NEWS: No Christmas in America?

namehere, where do I say Pagan's never did such things?

I was pointing out, they could protest in other ways about their dislike for it all of which I am sure people would rather didn't happen. I just guess that went right over your head.

Emmileigh510, glad you could chip in the debate.

No where, do I say “You can’t” take part in this Festival, in fact you missed the whole purpose of the post. Christmas, is a Tradition based around the birth of Christ - for those of us who do not believe in Jesus Christ, it can be seen as offensive by members of that Faith - but also what it has taken to meaning. The actions of Santa Claus [based more around Ded Moroz than anyone else these days] are one that do uphold some Christian Tradition and thinking however, there is no reason as to why people should wait till Christmas.

Allow the Christians to celebrate the birth of Christ, if you think the spirit of giving is something that should be celebrated than why wait to do it on a Christian Holiday? Do not.

If you desire to lead a life of giving, do it all the time do not wait for the excuse to do it on a Christian Holiday because I do not see the same on the other religious holidays that are based around the same ideology.

[edit on 28/12/2005 by Odium]

OOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooookay, I didn't really understand much of that but it sounded nice.
You are saying don't wait till cristmass to do your giving but what you dont realise is that its not that people are obdsessed with giving its that they are being censored

Previously posted by Odium:
if you think the spirit of giving is something that should be celebrated than why wait to do it on a Christian Holiday?

Giving is inherent to the CHRISTmas tradition as in “God gave his only begotten Son” and is an ALL life endeavor to CHRISTians not just a momentary pang of faith as some would have you believe. Giving is a charitable gesture and there are many CHRISTian charitable organizations that focus on this magnanimous show of compassion. Charity: [Middle English charite, from Old French, Christian love, from Latin cāritās, affection, from cārus, dear.], “The theological virtue defined as love directed first toward God but also toward oneself and one's neighbors as objects of God's love.” (Answers.com). Charity is a very large part of CHRISTianity, of being a CHRISTian and CHRISTmas serves to emphasis this. Just as many faiths have a day of atonement this doesn’t mean that one can only atone their sins for that one solitary day. Like giving, it is a lifelong undertaking.

As has been said, it is the systematic, progressive censorship of the Christian faith and celebration that concerns us.

[edit on 29-12-2005 by Quest_es]

Jeez I'm just saying that its not that it has nothing to do with giving gifts. Try actually reading my posts. I really dont want to have a huge lecture on christianity especially because I'm jewish but last time I checked the thread was on the removal of merry christmas rather than not allowing people to celebrate christmas.
LISTEN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quest_es, well done you've mastered the "colour" function.

You seem to over-look the point I am making, although Christmas might be based around those traditions there is no reason why NON-Christians have to celebrate it. In fact, they can give, they can be involved in charity other times of the year. They use Christmas as an excuse to feel good about themselves.

...and as soon as I begin to see the majority of Christian's being charitable all year round, I will start to look at them differently. The problem is, I live in a Christian Nation and I see the opposite day in and day out.

You know, I'm not technically a "Christian" or any other "ian" or "ist". However, I grew up with Christmas, and it's a family tradition, more than any kind of religious holiday. We celebrate more as a time of giving, and of simply being a little nicer towards your fellow man...and of course with all of the trimmings we cherished in our youth.

PC BS went way over the line years ago.... I'd recommend viewing the South Park Christmas episode when the school had to remove such symbology from their play...to see the end result of such idiocy.....

Gazrok, that is directly my problem with it.

People wait till Christmas, to be "nice" to one another. Season's good-will, so on and so on instead of bothering to be "nice" all year round. As though a few weeks make up for all the months of not.

TristanBW9456, read to see at who my post is directed to (in the quotation (blue)). It wasn't directed at your comments but those of Odium, the poster before you. The "lecture" was needed to clarify that giving wasn't only a one-day affair as Odium asserts.

As I stated before we live in a nation in which 96% celebrate Christmas of which 90% of those are Christians. Obviously the other 6% are non-Christian. Not all Christians are devout Christians. Some are Christian solely by birth, religion handed down to them by their parents and partake of the Christian holidays out of tradition. Just as many Jews are not practicing Jews of the faith. It would be a mistake to generalize and place all Christians under the non-charitable or giving category only because those are the only ones you know. Like looking for love in all the wrong places, you then need to look elsewhere to find practicing Christians. I’m sure you’ll find Christians in bars and places of ill repute as well as find them serving others in soup kitchens and churches throughout the world.

Originally posted by Quest_es
It would be a mistake to generalize and place all Christians under the non-charitable or giving category only because those are the only ones you know.

Did I say all Christians or majority of Christians?

Let me check...

Originally posted by Odium
...and as soon as I begin to see the majority of Christian's being charitable all year round, I will start to look at them differently.

Originally posted by Odium
Gazrok, that is directly my problem with it.

People wait till Christmas, to be "nice" to one another. Season's good-will, so on and so on instead of bothering to be "nice" all year round. As though a few weeks make up for all the months of not.

Odium,

I do not understand why you have a problem here, unless you think the Christians would stop YOU starting to be nice 365 days a year.

That’s fine, we can change “all” to “majority”. You can nitpick about semantics all you want but it still doesn’t change the context of what I posted.

[edit on 29-12-2005 by Quest_es]

christmas is more to get the kids to shut the hell up about what they want.

Originally posted by Quest_es
That’s fine, we can change “all” to “majority”. You can nitpick about semantics all you want but it still doesn’t change the context of what I posted.

[edit on 29-12-2005 by Quest_es]

Don't try and place words into my mouth, you'll find out it can leave a bitter taste.

Originally posted by Riwka
Odium,

I do not understand why you have a problem here, unless you think the Christians would stop YOU starting to be nice 365 days a year.

No, Riwka that's not my point.

It is more the fact people make excuses, and act like being nice for a few weeks out of the 52 make up for it Riwka. This is the problem with the whole season, why can't there be "Good will" all year around? Why must we base a "Season" of it instead?

okay I see the problem and I won't post against you again but Is this really the right place for that. This has almost nothing to do with the news article.

Originally posted by Odium:
Don't try and place words into my mouth, you'll find out it can leave a bitter taste.

Sorry if it came off that way, that was not my intention. As I said, it doesn’t matter, the context still remains the same regardless of which words were used therefore no bitter taste.

[edit on 29-12-2005 by Quest_es]

Odium, you are getting wrapped around the axels about a little saying that really is a small thing.

The fact of the matter is, this is a Christian nation and, while Christmas is not a proper Christian holiday (God said to observe only the days He told us to observe) people view this holiday as a Christian one. The only reason this day is an holiday is because of the birth of Christ. It is absurd to attack it, denying the meaning behind it, and it is totally absurd for an ignorant political jurisdiction to try and make it go away. At least in this country, Odium. I know as little about yours as yoiu know about mine, so I will not even speculate about yours.

I once read a huge list of various religious holidays that fall on or around Christmas - a time originally celebrated round the world as related to the winter solstice (the shortest day of the year, and the earth's day of "rebirth").

The winter solstice tends to shift around with the poles - for example, in 1828 the winter solstice fell on December 21, but now is moving to December 22.

Supposedly, the tradition of giving presents originated with Sigillaria, the Roman holiday after Saturnalia.

Christian Christmas day today has the distinction of being the single winter solstice celebration that has been totally perverted to become a consumer event. Hardly worth defending IMHO.

Of course, if the population was not distracted with the weighty concerns of naming opportunities for consumption most appropriately, people might actually think about their Constitutional liberties, the Bill of Rights, and the state of US democracy.

Obviously some folks here are not reading through the thread otherwise the same arguments wouldn’t continue to pop up. The argument that Christmas Day has been perverted into a consumer-shopping event is a valid one. As I said in another post here, the merchants that have the most to make from this “perverted” holiday should be dropping to their knees and building an effigy to Christ and not be ashamed in marketing Christmas outright instead of trying to censor the faith by trying to take the Christ out of Christmas. It is remarkable that an entire economy practically revolves around this “make or break” religious celebration.

As for: Constitutional liberties, the Bill of Rights, and the state of US democracy, that’s a different thread.

whatever I still think that the tread is still about what you said at the bottom. I wouldn't have posted on here if I had. Its really not my problem that your holliday is 'perverted'