Anyone else notice anything weird about the locations of the USA ebola patients?

originally posted by: nrd101
Airborn? Well sure is, if someone coughs - we know from studies that it transferred from pigs to monkies with
absolutely no contact, they were just in the same room. You bet its airborne.

I am not attacking you (and haven't attacked anyone), but I'm asking you to clarify two things:

1. You say there are studies that support Ebola can be transferred from pigs to monkies having had no physical contact. Source? I linked above to a source that suggest Ebola is not transferred as an airborne virus.

2. Why is this research generalizable to human beings?

a reply to: nrd101

I am not claiming it is airborne just yet, but it sure seems like it is either easier to get than initially spoken about or it has been dropped/implanted into people in certain areas...I don't know what to think just yet, just a bunch of speculation...But it certainly seems like I have a decent shot at being somewhat close here in my opinion.

a reply to: DupontDeux
Even if the disease doesn't spread, the fear will. People will stay home and the country will crash and burn. All thieves walk away unscathed. They collapse the already collapsed financial system when no one is looking.

originally posted by: Fylgje
a reply to: DupontDeux
Even if the disease doesn't spread, the fear will. People will stay home and the country will crash and burn. All thieves walk away unscathed. They collapse the already collapsed financial system when no one is looking.

This is my point about driving mass hysteria, and the news media is already doing it (see CNN article above). This is why I'm admonishing others to pay attention to the facts instead of wild speculation. I was attempting to get someone to examine his logic. I'm not trying to attack anyone. The situation has the potential to become a nightmare because of fear, with or without Ebola cases found in the USA.

a reply to: Petros312

If your statements in regards to "attacking new posters" is based on my post to you, then that wasn't an attack but merely self defense due to being accused via an erroneous assumption. You started it with me to be quite honest when I actually was one of the few that starred some of your less acerbic posts. Kind of regretting that now.

It's quite clear to me that you either failed to read the post that I was responding to or even bothered to consider what it was that I was saying in my response to the OP. His belief was that someone with Ebola could touch money and that money would then spread Ebola to other money and so on as if viruses propagated like bacteria. Hence my very specific response which also included the very dim, dim, dim possibility that the virus would actually survive outside of the host on that dollar bill to highlight the differences between bacteria and viruses as the OP was clearly confusing how each reproduce.

Be my guest. Continue to go after me on a failed belief of yours that I absolutely do not support. I'm quite literal, quite direct. If you'd like to waste your time by posting assumptions in response to my direct statements disagreeing with your initial erroneous assumption, fine. We can lob barbs at each other all day but the fact will still remain that many on this thread, despite what you or I are trying to say, still think that Ebola is going to destroy us all.

originally posted by: Excallibacca
Atlanta, DC, and Dallas all make sense in that they are International airports and major travel hubs. Nebraska is odd, though, I admit.

Is it Omaha? Omaha is one of the two big rail hubs east/west. The other KC. And like KC, Omaha is also one of the two big east/west overland routes for trucks.

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

Yep. And then there's this from the good ole CDC and WaPo: CDC: Ebola could infect 1.4 million in Liberia and Sierra Leone by end of January

a reply to: britchik

Heard it today - Saudi Arabia will not be allowing pilgrims from the infected countries to the Hajj this year.

a reply to: WhiteAlice

Actually, that's not quite true. They knew the neighbor had it. She was sick and convulsing, and he helped carry her to a taxi and rode with her to an Ebola clinic where she was turned away because they had too many patients already.

It is heavily implied that he was encouraged to come to the US by relatives because they all knew he was exposed and to stay in Liberia if he got sick was a death sentence.

Does anybody else think this is weird? The test supposedly came back negative so why are the police being given "medical containment jumpsuits"?

Marietta Police Get Jumpsuits

originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
Does anybody else think this is weird? The test supposedly came back negative so why are the police being given "medical containment jumpsuits"?

Marietta Police Get Jumpsuits

UMMMM......YEAH!! Seriously?? They know something is going on here to do this. Why at this stage of only knowing of a few cases would they outfit police cruisers with Ebola suits?? Oh boy.....We are in for a wild ride here! This whole thing stinks to high heaven and back!!

originally posted by: Petros312

originally posted by: nrd101
Airborn? Well sure is, if someone coughs - we know from studies that it transferred from pigs to monkies with
absolutely no contact, they were just in the same room. You bet its airborne.

I am not attacking you (and haven't attacked anyone), but I'm asking you to clarify two things:

1. You say there are studies that support Ebola can be transferred from pigs to monkies having had no physical contact. Source? I linked above to a source that suggest Ebola is not transferred as an airborne virus.

2. Why is this research generalizable to human beings?

One example Ive read pertaining to pigs to monkeys transference.
Linky

a reply to: Petros312

You could I think, but it would depend on how much body fluid is on the dollar bill and how fresh it is. The longer it sits around, the less likely you will be infected by the body fluid on the bill.

The problem with Ebola is this: it's both harder to spread than people think and at the same time highly contagious.

I've been trying to figure out how to explain it. Maybe this will help.

Picture a crowded scene of a New York sidewalk. Now picture one of those people being actively ill with the early stages of Ebola. They're sweating profusely. Almost everyone on that street, in that crowd, should have nothing to worry about as they won't come near the sick person. However, the ones who touch that person, maybe brush arms, hit the crosswalk button after he did, things like that have a problem because it takes very little virus to gain a foothold and establish an infection in a new person.

So, out of all those people who walked around the sick person, very few will be contaminated, but of those who are, there will be a very high rate of successful infection.

Now change the disease, this time the person in the crowd has the common cold or the flu. As he walks down the street coughing and sneezing, he exposes maybe half to two-thirds of the crowd to his infection because it travels very far in tiny little aerosolized drops, something Ebola doesn't do because it's pretty big for a virus. Ebola needs big, wet drops to travel that way. The thing is, cold and flu viruses have a harder time establishing a successful foothold than Ebola does.

So, out of all the people who walked around the sick person, a lot of them will be contaminated, and of those who are, a much lower percentage will actually get sick.

However, when you compare the overall numbers, in the end, the cold or flu is more successful at spreading then Ebola is, but Ebola makes better use of its opportunities than the cold and flu do.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: WhiteAlice

Actually, that's not quite true. They knew the neighbor had it. She was sick and convulsing, and he helped carry her to a taxi and rode with her to an Ebola clinic where she was turned away because they had too many patients already.

It is heavily implied that he was encouraged to come to the US by relatives because they all knew he was exposed and to stay in Liberia if he got sick was a death sentence.

If you looked at the LA Times and the NOLA links, which I'll provide again, they did not know that she was infected with Ebola.

A chain of confusion and denial links the Dallas apartment complex to which he moved to a dark green house about 30 yards from Duncan's door in Liberia, where the desperate family of a dying pregnant woman treated her illness as malaria, not the highly infectious virus that has killed more than 3,300 people.

But the Blessing Home Clinic, which examined Marthalene on Sept. 15, had diagnosed malaria, according to staffers. When she started convulsing, they told the family to take her to a hospital.

After she died, Mekey and the other family members prepared her body. She was hunched, so they straightened her, tenderly laid her out and covered her. Several people carried her and placed her in a casket.

www.latimes.com...

Thomas Eric Duncan rushed to help his 19-year-old neighbor when she began convulsing days after first complaining of stomach pain. Everyone assumed her health problems were related to her being 7 months pregnant. Still, no ambulance came as Ebola decimates Liberia's capital.

www.nola.com...

There's a lot of sites alleging that he knew because he answered "no" on the questions asking about Ebola exposure on the questionnaires. Duncan assisted Williams on the 15th, flew out on the 19th...5 days before the neighborhood fell sick with Ebola (around the 24th).

originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
Does anybody else think this is weird? The test supposedly came back negative so why are the police being given "medical containment jumpsuits"?

Marietta Police Get Jumpsuits

This has been in progress (ETA: here in the Atlanta area) since August, right after they brought the first two ebola patients to Emory. They're just repeating it due to the scare overnight.

Not seeing the threat/conspiracy/attack
here.. too much doom

originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
Does anybody else think this is weird? The test supposedly came back negative so why are the police being given "medical containment jumpsuits"?

Marietta Police Get Jumpsuits

Probably for the same reason why that little town on the East coast got a tank to protect its pumpkin festival. Worst case scenarios (like pumpkins being taken hostage by terrorists) are frequently used as reasons to requisition stuff.

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

What I find worst is that most of the ones coming out infected with ebola or possibly infected are people that has been allowed to come into this nation from infected countries, I consider all of them possible carriers of biological weapons

originally posted by: Petros312

originally posted by: WhiteAlice
a reply to: Petros312

snipped....
There really is a trend here to attack new members when they disagree with someone. Okay. Now I know.

You suggested that Ebola COULD be transmitted in a hypothetical case by an infected person touching a dollar bill in a Walmart and the virus survives. That is what you wrote, not what I mis-read:

originally posted by: WhiteAlice

As far as infectious banknotes, not many people actually carry cash these days. However, the possibility of transmitting contagions via a bank note does still absolutely exist...

Now let's hypothesize that Duncan went to Walmart and bought some antacid with cash. He was a foreigner so hey, could've happened. Those dollars that Duncan handed over would not have an endless stream of virus on it. Viruses don't work that way. What viruses do is very specific in that they only become activated when in contact with a genetically amenable host. That's why they say that viruses are this weird sort of half-life. They seem dead until they come into contact with a cell that actually triggers them to do all that they do to reproduce. Stick a few viruses on any surface for a week even and check back on them a week later and you're going to find the same number of viruses (if they survived). Viruses are not like bacteria which are self-reproducing. Viruses need to basically hijack a host cell to trick it into reproducing itself.

You are clearly supporting that a dollar bill could be the vector for someone to contract Ebola.


I leave you with this. The following are NOT based on sheer speculation:

Journal of Infectious Diseases (2007)
Assessment of the Risk of Ebola Virus Transmission from Bodily Fluids and Fomites
online source: jid.oxfordjournals.org...

"Large outbreaks of EHF [ Ebola hemorrhagic fever ] are usually driven by personto-person transmission, with caregivers both at home and in hospitals being at particular risk"

"direct contact with bodily fluids is considered to be the major risk factor"

"our results support the conventional assumptions and field observations that most EBOV transmission comes from direct contact with blood or bodily fluids of an infected patient during the acute phase of illness. The risk of casual contacts with the skin, such as shaking hands, is likely to be low."



Journal of Infectious Diseases (1995)
Transmission of Ebola Hemorrhagic Fever: A Study of Risk Factors in Family Members, Kikwit, Democratic Republic of the Congo, 1995
online source: jid.oxfordjournals.org...

"EHF is transmitted principally by direct physical contact with an ill person or their body fluids during the later stages of illness."


Hence, the people who continue to believe that Ebola can be transmitted like an airborne virus or from simply touching an environmental surface need to educate themselves.

I've heard/read all sorts of "truth" about how this virus is transmitted---so much truth from so many different sources that at this point I have no idea which "truth" to pick and run with....
However, if you actually read with comprehension the link and quote from the link ---

"Large outbreaks of EHF [ Ebola hemorrhagic fever ] are usually driven by personto-person transmission, with caregivers both at home and in hospitals being at particular risk"

See the use of the word USUALLY...

"our results support the conventional assumptions and field observations that most EBOV transmission comes from direct contact with blood or bodily fluids of an infected patient during the acute phase of illness. The risk of casual contacts with the skin, such as shaking hands, is likely to be low."

Read the actual words with their meanings here---support the conventional assumptions and field observations, that's the technical jargonish way of saying we've not done any scientific study on this but it is our BELIEF.
See there where the authors say MOST EBOV transmissions....and conclude that casual contact is LIKELY to be low.
Perhaps you are not aware that other strains of this virus have been proven to be airborne and that several researchers have been warning that it could and does mutate quite frequently.....and that no one source can know all there is to know about this disease....just sayin'...

As for your whining about being attacked as a nube....It seems to me that someone just finished up their freshman year in higher education and now believes they have all the answers.....via Psy 101 and Debate 101. Must have been a C student however to try to argue "facts" with what the OP stated as his own personal opinion.

I have no idea whether this is a massive conspiracy or not. I thought it was the height of stupid to bring active cases into the US for treatment since all the precautions taken by the highly-trained medical teams in Africa didn't prevent them catching the disease. Perhaps a hospital ship would have made more sense but nobody contacted me to ask my opinion. I do know that members of different governmental agencies have, from time to time, done terrible things to citizens of the US and other nations, causing massive pain and suffering so I can't just assume that all the rogue elements have been weeded out and that all government employees are pure as the driven snow in their motivations.

In my opinion if this is a biological attack or attempt on the US it is wholly by circumstance.

The outbreak of ebola in Africa is real. If some muslim nutjob paid a few people to contract it and fly to the US is plausible.

But according to the map of outbreaks, Denver airport is almost surrounded. You know about the underground govt base there.

Looks a little too close to home for our govt to be behind this.

Tom Clancy wrote a book with ebola turned into weapon released on the US. While no doctor, he does some research on his facts. It did kill a lot of people but was contained quickly.

what would be gained by our govt doing this?