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What are the connections between the god of Islam and the Arab moon god Allah?

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posted on Dec, 11 2004 @ 06:19 PM
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Christians are in no position to speak paganism in Islam when Christianity is rooted in paganism. Islam is not rooted in Christianity.

The truth has not been revealed no where in this thread.

Allah has many variatins such as Elah, or simply La... All these names can be found in Hebrew texts and manuscripts.

Jehovah is another variation of the named Allah and so Elohim.

Allah has always been Abraham's God. It was in a period pagan occupation of Arabia that pagans started to associate other gods with Allah? Why did they do this? And why did they associate other gods with Allah instead of associating Allah with other gods.


Allah was there first. Allah was always the main God in Arabia. Pagans associated many pagan gods with Allah. They even said Allah had three daughters.

Allah is no moon god or false god. He is the God of Abraham. Abraham was the one who built the Ka'aba with his son Ishmael.




posted on Dec, 11 2004 @ 06:29 PM
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hehe well i still dont think there can be any type of connection applied.



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 02:57 AM
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Originally posted by Illmatic67
Abraham was the one who built the Ka'aba with his son Ishmael.

Well, yes, so the story goes. Exactly what abraham was going so far off course from the promised land and why he'd've built anything there anyway, well, one shouldn't expect a story to make sense right?

The arabs have not allways worshipped allah. Allah wasn't introduced to the arabs (outside of any jewish or christian influences in the region) until Mohammed started preaching about him. The arabs were, like most other people on the planet, pagans, who worshipped many gods in many ways. The'story' is that they originalyl worshipped allah, but then became slack in their monotheism. Again, its just a story tho, there is no particular reason to beleive it.



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 03:03 AM
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Originally posted by Thinker

Well, at least you've been able to demonstrate once again just how ironic it is that you have chosen the name 'thinker' for this board.

You're response was meanginless and unsubstantial, probably because you have no ability to defend your silly little positions. Don't get sick all over yourself just because you're confused or whatever. But more so, you actually quoted the entire post i made, and then made a generalized response. Hell, on top of that, there were portions that weren't even directed at you. Did you actually read the post? Or was it too long and reading that much made your head hurt?



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 03:23 AM
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You guys are all clueless.

Before Mohammad (peace be upon him) received the Revelations, people there used to look at the moon and the sun as gods. After the Revelations Allah (God) made clear that this was polythiesm, and a great sin. La illaha illallah (none has the right to be worshipped but Allah (God)).

Now while the Arabs accepted Islam, the Turks (which I am one) worshipped the Moon and the Stars. Then Islam became the religion of the Turks and during the Ottoman Empire they retained the symbols as their Flag, but they stayed to Islamic Monothiesm.

In Islam, Moses (peace be upon him) was a Messenger, Jesus (peace be upon him) was a messenger, and Muhammad (peace be upon him) was the last Messenger from Allah (God).

Jews killed Jesus, and this made Allah angry, and the Christians worship Jesus and this makes Allah (Subuhanu Wa T'ala) angry because He has no son and worshipping Jesus (peace be upon him) is polythiesm. Islam was a chance for those who wronged Allah (God) to make it right, and for the Pagan Arabs to become worshippers of Allah (God).

Allah is not his name like John or Joe. Allah means "The God".

So when you call God God, Arabic language is doing the same thing.

Jihad does not mean slaughtering people to make them converts. Jihad means defending and punishing the oppressors, and those who benefit them. That is why 9/11 happened. Read this interview with Bin Laden in May 1998, and figure out what his deal is. It will help you understand why he thinks this is necessary. He's quite reasonable. But while America says one thing, it does another.

Jihad also means a struggle against oneself, such as me trying to rid myself of bad habits.

Any questions, I will gladly answer.

[edit on 12-12-2004 by cstyle226]



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 03:46 AM
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Originally posted by cstyle226
Now while the Arabs accepted Islam, the Turks (which I am one) worshipped the Moon and the Stars.

Since the Turks were a central asian people who didn't have real contact with muslims until they invaded the islamic domain this isn't terribly surprising.



Jews killed Jesus,
Interesting, I had thought that muslims generally beleived that jesus was not killed, primarily because god wouldn't abandon one of his prophets? Are you saying that the jews are stronger than god? Also, the jews brought jesus to the roman authorities, and they held trial, found him guilty, and executed him. NOt the jews.

and this made Allah angry, and the Christians worship Jesus and this makes Allah (Subuhanu Wa T'ala) angry because He has no son and worshipping Jesus (peace be upon him) is polythiesm. Islam was a chance for those who wronged Allah (God) to make it right,[/qote]
Wait. You are claiming that god abandoned the entire idea of judaism, because some jews handed jesus over to the romans, and decided to create islam as the 'new and improved' judaism (or religion or whatever you want to call it)?




Jihad does not mean slaughtering people to make them converts. Jihad means defending and punishing the oppressors,

Yes, slaughtering people, just not to make them converts, check.

and those who benefit them. That is why 9/11 happened. Read this interview with Bin Laden in May 1998, and figure out what his deal is. It will help you understand why he thinks this is necessary. He's quite reasonable.
He murdered nearly 3,000 innocent civilians in one attack. He is far from reasonable. His position is based on theological justification, and on that alone he is outside the bounds of 'reason', not to mention be a savage murderer.


But while America says one thing, it does another.

Ok, and right now its ripping to peices the resistance in iraq and preparing to wage another war against another muslim nation. Allah's protection doesn't seem to be worth much. Sort of like what you are saying happede with jesus, god couldn't stop it. Looks like he can't stop the west from beating the radicals in the middle east, nor help them defend themselves.



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 03:54 AM
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But how could Allah be angry with the jews killing Jesus, if according to Islam, Jesus never died? Also, it is kind of odd that you drag Osama into this, as killing innocent people is not what muslims ought to be doing. Wouldn't it be better if the Muslims spent time spreading their message? That way all the "unbelievers" would see the error of their ways and would convert, instead of just being killed.
*edit* Looks like Nygdan beat me to the post

[edit on 12-12-2004 by babloyi]



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 04:05 AM
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Whatever happens, victories and defeats are all preordained by Allah (Subuhanu Wa T'ala).

It matters not you think, or what I think. America can turn every nation in the Middle East into their own version of "democracy," but that will not stop more 9/11s. You can catch Osama, and you can kill whoever you want, but you can't stop justice. And while you're at it, the whole world hates America, so keep it up. Maybe next time a French terrorist group will attack America.



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 07:40 AM
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I think what you guys just Demonstrated is that all of this CRAP - the cause of all of this Violence - is
Mis-Understanding & differences in Interpretation! Just people saying "God" in their own Native Tongues!

I seriously Doubt that "God" is telling you to Blow yourselves & others up however!!! Just another example of Politics Hijacking Religion! Religion has simply become a Tool for the Brainwashing & Control of People - it is Not Productive @ all. In addition I feel that Organized Religion is Not Spiritual at all either!

I am officially making SCIENCE my new Religion - you Monkeys can keep Killing yourselves over the Name of the Invisible Man in the Sky if you wish!


[edit on 12-12-2004 by Seraphim_Serpente]



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 08:09 AM
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Muslims gained nothing from 9/11, but even more hardship.

You know what they say, follow the money trail.

Well, who gained from 9/11? War companies, Israelis in control of the US Government, oil seekers, etc, etc...

Now you may say, well, the oil part of that isn't working out, so how could you say that? Because the Mujahideen will never allow the corrupt to casually plunder their wealth.



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 08:56 AM
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Listen - I am not stupid enough to believe everything that my Government tells me (like some other Americans). I happen to Agree with you that the U.S. Government is Corrupt - Many Governments in this World are! But then I ask myself which Countries & Cultures & Societies in the World are doing good things - Advancing the Human Experience so to say! Who is doing the Best work in Medicine & Arts & Science & Technology - Which Countries allow for Freedom of Speech? Which countries have decent Economies were People try to give each other Fair Deals? Guess What ISLAMIC COUNTRIES COME IN DEAD LAST in all of these! This is a shame because as I Mentioned before Islamic Culture used to be very Advanced in These Academic Areas - Now it is a joke! Face it the West has Surpassed you! Could it be that you Hate the West so much because of Jealously? You have gotten to the Point were you think that Cutting off peoples Heads on TV is making a Grand Political Statement! It is simply Barbarism!

Last time I checked there was NO Democracy of any sort in Saudi Arabia or Jordan. Lets see Saddam Hussein = Former Dictator! Yasser Arafat = Deceased Dictator! Moammar Gadafi = Dictator! Ayatollah Khomeini = Dictator! Bashar Assad = Dictator! The list goes On & On!

America might not be perfect but we are better than the Insanity that is going on in the Middle East - you can keep your Islam - we have no need for it!

I will take America Over Middle Eastern Tyranny (were you openly Torture each other) any time buddy!


[edit on 12-12-2004 by Seraphim_Serpente]



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 09:04 AM
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-Seraphim_Serpente-

I know that the Arab governments are bad....read my signature.



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by cstyle226
Whatever happens, victories and defeats are all preordained by Allah (Subuhanu Wa T'ala).

So allah has pre-ordained that the jihadis will be defeated then?

It matters not you think, or what I think. America can turn every nation in the Middle East into their own version of "democracy," but that will not stop more 9/11s.
Why would a citizen living in a peacful democratic nation be willing to be manipulated into becomeing any kind of suicide bomber? 911 was able to get going because of the financial backing the bin laden was ablet o get and the organization that he and others were able to build up. Why would that organization even be able to operate in a democratized middle east? Turkey is a moderate muslim democracy, and, while I'm sure they have their own problems, it wasn't Turks that did 911, nor the madrid bombing nor any major acts of terrorism.



You can catch Osama, and you can kill whoever you want, but you can't stop justice.

Justice will be bin ladin and the other members of his database being captured and tried for their horrendous acts of mass murder.


And while you're at it, the whole world hates America, so keep it up. Maybe next time a French terrorist group will attack America.

Extraordinarily unlikely. The French have hated america and americans for a long time, but haven't built up any interest in terror attacks on america. More attacks in the US and the rest of the world will happen, but this Terror War isn't going to be able to break up the federal government, and certainly won't be able to actually invade and occupy the US. Its the middle east that is going thru an occupation phase, again, right now. The question is will the middle easterners live like the palestinians, or will they decide that being able to vote and having an open society is a good thing?


Well, who gained from 9/11? War companies, Israelis

Ah yes, 'its the jooooos, the joooooos'.


Because the Mujahideen will never allow the corrupt to casually plunder their wealth.

The wealth of iraq and other middle eastern countries do not belong to the mujahideeners,and beides, they've allways allowed others to 'plunder' that wealth, wether it was the ottomans, the government set up after the west defeated the ottomans, or the baathists. The religious fighters have never had control of any of it. So this 'never' idea is patently false, they've never been able to prevent it. Even now they don't prevent the sale of iraqi oil. Besides, the majority of people that the insurgents are killing have been killing have been iraqis, unconnected to the oil programs. EVerytime a roadside bomb goes off its '1 soldier killed, 12 iraqis that were nearby' and the like. Eventually the general public is going to get tired of dying from insurgent bombs.



posted on Dec, 12 2004 @ 08:51 PM
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Originally posted by cstyle226
-Seraphim_Serpente-

I know that the Arab governments are bad....read my signature.



"Why [is] your government...supporting the rotten governments of our countries?

This is nonsensical, since saudi arabia and pakistan are the ones that created, supported, funded, and were also the only two governments on the planet that recognized the taliban as legitimate. Bin ladin was protected by them as a guest in the country, and had camps operatign there for years, and fights along with them. He obviously doesn't have a problem benefiting and accepting the help of these governments.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 04:00 AM
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Best of Luck to all, But truth is found only in Christ Jesus .

As Pilate retorted, "What is truth"?







[edit on 13-12-2004 by Logician]



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 06:54 AM
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This probably is why many people are opposed to Islam:


Originally posted by cstyle226
Whatever happens, victories and defeats are all preordained by Allah (Subuhanu Wa T'ala).


Makes living useless then, doesn't it?


Originally posted by cstyle226
It matters not you think, or what I think. America can turn every nation in the Middle East into their own version of "democracy," but that will not stop more 9/11s.


Is that a threat?


Originally posted by cstyle226
You can catch Osama, and you can kill whoever you want, but you can't stop justice.


I thought justice involved being fair.


Originally posted by cstyle226
And while you're at it, the whole world hates America, so keep it up.


Not true, but good try.


Originally posted by cstyle226
Maybe next time a French terrorist group will attack America.


I think Americans dislike the French more than the French disliking Americans. Either way, it isn't right but we shouldn't play into the media and draw boarders around ourselves. Meet people, see then if you do or do not like them. If you are Christian, then you're taught to love them anyway.



posted on Dec, 13 2004 @ 08:32 PM
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Originally posted by saint4God
Makes living useless then, doesn't it?

If thats all there was to the hate then Calvinists would be universally reviled.


Is that a threat?

He's probably making a relatively reasonable, though I beleive ultimately incorrect, conclusion, rather than threatening anyone.


I thought justice involved being fair

This guy thinks that bin ladin was serving justice and following proper form by targeting attacking and murdering nearly 3,000 civilian men and women. He'd proably lie and say that the same thing happend to thousand of muslims at the hands of america, but isn't likely to convince anyone of that.



posted on Dec, 14 2004 @ 08:26 PM
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The true Aryans are Persians and many North Indians.



posted on Dec, 15 2004 @ 06:35 AM
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Quote: "The true Aryans are Persians and many North Indians."

Yes this is true - they also Migrated into Europe (i.e. Gothic
Indo-Europeans). I want you to remember that Race is something different & unrelated to Religion however. We CHOOSE what Religion to (or not to) Practice! If you look at all the Religions in that Area you will see a
Mish-Mash of Various Pagan Religions Like Hindi & Buddhism & Zoroastrianism - to Various Forms of Christianity & Islam! I just felt like pointing this out - I am Sick of seeing & hearing Ignorant White Racists refer to themselves as "Christians" - I wonder what would happen if I told them That Jesus (the Founder of their Religion) was a Brown Skinned Jew?



posted on Dec, 15 2004 @ 09:52 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
If thats all there was to the hate then Calvinists would be universally reviled.


Mind expanding on this statement? I don't follow what you're referring to.


[edit on 15-12-2004 by saint4God]



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