Why minimum wage jobs are bad

a reply to: DeadSeraph

It may eventually come to that.

People who settle for Minimum Wage jobs should move to places in the country that have the lowest cost of living. That should be priority #1 for those who lack the gumption to make themselves more marketable. With the internet, landing a job in a low cost-of-living state/town should be a snap. With few assets, moving to your chosen region (within the USA) is very easy to do.
-cwm

originally posted by: 2gd2btru
SomePeople, your questions opened up an opportunity to ask my adult child about jobs in their corporation. I was given a real life situation they are going through right now. They need to fill 100 jobs that pay around $32,000 annually, which is their company's lowest tier, and does not require a college education. After weeding through applicants they chose 800 to further test for aptitude and abilities. Only 53 past the test. All the employees are offered further education through tuition vouchers. Only 2% took them up on that benefit. There are still 47 jobs paying a living wage and offering free education that are still open.

Looking at the above I'm inclined to believe many of the living wage jobs are beyond the abilities of the minimum wage earners. If they do not make themselves marketable should Corporate America just throw money at them? How does one encourage them toward growth?

The wife can't even get new hires to even pass a background check for an accounting job. Let alone an aptitude test.

originally posted by: carewemust
People who settle for Minimum Wage jobs should move to places in the country that have the lowest cost of living. That should be priority #1 for those who lack the gumption to make themselves more marketable. With the internet, landing a job in a low cost-of-living state/town should be a snap. With few assets, moving to your chosen region (within the USA) is very easy to do.
-cwm

The gumption you're talking about costs money that the people you're talking about haven't got.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: tothetenthpower

I agree.

So paying mcdonalds workers 15$ an hour benefits everyone and not just the McDonald's employee.

Minimum wage jobs are there for those who have little to no skill set. If flipping a burger is good for $15.00 an hour why in the hell would I want to learn a skill? I can have no skill at all and make a decent living.

Yes, the cost of living has increased. Inflation has happened. The solution to that is not to raise minimum wage. Raising the minimum wage does not address the core issue at hand. You have to ask yourself, WHY? HOW? Why does it now cost over $5.00 for a gallon of milk when some years back it was only $2.00? HOW is it possible that you could have bought a home in 1980 for 25,000 but today that exact same house will now cost you 150,000? How does that happen?

It amazes me how many posters on this site when the discussion of money and Government comes up will always say you "can't just throw money at the problem and expect it to go away". Yet raising the minimum wage is doing exactly that- and those same people support it. So in answer to the increasing cost of living, you want to just throw money at it and think that solves the issue- It doesn't. The cost will just continue to increase, until one day that $15 per hour is not enough. Then what? Raise it again? Continue the cycle? How about stop beating around the bush and actually identify and address the real problem- The inflation. What is causing it.

a reply to: carewemust
Haven't read all posts so not sure if intended as joke however for sake of anyone reading this literally.
If all unskilled workers moved to poorer states/counties then this would drive down the wages further in these areas while in high income areas you would end up with phd's flipping burgers.

a reply to: MrWendal

That's exactly the point.

If the minimum wage worker makes more that makes your labor more valuable in the market. It's macro economics.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: MrWendal

That's exactly the point.

If the minimum wage worker makes more that makes your labor more valuable in the market. It's macro economics.

Really? You really think that?

I pay my painter 18 dollars an hour. If minimum wage goes to 15 dollars and hour, my painter will still make 18. Also, at 15 bucks an hour, I will be letting several positions go. Can't afford to pay those kind of wages.

Congrats on killing small businesses!

a reply to: beezzer

This argument seems emotionally valid. But let us look at reality:

The world needs service industry workers. Most of us take them for granted when we shop for things like groceries, clothes, cars, and all the goodies and gadgets we love to purchase. Without people to stock those shelves, price those items, be there to help consumers decide what to buy, to cashier out the items and then to ( sometimes ) load them into our cars for us - we are all lost.

Fast food, sit down restaurants, coffee shops, that corner store that is so convenient to stop at on your way home, the person behind the counter at the gas station, the guy you can never find at Home Depot... all necessary for our society... All taken totally for granted... all seen as name tags and uniforms and NOT as people.

As has been said in this thread and elsewhere "These are meant to be entry level jobs". In some cases yes, in others no. Quite a few of the jobs listed above require quite a bit of training and skill to be good at ( something we expect and never notice - we only want managers when the drones fail to live up to our expectations. ) But during the jobs crisis a few years back was not the battle cry something like "By God I would work - even if it were at McDonalds, I would work before I would collect one red cent of Unemployment!"?

A statement made from a position of luxury - just as the current mantra of "Well if you're too lazy/failed/worthless to find a better job - that's on you" is.

The fact is that we currently have a service based economy - as Corporations all decided that paying people in the third world a few cents an hour was better business than paying Americans good wages to work in manufacturing. The people who work in these jobs work hard ( mostly ) and deserve to make enough to live upon.

I've had several arguments lately with people using the term "burger flippers" as an ephit when the fact of the matter is that flipping burgers is damn hard and thankless work.

In essence - the argument you make reeks of a caste system to me. Those who sit in offices matter more than the soldiers in the field.

originally posted by: Hefficide


In essence - the argument you make reeks of a caste system to me. Those who sit in offices matter more than the soldiers in the field.

If it is a caste system, then it is one created by those who feel it most.

I don't think I have ever said that those who sit in offices matter most.

What I see is people in entry level positions, angry that they are in entry level positions and demand that they not get paid entry level wages for entry level positions.

What I see is people that want to skip the hard work, they want to skip the learning stage, they want to skip the apprentice stage, and go straight to the corner office with a secretary and a private bathroom.

How dare that person make more!

Yet they ignore the decades that it took for that person to get to a position where he/she could.

It's only a caste system when those who want to separate, do.

Everyone should have the oppourtunity to obtain a good job with a nice salary.

But who in the hell said that it'd happen over night?

Heff, I'm over 50 and for the first time in my life I finally have one of those jobs. But it took me over 3 decades of back-breaking work to get to this point.

I don't have alot of sympathy for those who want to skip the decades of hard work, education, life lessons, teaching moments and accumulated wisdom, just to sit in my chair because they feel entitled.

a reply to: KawRider9

Yeah but what your not factoring in is the value of the labor. You won't attract the same quality of labor with the lower prices.

I didn't say it was good for small business. Also if you haven't noticed small business has been dieing for a long time and one of the reasons for that is because people can't afford to spend the money that small businesses need for the better quality product in the first place.

a reply to: Hefficide

Heff, going to have to agree with your post strongly.

a reply to: beezzer

There is nothing in your feelings or statement that I disagree with. Thinking that all people who work 40 hours should make enough money to have a moderately comfortable life ( housing, food, transportation, with enough left for the necessities and maybe a bit of fun ) is not the same as saying that entry and executive should be equal.

By all means, advancement and achievement should be recognized. The people who shine and stand out by their work ethic should make more money than those who do not sacrifice as much of themselves.

The problem is that a three tier system has become a two tiered one in the past three decades. The vast middle drying up and leaving, in it's wake, a very polarized financial gulf between the successful and the surviving.

originally posted by: Hefficide


The problem is that a three tier system has become a two tiered one in the past three decades. The vast middle drying up and leaving, in it's wake, a very polarized financial gulf between the successful and the surviving.

Agreed.

And it sucks.

I think I've stated repeatedly how much minimum wage jobs stink.

I also think I explained "why".

Our economy is in the toilet.

That's why minimum wage jobs are such a big deal, because there aren't the good paying jobs that there used to be.

But simply raising minimum wages is only masking the symptoms.

It won't solve a damned thing.

Giving more morphine to a cancer patient doen't cure the cancer, but he will feel better for a while.

Same as all these "fixes" for the job market.

It's hard. Harder than it's been for a long time.

And it's only going to get worse.

So people have a choice.
1. Work harder.
2. Storm the Bastille.

a reply to: beezzer

Given that my birthdate is 07/14 I'm going with option "B". You with me?

a reply to: beezzer

Storm the Bastille is the inevitable.

originally posted by: onequestion
Hi I'm postulating here and making an assertion so please feel free to educate me.

Companies who pay low wages devalue the entire job market.

If low wage jobs had the bar raised such as mcdonalds it would force the entire labor market to adjust to their income level. The reason this would happen is because in order for companies to compete and find better emoyees they would need to raise the bar or risk not attracting better employees.

Anyway I think that I got the general premise out.

Let's not forget that healthcare costs would skyrocket due to the increase of wages...That would be untold billions of dollars for those on Medicare and Medicaid...

Food prices would increase dramatically and every other cost imaginable...That's more untold billions to cover those on Social Security, Disability and Welfare...

So of course taxes would have to rise dramatically...There's two sides to the story...

originally posted by: Hefficide
a reply to: beezzer

Given that my birthdate is 07/14 I'm going with option "B". You with me?

Sure, right after I finish my cake. . . .

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: beezzer

Storm the Bastille is the inevitable.

Sadly, you may be correct.

originally posted by: tothetenthpower
a reply to: onequestion

The reason is simple. A chart can show just about anybody why GREED is the primary reason wages are low.

The cost of living has increased, inflation has occurred a hundred times over, but wages have stagnated.

Why is this?

Greed!

~Tenth

That's true but how is this greed played out??? Shipping Americans jobs overseas to take advantage of cheaper costs...Flooding the American market with cheap, illegal labor which keeps the cost of labor way down...

Solutions are there but the American people seem to be too doggone stupid to demand the change necessary to fix it...