NEWS: No Christmas in America?

And screw this closedminded, generalising and judgemental post too!!!

It sucks having a few complainers able to dictate what you can or can't do doesn't it? Imagine my displeasure when a few religious wackos write to the FCC screaming about morality on the radio and they are taken seriously. It doesn't matter millions are not offended, only that 100 are. It doesn't matter that if they don't want to be offended they only have to change the station.

Just A FYI

I am a store owner in New Jersey and I dare anyone to tell me that I cant have the sign "Merry Christmas" on my storefront window. Besides what is entaled by religious belief, its still Christmas, a time for children to be happy, families to come together and Santa to put smiles on faces of all regardless to religious beliefs..

One important thing to say to all you politically correct buggers out thier.

"Ba-Humbug!!!

Originally posted by Dawnaj

Seriously, didn�t they change it from "Christmas" to something like "Festival of the Tree" - help me out here

A star cult....or sun-worship, became (in the third century A.D.) the dominant official creed, paving the road for the ultimate triumph of Judaeo-Christian monotheism. So strong was the belief in the Invincible Sun (Sol Invictus) that for example Constantine I (d. 337), himself at first a devotee of the sun cult, found it, indeed perfectly compatible with his pro-Christian sympathies to authorize his own portrayal as Helios. And in 354 the ascendant Christian church in the reign of his pious but unsavory son, Constantius II, found it prudent to change the celebration of the birth of Jesus from the traditional date (January 6) to December 25, in order to combat the pagan Sun god�s popularity�his �birthday� being December 25. This is actually just history that for some odd reason, many people do not know

"For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the ax. They deck it with silver and with gold..." -- Jeremiah 10:3,4

As to many of the other trappings of the holiday...
Many customs are Pre-Christian .......Among them is the ever-popular Yule Log. Traditionally, the Yule Log has been of oak, ash or beech, ritually cut (often at Dawn) and ceremonially carried into the house. It was lit by the head of the family with much ado. Toasts were often drunk with wine, cider or brandy, in those early morning hours, giving the participants a good head-start on the festivities. A lesser known tradition is that of the Yule Clog. The Clog was a knobby block of wood, burnt in the kitchen hearth. Household servants were entitled to ale with their meals for as long as the Clog was kept burning. In many parts of Scandinavia, the object burnt was a fat wax candle, instead of a log. The candle was lit at Dawn and must burn until Midnight, or be considered an ill omen The Yule Log was said to have many magickal properties Remnants of it, or its ashes, were kept in the house throughout the year for many purposes. Among these were protection from thunderstorms or lightning, protection from hail, preserving humans from chilblains and animals from various diseases. Mixed with fodder, the ashes would make the cows calve and brands were thrown into the soil to keep corn healthy. Women often kept fragments until Twelfth Night to ensure a thriving poultry flock in the coming year. It was customary to pour libations of wine or brandy upon the Log and to make offerings by scattering corn or bread crumbs over it. Even money was placed on the Log. Those charred "lucky coins" were then given to children or servants as gifts.

Wassailing is another happy survival of an old tradition. "Wassail" comes from the Anglo-Saxon "Waes Hael", which has been translated to "Be Well," "Be Whole" or "Be Healthy." The proper response to this toast is "Drink Hael", making it a shared blessing, a mutual well-wishing. Traditionally, carolers went from door to door, singing and bearing their "Wassail Cups", to be rewarded with the drink and fruited breads or other sweets.

Even with the Yule Log and the Wassail Bowl, no Yule celebration would be complete without a decorated tree. This custom is thought to originate in the Roman custom of decorating homes with laurel and evergreen trees at the Kalends of January (the Roman Winter Solstice celebration). It is interesting to note that, as with many other traditions adopted by the Church, the decorated evergreen (now called a "Christmas Tree") was originally condemned by Rome. An early Christian writer, Tertullian, spoke of the practice as follows:

"Let them" (the Pagans) "kindle lamps, they who have no light; let them fix upon their doorposts laurels which shall afterward be burnt, they for whom fire is so close at hand; meet for them are testimonies of darkness and auguries of punishment. But, thou" (the Christians) "art a light of the world and a tree that is ever green. If thou hast renounced temples, make not a temple of thine own house."

Even as late as the sixth century, Bishop Martin of Braga forbade the "adorning of houses with green trees." So obviously, the Christian adoption of the evergreen tree as a holiday symbol was another case of "If you can't beat'em, join'em!" In Winter, when all is brown and dead, the evergreens symbolize immortality. They are reminders of the survival of life in the plant world, a means of contact with the Spirit of Growth and Fertility, which has been threatened by the absence of Light. Especially good for this purpose are plants like Holly and Mistletoe, which actually bear fruit in Winter. (Mistletoe, the Golden Bough, the All-Healer, is traditional both at Winter and Summer Solstice.)

Music is a very important part of this joyous festival. Many of the "Christmas" carols are just as suited to Yule, with virtually no change. (It's a good guess that some of them were ours to start with!) "Joy to the World" and "Deck the Halls" are quite appropriate as is and you can have a lot of fun creating your own words for some of the others. In some cases, existing old lyrics prove that we are simply "reborrowing" what was "borrowed" from us!

Seattle, Washington (state, USA) in a nearby community the Charles Dickens play 'A Christmas Carol' was removed from a program so that no one would be offended

And who exactly would be offended ? The Ghosts ? :shk:
We can't see 'A Christmas Carol' just in case the dead are offended. A joke yes, but I wouldn't put it past the PC brigade to actually do something like that next.

If this happened on April 1, I'd think it was a joke. As it is, I just think its more PC crap that needs ignoring. Feck them - Toleration my arse.

Originally posted by Pisky


And who exactly would be offended ? The Ghosts ? :shk:
We can't see 'A Christmas Carol' just in case the dead are offended.

The different adaptations of that story are my favorite of the holiday season....again, things taken too far

[edit on 12/8/2004 by LadyV]

dissatisfaction among people beliefs.this is the type of thing brewed in an enviroment of fear.dont let politics stop you from enjoying whatever you like for the holidays.music should not be veiwed by one type of beliefs.why are these schools being so mean.have we lost the joy of life the way we all view things in different colours.thats what being human all about.enjoy life spread the news forget about world leaders right now there lost in there own world of hate and greed.

Merry CHRISTmas everybody! God bless you and your family.

Merry Chrismaquanakka, to everybody!


Hey, its all the same thing, deep down, all the "winter" holidays are really just piggy backing on the age old practice of celebrating the Winter Solace and to give good luck for harvests and oppurtunities of fellow man during the winter and the new year to come.

This sadly is the true story of the grinch who stole christmas.........

Originally posted by WolfofWar
Merry Chrismaquanakka, to everybody!

LOL..I saw that on Yahoo! news the other day....cute

Happy Halloween seems to be all right but not Merry Christmas? It is the ACLU that’s going crazy suing or threatening to sue in order to curtail the traditional public celebration of the birth of Christ, which is a federal national holiday in this country (U.S.). It is a secularist outright, in your face attack on Christianity and their right to celebrate the birth of Christ.

Some retailers have ridiculously even resorted to selling “Holiday” trees instead of the traditional “Christmas” trees in an attempt to be politically correct. Political correctness be damned I always say. You don’t do that in a country where 96% of its population celebrates Christmas and 90% are Christian…talk about biting the hand that feeds you.

Is it just me or does anyone else remember statements to the affect that Christmas was too commercialized? As I see it, they should be building an effigy to Christ and dropping to their knees in veneration for the profit they swim and make on the day of the celebration His birth. Fortunately we have the ADF ( Alliance Defense Fund) to put things back in perspective and counter the ACLU and the “left wing” secularist contingency.

This is just another case of trying to keep everything PC. But this is encroaching on our freedom of speach! My school has been told they can no longer call the christmas tree, a christmas tree. It truly is disgusting.

My feeling is that if we are to remove all religious connotations from Christmas, then that should include any sort of governmental recognition of the day, at all. The fact is, however, that Christmas is an official national holiday.

If we are to abandon the meaning of Christmas, then we should abandon the holiday completely and save it all for New Year's Day. Christians, who should be knowledgeable enough to know that Jesus wasn't born at any time near December 25th, should designate any given Sunday as their time to celebrate the birth of Christ and be done with it.

When you get down to it the word holiday comes from the term holy day, which before labor unions was about the only excuse ordinary people could use to get some free time, so we should abandon all holidays. There are even some secular holidays I consider offensive, but governments and the private sector honor them regardless of my personal feelings on the matter.

No day is any better than any other, except as the weather and personal events dictate. Give everyone about ten personal days each year and let them duke it out with their coworkers as to when to take them and let's stop spending taxpayer's money to fund anything remotely connected with historical events or the lives of men.

[edit on 2005/12/8 by GradyPhilpott]

As if there is not enough shouting about the term Merry Christmas versus Happy Holiday's, some bozo in FL has people upset for hanging Santa.



Man Hangs Santa bound from a tree

Now this guy is just sick in my mind.

Here are the survey results

A Miami Beach man has a life-sized Santa Claus doll that is bound and gagged hanging from a tree in his yard. Do you think this type of holiday display is inappropriate?
Choice Votes Percentage of 2534 Votes
Yes 1619 64%
No 834 33%
I'm not sure 81 3%


[edit on 12/8/2005 by shots]

Go figure:

“Kindergartners at a public school in Oregon were invited to bring cards to a Christmas party, but a teacher barred one student from distributing his holiday greeting because it mentioned Jesus Christ, prompting a lawsuit filed yesterday.”

“In a move that many might consider ironic at the least, a charity Christmas CD has been banned from distribution because it mentions the baby Jesus.
The decision by the Royal Hospital for Sick Children in Edinburgh, Scotland, was instituted because of fears it could offend people who belong to a faith other than Christianity.”

“A parent of an elementary school student is upset with a teacher who replaced "Christmas" with "winter" in a carol to be performed during an upcoming concert.
… Darla Dowell, the parent of a 7-year-old student, thinks the move is "absurd," especially since the children will sing a Hanukkah song referring to the "mighty miracle" of Israel's ancient days.”

“The Colorado ACLU is threatening to sue a school if the principal refuses to censor Christmas for its students.
… The Nov. 10 letter demands Principal Les Gray censor Christmas and insists the school "must take immediate steps to comply with the constitutional separation of church and state.”
It insists the school must ban all references to Christmas in its annual holiday program, including secular songs such as "Jingle Bells.
… "separation of church and state" is the work of activist judges, and has utterly no basis in the Constitution."

“Fearing they might offend someone, Red Cross stores in Britain have taken the Christian out of Christmas this year, banning any display of overtly religious decorations.
At a shop in Ipswich, England, for example, Christmas cards are on display but none of them depict the classic Christian images of the birth of Christ, Joseph and Mary, and Bethlehem, the Evening Star newspaper of Ipswich reported.
Instead, the store carries only cards with wintry, non-religious scenes.”

“At a time when Americans of many faiths – and even no faith – gear up to celebrate Christmas this year, a first-grade teacher in Sacramento Co., Calif., says she's been ordered by her principal not to utter the word "Christmas" at school.
The 24-year education veteran, who wishes to keep her name and the school anonymous at this time, claims she and two fellow instructors were told that use of the word "Christmas" in the classroom or in written materials was now prohibited.”

“In its suit, the Thomas More Law Center said the district's policy "unlawfully discriminates against Christians" because it "prohibits the display of [Christian] Nativity scenes" in public schools during Christmas, while it "expressly permits and encourages" the display of the Jewish Menorah and the Islamic Star and Crescent during certain religious holidays and observances.”

Can there really be a Christmas without Christ?




[edit on 9-12-2005 by Quest_es]

Hey guys, welcome to our world. In Australia we've had people trying to stop Christmas for quite some time now & it seems they are upping the ante, so to speak. Kids in kindergarden can no longer play out or be part of the nativity scene nor have santa come to give them pressies, nor a christmas tree or decoration is to be found.

In our local shopping centres, there may or may not be a christmas tee & definately no signage which wishes one & all a Merry Christmas.

Its a sad state of affairs when your local State Government actively encourages this behavoiur.

Christmas may not be a religious thing for many of us, but we still enjoy the fact that for one day a year we get to spend time with our whole families, not just one or two of them over the year. Its traditional for us to have seafood on the barbie, & salad, & trifle, with a christmas tree & presents for our loved ones.

What really craps me off is that we are supposed to practice racial & religious tolerance, but no other race or religion is supposed to. Its begining to feel more & more like we're being smothered into nothingness by taking away the very things we hold dear to us. One of them just happens to be Christmas Day.

Whats next? Are they gonna attack the Easter Bunny? The Queens Birthday long weekend? Where does it end?


I sincerely believe that there is racial discrimination & intolerance towards the white / anglo / christian / people & I for one am starting to grow weary of it.
I proudly display my Christmas tree & have my house done up like the Griswalds, in celebration of what Christmas means to me.

Those that don't like it, need to just chill until our day is over. Don't see us complaining about Ramadan, or Rosh Hashana ( spelling ), or Chinese New Year, do you?

Get lives people, & get some tolerance too. It runs both ways you know.

Originally posted by cryptorsa1001
This country was founded on religous beliefs. All religions are given equal status along with the rights of citizens to practice and show their faith wether it is through a manger scene or otherwise. I'm not jewish but I do not want to block jews from showing their faith. It is like I do not like Howard Stern so I just change the channel. I do not call for the banning of Stern. If everyone in the US wants to keep their freedoms they need to respect everyone elses freedoms. Even if that means you do not agree with them.

The country was NOT founded on religous beliefs, but very secular Grecco Roman ones.

But I think this banning of this and that is insane. So long as public tax dollars arent being used to fund any one religous representation, I honestly dont see the problem.

Ironic that the Puritans in Massachutes actually banned Christmas celebration for 22 years once they arrived in america.

I guess christmas really isn't really that much of a part of our puritan roots that much afterall.

Hold up. No-one is banning Christmas, or Christmas carols, or Christmas plays, or any of that.

What's happening is an increased awareness that it really is unconstitutional and immoral to use tax dollars and public facilities to promote a particular religion.

But there's no restriction being imposed on the private sector. If you want to put a manger scene up on your lawn, or even if Macy's wanted to do that, there's no issue with that. There's no conspiracy to elliminate Christmas as far as I can tell, there's simply an increased awreness that the US is not a theocracy.

I see much of this as a backlash from the political activism of the religious right in recent years. If they're going to try to cram religious nonsense down everyone's throats with legal maneuvers, others who oppose that will slap them back as hard as possible. It doesn't make sense just to fight tit-for-tat when it takes the same amount of effort to wipe them out of the public sector altogether. There's really no choice. The strongest argument is that it's unconstitutional to promote Christmas in the public sector. But if you take that path, you can't stop half way, because half way is still unconstitutional.

You have groups like the Christian Coalition to thank for this. They have created this all or nothing war. If they don't succeed in instituting a theocracy, they are going to lose everything in retaliation. They started to win for a while, but have awakened a sleeping giant - the vast majority of American's who really do value keeping religion and politics separate regardless of their personal religious beliefs. Even some of the more politically active Christians have seen with Iraq what happens when the religion intermingles with politics.

The end game will be the removal of all religious reference from the public sector, and you who have been involved in politicizing your religion can blame yourselves for this.