Disgusted over idiotic gun advocacy comments

This is a spin-off thread with a genuine concern. The hate was strong on FaceBook and YouTube after the most recent Next Level BS episode: Next Level BS #7: Open Carry Nuts, Revenge Porn, Stupid Millennials, and more…; where we covered: "Today we take a look at the apparently increasing trend of lunatics advocating their right to open carry firearms, by open carrying in insanely stupid places. The recent open cary insanity comes from Leonard Embody of Tennessee, as well as more crazy in Phoenix."

The jerking-knees of intense gun advocates spawned all manner of vitriol and hate, presuming that the opinions in the video were advocating gun control, taking away guns, limiting gun ownership, in support of the government, and other general pro-government shillery. When instead, the position was quite the opposite, and one of concern: concern that over-the top irresponsible gun-related protests could result in erosion of the rights to own arms.

I don't get it. Really, I don't.

I'm a strong advocate for free speech and free expression… intensely strong. I've been part of groups traveling to Washington, DC to voice concerns directly to lawmakers about issues related to free speech. But I'm not jumping up on a pedestal in the middle of a crowded public space, spewing nasty vulgarities and flashing naked pictures just to make the point that abridging the freedom of speech shall not happen. I'm not shouting "fire" in a theater. That type of activity, just to advocate that I have freedom of expression, would be irresponsible.

So why aren't the majority of gun advocates agreeing that the two people outlined in the video are grossly irresponsible?

1) 'Radnor Lake Rambo' causes stir at Vanderbilt, Hillsboro High

2) Phoenix doctor arrested with gun at Sky Harbor on administrative leave

Amongst the small handful of supportive comments, for which we have no idea about their position related to gun-control, we have an overwhelming flood of (often borderline illiterate) intensely negative comments, some advocating violence against those who made the video.

What gives?

And if this is the norm, could these types of gun advocates be their worst enemy? Could the nature and style of their reflexively hostile advocacy -- over an important point in the gun conversation, responsibility -- be a catalyst for gun-control advocates to increase their efforts, and find cause for actual change to happen?

originally posted by: SkepticOverlord

What gives?

Cleverly used propaganda?

Let's be honest, we have a long history in Western media to people who are saying the craziest thing, instead of the moderate thing.

Probably also has to do with the lack of critical thinking people do with hot button issues that matter a lot to them.

You're right, it's important that any movement, reign in it's fringe and not support ideas that have a greater potential of setting you back then moving you forward.

~Tenth

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

I am not sure what posts you are talking about, but on the NLBS thread, I thought most gun advocates thought the over the top open carry folks were not doing it right. I saw lots of comments about there not being a need to scare the public to make a point.

And since some of us live in America and have freedom of speech, all opinions can be voiced. Even the wrong ones.

Guns don't kill people, people kill people. (and rabid hamsters)

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

John Crawford III. Ohio. Minding his own business inside a Walmart carrying a BB gun from the store shelf. Gunned down on sight by police.

I believe there is appalling racial inequity in how "open carry" and "stand your ground" laws are enforced.

That is a threat to the rights of all. NRA --silent.

a reply to: InverseLookingGlass

I don't think that is a good example, other than the racial aspect. Lots of mistakes were made with that account. From the guy swinging around the BB gun not thinking about how it may look to store patrons who didn't see him pick it up in sporting goods, to the guy who gave false information to the police, to the police who shot as they gave the command to drop the weapon. If it was a white guy holding the gun, it may have been different. Then again, maybe not. But then if that was the case, nobody would know about it would they?

a reply to: network dude

If a white guy was holding the gun you would never have heard about it.

a reply to: Hoosierdaddy71

Exactly. It's just not news worthy. No shock value at all.

a reply to: network dude

Idk what post you were reading but I saw alot of "it doesn't matter how they do it, it is their right to do it post"

Spot on SO

The wording of your headline surely didn't help you at all. First of all calling them open carry nuts, probably wasn't the best choice of wording if you were looking for legitimate debate on the subject matter. Secondly, as soon as you start to present this in the manner in which you did, to some it immediately looks like you are pushing less for open debate and more towards propaganda for regulation, even if that was not your intention.

I think you have to keep in mind that any talk of gun control is going to be very heated at this point whether it's real or not, especially being hot on the heels of the legislation that was recently rammed through in some states following Sandy Hook.

Could the guys in the videos have used a little more tact and a lot more class? Yes! Are they reason for more regulations, or a change in the law? No!

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: SkepticOverlord

I am not sure what posts you are talking about,

As mentioned, the comments were in the FaceBook and YouTube threads associated with the video.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: network dude

Idk what post you were reading but I saw alot of "it doesn't matter how they do it, it is their right to do it post"

Spot on SO

This is from page 1 only:

I love me some 2nd amendment... HOWEVER, just because you can do something... It doesn't mean that you always should. The whole school thing was a bit much. We should be able to carry of course, but we know what that looks like in today's world when it comes to schools. And truthfully... There are lots of folks I don't want carrying near my daughter's school. Including a lot of LEO's.

Common sense folks. Learn it, use it, or lose it.

Nice episode and I loved the man card/Starbucks reference.


You're going to piss off a lot of hipsters and trendies.




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How many of them do you think are actually working for the gun control groups?

Maybe they do it because they can, because it is their right, but maybe, just maybe there is a plan?

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It's more of think twice before you hang around crowded areas with guns just to try and prove a point.
You don't need your rifle to go get a cup of coffe or a burrito.

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Exactly !

Unfortunately, extremism in any arena is not well known for its 'common sense'.

I have this horrifying feeling that I'm going to have to secretly bury my firearms in my backyard in an unmarked grave so as to not lose them entirely in the very near future.

These nutjobs are going to kill the very thing they're fighting against.

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I guess I'm one of them there lunatic type people that advocate their right to open carry firearms, Although, I'd highly recommend exercising that right within reason and common sense as to where it should be exercised.

I guess for some they can't seem to figure out that although they have the right to carry that doesn't mean they should walk around anywhere they choose while scaring the crap out of people. Don't carry your AR-15 into a bank, or picking up the kids at preschool, etc etc etc

so on and so forth.

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I guess some only see what they want to see. One of those quotes was even yours.

originally posted by: SpaDe_
First of all calling them open carry nuts, probably wasn't the best choice of wording

I think it was the ideal wording. The two individuals discussed are, in fact, nuts. Reigning in the terminology by not calling a spade a spade would be disingenuous.

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

Sorry, I didn't look at those places as they tend to accumulate some really, REALLY stupid folks. At least here, you get intelligent debate, or at least amazingly well worded put downs. Facebook is for pictures of kittens, and youtube is for chemtrail videos showing "PROOF". IMHO

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

Yes, but by wording it the way you did just lumped all open carry people into that group of "nuts", when some are anything but. It is no different than me singling out one or two people who are crazy liberals and then posting a title about crazy liberals and not expecting some very heated and angry posts to follow. You kicked a hornets nest with your wording.

a reply to: SpaDe_

To be fair, SO was doing a counter point to this thread.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

My intention was to show at least one liberal in particular what my feelings were on his opinion. And I 'inadvertently' upset some others on the left. Fair is fair after all.

a reply to: SpaDe_

es, but by wording it the way you did you just lumped all open carry people into that group of "nuts", when some are anything but.

That's only if you failed to understand the context in which they were discussing the two individuals.

The segment to me, was exposing exactly what you said, and wondering why these people were at the fore front of the open carry activism movement when they don't actually represent the majority of you.

~Tenth

originally posted by: SpaDe_
a reply to: SkepticOverlord

Yes, but by wording it the way you did you just lumped all open carry people into that group of "nuts",

That's quite a revealing jerk-of-the-knee, don't you think?

A video series, covering two people doing stupid things (and saying so in the description) to advocate open carry, can somehow be interpreted to apply to all people in favor of open-carry laws?

when some are anything but.

Of the people carrying high-powered weapons (not sidearms) into restaurants, retail stores, and public spaces -- please point out which are not nuts doing more harm than good?

a reply to: tothetenthpower

And that's the crux of it, all some people needed was the headline infuriate them.

originally posted by: SpaDe_
And that's the crux of it, all some people needed was the headline infuriate them.

That's a problem of a different sort. The trend of people, "nowadays," to formulate a reflexive response based on a short headline, ignoring both content and context.

We're not going to defer to stupid by dumbing down for the twitter-heads.

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

Well that's the kicker with your headline, you didn't say "These specific open carry nuts" you said it in general. I am just pointing out how it could have been taken, I actually took the time to read through it when it was posted, hence my lack of response in the original thread. It was already thoroughly off by the time I read through it.