Nephews Who Are Army Officers Recently Asked "Are You Prepared To Kill US Citizens?"

a reply to: bludragin

I now know that this is typical of some members at ATS.

Actually it's typical of the internet. So you wanted responses.
You have to take the good with the bad and the quick with
the dead here as in any case. Lucidity and other members haven't
been that hard on you Blue. It might help you to take a look at
some real hammerings on my page. It goes with the territory
fellow member.

You'll get used of it.



SnF

originally posted by: bludragin

originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: bludragin

originally posted by: Patriotsrevenge
a reply to: bludragin

Every Recruit is asked that question before going to basic training and they have been asking that for over 20 years. You have to say yes just to be allowed into the armed forces of the USA. I know because I was asked this over 20 years ago. Saying you will just to get in hardly means anyone will.

There were many Army and NG troops told their Commanding officers when landing in New Orleans during Katrina that they would not disarm any Americans, they heard about the rumors that the orders were in and decided in mass to quash the idea in a hurry.

Our troops train to do a lot of crazy scenarios just because they are ordered too and it keeps them sharp, if the order comes down to shoot Americans in a big way many of those barking that order will either be arrested or shot. American troops know what they fight for and its not D.C., its their families, friends and the people of the country as a whole.

Yes, other posters shared this. But this was different. My sense was it was connected to a possible advancement of some kind. I wonder now if such a hypothetical advancement could be related to special forces, based on another recent respondent's reply. This is what led me to create the OP. I wondered what people knowledgeable about military matters might think. I do appreciate your reply. Any further comments / insights from you would be most welcomed.

The people familiar with military matters have seriously questioned the validity of your story but you ignore them or respond defensively. You only seem interested in patting people on the back when they agree with you. Most responses that seem to have first hand experience have stated that they were never asked by a superior in an official capacity but were only asked as a "what if" type question while having random discussions among their peers.

Your rabid defensiveness is a liar's trait.

Apparently you have not read all the replies. The fact that you do not respond to the topic, but attack me personally, tells me all I need to know. If you consider standing up for oneself and one's truth "rabid defensiveness," then there is little more for me to say.

Ironic... maybe you haven't read all the replies but I've responded to your topic a couple of times.

The fact is, you're not standing up for yourself and your truth... you're vehemently opposing any alternate opinion, playing victim when your truthfulness is questioned, and kissing the butt of anyone who supports you. That is the very definition of "rabid defensiveness."

You weren't there and you don't know what happened but you defend your story as though you were. That smacks of a fabricated story.

You claim to want the opinion of people who have first hand knowledge yet when they offer it, you disagree with them and stick to your guns. Again, the traits of a liar.

When someone lies on the internet about a topic this serious, I will question that person every time. Your constant use of the "personal attack" card and calling for mods to help you out is further proof that you have nothing solid to offer and can't support your lies.

originally posted by: Feltrick
a reply to: bludragin

So I'm trying to piece this together. You have two nephews who are high ranking officers and Helicopter pilots in the US Army. Currently they are serving in Afghanistan. During an interview by a higher ranking officer they were asked if they could order subordinates to shoot US citizens on US soil. They call their mom and tell her about the interview but give no more details and do not tell her their answers...

Were other soldiers asked this? What type of interview were they going thru? Was it a fitness evaluation/OER?

I have never heard a first hand account of anyone in the military being asked this question. I have heard it discussed around the Wardroom/Chief's Mess and around a campfire...drinking, of course...but have never heard something like this discussed in an interview. Just seems odd.

Why would Helo Pilots get asked about ordering subordinates to fire? I could see an infantry O-5 or below being asked that but a Helo Pilot? I'd really need to know what the context of the interview was. Was it a Medical Officer asking them in order to gauge their fitness before returning to the states?

Sorry for all the questions.

Quoted for posterity.

Helicopter pilots do not give orders to fire on anyone.

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: bludragin

I now know that this is typical of some members at ATS.

Actually it's typical of the internet. So you wanted responses.
You have to take the good with the bad and the quick with
the dead here as in any case. Lucidity and other members haven't
been that hard on you Blue. It might help you to take a look at
some real hammerings on my page. It goes with the territory
fellow member.

You'll get used of it.

SnF

Thank you for this. Actually, they were indeed hard on me. They took their distorted version of reality to a moderator and I was deducted 1000 points. Whatever that means. That didn't bother me so much. However, the moderator failing to contact me to hear my side of things did. In any event, I appreciate your reply, and look forward to seeing your threads.

a reply to: Patriotsrevenge

????????

I was never asked in DEPS or MEPS this

It was during C school

Please read the replies and my responses to other queries, Answer. My nephews flew at one time. The past few years I assumed they still flew but now know they were promoted. The interview that contained the question that the OP is centered around would appear to have been related to these promotions. I did just confirm with their mother that they command troops now. I also thought this odd...why ask this of helicopter pilots (would they shoot US citizens)? Why ask even commanders of helicopter pilots? I simply do not know. If anyone has ideas on this, please feel free to chime in.

a reply to: Answer

You obviously excel in reality distortion. I am open to opinions and challenges and disagreement. However, what you and some others are doing is different than that. You are flat out calling me a liar, and you are accusing me of making up this story. Such accusations do indeed constitute a personal attack. What a wonderful example of the "double bind". No matter what I say or do, I am wrong. You, sir, are a first class ass.

Been following this interesting read. Sorry, just wanted to book mark for continuing reading.

originally posted by: bludragin

Please read the replies and my responses to other queries, Answer. My nephews flew at one time. The past few years I assumed they still flew but now know they were promoted. The interview that contained the question that the OP is centered around would appear to have been related to these promotions. I did just confirm with their mother that they command troops now. I also thought this odd...why ask this of helicopter pilots (would they shoot US citizens)? Why ask even commanders of helicopter pilots? I simply do not know. If anyone has ideas on this, please feel free to chime in.

So when your "facts" don't add up, the story changes?

They aren't helicopter pilots anymore? Both brothers were promoted at the same time to a position that has them commanding troops?

You have very little knowledge of how the military operates and when your lie didn't make sense to those of us who have some clue about the real world, you altered the details and played dumb to avoid answering too many questions. When your story is questioned too harshly, you pull out the personal attack card. When someone is gullible enough to support you, you quote their post and french kiss their butthole for attempting to add validity to your fairy tale.

You're transparent.

a reply to: Answer
actually the story that you're claiming does not make sense actually does. The issue is the military has rotation cycles for various positions. Officers and up getting rotated every so often. Not sure about the army rotation but the navy rotation is supposed to be so much time at land so much time to see and do not call me on this but it was about 3 years per command.

and I think they play the gimmick game of lateral transfers counting as changes of command.

if his nephews wanted promotion they could not stay at the same place for a long time because it is a killer of your career




edited the fact I'm on my cell phone makes this a pain in the butt. The actual edit on this one is it supposed to be read command... It sounds annoying on typing it the issue was supposed to read officers and enlisted not officers and up to include warrant officers... I sorry its just this whole phone thing is getting annoying when trying to explain it pretty much for tation cycle officers one officer and enlisted get irritated it comes back for about removing officers I sat in one position for way too long


try third time. Officer enlisted and warrant officers get rotated.

I am truly disappointed by the ignorant and immature responses I received in regard to my post. To the few of you who responded intelligently, I thank you. As for the rest: Those of you who believe that effective dialogue includes dismissing a post as a lie, and the poster as a liar, do a disservice to ATS. Any moderator that supports such behavior also does the same disservice. I have lost all respect for this site, and how it is run. What a #ing joke.

originally posted by: ripcontrol
a reply to: Answer
actually the story that you're claiming does not make sense actually does. The issue is the military has rotation cycles for various positions. Officers and up getting rotated every so often. Not sure about the army rotation but the navy rotation is supposed to be so much time at land so much time to see and do not call me on this but it was about 3 years per command.

and I think they play the gimmick game of lateral transfers counting as changes of command.

if his nephews wanted promotion they could not stay at the same place for a long time because it is a killer of your career



edited the fact I'm on my cell phone makes this a pain in the butt. The actual edit on this one is it supposed to be read command... It sounds annoying on typing it the issue was supposed to read officers and enlisted not officers and up to include warrant officers... I sorry its just this whole phone thing is getting annoying when trying to explain it pretty much for tation cycle officers one officer and enlisted get irritated it comes back for about removing officers I sat in one position for way too long

try third time. Officer enlisted and warrant officers get rotated.

It works a little differently for Army helicopter pilots, I assure you.

originally posted by: bludragin
I am truly disappointed by the ignorant and immature responses I received in regard to my post. To the few of you who responded intelligently, I thank you. As for the rest: Those of you who believe that effective dialogue includes dismissing a post as a lie, and the poster as a liar, do a disservice to ATS. Any moderator that supports such behavior also does the same disservice. I have lost all respect for this site, and how it is run. What a #ing joke.

You've come to a conspiracy site and posted a story with no factual basis. Every single thread you've authored since joining this site 2 weeks ago has been about Ebola and you just happen to have this convenient story about Army officers being asked if they can fire on U.S. civilians?

Any story of this sort WILL be questioned because you aren't the first person to join this site and immediately post a far-fetched tale with no proof to back it up. Are we supposed to just take your word for it and not question anything you say? Sorry, the posters on ATS aren't that gullible.

Whine all you want and blame the moderators but you've made your own bed and you weren't able to lie in it. If you're going to get butthurt anytime someone questions the validity of your claims, you probably don't belong on ATS.

originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: bludragin
I am truly disappointed by the ignorant and immature responses I received in regard to my post. To the few of you who responded intelligently, I thank you. As for the rest: Those of you who believe that effective dialogue includes dismissing a post as a lie, and the poster as a liar, do a disservice to ATS. Any moderator that supports such behavior also does the same disservice. I have lost all respect for this site, and how it is run. What a #ing joke.

You've come to a conspiracy site and posted a story with no factual basis. Every single thread you've authored since joining this site 2 weeks ago has been about Ebola and you just happen to have this convenient story about Army officers being asked if they can fire on U.S. civilians?

Any story of this sort WILL be questioned because you aren't the first person to join this site and immediately post a far-fetched tale with no proof to back it up. Are we supposed to just take your word for it and not question anything you say? Sorry, the posters on ATS aren't that gullible.

Whine all you want and blame the moderators but you've made your own bed and you weren't able to lie in it. If you're going to get butthurt anytime someone questions the validity of your claims, you probably don't belong on ATS.

This. So much of this.

More proof of the U.S. militaries' adoration of unstable, "toxic" officers:

www.stripes.com...
(Oct. 2014) "TOXIC" BATTALION COMMANDER RETURNS TO JOB - DESPITE RECOMMENDATON OF FIRING
" The commander of a Fort Carson helicopter battalion objected when subordinates talked about a toxic command climate, according to documents obtained by The Gazette. "You want toxic? I'll show you toxic," Lt. Col. Tammy Baugh allegedly told soldiers in the 1st Battalion of the 25th Aviation Regiment, documents said.

"A 263-page Army investigation report released under the Freedom of Information Act portrays Baugh as a foul-mouthed boss who belittled soldiers, threw things during a meeting and sometimes stormed out of battalion gatherings.

"Baugh and the battalion's command sergeant major were temporarily relieved in July, but later placed back in command despite the scathing report."

originally posted by: bludragin
I am truly disappointed by the ignorant and immature responses I received in regard to my post. To the few of you who responded intelligently, I thank you. As for the rest: Those of you who believe that effective dialogue includes dismissing a post as a lie, and the poster as a liar, do a disservice to ATS. Any moderator that supports such behavior also does the same disservice. I have lost all respect for this site, and how it is run. What a #ing joke.

I suppose you will be leaving then?

originally posted by: bludragin
a reply to: Answer

You obviously excel in reality distortion. I am open to opinions and challenges and disagreement. However, what you and some others are doing is different than that. You are flat out calling me a liar, and you are accusing me of making up this story. Such accusations do indeed constitute a personal attack. What a wonderful example of the "double bind". No matter what I say or do, I am wrong. You, sir, are a first class ass.

I would say posts like these are probably what got you deducted points, not others conspiring with mods.

I think this whole thing can be solved rather easily. Has any military officer or NCO (past or present) who is currently a member of ATS ever been asked the question? Pretty simple. First hand accounts only, no second or third hand accounts. No stories from moms, dads, siblings, grandparents, aunts, uncles, etc.

I know there are many military and ex-military members on this site. If these stories are true, someone must have a first hand account.

Space Marines need not apply.

a reply to: Feltrick

I gave one

It is true but the reasons vary it seems

My GF who is on this site was asked the same question

a reply to: ripcontrol

Was it in a formal setting (i.e. Promotion/advancement board)? What did they specifically ask and were others at your unit asked the same question? Do you feel your answer hurt or helped your chances for promotion/CMD assignment/etc? Who asked the question?

Thanks for replying! BTW I have never been asked.

a reply to: Feltrick

I served in combat arms and combat support for three decades and have never been asked that question.

I don't know anybody who still serves as having been asked that question either.

But it does come up in conversations sometimes.