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The Great Pyramid And Sphinx, The Lies And Deceptions

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posted on Dec, 4 2005 @ 07:50 PM
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What we now consider to be boundaries of Egypt and Jerusalem were not the boundaries thousands of years ago. The current boundaries are a deception perpetrated by the Master Of All Deception Satan, who in an effort to hide from us the proof of God's Plan made in stone on the Giza Plateau.


What the hell are you thinking, posting this? Really, you should TRY to remain unbiased. The Egyptians didn't even believe in your uncreative "God", why should he have any say in what they made?




posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 03:13 PM
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Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII
The accurate longitude on the portolans maps proves that prehistory witnessed at least one great civilization ...

The Mayans had a more accurate distance to the moon than we did up until the 1970's.


Please provide some references that indicate that these two statements might be accurate.

Harte



posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 11:21 PM
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Originally posted by Lastday Prophet
I do not need to offer proof of God, if you don't beleive there is a God, one day you will find out how wrong you were.

That choice is yours.

Some proof I gave earlier in the post with the measurements of the Pyramid.

[edit on 6-8-2005 by Lastday Prophet]


um, the bible isn't proof, it's philosophy
if the bible is proof, than all other religious texts are equally adequete



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 07:28 PM
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also, why would the jewish people choose the egyptian symbol of creation (a pyramid shaped mound)?



posted on Dec, 27 2005 @ 04:05 AM
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Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII
The accurate longitude on the portolans maps proves that prehistory witnessed at least one great civilization ...

The Mayans had a more accurate distance to the moon than we did up until the 1970's.


Please provide some references that indicate that these two statements might be accurate.

Harte


www.world-mysteries.com...

www.anomalies-unlimited.com...

www.dreamscape.com...

These are a few sites about the piri reis map and its anomalies.
I cannot find the source for my Mayan moon info. Still looking.



posted on Dec, 27 2005 @ 05:54 PM
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Originally posted by christkiller
What the hell are you thinking, posting this? Really, you should TRY to remain unbiased. The Egyptians didn't even believe in your uncreative "God", why should he have any say in what they made?


Firstly, do not be so rude to a member on the basis of his belief.
Secondly, the first post in this thread is pointing out how he holds the belief that the Pyramids were built by King Solomon, not by any Egyptians.
Thirdly, if the Judeo-Christian God is real, than he easily have say in what they made.



posted on Dec, 27 2005 @ 09:09 PM
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Originally posted by Odium

Originally posted by christkiller
What the hell are you thinking, posting this? Really, you should TRY to remain unbiased. The Egyptians didn't even believe in your uncreative "God", why should he have any say in what they made?


Firstly, do not be so rude to a member on the basis of his belief.
Secondly, the first post in this thread is pointing out how he holds the belief that the Pyramids were built by King Solomon, not by any Egyptians.

‘Treat the other man's faith gently; it is all he has to believe with. His mind was created for his own thoughts, not yours or mine. ‘ Henry S. Haskins
I cannot see how it is possible for Solomon to be the Giza pyramid builder, due to the Moses exodus story. If he was behind them, I think that Egyptians are still the builders. Ever since Abraham and Sarah, through Vizier Joseph, and Moses, the Egyptian/Jewish bond has been close. Moses was likely partly Egyptian, kin of Tut-Moses, and Ra-Moses, and he was also likely partly Hebrew.



posted on Dec, 27 2005 @ 09:33 PM
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There is a guy on here, or the was who had his own website based around this idea, I wish I could find the link but I can't right now.

Anyway, long story short with the evidence he had the arguement could be used to debate this against any Egyptologist and keep them on their toes. However, it is based around what you believe.

Nobody for sure can say what the Pyramids are used for, I tend not to agree that they are burial chambers although a lot of evidence does support this claim. Hopefully, one day we will find out.

Edit: Since nothing was found inside, maybe old Titor himself went back and took it.
While averting a Civil War....

[edit on 27/12/2005 by Odium]



posted on Dec, 27 2005 @ 09:45 PM
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When it was first entered, the entire pyramid was virtually spotless, except for a tiny piece of wood and scrap of fabric. It was totally empty. There was no sign of previous entry, and even if looters had been there, it is unlikely that they would clean up after themselves. That is the main reason I doubt it was a burial chamber. Other pyramids clearly were, but none of them come close to the amazing feat that is the Giza Pyramid.



posted on Dec, 27 2005 @ 11:09 PM
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Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII
The accurate longitude on the portolans maps proves that prehistory witnessed at least one great civilization ...

The Mayans had a more accurate distance to the moon than we did up until the 1970's.


Please provide some references that indicate that these two statements might be accurate.

Harte


www.world-mysteries.com...

www.anomalies-unlimited.com...

www.dreamscape.com...

These are a few sites about the piri reis map and its anomalies.
I cannot find the source for my Mayan moon info. Still looking.


Sorry Blackguard13, but the Piri Reis map won't do. The longitudes, latitudes and coastlines depicted thereon are not accurate to the extent claimed at all the pseudohistory sites. The bottom of the map, where everyone cliams that Antarctica is mapped, actually corresponds far better with the coastline of South America. If you use the search function here at ATS with the phrase "Piri Reis", I'm certain you will (eventually) come across several well thought out and thoroughly discussed reasons that this section actually represents South America's coastline, the hows and the whys of it.

Regarding the so-called "accuracy" of the map itself:



Someone needs to provide some sort of evidence that itis indeed an accurate map. The examinations that I have
made of it show all sorts of errors that certainly falsify
any claim of unusual accuracy for this map. Also, the
methodology used to determine the longitude and latitude
of the map allowed all sorts of unintentional fudging. As
Mallery in his, "Rediscovery of Lost America", on page 145
states:

"Midway in my research on the old charts and maps,
I discovered that the grids marked on them were incorrect.
After deciding that these incorrect grids had probably
been added much later by persons other than the original
draftsman, I removed them and worked out what I consider
to be the correct grids. During this time it became obvious
that each map or chart was an assembly of several charts
and/or maps of contiguous areas and that the separate
charts or maps combined to produce a single map were not
all drawn to the same zero point."

The basic assumption of Mallery is that the maps were
originally accurate and any errors are the result of later
copying and compilation. As a result, any error, whether it
was part of original source map(s) or not, is erased in the
reconstruction of the original "source map(s)" on which a
particular map is based. Thus because removing errors
regardless of their origin is a standard part of reconstructing
the original source map(s), it is not surprising that they are
remarkable accurate. However, these reconstructed source
maps may have no basis in fact because no proof is offered
that the errors that they corrected were indeed the result of
the copying and compilation process and not actually part of
the actual source map.

Dr. Hapgood fixed up the Piri Reis Map in much the same
way. The accuracy that the Piri Reis Map has results from
his "source maps" being reconstructed with the
assumption that original source maps were accurate and
any errors in it came from copying and compilation. Thus,
any errors in the Piri Reis map were eliminated by
fitting the Piri Reis to modern maps and accounting for
the misfits by adjusting the boundaries and separate grids
of his hypothesized and unproven "source maps". The
latitude and longitude on the Piri Reis is accurate because
Dr. Hapgood drew the boundaries and lat.-long. grids on his
"source maps" in order eliminate errors the gross errors
exhibited by the Piri Reis as best as he could.

Source

The Piri Reis map is only accurate to the extent that the errors have been removed on the assumption that all the errors were due to copying and compilation, so the assumption was that the map was accurate, hence the map was accurate.
For more on this map, and why it's not even all that interesting of a relic, go to the link above.

Harte



posted on Dec, 28 2005 @ 11:54 AM
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The Pyramids of Giza: Could they have been made?

The idea that it is a burial chamber, comes from four main pieces of evidence:
  • The legends told to and reported by Herodotus who visited the pyramids in 443 BC
  • The funerary complex near the Great Pyramid with inscriptions citing Cheops/Khufu as the reigning pharaoh
  • In the pyramid itself, on a granite slab above the ceiling of the main chamber, some small, red ochre paint marks that have a slight resemblance to a hieroglyphic symbol for the name of Khufu
  • Writing outside the pyramids, describing how and when it was built.
Now to truly argued against it, you need to examine the main pieces of evidence.
  1. Can’t be taken as fact, as it is a story.
  2. Could have been built after.
  3. Claimed to be faked.
  4. Seems to describe repair work, not building.
Now, the Pyramids are claimed to contain 2,300,000 limestone and granite blocks - which is actually more than contained in the entire Churches in the United Kingdom, during the 1400’s to 1800’s. On a mineral scale, limestone is 4 to 5 and granite is 5 to 6. Now, housed in the Cairo Museum the only example of saws that were found dating from the 4th Dynasty are copper and bronze, both which come between 3.5 to 4 on this scale. [1]

So, when looking at the first part the ability to cut and shape the blocks so perfectly is heavily suspect with the technology that they are described to have been using - next, you have the blocks themselves. Many of these blocks are meant to weigh on average 2.6tons, with the heaviest being estimated at over 15tons. Now, to complete the project in ten years Civil Engineering magazine [June 1999.] estimated that the average workforce was 13,2000 with a peak workforce of 40,000. Their calculations suggest that to complete it in ten years, with that many people you would have to sustain a rate of 180 blocks per-hour or three blocks every 60-seconds.

Now, think of that for a moment: to construct in ten-years, it would take a rate of 3blocks per-minute to be built in that time. An amazing feat, when many of the blocks were carved in Aswan, 600miles to the south. The problem with the Civil Engineering magazine, what they did not factor in was the time it would take to design, plan, survey, level a 13-acre site and more importantly, they didn’t factor in the building of other pyramids, temples, houses, gathering of food, etc. All of which would add considerable to their ten year estimate. When compared against the time span that Khufu reigned [2589 BC to 2566 BC.][2] the ability for such a project to be under-taken is highly suspect. However, it is not impossible.

How were the blocks moved? It is known, that the most likely source of the material was gathered from Aswan and the surrounding region - transporting them almost 600miles, in some cases. Now, depending on which theory you ascribe to the ability to move them is different. From, rolling them on wooden slates, to using kites to pull them and so on and so fourth. I actually ascribe to a hybrid theory:

If you take the theories of Mark Lehner and Mory Gharib, and combine them you have the ability to move the blocks “quickly”. Mark Lehner, put forward the theory that there was a road that was lubricated [with water or milk] and then pulled along these - sliding. Mory Gharib, a Caltech aeronautics professor put forward the idea that they could have been moved using “kites” and in June 2001, they were able to raise a 3000kg obelisk into position in 25seconds in just 22mph winds. It is fully possible, that these were added together. Thus much of the weight of the blocks, was removed from the labour force and they just helped to pull the rest of the weight. The largest blocks being transported fully by land, but the smaller being transported by ships with these kites helping to lift them.

Now, the problem of the ramp? To build a ramp to the top of the Pyramid would in fact take more material than the Pyramid themselves - however, excavation to the South of the Pyramids found the remains of a ramp. However, it wasn’t solid - two walls, filled with sand a material they had in abundance. The walls were used to help compact the sand so that they could build the pyramids.

When coupled with recent studies, done by Gilles Dormion and Jean Patrice Goidin they have found that between 10 to 15% of the Pyramid, is actually filled with sand, rubber, gypsum and so on and so fourth - the smoother blocks being on the outside and this can be seen on the pyramids themselves. Now that the case-stones have been removed [hundreds of years ago], the ones below them are not as smooth as people would suspect and this would remove the time they needed to work on them.

It is possible, that Khufu had them built - it has been displayed, through various theorists that it is fully possible to have built the pyramids in such a time frame. However, it would be hard-work - the evidence is there and clear that it could be completed but would be an amazing feat or engineering that is something even now we can’t compete with.

What was it used for?

Who knows? I tend to believe it was used for another purpose, not as a burial chamber but a temple. Will we ever find out? I hope so for my own sanity.

Odium.

[1]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohs_scale_of_mineral_hardness
[2]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khufu



posted on Dec, 29 2005 @ 07:08 PM
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'Many of these blocks weigh on average 2.6tons, the heaviest being estimated at over 15tons. Now, to complete the project in ten years Civil Engineering magazine [June 1999.] estimated that the average workforce was 13,2000 with a peak workforce of 40,000. Their calculations suggest that to complete it in ten years, with that many people you would have to sustain a rate of 180 blocks per-hour or three blocks every 60-seconds.

Now, think of that for a moment: to construct in ten-years, it would take a rate of 3blocks per-minute to be built in that time. An amazing feat, when many of the blocks were carved in Aswan, 600miles to the south. The problem with the Civil Engineering magazine, they did not factor in the time to design, plan, survey, level a 13-acre site or the building of other pyramids, temples, houses, gathering of food. All of which would add considerable to their estimate. However, it is not impossible.

How were the blocks moved? It is known, that the most likely source of the material was gathered from Aswan - transporting them almost 600miles, in some cases. I actually ascribe to a hybrid theory:
If you take the theories of Mark Lehner and Mory Gharib, and combine them you have the ability to move the blocks “quickly”. Lehner put forward the theory that there was a road that was lubricated and then pulled along these - sliding. Gharib, an aeronautics professor put forward the idea they could have been moved using “kites”. It is possible these were added together.'
Odium

I like your take on this subject, Odium, it is much more informed than the vast majority I have read. In regard to the weight of the heaviest block, I believe that there is a granite slab above the King's Chamber (200+ feet above ground level) which weighs an estimated 200 tons. Placing such a block would be a feat today... back then, wow.
The best estimates I have seen for the number of blocks is about 580 000, but the tricky thing is the tiers are all different heights, and the blocks all different widths, so imagine if they dropped one... The delay while they cut a new one would be considerable.
As you point out, copper is too soft to cut them, but even more puzzling, the sarcophagus was drilled using a technology that cut deeper into the granite per revolution than out best drills can do today.
I like Herodotus, and if I recall, the priests told him the pyramid was much older than presently claimed. Just thought I'd add those points. Cheers



posted on Dec, 29 2005 @ 07:22 PM
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Thank you, BlackGuardXIII for taking the time to read it and reply - for a moment, I thought my post had escaped the World...


The reason I can see them being able to place three-blocks a second, would be in the early stages of the build. When you think of the size of the site, it would be easy to have teams working at each corner of the pyramid with their own ramps and less blocks being placed as it got higher.

That's how I see it at least and it makes it easier to believe, there are still many parts that are unproven or difficult for us to understand at the moment but a lot of the basics are there - I thought I would show them to the ATS Community.



posted on Dec, 29 2005 @ 07:39 PM
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Until I see a workable blueprint, that cannot be disproved as feasible, which answers all the present puzzles, and duplicates the precision and detail of the Giza pyramid, I will concede that the builders were able to do something that we cannot. I wonder, why was it square to within .015% of perfectly square, when today 3% is the average, and the naked eye cannot see the difference. The huge, (100's of times harder), increase in difficulty seems to have no purpose.
Why was it sealed up empty?
Why did they make it so complex? The differing tier heights, and block sizes are very quake proof, but why did they choose to make it so durable, when that method was so much more logistically demanding?



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 01:07 AM
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I have not been around for awhile, been busy in the real world.
To quickly reinforce my position lets look at the "FACTS"

Firstly, no ancient civilization could have come up with this information:

The Diameter of the Earth
The Center of the Landmass of the Earth
The Distance of the Earth to the Sun
The Knowledge of PHI and the ability to use it in structures
The Knowledge of True North within .005 degrees

This information had to be "Revealed" to the builders. Revealed by who? Aliens, NO, there are no Aliens and not one peice of evidence is available to prove the exsistance of Aliens, all you will find is thousands of pictures which have to date not proven anything. There is not ONE clear picture of a UFO anywhere.

Who then revealed this info and is there any written record?
GOD revealed the info to King Solomon and the record is in I and II Chronicles in the Bible.
GOD showed him the "WORKING OF THIS PATTERN" meaning the Blueprint of the Building.

It tells how long it took to build the Three Giza Pyramids, 20 years

How many workers there were, over 153,000 workers

How the blocks were moved, King Solomon had boats and used "AXLE CARTS" to move the blocks over land.

King Solomon had the abundance of DIAMONDS needed for the saw blades that cut the stone blocks.

He had over 100,000 tons of Gold that were used in the building

He had 1,000,000 tons of iron

The brass could not be weighed for it was such an abundance.

The Great Pyramid was not a tomb, for no body or burial utensils or residue were ever found in the Great.

The Great Pryamid is the "Great And Wonderful House Of GOD"

Prophetic Numbers can be found in and out of the Great, there were originally 144,000 casing stone covering the Great. 144,000 is the number of last day jewish servants of GOD spoken of in the book of revelations.
The Sphinx is 288 ft. long ( 2x144) The height of the Sphinx is 66, the number of man. The height of the Great is also a multiple of 144 in Cubits.

The Coffer in the Kings Chamber is the same size as the "ARK OF THE COVENANT" and the room itself is the same size as the room where King Solomon Placed Two Golden Cherubim, whose combined wingspan was 20 cubits or 34 ft. 34 ft. is the width of the Kings Chamber

All the rulers of the then known world came to see the House King Solomon built unto the Lord and to inquire of his "WISDOM"
He was wiser than the egyptians or anyone else
He had over 40,000 chariots that brought the visitors to the Giza Plateau

The Bible states that "The "Heavens" Declare My Handywork Saith GOD"
The Star Constellation "Orions Belt" is a exact duplicate of the Giza Plateau in the "Heavens"
The Bible states that there is an "ALTAR OF WITNESS" in the midst of Egypt and on the border thereof, this is exactly where the Great Pyramid sits.





[edit on 4-1-2006 by Lastday Prophet]



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 05:11 AM
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Firstly, no ancient civilization could have come up with this information:

The Diameter of the Earth
The Center of the Landmass of the Earth
The Distance of the Earth to the Sun
The Knowledge of PHI and the ability to use it in structures
The Knowledge of True North within .005 degrees

And somehow they all new it? How come we did not have aliens and GOD to help us figure it out. And finally, why God did not say: ‘In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Diameter of Earth was….’





This information had to be "Revealed" to the builders. Revealed by who? Aliens, NO, there are no Aliens and not one peice of evidence is available to prove the exsistance of Aliens, all you will find is thousands of pictures which have to date not proven anything. There is not ONE clear picture of a UFO anywhere.

Who then revealed this info and is there any written record?
GOD revealed the info to King Solomon and the record is in I and II Chronicles in the Bible.
GOD showed him the "WORKING OF THIS PATTERN" meaning the Blueprint of the Building.


Is there a single piece of evidence that GOD even exists?

In December of 2005 there was documentary on released KGB files titled “Project ISIS”. It is all based on discovery of ‘Visitor’s tomb’ and there was video footage and documents stating that number of artifacts were found on the site. This might be KGB hoax, but I can’t find reason for KGB to make this kind of hoax and then keep it secret for 30-40 years.

Another reasoning on big Pyramids is that some advanced civilization existed before Egyptians. The story of Mu and Atlantis come to mind.

I’ve read that Abdullah Al Mamun, first person who broke in to the pyramid has found 2-3cm tick layer of salt inside the pyramid. According to Semir Osmanagic, analysis of salt suggested that this was sea salt, which suggested that this region at some point was covered with sea.

Only thing that I agree with you is that pyramids were not built by slave labor, which was previously believed.



It tells how long it took to build the Three Giza Pyramids, 20 years

How many workers there were, over 153,000 workers

How the blocks were moved, King Solomon had boats and used "AXLE CARTS" to move the blocks over land.

King Solomon had the abundance of DIAMONDS needed for the saw blades that cut the stone blocks.

He had over 100,000 tons of Gold that were used in the building

He had 1,000,000 tons of iron

The brass could not be weighed for it was such an abundance.

The Great Pyramid was not a tomb, for no body or burial utensils or residue were ever found in the Great.


And where is single proof of this? Single diamond blade? Single axle cart? Where is iron or gold? Disappeared?


You better post this on some religious forum, as there someone might believe this. Here you have to provide proof to your cause.


[edit on 1/4/06 by vietifulJoe]



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 05:19 AM
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'The Star Constellation "Orions Belt" is a exact duplicate of the Giza Plateau in the "Heavens" ' lastday prophet
I presume you meant it the other way around, in that the three main Giza pyramids are laid out to duplicate the relative positions and magnitudes of the three stars in 'Orions Belt'.
And I have trouble with the idea that Solomon lived in Egypt, as I thought Moses fled Egypt, and that in Solomon's time Egypt was recognized as a neighbour to their nation. How could he then be the pyramids builder?
And as for ancients not able to know those things, they very well could have, and much more. I hate to say it, but we just might not be the first advanced global society on earth. Many people seem to dislike that concept. It is not so farfetched.



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 05:19 AM
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According to bible, this is how temple should have looked:

college.hmco.com..." target='_blank' class='tabOff'/>

[Image source: Institute for Religious Research]

Not even close to pyramid shape, and very different building style.


[edit on 1/4/06 by vietifulJoe]



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 07:10 AM
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Can I just ask someone to validate these issues for me:


The Diameter of the Earth
The Center of the Landmass of the Earth
The Distance of the Earth to the Sun
The Knowledge of PHI and the ability to use it in structures
The Knowledge of True North within .005 degrees


The Diameter of the Earth - as the earth is not a sphere, what is meant by "diameter"? And what one of these "diameters" is purported to be shown by the pyramid? And how?

The Center of the Landmass of the Earth - again, how is this purported to be encoded? Also, given recent imagary of graviational variation of the earth's crust (there's even a thread on here with pictures of this), modern understanding of the relative densities of landmasses have changed. What modern techniques have been employed to calculate this "centre of landmass"?

The Distance of the Earth to the Sun - the orbit of the earth is elliptical. The distance varies considerably throughout the year. I don't know what the assertion means therefore.

The Knowledge of PHI and the ability to use it in structures - do you mean pi? If not, can someone tell me what Phi is? if you mean Pi, it must be remembered that Pi is not really a number in its own right, so to speak. It is a mathematical way of saying that the circumference of a circle is directly proportional to its diameter. We could count all our numbers in base Pi (instead of base 10) and we would magically see no mystery in this.

The Knowledge of True North within .005 degrees - this is actually very easy to calculate... Observe the rising and setting points of a star on a flat horizon (say the sea), draw lines pointing at these points. The angle between those points then needs exactly bisecting to give true north. (The stars rotate in the sky about true north: so if you pick stars which go highest in the sky the angle gets larger, and if you draw the longest lines possible, then your measurement is more accurate). Incidentally, I find it more believable that ancient cultures were more fascinated by the "point aroud which the sky revolves", rather than in the rather abstract knoweldge that this corresponds to something we now know is an axis of rotation of the earth.

Anyway, given that these assertions have been made on here a few times, can someone point me to the answers?

Also, in passing, I noticed that earlier there was talk about the name of Cairo being Babylon. Not sure what that has to do with Jerusalem, as Babylon was by ancient Baghdad... However, I will point out that the name "Babylon Fort", "Babylon-in-Egypt" or "Babylon-on-the-Nile" was given to the Persian (later Roman) garrison founded some miles away from Giza, before Cairo (founded in 969AD to the north of the old garrison) even existed. This was in the sixth century BC at the earliest and certainly not from as long ago as the pyramids most conservative age estimates would demand. In fact, the site of Babylon is on the opposite side of the river from Giza, a number of miles to the north of Giza. I don't see it has anything to do with pyramids whatsoever.

touregypt.net...
touregypt.net...
ce.eng.usf.edu...

Cheers.

Rob.



posted on Jan, 4 2006 @ 07:29 AM
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The Knowledge of PHI and the ability to use it in structures - do you mean pi? If not, can someone tell me what Phi is? if you mean Pi, it must be remembered that Pi is not really a number in its own right, so to speak. It is a mathematical way of saying that the circumference of a circle is directly proportional to its diameter. We could count all our numbers in base Pi (instead of base 10) and we would magically see no mystery in this.


Ah, sorry, I have checked this out now. Ratio of height to base.
And checked out the derivation of Phi (golden ratio).

Both claims examined interestingly here: www.math.washington.edu...
and here: www.jimloy.com...

Cheers.

Rob.

[edit on 4-1-2006 by d60944]



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