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NEWS: Man jumps on stage and opens fire at concert

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posted on Dec, 9 2004 @ 09:07 PM
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MKULTRA,

First, I think the date thing is only a coincidence.

Second, the murder of Lennon, if a result of mind control, would probably have been only an experiment to test the overall social reaction to the violent intentional killing of an icon. That reaction, while strong, wasn't anything I would think the government or any other group could use. Now if he was eliminated for a particular type, frequency, and/or strength of subversion against said government or group, I can understand that.

Dimebag was a great guitar player. He wasn't an icon. He wasn't subersive to the government, or any other power structure that I can imagine. This was probably not a psychotronic assassination operation.

My theory is this:

With the increasing prevalence and now extended use of new harmful drugs such as methamphetamine by people of the lower class, we will begin to see more frequent incidences of random violence such as this one. The physical and chemical effects of long term use of methamphetimine on the brain and other human physiology is proving to cause many diverse adverse psychological effects including maladaptive sociopathy, identity degeneration, and paranoid and schizoid psychoses. Not to mention the rapid decrease in higher brain functions.

This guy had probably been up for three days prior to the event, tweeking his balls off and being angry at Darrell for shutting Anselmo out of the music. I believe that was the issue. If someone is going to kill an artist for breaking up his favorite band, he's got to be high.

[edit on 9-12-2004 by DeltaChaos]




posted on Dec, 9 2004 @ 09:22 PM
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Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf


You simply dont get it. This crap about violence, music, and lyrics is an old lame paranoid old people party line.


OMG I can't believe I read that!
I'm one of those old people and I'm still at it! I front a rock band, have rocked with the likes of Zeppelin and Nazareth! Yes....there are bands that need cleaned up, to deny that is just ignorance! I'd rock your butt right under the table!



posted on Dec, 9 2004 @ 10:09 PM
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John Lennon was a very popular figure and leader in the counter-culture movement. I mean the guy was a freakin Beatle. While being a great guitar player the overwhelming majority of the population didn't know who Dimebag Darrell was until today, and probably still aren't totally sure what a "Pantera" is. And while I understand this is a conspiracy site trying to find a government connection to this seems pretty absurd to me. This seems more like a "crime of passion" than a conspiracy.



posted on Dec, 9 2004 @ 10:16 PM
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But this just plain sucks.


I hate things like this. Please excuse me while I go cry somewhere.



posted on Dec, 9 2004 @ 10:44 PM
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As someone here likes to point out, I am so old that I have forgotten everything I've ever learned, but I thought Pantera is a sports car marketed by Ford in the seventies. I never heard of Dimebag or Ol' Dirty Bastard for that matter. I have to say, though, that only the shooter knows what his logic was and he's dead. If he had a grudge against Abbott for breaking up his favorite band, his timing might have been very purposeful. However, Abbotts murder makes no more sense than Lennons.

To address, the subject of military training, Gale's having been a Marine is relevant only to the extent that he was in all probabilty an excellent shot, but then he made certain that he didn't need extraordinary marksmanship skills to carry out his act.

Certainly, he did not consider his own well-being or he could have found a wealth of other opportunities to carry out his act. Bands like this one usually travel by bus and they have to eat and whatnot, so a well-directed shot in a vulnerable moment on the road would have been the most logical action, if killing Abbott was his only imperative.

Word so far, indicates that Gales was discharged from the Corps early and knowing the reasons why will certainly shed light on this subject. All we need to find out now is that he was reading The Catcher in the Rye.

And the elf's lack of decorum is of no concern to me at all.

[edit on 04/12/9 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Dec, 9 2004 @ 11:32 PM
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I think some fans take music entirely too far and serious. Fans dont own the music nor do they own the players. Some people get too attached. This guy surely couldnt have thought pantera would stay together forever?

I will personally be playing cemetary gates tomorrow for a whole new reason.

RIP DDarrel

shout cast is doing a tribute to him @ 209.142.3.9:8100...

[edit on 9-12-2004 by porschedrifter]



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 08:51 AM
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As news of Dimebag's (born Darrell Lance Abbott in Dallas, Texas on August 20, 1966) bizarre and tragic demise rippled through the metal community, the news was met with shock and sadness.

"I'm speechless," friend and ROB ZOMBIE/OZZY OSBOURNE bassist Rob "Blasko" Nicholson told MTV. "This is totally unreal. Dimebag is a f***ing legend and this is total bulls**t."

"This is insane and this is beyond travesty," KILLSWITCH ENGAGE frontman, and former DAMAGEPLAN tour partner, Howard Jones said. "This is beyond anything I've ever heard. This shouldn't happen in or outside of the rock and metal community. He will be missed and mourned as a person, as a musician, and as a friend."

ANTHRAX guitarist Scott Ian, whose band has toured with PANTERA and has featured Dimebag guest appearances on their albums, stated in a posting on ANTHRAX's web site, "I am devastated as I'm sure we all are. All I can convey at this moment are my condolences to Rita and Vinnie and the whole family. My heart is with you."

MTLEY CRE bassist Nikki Sixx offered the following: "Dime, I will never forget all the times you made us laugh. I'm so happy we got to spend the day together in London recently We should all live our lives as full as you have. I will miss you, as will all of us... This is a sad day."

Rich Ward (FOZZY, STUCK MOJO): "Darrell was as nice as they come. During the times that I spent with him, I wondered why he played in such a heavy band. Not that he didn't have the ability to school all of us that dared to share a stage with him, but because he seemed like such a gentle and kind man. He had a great sense of humor and was someone that everyone in the room gravitated toward. He never carried himself like the big rock star that he really was, instead he came across humble and appreciative. I consider it a privilege to have known him, as he was one of the 'real' guys in the business and as Zakk [Wylde] would say, 'one of the boys'!"

Shaun Glass (SOIL): "Today I am saddened to say I lost my friend and hero it sickens me that someone would take away a person that brought so much joy to so many people. Love ya, Double D."

SEPULTURA: "Dimebag was an excellent musician and a good friend, a #ing great partner in memorable tours. We'll miss him very much. Our condolences to the Abbott family."

MACHINE HEAD: "MACHINE HEAD are devastated by the horrific news. Our deepest sympathy and condolences to the Abbott family, DAMAGEPLAN and former members of PANTERA. Our thoughts are with you all."

Jon Dette (ex-SLAYER, TESTAMENT): "My brother just called to tell me that Dimebag Darrell was shot and killed on stage tonight. Words cannot express the sadness I'm feeling right now and my condolences go out to Vinnie Paul and the Abbott family for their loss. This is a huge tragedy for the music world."

Orange County, California-based sextet BLEED THE SKY (recently signed to Nuclear Blast Records): "It's a sad day in heavy metal, Dimebag Darrell formerly of PANTERA, was shot and killed while performing with DAMAGEPLAN in Ohio. We would more than likely not be a band if it wasn't for him, and can't possibly imagine the pain that his brother and his family must be in. RIP, brother, heavy music will never be the same without you."


Source: Blabbermouth.Net

[edit on 12/10/04 by The Axeman]



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 09:02 AM
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Just to couter your idea that all metal is negative or that some bands "Need to take a look at themselves", Here are some lyrics from one of my favorite bands, and one of the heaviest out there. Their music is brutally awesome, very heavy, lots of screaming and whatnot. And Grady, the name of the band is KILLSWITCH ENGAGE. Sounds like it promotes violence or killing doesn't it? Check this out...

___________________________________________________________

Rose Of Sharyn

Numb and broken, here I stand alone
Wondering what were the last words I said to you
Hoping, praying that I'll find a way to turn back time
Can I turn back time?

What would I give to behold
The smile, the face of love?
You never left me
The rising sun will always speak your name

Numb and broken, here I stand alone
Wondering what were the last words I said to you
It won't be long, we'll meet again

What would I give to behold
The smile, the face of love?
You never left me
The rising sun will always speak your name

It won't be long, we'll meet again
Your memory is never passing
It won't be long, we'll meet again
My love for you is everlasting

I mourn for those who never knew you

It won't be long, we'll meet again
Your memory is never passing
It won't be long, we'll meet again
My love for you is everlasting
___________________________________________________________

Take This Oath

Abandon the safety of mindless following,
Abandon what holds us captive to suffering
Pierce the blinders, behold
The path that leads before you
Let us forsake - forsake all the things
That lead us to our demise

Open your eyes,
See the divine
Open your eyes,
See the...

Destruction of innocence
Watch it breathe it's last

Open your eyes (behold the path before you),
See the divine (forsake our demise)
Open your eyes (behold the path before you),
See the...

Abandon the safety of mindless following

To the grave we take this oath
To leave this world behind
Hear the words of the voice
That lives inside

Break free, this is your time
Break free.

To the grave
Take this oath
___________________________________________________________

Wasted Sacrifice

Trading life for life
It all must fall
It must end with us
It must end with me

Insinuations of what might be
Fight through depriviation
There will be no sleep

Heed my cry

Because of greed and hatred
To dust we return
They will see the strength in our numbers
Only then will the self-righteous learn

Insinuations of what might be

To the masses, we mean nothing
But it starts in the hearts of the few
Witness the birth of a people
Unite. Renew.

There is no forever, just today
Don't let your sacrifice waste away

Through change and purity, turn the shadows to light
Buried beneath the ashes is a passion for life

There is no forever, just today
Don't let your sacrifice waste away

Let there be no more of this bloodshed

Heed my cry.

There is no forever, just today
Don't let your sacrifice waste away
____________________________________________________________


Just three examples of many. All their songs are about positive things, even some songs (I believe Rose of Sharyn is one of them) are abot God, or at least that's how I interpret them.

I know there are bands that sing and play about downright evil things, but Pantera nor Damageplan was one of them.

It all comes back to holding the many accountable for the words or deeds of a few.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 09:29 AM
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It really is a tragedy to lose such a good guitarist.

Now, about music, and video games and such changing kinds into brain dead, murdering zombies, come on now. If music and video games do it, what about all the crap in the news papers and blaring over CNN and Fox 24/7 with U.S. soldiers blasting their way through some city in the desert.

We tell the kids these other medias are bad, bad influences, or whatever. Then we switch on the news, and tell our kids of their patriotic duty to their country, and how these wars are right, justified, and their business. So they see people, REAL people mind you, getting killed on live TV, thats ok, but music is bad.... hrm.

People need to quit scapegoating, and look at themselves for a minute.

The guy who shot those people would probably be the same kind of guy who shot Lennon, a freakin nutcase fan. Or, maybe there was some other element, bad drug deal, or, he was screwing his wife. We'll probably never know.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 09:37 AM
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Originally posted by LadyV


OMG I can't believe I read that!
I'm one of those old people and I'm still at it! I front a rock band, have rocked with the likes of Zeppelin and Nazareth! Yes....there are bands that need cleaned up, to deny that is just ignorance! I'd rock your butt right under the table!


Zeppelin..............I saw them in concert when i was four and my cousins took me..................................

Is this a challenge then? To see who is more metal than thou?

YOU'RE ON!



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 09:47 AM
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The Columbus dispatch reports that previous friends of the gunman said that about 6 years ago he came over saying he wanted to show them some lyrics he just wrote. His ex friend said that the songs were copied from one of Panteras records. When his friend said that the songs were Panteras. Nate said he was going to sue Pantera. His ex friends said they distanced themselves from nate at this time because he was also talking to himself
There is your motive mental illness.

The night of the show Nate came up to the tour bus and asked if Dimebag and his brother were on the bus. The sound man said they had just gone onstage.

Here is the list of people associated with the band that were killed Dimebag and Jeff Thompson a crewmember. Wounded Chris Paluska the tour manager and John Brooks a drum technician. The paper says that Nate fired at Vinnie and missed so it appears that Vinnie was not injured physically.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 09:48 AM
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Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
As someone here likes to point out, I am so old that I have forgotten everything I've ever learned, but I thought Pantera is a sports car marketed by Ford in the seventies. I never heard of Dimebag or Ol' Dirty Bastard for that matter. I have to say, though, that only the shooter knows what his logic was and he's dead. If he had a grudge against Abbott for breaking up his favorite band, his timing might have been very purposeful. However, Abbotts murder makes no more sense than Lennons.

To address, the subject of military training, Gale's having been a Marine is relevant only to the extent that he was in all probabilty an excellent shot, but then he made certain that he didn't need extraordinary marksmanship skills to carry out his act.

Certainly, he did not consider his own well-being or he could have found a wealth of other opportunities to carry out his act. Bands like this one usually travel by bus and they have to eat and whatnot, so a well-directed shot in a vulnerable moment on the road would have been the most logical action, if killing Abbott was his only imperative.

Word so far, indicates that Gales was discharged from the Corps early and knowing the reasons why will certainly shed light on this subject. All we need to find out now is that he was reading The Catcher in the Rye.

And the elf's lack of decorum is of no concern to me at all.

[edit on 04/12/9 by GradyPhilpott]


His military training probably has ALOT to do with his actions.

Just as you claim, that somehow, violence or dark, gruesome imagery makes people kill each other, so does military training, even more so.

Some of the most gruesome, horrific killers in our history were veterans.

Jeffery Dahmer was ex army.
Lee Harvey Oswald was a former Marine.
Timmothy Mc Veigh and Terry Nichols were both Desert storm veterans.
So was the DC Sniper.
There was a contract killer, who was arrested in the UK for shooting 3 cops in cold blood. He was a former U.S. Marine.

So we have examples of where military service can turn people into sociopathic killers. There are certain people that get let in, trained to kill, and once that button is turned on, it never turns off when they go into civilian life.

I see far more killings and violence from former military types than I see from metalheads.

So, why not blame the military as a dangerous influence? Hell, divorce and domestic violence are higher in the military than in the civilian world.

Im showing you the error of your logic. There exist in society, have always existed, certain people who simply are unstable and are influenced by anything and everything. Nothing can be done to prevent it. Even church music will inspire them to kill, and the gruesomeimagery of the book of revelation has made many a kook go out and do sick stuff.

So once again, stop blaming heavy metal music. That is so 1980's paranoid televangelist type crap.

You may as well blame country music for wifebeating, incest, drunk driving, and one eyed dogs.

And I hardly care about your concern or lack of for my "lack of decorum". Decorum is for people who want to beat around the bush. I prefer to get straight to the point.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 10:05 AM
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I worked security for a summer for outdoor concerts. Some of the shows were motly crue, ac/dc and there was Hank Williams Junior. There were 10 times more fights at the Hank show than any metal concert. Them hillbillies are called rednecks for a reason. Not to offend hillbillies but it is the truth.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 10:11 AM
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Originally posted by cryptorsa1001
I worked security for a summer for outdoor concerts. Some of the shows were motly crue, ac/dc and there was Hank Williams Junior. There were 10 times more fights at the Hank show than any metal concert. Them hillbillies are called rednecks for a reason. Not to offend hillbillies but it is the truth.


No, I agree. I moved to Texas from California when I was a kid. I've been here a majority of my life and I'm offended when people refer to me as a hillbillie. Hillbillies are straight off the farm with barely a fifth grade education. They wear the full cowboy get-up out to bars and always will be the first ones to start something. I mean, come on, LINE DANCING!!!! Nuff said.

Peace



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 10:31 AM
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Hillbillies are called hillbillies. They do not come from farms, they come from hills. Rednecks are rednecks and should not be confused with the hillbillies. Rednecks come from straight off the farm, that's why their necks are red. Cowboys are a different species, still. They come from ranches. Where they keep the cows. The first cowboys were black; freed slaves who went west to the frontier. Some cowboys come from Hell.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 10:35 AM
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Originally posted by DeltaChaos
Some cowboys come from Hell.



I like how you slipped that in there. Nice.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 10:37 AM
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Originally posted by DeltaChaos
Some cowboys come from Hell.

Sounds like the next Stephen King novel....

DOH! He already did that one!


[edit on 12/10/2004 by EnronOutrunHomerun]



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 10:55 AM
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Originally posted by DeltaChaos
Hillbillies are called hillbillies. They do not come from farms, they come from hills. Rednecks are rednecks and should not be confused with the hillbillies. Rednecks come from straight off the farm, that's why their necks are red. Cowboys are a different species, still. They come from ranches. Where they keep the cows. The first cowboys were black; freed slaves who went west to the frontier. Some cowboys come from Hell.


In my book, unless they wanna wear a sign on their head, THEY'RE ALL HILLBILLIES! Anyone with a Skoal can ring on the back pocket of their blue jeans is Hillbille! Anybody who wears a cowboy hat while driving is a hillbillie. Anyone who doesn't wipe the shat off the bottom of their boots before they walk into your house is a hillbillie. Hillbillies have red necks as well. Damn shat kickers!!!

Peace



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 11:01 AM
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Rednecks:
1. Used as a disparaging term for a member of the white rural laboring class, especially in the southern United States.
2. A white person regarded as having a provincial, conservative, often bigoted attitude.

Hillbilly:
A person from the backwoods or a remote mountain area.

I think the to terms have sorta morphed into one. Anyway them hillbillies and rednecks both show up for Hank shows and like to fight more so than metal heads.



posted on Dec, 10 2004 @ 11:09 AM
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Originally posted by cryptorsa1001
2. A white person regarded as having a provincial, conservative, often bigoted attitude.


Wow, this definition of Redneck kind of resembles Dr. Love...

Are you a closet Redneck, Dr. Love?

Anyway, I have had the privilege of knowing many rednecks and many hillbillies. Personally, I think hillbillies make the best snipers and the best Rangers. They have all also been good an honest men, by my standard.

And if I have a pair of BDU pants that have a hole worn in the cargo pocket from a Copenhagen can, am I a hillbillie? Well, I reckon so, then. Ok.

Rednecks are kind of a coin toss. There are good and bad rednecks. George Bush Jr, for example. He's a redneck.

Then there's Dimebag Darrell. He's a redneck, and he'd be the first one to tell you. He's good in my book. I've never met him, but he feckin' rocks, so that's all I need to know.




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