It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Scotland Vote No In Referendum – Selfish, Scared People, Well Done!

page: 12
42
<< 9  10  11    13  14  15 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 10:20 AM
link   
a reply to: shauny
Interesting thoughts.
I note that 17% of Scotlands population are aged over 65, and 66% are aged between 16-64 (www.scotland.gov.uk...) and a poll of 2,047 voters found that 73% of the over 65's voted no www.bbc.co.uk... - When you include the 16% of Scots who didn't care enough to bother voting, it doesn't appear to add much strength to your argument.

You are bitter about losing, I understand that, but the Scots made the choice, not the Welsh, N.Irish, or English, the Scots. Unlucky they didn't vote the way you wanted them to.

edit on 21-9-2014 by grainofsand because: To fix link issues




posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 10:31 AM
link   
a reply to: midicon

I feel for you, but according to mostly everybody on this thread, most of Scotland wanted to continue being in this union. I think it is just good ol' fashioned brain washing, which is what colonial powers do to better sway the opinions and emotions of the population; ,make them think that they are nothing without the great Britain. Once a financially solid, content middle and upper class is established, and healthy amount of brain twisting, they then think that this is the best.

But people here are informing me that Scotland decided to join up. But what i am asking is, was it the Scottish rulers who wanted this, or did the majority population of Scotland want this? My assumption is no, based on my belief that no sovereign nation would want to be subject to or have there policies decided by another.

If the Scottish population really did want to be under the Empire, then that is something Scot's must address with Scots.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 10:34 AM
link   

originally posted by: douglas5
There is talk of a 25 billion cut to the budget in Scotland , and cut's to the free travel of pensioners and the heating allowance , i bet they never knew that when they voted


The travel and heating allowance cuts have been mentioned before and are not limited to Scotland, are you trying to suggest otherwise? They have also not been written into anything that has been passed through parliament, are you trying to suggest they are a done deal?



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 10:39 AM
link   

originally posted by: bigman88
a reply to: midicon



no sovereign nation would want to be subject to or have there policies decided by another.



You have described perfectly what has indeed happened to The Native American Indian Nations.




posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 11:12 AM
link   
a reply to: bigman88

Nope, it's good old fashioned democracy, the majority won, the majority said No. It's not about most of this or most of that...45% said Yes 55% said No...only a 10% margin, but still the majority was No



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 11:27 AM
link   

originally posted by: bigman88
a reply to: midicon



I feel for you, but according to mostly everybody on this thread, most of Scotland wanted to continue being in this union. I think it is just good ol' fashioned brain washing, which is what colonial powers do to better sway the opinions and emotions of the population; ,make them think that they are nothing without the great Britain. Once a financially solid, content middle and upper class is established, and healthy amount of brain twisting, they then think that this is the best.



But people here are informing me that Scotland decided to join up. But what i am asking is, was it the Scottish rulers who wanted this, or did the majority population of Scotland want this? My assumption is no, based on my belief that no sovereign nation would want to be subject to or have there policies decided by another.



If the Scottish population really did want to be under the Empire, then that is something Scot's must address with Scots.





I agree with you about the brain washing. If you had watched this whole referendum play out it was there for all to see.

Scotland joined up...lords and nobles doing what lords and nobles do. They gambled all their money, lost it and in order to survive sold the people down the Swannee. We still have a house of commoners and a house of lords. That word lord or even the idea of monarchy is an insult to any right thinking human being.

Many Scots, myself included want to unhitch ourselves from the UK war wagon, as you can see we are up against it. It is not only the establishment we have to contend with but the opinions of our fellow countrymen. I can't complain about that, everyone is entitled to their own opinion and vote but I can say that this was not run the way it should have been.

There is also an element of sectarianism which has raised it's ugly head. We don't in general have a problem with it although every year we have to suffer the nonsense of the bigoted orange marches. I was brought up in that environment and was one of those children dressed in white with an orange sash that would march behind the bands. I say that lest anyone thinks I have some catholic agenda. This referendum has made me realise that they are another problem we will have to deal with in an independent Scotland.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 11:46 AM
link   

originally posted by: midicon
I agree with you about the brain washing.


So, let's get this straight shall we.

Scotland is part of a long-standing union of nations. People in Scotland and the rest of the Union, (England, Northern Ireland and Wales) are not really that different, if the British Social Attitude Survey is anything to go by. In other words, you average Scot is pretty much the same as your average Devonian or Northumbrian.

The majority chose to stay in the UK after a long-winded process. The "yes" camp's argument was essentially "you are Scottish, but different, and therefore should be separated".

The Scottish are intelligent people, just like the Devonians and Northumbrians, yet those who voted "no" are brainwashed. In fact, could it be that the brainwashing is the other way, that of attempting to define the difference when there is none.

Interesting that the Shetland and Orkneys were really against independence in the votes. If anything, these people don't want to be Scots!

Regards



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 12:09 PM
link   

originally posted by: midicon




I think it is just good ol' fashioned brain washing



Come on midicon, that is uncalled for. Salmond and Sturgeon promised milk and honey but when asked for the details couldn't give them but continued with the same rhetoric with no substance. I've applauded the people of Scotland for having such a huge voting turnout, as it happened more people who voted had a different opinion as to how Scotland (and the UK) should go than you did - why are they brainwashed and not the Yes campaign? I could talk about the socialist (and former socialist militant) members that probably did the Yes campaign more harm than good in trying to persuade people how to vote but why bother?

The Orange order marches are bigoted, no getting away from it. Having said that, read through this thread alone and you will see as much sectarianism from either side which can make uncomfortable reading. Perhaps a lot of voters worried about what that would mean for any future Scottish government.

Democracy won. Isn't that the message?
edit on 21-9-2014 by uncommitted because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 12:24 PM
link   
a reply to: paraphi

I don't know what that was all about or what it was supposed to straighten out. I don't think for a minute we are any different in any way. In fact if we had a different system of government in the UK or at least one that was fit for purpose I wouldn't dream of independence. I want the society I live in to change for the better, An independent Scotland was the opportunity of a lifetime. I feel cheated, not because of the outcome as I can see the positives of the union and why people would support it, but by the way the whole thing played out. You may not agree...that's your call.

I don't like borders...I am not patriotic.

Regards Midicon



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 12:41 PM
link   
a reply to: uncommitted

Hey nice move, quote me a quote I never made. I watched most of the debates, I didn't see any milk and honey in fact I don't think they went the right way about anything. I haven't had any interest in politics before and watched this play out in front of me. I can only call it as I see it. No matter what anyone says, there was mainstream media bias and spin. That bothers me even if voting yes was a bad decision it is our call to make and we deserved better.

Regards Midicon.

edit on 21-9-2014 by midicon because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 01:22 PM
link   
Member Soloprotocol has a good thread about the "brainwashing" via media.
Now, sure, the newspapers spin any old story to suit themselves. BBC & other TV outlets pick up on that, the nightly "press previews" on tv rolling news and the morning "what the papers say" spots give everyone their twice daily dose of what Murdoch, the Barclay Brothers & Rothermere want us to think.

But the relentless onslaught against the Yes campaign at the hands of the media, the corporations and "the establishment" was in a different league altogether. And that's something that Farage and some in the Conservative Party need to take into account as they psyche themselves up for a referendum on continuing UK membership of the EU. Because those same arguments used to scare Scots into voting No will be the same ones employed to keep you guys in the European Union ... huge "British" banks moving their headquarters to Berlin, Nissan Sunderland employees being told their jobs are on the line as production is planned to move to the Czech Republic ... you get the picture.

There's an interesting "Boycott the BBC" campaign underway just now in Scotland, because of their perceived bias. TV licences being cancelled all over. You don't need one if you only watch "catch up" on iPlayer, ITV Player or 4od, seemingly so consider if you really want to pay £145 for live tv when you can simply watch an hour later instead.

And to those who think the issue of Scottish independence has been settled for a generation ... I saw someone today wearing their "45" badge on their shirt. And little 45 icons are appearing all over social media. I think it's a neverendum that's been unlocked, you now have a whole generation of politically clued up young Scottish people who simply won't take No for an answer. What is their saying ? A no vote is simply a deferred yes vote ? Long runs the fox.

As to the Orange Order. I was put in my place last year by Soloprotocol and kept my mouth shut since . I disagree a bit with some in this thread though. The Orange Order I think is wholly misunderstood. I don't think they're as bad as made out. I know very many who actually voted Yes, they defied their own traditions and are now trying to reconcile their consciences.

It's a different type of protestant vote which won it for the No's. It wasn't the tiny number of BNP/Loyalist type idiots like those in Glasgow on Friday night who won it for the No's, it's the "bowling club blazer" people, the rotary club types, the once a week little beedy beedy female Church of Scotland types who won it for the No's. Older, pensioners, works pensions "cos they worked so hard" types, faultless, always someone else to blame, lace curtain twitching know it alls. I know very many of them, insufferable people.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 02:18 PM
link   
a reply to: LeBombDiggity

Great post. I already mentioned the idea of boycotting the BBC a while back.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 02:30 PM
link   

originally posted by: midicon
Great post. I already mentioned the idea of boycotting the BBC a while back.


Yes, the BBC reports did ask some awkward questions and the Corporation provided a platform for those who has a different worldview to the nationalists.

Regards



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 02:46 PM
link   
a reply to: shauny

What a remarkable week it has been, indeed.

I believe the UK came out stronger and better. It takes a lot of nerve to allow the people of a Nation to vote against the Union - but the Union allowed it and had the Scots voted "Yes", the Union would have accepted it. That is democracy, that's how it should be.

But I'm very happy the Scots are still part of the Union. What really matters to me is that they are in the Union voluntarily and by majority vote. Also that the voices of the "yes" voters have been heard - they were loud enough and their numbers were plenty. Now, the UK government has no choice but grant all Nations more power to govern themselves.

I believe that this is a good example of the way Europe should cooperate: decentralised government if possible, no European "Super state" but a federation of cooperative states, each maintaining its own identity whilst working together tightly - but voluntarily. People need a local identity to survive in a world that became small in one generation, thanks to the Internet.

Hooray for the Scots - and I for one am happy you're still part of the UK and Europe.
edit on 21-9-2014 by ForteanOrg because: dyslexia struck again.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 02:49 PM
link   
a reply to: LeBombDiggity

Feel free to clear up any misunderstanding I may have about the Orange order. I am pretty limited in my viewpoint and can only speak from my own perspective. I think you are probably correct though in the protestant demographic you describe that counted.

I have no real issues and the the only reason this whole subject came up is how it has affected the independence referendum. At the end of the day people are entitled to vote as they please.

Regards Midicon.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 03:19 PM
link   

originally posted by: bigman88

originally posted by: TinfoilTP

originally posted by: SubTruth

originally posted by: TinfoilTP
Awesome.

Sanity reigns supreme.

The yes'ers over there can go to the admonished kiddies corner with the Ron Paulers from over here, dunce hats for all.




I notice your posts kinda push a pro PTB agenda........Just saying. It is what it is. Personally I think it is crazy to have a outside force determine your families future. It is also crazy to say well at least they are giving us some more rights.




Nobody has ever shown proof there is an all powerful PTB, so it is just faith that holds that paranoid new age religion together. The existence of God will be proven before anyone ever proves there is a PTB.


Aquick google search will show you various quotes by Rockefellers, JFK, Kissinger, Soros, various politicians, government officials and businessmen of various countries that a powerful global elite controls all vital materials for livlihood on this earth.


All that proves is that there are rich people, everyone knows there are rich people and always have been even in ancient times. Preach the faith brother, point to the obvious and pretend to be amazed.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 04:06 PM
link   

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: douglas5
There is talk of a 25 billion cut to the budget in Scotland , and cut's to the free travel of pensioners and the heating allowance , i bet they never knew that when they voted


The travel and heating allowance cuts have been mentioned before and are not limited to Scotland, are you trying to suggest otherwise? They have also not been written into anything that has been passed through parliament, are you trying to suggest they are a done deal?


are you trying to suggest that it is not going to happen maybe they will forget about the cuts



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 04:23 PM
link   
a reply to: destination now

If you look at the total population registered to vote and those who voted Yes, only 38% of Scots voted for independence. 62% said No or simply couldn't be arsed to vote, which can be assumed they weren't that bothered about independence otherwise they'd have got off their bottoms...
edit on 21/9/14 by stumason because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 04:38 PM
link   
a reply to: stumason
Yeah total fix lol



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 05:29 PM
link   

originally posted by: ForteanOrg
a reply to: shauny

What a remarkable week it has been, indeed.

I believe the UK came out stronger and better. It takes a lot of nerve to allow the people of a Nation to vote against the Union - but the Union allowed it and had the Scots voted "Yes", the Union would have accepted it. That is democracy, that's how it should be.

But I'm very happy the Scots are still part of the Union. What really matters to me is that they are in the Union voluntarily and by majority vote. Also that the voices of the "yes" voters have been heard - they were loud enough and their numbers were plenty. Now, the UK government has no choice but grant all Nations more power to govern themselves.

I believe that this is a good example of the way Europe should cooperate: decentralised government if possible, no European "Super state" but a federation of cooperative states, each maintaining its own identity whilst working together tightly - but voluntarily. People need a local identity to survive in a world that became small in one generation, thanks to the Internet.

Hooray for the Scots - and I for one am happy you're still part of the UK and Europe.



Most awesome post that I have seen on this debate...You deserve 1000 stars for that.




new topics

top topics



 
42
<< 9  10  11    13  14  15 >>

log in

join