It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
originally posted by: onequestion
Not understanding your intrinsic roll in the community is stupid period.
originally posted by: CardiffGiant
originally posted by: haviahabia
You cannot grow or maintain society by cutting the wages of the majority of people who spend the money in the first place, that is contrary to the math.
So it is our concern that the best approach to help the health of our nation is to advocate better wages which ultimately translates to positive outcomes as these outcomes are classified by economists and sociologists.
i think the first step to the 'health of the nation' is for people to start pulling their own weight and do the best they can for themselves and their family.
better wages would be fantastic. better wages across the board....
i never advocated against better wages. not once
edit*
am i supposed to advocate for or feel bad for the able bodies people out there that do nothing to better their financial situation? i dont...i can tell you that right now.
the 30 something husband and father of 2 that slings hash at burger king for 8 bucks an hour and bitching about it...what is he doing to better his situation? what jobs has he applied for?
probably none because those jobs that i am talking about do not let you hang out on facebook all day while you toss fries and talk to your co workers.
i dont feel bad for them even a little bit.
i know not every person is in that situation but those are the people that i am talking about.
originally posted by: CardiffGiant
originally posted by: onequestion
Not understanding your intrinsic roll in the community is stupid period.
well i live in the real world, not a hippie commune with free love and where everyone shares all they have with the other members of the commune.
here in my real world community, i understand my role very well.
my role is to be a productive member of society....by that i mean working and taking care of my family. paying my bills while not expecting others to take the burden or bitching when i cant get it done.
my role is to take care my family, not yours.
maybe, just maybe if more people took on that same kind of role instead of complaining about making crap money and not being able to do anything about it we would actually be closer to that fantasy utopia you think you live in.
maybe, just maybe if every able bodies adult joined the work force(or got educated) instead of working for minimum wage and collecting assistance we would all be better off.
i know there are people that really do need help. medical disabilities..this or that. lots of reasons and i am not saying we should deny them.
fact is a LOT of people can work they just dont. a lot of people Can do better but they wont. i suppose there are loads of reasons.
i think laziness is very high on the list.
its not like i did anything special. my brother didnt do anything special. nor did my father before me or my grandfather before him. nor did the millions and millions of other adults....
we(they) just did what we had to do.
i think if more people actually took responsibility for themselves(and the people that depend on them) then we(society/the community) would be better off.
edit*
^^^the above is the real truth...imo
originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
a reply to: onequestion
I am in industrial sales and the manufacturing base is far from dead.
originally posted by: LDragonFire
Didn't the George W Bush administration make McDonald jobs manufacturing?
originally posted by: Aazadan
I just took a look at CNC programming salaries after this thread, I'm kind of surprised really given how simple it is to do. Then again that job still doesn't even put you into the top 50% though it is borderline.
.
originally posted by: haviahabia
, as it is now, a days labor cannot support one person
There are in fact, many locales where the Burger King type job is the only job available
I wish you did not advocate for no one and nothing but the bleakest that reality has to offer where we are all monkey pressing the button because everyone else is doing it.
originally posted by: CardiffGiant
now take a look at cmm.
i wouldnt say cnc programming is easy but its not the hardest thing. writing a program is one thing but writing an efficient program is something else.
when youre in a job shop its all about production and time.
there is more to it than just writing a program and then letting your operator run it.
you need/should be able to do things on the fly....
now since it is fairly easy and you can get into that relatively easy with little or no experience, why dont people jump all over it? my city and the surrounding area has cnc operator/programming jobs open all the time...
wouldnt you rather get into a job where you can make some decent cash?
youre not going to walk onto a programming job with no experience. youre going to have to start in the shop operating a machine. a press or something...even that is going to pay more than fast food. before you know it, if you show up and are not a moron you will be operating the cnc....they need people to do it.
from there if you want to program you are going to have to take some of it on yourself....
as far as people only wanting to be management....i saw a lot of that at the foundry. i always wanted to climb the ladder a bit but never had any thoughts of being 'upper management'.
i probably could have been the lab supervisor if i stayed in there and that would have been cool.
i ran the inspection department off and on for various internal reasons and that was ok...there were only 11 of us though
i never wanted all that responsibility to be honest.......being the boss of 20/50/100 people didnt really interest me.
just like someone said somewhere along the way people started wanting to be management i think somewhere along the way people stopped doing for themselves and started wanting others to do it for them.
just my opinions. simply put i have seen plenty of evidence and situations that show it is very possible to get into a decent job making decent money with little or no experience or education. you just have to get after it.
originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
originally posted by: Aazadan
Then again that job still doesn't even put you into the top 50% though it is borderline.
Why would someone who is just starting a new trade expect to be in the top 50% of wage earners?
Quite often, the best thing that post-secondary educations provides is an ability to think. Some political parties don't encourage an intelligent, educated, electorate. Go figure.
originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71
When those graduates have lousy educations obtained at universities that can send kids into the world with degrees in unemployment, I have a problem with paying for that. This has nothing to do with their pay after completing school, only what they have to offer the world after getting a free education.