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Germany considers sending soldiers to eastern Ukraine: source

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posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 05:51 AM
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originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
a reply to: DJW001

The one whom started was America's gov. Everyone knows it.

-America wanted to attack Russia what better of doing through proxy means and blame game?


You forgot to mention Syria. Here, I'll do it for you: SYRIA!




posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 05:56 AM
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a reply to: DJW001

that's what I'm saying, Merkel would most certainly not start war with Russia.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 06:26 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Probably not a great idea, Ukrainians, Russians having German soldiers around not far from Stalingrad.. what could go wrong? Atleast the Germans have detailed maps and know the vantage points, so that's a positive.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 06:34 AM
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Having just moved to Germany certainly not what I wanted to see..

As for America being behind everything and anything that goes wrong in the world..

Come on folks the CIA can barely find its own butt, with two hands a helper a map and a GPS... are they responsible for a lot of messed up stuff in the world sure. But that's mainly due to incompetence now a days, not some grand plan.

As for pushing the EU... how can a country who's biggest economic asset is buying everybody's else's crap push anyone to do anything they weren't already thinking about. I think a lot of folks are still stuck on the US as we used to be, not the shadow that we are today.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 07:12 AM
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originally posted by: Agit8dChop
a reply to: Xcathdra

Probably not a great idea, Ukrainians, Russians having German soldiers around not far from Stalingrad.. what could go wrong? Atleast the Germans have detailed maps and know the vantage points, so that's a positive.


Just a tad under 1,000 klicks between Kiev and Volgograd, as Stalingrad is now called, that is as the crow fly's. (stupid saying!)



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 07:27 AM
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originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: GargIndia


I doubt that Putin is "emboldened" due to anything Obama did or did not do.


Do you really think Putin would have made his play for Crimea if Obama had followed through with his "red line" talk about Syria?


The news item talks about OSCE which is not a military force.


Correct, but they are citizens of NATO countries. If they get killed, their countries can justify retaliating, and if NATO members and Russia engage, the rest of the alliance swings into action.


Sure they can observe. I doubt it changes much on the ground.


The point to the exercise is to change things in Putin's head.



What the US did in or did not do in Syria made no difference to Putin because he knew without selling out Assads Chemical weapons then the US would have struck. What made Putin think that he could move in Ukraine is the fact that Russia has acted in Georgia (twice) and Moldova with little to no reaction from the US or Europe outside of lip service. I think he felt he had an unofficial deal with the US that Russia would complain about what the US did other places but, never do anything about it and in return Russia could do what it wanted in the former Soviet Republics with nothing more than lip service from the US. That is the way things has been and he had no reason to think they would change.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 08:10 AM
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a reply to: MrSpad

Yes you are right fundamentally.

Nuclear powers have respected each other's territory. This has been an unwritten rule.

If USA or Europe wants to change that now, then war is definitely around the corner.

It is unlikely that Russia can put up with nuclear missiles aimed at it deployed in Ukraine.

The stakes are simply too high.

I doubt it is a territory game or nationalism alone. We dealing here with survival of the State.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 09:08 AM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

The flip side to that coin revolves around German ties with Russia. Merkel has a closer relationship with Putin than any other EU head of state.

Your argument has merit however Germany might be the only EU nation that Russia would be ok with in that role.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 09:12 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

The key is not, and has never been, what Mr Putin is ok with.

The issue is what on the ground commanders, and super nationalist nutters involved in the conflict might do, if they see a dark past haunt them anew. Putin is a hard case to be sure, but all it takes is one total lunatic with troops under his command who trust him, and the whole situation would spiral out of control like a helicopter caught in a tornado.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 09:22 AM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

Considering Russia called for peace keepers a few months back supports my theory. Since Germany is the one calling the shots in terms of dealing with Putin it would only make sense for them to be involved in this manner.

Since Germany has the largest trade balance with Russia, failure to find peace could cause massive issues in Germany. It will continue to cause issues in Russia until there is a resolution (sanctions in place with more ready to be applied). It would allow Putin and Merkel to save face so to speak.

Merkel shows German leadership by getting a more permanent cease fire in place.
Putin gets out from underneath the sanctions while being able to claim they participated in and support the German plan.

Of course I could be way off however based on the info thus far its a possibility.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 02:08 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

I really hope you are right.

Your analysis has merit, and as I say, I hope that it turns out being as you say in time to come. However, much as I hope for it, if I was a man of means, I would not place a wager upon such a result being forthcoming.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 07:53 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Putin has disengaged from Ukraine after a surge and achieving ceasefire. It is clear Putin has no desire to increase the scope of fight in East Ukraine at this time.

The fight is being carried on by militia on both sides.

Germany and France can send observers for sure. This will actually be more trouble to Kiev than to Russia.

However if Germany and France take a partisan attitude by blindly siding with Kiev, the situation will become worse. You will see the German UAVs shot down and the forces fired at.



posted on Oct, 6 2014 @ 09:15 PM
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a reply to: GargIndia

Then there should be no objections from Russia, or pro Russians in general - both in Ukraine and on these forums, if Ukraine wants German troops to secure the Ukraine-Russian border and help remove the Russian forces remaining in Ukraine.

Also Russian troops and support have not ended. Do your own research before buying into Putin propaganda hook line and vodka.



posted on Oct, 7 2014 @ 03:50 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

I fail to understand what you are trying to say. You are advising Germany to join Ukraine civil war.

We shall see how this turns out.

I have no idea if any Russian troops are in Ukraine. The "Russian" carries a very broad meaning and any Russian speaking soldier can be called a "Russian soldier". The nationality is a very serious problem nowadays. Millions of Ukrainians have moved to Russia before and during Ukraine civil war, many out of these have obtained Russian citizenship.

If you mean units of army of Russia, I doubt that there are any in East Ukraine.

German troops securing Ukraine border with Russia seems a far-fetched idea to me, but if that is the intention, it is clearly equal to Germany fighting on Kiev side.



posted on Oct, 7 2014 @ 07:53 AM
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"German troops will not take a neutral position in war-torn eastern Ukraine. Along with the US, the German government was a driving force behind the coup in February to overthrow the government of President Viktor Yanukovych. Since then it has offered strong support to the regime in Kiev, which in turn relies on fascist forces."

Please read www.wsws.org...



posted on Oct, 7 2014 @ 10:23 AM
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a reply to: GargIndia

The World Socialist Website is your source? ..........................................k

I see once again you ommitted information in hopes that what you cited would be taken out of context. What was the last sentence in that paragraph you didnt completely quote?


It comes as no surprise, therefore, that Ukrainian Foreign Minister Pavlo Klimkin enthusiastically welcomed the German offer to deploy drones.


150 german soldiers to run the drones and 50 armed security, none of which has been agreed upon by the OSCE.

Is there any chance in hell you can stop with your creative editing of paragraphs / news articles?

Drones... So they can monitor the border / conflict ares to make sure the cease fire is holding while observing the buffer zone.
edit on 7-10-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-10-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 7 2014 @ 07:38 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

My sources are quite diverse. I have to provide links as per the rules of your website "abovetopsecret". People here expect links. My sources are generally not quotable.

Europe is socialist mostly. So quoting a socialist website is not a crime.

Germany can send troops to Ukraine. The number 200 or 2000 does not matter. As I see things in the context of your statements above, these troops will only worsen the situation. German troops will be fired at.

You think UAVs are like some miracles, as if Germany will do something unthinkable with its UAVs. The UAVs will be shot down. Germany better have a long term plan.



posted on Oct, 8 2014 @ 01:10 AM
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a reply to: GargIndia

Its not my website.
The T and C is something you should read up on since its what you are violating.

If your sources are not quotable then why do you use them? Are we to take your word for it with nothing to substantiate your claims?

The troops are for the OSCE plan Russia agreed to. Or are you suggesting Russia lied to the OSCE and the world when they supported OSCE monitors?

Russia could use its drones if it had any left. they lost their contract to Israel because of their invasion of Ukraine.

With that said you have anything on topic or are you just going to launch personal attacks because you cant refute the facts?



posted on Oct, 8 2014 @ 02:05 AM
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This is the move that will spark world war III. It's written in the stars!



posted on Oct, 8 2014 @ 02:20 AM
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a reply to: Agent_USA_Supporter




The one whom started was America's gov. Everyone knows it.


You really are stuck on that bit of non sense aren't you, because it was Yanukovych disregarding what he told the Ukraine people and decided to go with Russia instead.


Namely, this was finally a choice that was being made by Ukraine to join Europe. And that means joining the world and kind of being like everybody else in the democratic and capitalist world. When Yanukovych went back on his own promises, that just led people to go out onto the streets. And, you will recall, there were mass demonstrations and many were 500,000 and more people in downtown Kiev. And they were simply insisting at the beginning that Ukraine just sign the agreement.


www.pri.org...


On Nov. 21, the Ukrainian government decided to cancel plans to seek an association agreement with the European Union, which would have led to Ukraine’s economic integration into the continental bloc but stopped short of membership. The decision sparked mass protests reminiscent of the Orange Revolution nine years ago against alleged electoral fraud in the country’s 2004 presidential election. The E.U. was ready to sign a trade and cooperation agreement at a summit in Vilnius, Lithuania, for the Eastern Partnership, which governs the relationship between the E.U. and six former Soviet republics, including Ukraine. In response to the decision, 100,000 Ukrainians who support further European integration have set up tents in the center of Kiev, Ukraine’s capital, and plan to demonstrate until President Viktor Yanukovych signs the agreement.


america.aljazeera.com...

But it's easier to blame America for the problems that Russia helped create now isn't it?




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