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BREAKING: Video Finally Released of Cops Shooting Man with a Toy Gun in Wal-Mart

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posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:26 PM
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a reply to: Ahabstar


So do you listen to WLW or 550? I'd like to hear the interview, but I'd also like to hear from the Crawford family and their atty, as well. Regardless, this is unjust and sickening. This and the Samantha Ramsey girl that was shot FOUR times down in Boone County, KY earlier in the summer, late spring. Her case is still under investigation by the police department's specially appointed team, or whatever you call it.

Oh, btw, he didn't drop to surrender. He dropped dead after being shot by the police.




posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:26 PM
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a reply to: seeker1963

Homesteaders where I grew up would always make sure to have at least a pellet gun with them. And those were the hippieish city people who hated guns. They saw the value in them. Me, I have no idea what they look like, I've never handled a gun before lol.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:31 PM
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originally posted by: Snarl
a reply to: Answer

Simple question: Do you believe that kid 'deserved' to die?


Right, because now it's going to that point since you can't stick to arguing the facts. Predictable that you attack my character.

Nobody deserves to die unless they are a threat to others. When you present yourself as a clear threat to others in a public place there's a good chance you're going to be confronted by police. He didn't "deserve to die" but he is definitely responsible for his own death because he was carelessly waving a rifle around in a public place and he presented himself as a threat to anyone who observed him at the time.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:32 PM
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a reply to: Answer

Try watching this video of police in Michigan interacting with an older white guy with a gun, then repeat this statement to me


Police do not intentionally put themselves in front of a person with a gun, EVER.


Link

The headline on the article?
Watch Police Diffuse Gun-Toting White Man Peacefully Even After Stand Off!

Some of my favorite excerpts:



On May 4th in Kalamazoo, Mich., White 63-year-old Joseph Houseman (pictured) engaged a phalanx of local police for a 40-plus-minute argument as he held a rifle over his shoulder, parade-style, in broad daylight.




After receiving several calls about the odd site by passersby, police finally went to where Houseman, who was wearing pajamas, was spotted. Standing on a sidewalk, Houseman defiantly mouthed off to them...




...didn’t stop Houseman from making lewd gestures and cursing at them — all while refusing to produce identification and lay down his weapons.




...the officers remained respectful toward Houseman during the entire standoff and addressed him as “sir” on a few occasions.


This is leading into my favorite part now (bold emphasis is mine):



After police approach him and check his rifle, they find out that his weapon is actually empty and then offer him the opportunity to walk home and retrieve his rifle the following day or drive him home.


And now for the best part. The guy refuses both options and this happens:



After a discussion about Houseman’s sanity and amendment rights, he and the officer actually shake hands and the old man is free to walk away.


Yes, I think the Walmart situation was handled completely wrong.

edit on 9/24/2014 by halfpint0701 because: Embedded video



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:35 PM
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u know one thing i knoticed not about to say this was ok it was not but

he grabed the bbgun in 2 seconds iv never picked up something that fast without knowing what i wanted

i have to say he intended to pick it up i have no idea why but may of been setup for this

gun out of box witting there just just straight picks it up that fast just dosent sit right

and yea the time between cops making contact and shooting is to short

he did marginaly raise the gun but whos to say it wasent just reaction

the cops where in the wrong regardless but ... n i hate cops ... they where acting to what they thought was a guy with a loaded full auto gun about to shoot the store up bad intel led to this

the guy that called should get manslauter and a fyew years minimum

he flat out lied its proven he deservs punishment ... the cops atleast reprmanded retrained ... they should of handled it better

what ever happen to getting people out of the area and useing a loudspeaker to comunicate from a safe distance


still tho why did he pick up the gun so fast whoever was on the other end i bet knows and will never talk



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:36 PM
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a reply to: halfpint0701

Exactly. It has nothing to do with them being in the right. It has all to do with them being in the wrong. They went in and shouted. Two seconds later the kid's on the ground.

All an overreaction due to the cold guts and glory attitude combined with the current attitude that anyone with anything slightly resembling a gun is a serious threat.

Many cops can deal with it correctly, these guys didn't.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:37 PM
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originally posted by: Fylgje
a reply to: lovebeck

Good catch. This is how the media works. They all work together to smear someone. Shooting a guy in a store like that is the end of the line for America. We can go no further like this.



When it first happened, you'd think there was a psychotic mad man with more guns and ammo than Rambo taking out old ladies, babies, the handicapped, and everyone else for that matter. They all (local media) went on for days like that, and I'm two hours away from that area!

I felt that, based on the (totes biased) reporting, that it may have been justified because the only other thing we had heard about him was his family's statements. After seeing the video, I can see that what was reported and what actually occurred are two entirely different things.

That's just unreal, that screen shot. Don't they realize that people will watch the video? Why even post ANY PART of the video there? A man was killed and, again more police will get away with killing a young black man who was NO threat to anyone, especially them. Why can't they just shoot to injure if they MUST shoot? What's up with only going with the kill shots, and the shots to the posterior parts of huge arm, back, etc?



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:38 PM
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originally posted by: halfpint0701
a reply to: Answer

Try watching this video of police in Michigan interacting with an older white guy with a gun, then repeat this statement to me


Police do not intentionally put themselves in front of a person with a gun, EVER.


Link

The headline on the article?
Watch Police Diffuse Gun-Toting White Man Peacefully Even After Stand Off!

Some of my favorite excerpts:



On May 4th in Kalamazoo, Mich., White 63-year-old Joseph Houseman (pictured) engaged a phalanx of local police for a 40-plus-minute argument as he held a rifle over his shoulder, parade-style, in broad daylight.




After receiving several calls about the odd site by passersby, police finally went to where Houseman, who was wearing pajamas, was spotted. Standing on a sidewalk, Houseman defiantly mouthed off to them...




...didn’t stop Houseman from making lewd gestures and cursing at them — all while refusing to produce identification and lay down his weapons.




...the officers remained respectful toward Houseman during the entire standoff and addressed him as “sir” on a few occasions.


This is leading into my favorite part now (bold emphasis is mine):



After police approach him and check his rifle, they find out that his weapon is actually empty and then offer him the opportunity to walk home and retrieve his rifle the following day or drive him home.


And now for the best part. The guy refuses both options and this happens:



After a discussion about Houseman’s sanity and amendment rights, he and the officer actually shake hands and the old man is free to walk away.


Yes, I think the Walmart situation was handled completely wrong.


Key differences in your case and this one:

1) Man was not inside a store.
2) He was holding the rifle parade style over his shoulder. That's an extra few seconds required to ready the rifle to fire... this is a much more substantial difference than you'll be willing to accept.
3) The dispatcher in your case didn't say "he's pointing the rifle at people" and "he was seen loading it."

Would you like me to find a case where police should have acted sooner and someone got shot? I'm sure I can drag up plenty of those if we want to play a game of "irrelevant comparisons."



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:43 PM
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originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
a reply to: seeker1963

Homesteaders where I grew up would always make sure to have at least a pellet gun with them. And those were the hippieish city people who hated guns. They saw the value in them. Me, I have no idea what they look like, I've never handled a gun before lol.


Here's a link to the rifle held by the man who was shot in this case:

www.crosman.com...
edit on 9/24/2014 by Answer because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:43 PM
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originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: Snarl
a reply to: Answer

Simple question: Do you believe that kid 'deserved' to die?


Right, because now it's going to that point since you can't stick to arguing the facts. Predictable that you attack my character.

Nobody deserves to die unless they are a threat to others. When you present yourself as a clear threat to others in a public place there's a good chance you're going to be confronted by police. He didn't "deserve to die" but he is definitely responsible for his own death because he was carelessly waving a rifle around in a public place and he presented himself as a threat to anyone who observed him at the time.


Don't 'cop out' on me. This is not about you or your character.

You can't simply state that the kid didn't deserve to die. That would be an attack on your character.

And as far as being a threat to others ... I am always a threat to others. Always!! By your definition, the cops should 'always' at liberty to kill me on-sight. Sorry ... but that means your arguments are just BS. I'm done trying to help you get your mind right. There's a bunch of other folks in-thread that may want to continue, but I am not.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:43 PM
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originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme

All an overreaction due to the cold guts and glory attitude combined with the current attitude that anyone with anything slightly resembling a gun is a serious threat.


Haven't you heard? Police need to fire at anyone holding anything resembling anything that could be construed as a potential threat without hesitation otherwise it would be too late for them to realize there isn't an actual threat but rather a big misunderstanding.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:44 PM
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originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
a reply to: lovebeck

BBs are either metal or plastic and can hurt you if it hits the eye, ear or sensitive part of the body. A pellet gun is usually a metal pellet that impacts with a pretty strong punch. I'm pretty certain it can be lethal.


Ok. I'm thinking he had an air soft gun. My hubby had a few of those a while back and we used them for target practice. We have a BB gun as well and it used those copper colored little BB's. Idk if I've ever seen a metal pellet gun.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:46 PM
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originally posted by: Snarl

originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: Snarl
a reply to: Answer

Simple question: Do you believe that kid 'deserved' to die?


Right, because now it's going to that point since you can't stick to arguing the facts. Predictable that you attack my character.

Nobody deserves to die unless they are a threat to others. When you present yourself as a clear threat to others in a public place there's a good chance you're going to be confronted by police. He didn't "deserve to die" but he is definitely responsible for his own death because he was carelessly waving a rifle around in a public place and he presented himself as a threat to anyone who observed him at the time.


Don't 'cop out' on me. This is not about you or your character.

You can't simply state that the kid didn't deserve to die. That would be an attack on your character.

And as far as being a threat to others ... I am always a threat to others. Always!! By your definition, the cops should 'always' at liberty to kill me on-sight. Sorry ... but that means your arguments are just BS. I'm done trying to help you get your mind right. There's a bunch of other folks in-thread that may want to continue, but I am not.


I actually did say he didn't deserve to die... reading comprehension, much?

My mind isn't right... that's your solution. It's not that I see this issue from a different angle... my mind isn't right and my arguments are BS. Ok, good riddance if you can't come up with a decent debate.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:48 PM
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a reply to: lovebeck

WLW for the most part. Cunningham goes over the top but he does let the interviewee's speak their mind. Scott Sloan tends to speak with more of an everyman position. Funny thing about Willie is that he isn't like his on air persona at all. He is actually rather quiet and reserved in person.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:50 PM
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a reply to: Snarl

Thank you. He's just trolling and I agree with you; it's better just to ignore these types.




posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:52 PM
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a reply to: Ahabstar

That's what I also listen to if the mp3 isn't playing. You're right about Cunningham, lol!



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:52 PM
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edit on 24-9-2014 by lovebeck because: Double post...



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:55 PM
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originally posted by: Answer

originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
a reply to: seeker1963

Homesteaders where I grew up would always make sure to have at least a pellet gun with them. And those were the hippieish city people who hated guns. They saw the value in them. Me, I have no idea what they look like, I've never handled a gun before lol.


Here's a link to the rifle held by the man who was shot in this case:

www.crosman.com...


A link to where you got that information would be most helpful. To me, it looks like a toy. But I know what a gun is supposed to look like, including assault rifles. If in fact this is the toy he had in the store, the "track" on the top gives it away.



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 09:58 PM
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a reply to: Answer

Did you also notice how many people called in about the guy in the video?

Yet there was only 1 call from 1 customer inside Walmart? This kid was supposedly pointing the gun at women and children, yet no other shoppers had a cell phone to call it in? And no 911 call from Walmart security who I'm sure was watching this guy, too. And where are all the witness statements from other people in the store if this guy was supposedly threatening all these people?

If they went into the store and didn't see any people scared for their lives loitering outside, then the police failed to completely assess the entire situation.
edit on 9/24/2014 by halfpint0701 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 24 2014 @ 10:03 PM
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Nobody has mentioned this yet. In the video, (I forgot the young man's first name) Crawford after being shot goes back for the gun. That was not a good idea either. That can be seen as aggressive also. Also, he spends a lot of time practicing some type of maneuver that seems to be doing a shoot out. I noticed that most of the time he was holding the gun near the trigger. I don't have enough framework to make a good judgement on the shooting but why did he pick up the gun in the first place? To me, this is stupidity getting you killed.



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