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Si se puede, si votamos! Yes, we can, if we vote!'

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posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:07 PM
a reply to: Yeahkeepwatchingme

I genuinely think you're not racist or unreasonable just misguided with your attitudes. You make lots of good posts and good points. I just think you're misguided in your attitudes. Also when I said you in my recent reply to you it wasn't specific to you. I was using it in the same context as the following quote. "When life gives you lemons you make lemonade". The you is general.

I do think the OP is an unreasonable ignorant bigot based on how he's presented himself.

Just to make things clear Yeahkeepwatchingme since we seem to be unintentionally doing battle all over I respect you. You seem reasonable and intelligent (from reading your posts you're calmer and very likely smarter than me.) I actually identify heavily with you. You sound exactly like me from 5-10 years ago. I only recently stopped being pessimistic and reactive and stated being active and optimistic. I hope you find the light. The world's a corrupt and scary place but it doesn't have to be.

posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:07 PM
a reply to: xuenchen
You knew they'd have Nothing to come back with didn't you?
All they got it,,, Race and Muslim Bull Sh*t.
No one ever mentioned it but the Democratic Obama Agenda Supporters.
Why,,,, Because they Got Nothing!
I guess they could come back and use this,,,,,

Yes Obama gave you that box to check on your tax return,,,,, you can give him credit for,,,,then of-course,,,Obama doesn't Care!

posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:12 PM
a reply to: tavi45

You see everybody.....

This is the beauty of ATS. Two people who disagree on various points......

Can still admit their likenesses.

You know what, this is why I joined after 14 years. Not only to discuss issues I always thought were relevant but to discuss them with people who actually know what they're talking about (even if I disagree).

Well, anyway. I'm really not pessimistic I just see how the plan is being carried out and at this point, it's written in stone. Things will get better but not until TPTB are finally vanquished, and believe me it won't be for a very, very long time.

The beauty of ATS, the beauty of ATS.

posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:19 PM
a reply to: marg6043

I've presented my point several times in various ways with evidence to back it up. It's very hard to find sources since propaganda is on your side. This makes sense since Obama is a scapegoat like I said.

I'm the only one because the reasonable people know better than to engage in this. It's pointless because people like the OP and yourself are not interested in debate or facts much like the leaders you worship and respect. It's fantastic training though. The more I engage in combating ignorance the more I burn away my own ignorance and anger and frustration. I'm on ATS to better myself and to learn. I'm far from perfect. I'm not a genius. But I believe strongly in the morals I learned from my family, morals derived in equal part from the positive facets of Judeo Christian and of modern secular society.

Keep attacking me and my values. Hopefully I can learn to stop attacking others. It's very hard to stand up for yourself and your morals without losing them, especially when you've spent your whole life being bullied and denigrated by those of weak morals. I've only realized recently that I should never have lived a life with a motto of "don't make waves". I've always been strong and righteous but I never believed it because people said I wasn't. Add to my strength. I will need it in the times to come

posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:24 PM
Oh, May, I'm a Chinese Female Racist Naturalized American Citizen.
Married to a Full blooded American Indian of the Dakota Sioux Nation.
Born and Raised a Communist and worked for the Beijing Central Government.

Surprise, Surprise, I'm a He and I'm a Racist!
OH, I'm Ignorant too, I guess because I still think in Mandarin Chinese before I talk or Type in English.
Oh, Yes, I like Picture, What you and your young friends don't because you don't understand how to post them?
I'm very tried of being told I'm either ignorant or of my ignorance by you of all people.
I will not reply in any form to any post or thread you are allowed to participate in.

I have made no Racist remarks.
I don't like illegals and that is my right, because they are that, illegal. I came to America The Right way it it took my husband 22 months for us to get my Visa for me and our daughter.

So you can take your Racism and keep it for yourself! I forgot to Add,,,, I'm A Bigot!!!!!
edit on 3-10-2014 by guohua because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:30 PM
a reply to: Yeahkeepwatchingme

Nothing is written in stone until it's happened. Every person who thinks they've won brings them closer to victory. Hopefully I can convince you that they may have won many battles, but the war for our hearts souls and bodies is not over yet. You're intelligent. Look at history. It's riddled with the corpses of tyrants. Victory never congress without sacrifice. They are winning because people feel besieged and are so comfortable they are allowing the futility of the fight to sway them into passivity.

# man you think it's a tough fight here? Try living in China or Russia or Liberia or Myanmar. Americans have had a great run of living in a fantasy of happiness without work, of security without sacrifice.

Americans have been fighting the good fight since our inception to prevent tyranny and oppression We've been successful until modern times. The responsibility and guilt of global leadership scarred our spirit. It's our generations turn to fight for true american ideals not only for America this time but for all people. Our generation has the privilege, honor, and responsibility to take back our nation and begin to try for true peace for all. I look forward to convincing you of this truth over the coming weeks and months.
edit on 3-10-2014 by tavi45 because: changed a sentence for clarity

posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:46 PM
a reply to: tavi45

You write a good argument with no substance.

This topic is about Obama and the "Dream" for immigrants.

If he actually takes action, it will come with a price to the immigrants who desire "citizenship".

Already they are not showing up for hearings.

How many "Dreamers" will actually pay rather than just remain illegal?

related topic for reference;
Most new immigrant families fail to report

posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 11:51 PM
a reply to: guohua

Since when does not bring white or having non white family/friends absolve you of racism? I love the "I have a [insert race] friend" defense. Racist politicians use that all the time.

Even more amusing is that you're not even one of the truly oppressed races. China itself is one of the most racist nations on Earth with a long history of genocide, eugenics, and oppression of minorities.

In the 20th century, the social and cultural critic Lu Xun commented that, "throughout the ages, Chinese have had only two ways of looking at foreigners, up to them as superior beings or down on them as wild animals." [4]

The only country I know of with that level of success in eradicating certain racial groups of its citizens through genocide is Japan. This is ironic since the Chinese and Japanese have a deeply rooted bitter racist hatred of one another despite the huge number of cultural similarities.

If you came legally you should be aware how hard it is to do. You must have money or skills or family/political connections or a highly valid reason for asylum. There are also strict quotas.
Mind sharing how you got here legally? I'd be interested to know. Every legal and illegal immigrant I've known tells me how hard it is to legally immigrate or gain citizenship.

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 12:00 AM
a reply to: xuenchen

Corporate elites don't pay into the system either but no one wants to talk about that. Why would they want to actually become citizens? They probably know they just become slaves of the wealthy. At least this way they can actually have control of their lives to some degree and can send money home to help their impoverished relatives. If this is truly about illegal immigration then make some real points.

I have more respect for illegal immigrants who work hard, don't complain and stay off the books out of a need to help suffering relatives back home than I do for CEOs who don't work at all and make literally millions of times more money and also pay nothing into the system.

I love civilized debate. I've been begging for actual debate over Obama scapegoating propaganda. I've personally met quite a few illegal immigrants as well as millionaires and billionaires and I know which group actually represents the TRUE American dream.

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 02:04 AM
a reply to: tavi45
Mr. g. here, My wife tells me you want to know if she actually immigrated legally and how. You're a Nose Little guy aren't you?
First off, I retired from our Government after 40 years and my wife worked for the Chinese Government. That's how we met and I did all the paper work, it's very easy, you do not need an Attorney.
the I-130 was filled out with all the supporting documents to include my wife medical records and police records and any past marriages, a copy of her passport and extra pictures along with our marriage Lic. and wedding pictures and other documents to prove an honest and bidding relationship not to mention our daughter.

I also submitted the check for at that time the amount of $380. and another $120. for both of their Bio-metrics to be done which was $60. each I believe at the time.
Now all was turned into at that time what was call a Drop Box and you received an I-172 that explained if thet needed more documents or you needed to wait for an interview date.

All my wife needed to do was wait for am interview date, that told 22 months, which she pass the interview and got her Orange slip for her and our daughter which allowed their Passports to get their Visa's.

That's the Legal way, the right way. The I can Hold My Head Up in Public and Be Proud of Myself Way!

Now the quota's you spoke of are for children over the age of 18 or other wishing to migrate with out a spouse.
Unless you have a business and can pay the fee's to operate in America.

But actually, America's Visa policy is much Nicer and Kinder Than Others,,,,, Try Mexico or Russia or Sweden.

As far as calling my wife a racist, your Blind, you know nothing of the treatment of the Chinese in American History.
You need to do some reading before you go around making the Claim That Chinese People were not a truly oppressed race.
Just look at the 1700 and 1800 American of the treatment of the Chinese Laborer and see for yourself, as a matter of fact.
There was a law passed that No Chinese Women Could Be Brought Over To their Men or Husbands and White Women Could Not Marry Chinese Men.

So, Please, take your Very Young Head Out Of Your Mother House and See The World, It Might Surprise You.
Of-course it's not as dangerous as it was when we were young.
I just came back from another of my friends funerals in Russia, he was an Old Cold Warrior KGB agent that later we became Great Friends.

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 02:42 AM
a reply to: guohua

If your wife read the post carefully and without bias I never questioned her immigrating here legally at all. I questioned HOW, because it's quite difficult. You answered well and proved my point. She married into the country. This is one of the easiest ways in. Not everyone who wants to immigrate here is lucky enough to meet an American who falls in love with them and has a child to boot.

You say the process was easy for her. No kidding. She had an American government employee do all the work for her. So what you're saying is these Latin American illegal immigrants need to find themselves single Americans to do all the work for them.

Can you suggest how these people find one? Is there a dating site they can go on? Oh wait, many of them lack internet access. Hmmm, well I'm sure they'll figure our a way to meet some single Americans amid the crushing poverty and endemic violence.

Let me clarify some of the falsehoods in the rest of what you say. I was referring to the quotas for refugees not family based immigration. Obviously immigration is easy if you have a family member with american citizenship supporting your bid. I suspected the nature of your wife's immigration being family based as that's the only realistic way to get in for the vast majority of people.

The following information is pulled from a credible source which I will link at the end. Some is slightly generalized so I encourage you to fact check as it's difficult to summarize this complex system.

Family based immigration quota - 480,000
Employment (generally if you are a prominent doctor or other skilled job in high demand or a random dude with a day wallet who pledges to start a business in America) - 150,000
Refugees - 70,000

The Latin American legal immigrants would fall under the last category. If you dig deeper this refugee quote is subdivided by region.

Latin America/Caribbean - 5,000

There are also 3000 slots that can be used anywhere.

So this group you started the thread about would get at best (including all the free slots) 8000 people a year. I'll let you look up the number if you two have the gall to continue this but I'm pretty sure there but I think this year many 10000s came illegally into America.

(post by tavi45 removed for a manners violation)

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 03:15 AM
a reply to: guohua

I called your wife racist because of the ignorant racist nature of her posts not her race. I never asked her race (at least I don't think I did but feel free to comb my posts. I don't mind being called out and will admit to mistakes). She volunteered her race and your race as get out of jail free cards for racism. The race card only works on racist public figures not private citizens who are actually advancing goals of trying to remove the race card from politics on all sides. Nice try though. Just because you are a minority (anyways Asian race card is weak as hell these days) doesn't em give you a free pass to be racist.

I'm fully aware of racial history in America. The only people in America who have no history of being oppressed are WASPs. Everybody else can claim it to since degree or another. I'm white as hell by modern American standards but my immigrant ancestors were racially oppressed.

I brought up the racism of the Chinese and the specific quote because your wife is showing that classic brand of Chinese racism. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know your wife personally. I'm sure she's nice in person. I'm going off how she presented herself here.

I brought up the Japan bit to add to the whole idea that every nation is guilty of racism/bigotry in their own way. OK mostly it was because I'm familiar with racial politics and I know most Chinese people would flip the hell out over a comparison to the Japanese. Did it work? Is that why you came on in place of your wife? Let me know if it did. I've always been fascinated by the east/south east Asian brand of racism. It's much more personal and rooted in history than the Walmart (weve got every kind, at low low prices) style of racism in America.

I've been outside my mother's house thank you. I've met people of all walks of life. I haven't met someone of every race or nation, but who has? It doesn't matter because as I said earlier the "I have black friends so i can't be racist to blacks" is a weak weak play. I suggest you stop listing the petiole you've met in your life as a racial checklist that gives you credibility.

Also how young do you think I am out of curiosity? And why bring up how dangerous you perceive the world to be then and now? That whole last paragraph seemed like a truly juvenile attempt at baseless character assassination.

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 03:20 AM
a reply to: tavi45
You're just having a Great time Ranting aren't you.
I won't know about dating sites but I would imagine there are.
How they get here is their business as long as it's legal.
we have laws that have been doing very well for many years.
Actually, our bathrooms where cleaned and our lawns where mowed and our burgers where flipped and our homes where built long before we needed illegals to do it.
Let see, my first job use pumping gas for $1.25 cents an hour that was minimum wage in 1965 before I joined the Army.
Then I think I made $83.00 with Combat pay.

I got out after two tours and Cleans bathrooms at restaurants and bused tables until I got a Job I wanted.
I don't remember any illegals of any nationality cleaning bathrooms or busing tables or moping floors.

Seen it, Lived It Know it!
Those kids are Not Refugees, There are No Wars In Any of Those Countries!
None of those people can be Classified as a Refugee.
That's Reid, Pelosi and Obama Bull Sh*t to the uniformed.

I won't call you names like you do other's here and I won't get angry because you disagree like you do with people who know better than you.
No I won't stoop to your level, I won't call you ignorant or a Bigot for not having the same belief as we do, we're not like you. We're better, we don't have to name call if we disagree with you.

Oh and like a Dear Friend of mine here as already told you, Your the one who brought up Race, no one else mentioned Race,,it must plat heavily on your mind, do you see anyone about that?
Also as another friend of mine as put forth to you, you haven't shown anything Obama has Done that's Positive for America, No we're Not Talking About illegals, But American's, Remember them?

edit on 4-10-2014 by guohua because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 03:40 AM

originally posted by: guohua
I won't call you names like you do other's here and I won't get angry because you disagree like you do with people who know better than you.
No I won't stoop to your level, I won't call you ignorant or a Bigot for not having the same belief as we do, we're not like you. We're better, we don't have to name call if we disagree with you.

No, the OP just hinted at how dumb everyone who "believed in the Hope and Change Bull Sh*t" was, despite the many times you posted on ATS and tried to warn everyone, only to be ignored.

I see a difference in tactic but the level seems about the same.

On topic: A politician was gerrymandering. Who'da thunk it.

edit on 4-10-2014 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 03:50 AM
a reply to: guohua

Lol you called me a little mouse and your husband called me a young (in an ageist fashion) sheltered mommas boy. But you won't resort to name calling right?

There's no wars in Latin America? Ever hear of the drug wars or CIA regime changes or corporate banana republic murders? There hadn't been a declared war in ages anyways so by your definition there are no refugees anymore. I think the very refugees you are spewing racial hatred about would disagree. As would the MILLIONS of Syrian/Iraqi refugees just to name the biggest group at the moment.

You're correct. Americans did do those jobs back in your younger days. You might wanna speak to the CEOs and politicians about those changes. It's not a recent shift at all so blaming (yet again only Democrat) current politicians for that is beyond historically inaccuracy and misinformation.

As for me being the one ranting that's just silly. I'm working on the name calling (I haven't mastered the art of hiding behind clean words yet) but isn't that the pot calling the kettle black since you have called me names and attacked my character while I've been attacking factually incorrect assertions you are making about this group of refugees, illegal immigration in general and the legal process required to immigrate here.

I already admitted I don't know either of you and I'm sure you're great people in real life but you're not debating or seeking to enlighten. You are just throwing out baseless Republican propaganda, Obama and Hispanic hate rhetoric and personal anecdotes from like thirty or forty years ago.

This isn't the cold war times any more. You can't pretend there is no war besides the officially declared ones like you did in your youth. The facts are out there. America has been playing violent and oppressive games in Latin America for a long time and just like with every other place we've done this we take no responsibility at all. But yeah let's turn away refugees from our wars who risked life and limb to get their children to the Land of Opportunity and who will contribute to our economy. That will surely fix everything right? Isn't this group of refugees desperate for their shot at the American dream? Sorry America is all our of opportunity. We'd rather keep letting the parasite bankers and corporate overlords continue their corrupt reign than let child refugees get a fair shot. If this is the new America then maybe we should rebrand. America, Land of the Debt Slaves, Home of the Fearful Isolationists.

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 03:55 AM
a reply to: guohua

Also thanks for entirely ignoring all my links to credible sources, all my rational responses to your weak defenses and poorly written baseless assertions. It's always nice when I spend a lot of time and thought writing quality posts backed by facts just to be ignored entirely for more character assassination and blind propaganda spewing.

Can you please address a specific point of mine for clarification or for me to back up with evidence? Let's try to get this somewhere rational. That is your goal right?
edit on 4-10-2014 by tavi45 because: added a sentence

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 04:18 AM

originally posted by: Fylgje
He's aiding and abetting illegal invaders. He's a criminal. Our forefathers weep in the afterlife. All the Americans who fought and died for this country are being shamed. Obama and friends are hell-bent on destroying traditional America. But I guarantee one thing; None of these illegals will live amongst the elite politicians or rich folk. NO! They will live amongst us.

Profound and a half... "They will live amongst us"

In the end they will regulate this as well. Create the problem then set about to fix it at our expense, for our own good. All this while they benefit from the false promises of vote pandering politicians. Criminal is to kind. Obama is the greatest example of this.

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 04:37 AM
I'm sorry, but I can't figure out exactly what is wrong with Obama's speech here, or how it was proven that the two interns he refers to are, in fact, illegals?

It appears to me that this CHCI organization is simply promoting the welfare of Latinos in general - NOT promoting illegal immigration. It appears to be a leadership program for Latinos:

In 1978, a small group of Hispanic members of Congress established the Congressional Hispanic Caucus Institute (CHCI) to develop the next generation of Latino leaders with a clear vision of a strong America made possible with the many contributions of educated and civic-minded Latino leaders engaged in and contributing to all aspects of U.S. society. This vision was founded on three cornerstones for success: education attainment and college access, leadership development programs in D.C., and access to a powerful network of Latino leaders in the United States.

Today CHCI is the premier Hispanic nonprofit and nonpartisan 501(c)(3) leadership development organization in the country firmly rooted in the same three mission cornerstones laid by our founders

I cannot find any reference to them being illegal immigration activists. An incorrect accusation possibly?

Regarding the two interns, Obama also says they are members of the CHCI fellowship program. I searched CHCI's website, and under the eligibility requirements to become a Fellow:

Eligibility Criteria

Applicants must have completed a master's degree or post-graduate degree prior to the program start date
High academic achievement (3.0 GPA or higher)
Evidence of leadership skills and potential for leadership growth
Demonstrates commitment to public service-oriented activities
Superior analytical skills, outstanding oral and written communication skills
Applicants must be U.S. citizens, lawful permanent residents, asylees, or individuals who are lawfully authorized to work full-time without restriction for any U.S. employer and who, at the time of application, possess lawful evidence of employment authorization.

So, where's the proof that these two young men are illegals? I think the article linked in the OP is spewing some misinformation here. An agenda perhaps?

posted on Oct, 4 2014 @ 04:47 AM
a reply to: guohua

For my favorite posters. Funny how he wasn't at the border doing the meet and greet. And calling my president a POS? Well, ok just this once. lol

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