, ever. I wish I could give you more stars, you summed up how all of this started very well.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I just think there are massive quality issues in gaming which need addressing before we even arrive at the stage where discussing gender becomes relevant, game length and value for money being chief amongst them. Add to that the number of games which are being expanded upon by expansion packs for them, which essentially means that someone should have finished the game before selling it the first time, and the overall picture is not one that I like, and I miss being able to pick up a title and know that I was going to get a bare minimum of fun out of it, commensurate with its type and scope.

Now, all of that said, regarding the issue of women in computer games...male computer game protagonists are usually stereotypically male, washboard abs, chiseled jawline, and their presence in the game is necessary because they are the engine of destruction in the game. Games with female leads have similar focus on symmetry, form, and lethality.

I fail entirely to see the problem.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I don't disagree with this. But taking her side, or his, amounts to pretty much the same. Outside of the whole " I don't like that she gets death threats'. Which I don't of course, nobody deserves that kind of treatment.

But I still maintain that her online infamy, was sought out and encouraged by her when this all started.

This whole 'gamergate' thing distracts us from what is really happening in gaming right now, which is a dedicated attempt by Hollywood to infiltrate it and bring the same kind of brain numbing 'mind control' for lack of a better term, that we see in movies and TV.

~Tenth

Honestly I have no idea how and when the gaming community reached a level were gamergate could be a thing.

This bundle of drama is poisoning the gaming community

Why can't we all just play games as a community?

While gamers complain and cause drama about the whole "scandal", I'll be having fun playing games!

*sorry for not really adding anything constructive to the thread*

a reply to: TrueBrit

You think so? I get immense satisfaction out of the games I play. I enjoy many single player games, especially the platforming variety. I've enjoyed the Arkham series quite immensely and found them to be of appropriate length. JRPG's as I mentioned earlier have more content than most can even finish. As for multiplayer games, I enjoy fighting games the most, and THEY are a genre that is being exploited greatly by greedy corporations (what with games like Capcom x Tekken where they sell you a game with an incomplete roster and make you buy the rest of the characters). But even then I'm ok with it, because if you are just discerning with what you buy, you can get a LOT of pleasure out of the games you play. Not everything has to be top notch, there is nothing wrong with shovelware, if you don't like it, don't play it.