It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

A Realistic Afterlife

page: 3
16
<< 1  2    4  5 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 05:10 AM
link   
a reply to: LesMisanthrope
'After' life is an assumption. 'After' life is a concept. There is no one who can say what life is like 'after' death (death is also a concept). No one has seen death or experienced death.
When making up stories (assumptions and concepts) about 'after' life and buying into the ideas and beliefs, one must examine closely what 'life' is 'now'.

The first assumption is that there is a 'you' separate to 'life'. Also, there is an assumption that there is something other that what there always is.
Right now (as always) there is an appearance.
Who can honestly say that the appearance (the presence of radiant light) will ever stop?


edit on 20-9-2014 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 05:32 AM
link   
There is only ever this.............
and this constantly appears different.

edit on 20-9-2014 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 07:04 AM
link   
Ah, LesMis, many of your threads are a compelling read. However, maybe not the reason for which you strive. Peppered with condescension and indignation, the phrase "drama queen" comes to mind. However, I realize your need for attention may be subconscious, and surely one as knowledgeable as yourself realizes this arises from the ego's subconscious feelings of never being enough.

Anyway, there are literally mountains of research and evidence of some kind of afterlife, beginning with the records of highly and advanced civilizations such as the Egyptians......and on up until the Chinese. Ever heard of "The Wheel of Life"? Of course this is related to Buddhist teachings....

Ever hear of lucid dreaming? This is a fact. Your mind/soul can take you places and have you do things with no assistance from your physical body, how is this so different from life after death?

Of course I also laugh at the morbid descriptions of life after death given by some religions, the aims are so obvious they are laughable, the contradictions so plain. People in fear are easier to control. Also, if God is all powerful, he must have invented hell, the devil etc if they exist. But how can God be compassionate and merciful at the same time?

Here is a link to some after death accounts:

After death accounts

some more articles on the Astral Plane:

Astral Plane

Enjoy. Of course make the most of your physical life, but do not fear the following non-physical one.



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 10:46 AM
link   
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

You are in for one hell of a surprise when you die my friend. Do you have any experience with ayahuasca, D m t, meditation or astral projection?

I'm guessing no, you've been educated by western academia therefore denying any truth to the afterlife you may come across.



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 11:24 AM
link   

originally posted by: booyakasha
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

You are in for one hell of a surprise when you die my friend. Do you have any experience with ayahuasca, D m t, meditation or astral projection?

I'm guessing no, you've been educated by western academia therefore denying any truth to the afterlife you may come across.


Yes, I agree wholeheartedly. There is ample evidence our physical body is only one component of our sevles, and the core of who we really are can be quite independent of it.



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 01:25 PM
link   
a reply to: PhotonEffect

I’ve had a life-changing waking life. What I think about in hibernation has little to no effect on my waking life. In fact, it is the other way around— I’ve had a dream changing life. Perhaps one needs to get out more if they rely on dreams as sources for their profundity.

I never said religious belief enforces the likelihood of having an NDE. I’m not sure where you’re coming to these conclusions, nor why you’re so adamant on twisting what I said. The data shows that anyone under the stress of bodily shutdown can have these experiences, regardless of life and culture. What I said was that neurobiology has an affect on these experiences, i.e. that neurobiology could explain the meeting of loved ones, memories flashing before the eyes, white lights, out of body experiences etc as the dying of neuronal connections. Is this out of the question for you? Is this invalid? It is the interpretation of these experiences that is influenced by the culture and religion. Interpretations of near death experiences does not equal proof of the afterlife.


Another study (6), taking a cross-cultural perspective on the near death experience phenomena, indicates that although there are common themes, there are also reported differences. According to this study the variability across cultures is most likely to be due to people’s interpretation and verbalizing of such events through the filters of language, cultural experiences, religion, education and their influence on their belief systems.


Horizon Research

Obviously coming close to death has an profound affect on the nearly deceased. That is not in question. Like I said, read the accounts of near-death experiences. There is a large database of them for your perusal. I have a feeling you’re limiting yourself to the accounts that peak your biased interest.

NDREF



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 01:25 PM
link   
a reply to: booyakasha


You are in for one hell of a surprise when you die my friend. Do you have any experience with ayahuasca, D m t, meditation or astral projection?

I'm guessing no, you've been educated by western academia therefore denying any truth to the afterlife you may come across.


What you do with your Narcotics and what you do while sleeping is your key to the universe? There are plenty of people on the streets that share your enthusiasm.



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 01:26 PM
link   
a reply to: PlanetXisHERE


Ever hear of lucid dreaming? This is a fact. Your mind/soul can take you places and have you do things with no assistance from your physical body, how is this so different from life after death?


So what you dream while sleeping is reality? No, what you dream while dreaming is a dream.

I did laugh out loud at the diva comment. Very good. I cannot disagree.



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 03:11 PM
link   


What you do with your Narcotics and what you do while sleeping is your key to the universe? There are plenty of people on the streets that share your enthusiasm.

If you got the key during your altered state ( sleep ). Then it wouldnt not necessary apply to your "physical" universe. What I've gathered over the years, have lead me to the point, that. There are parallel universes and during sleep you tune in to another "you".

Any form of, motion, is created by the shifting of consciousness.



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 03:30 PM
link   
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

So, you are claiming that your position observes only evidence, or the lack of, to support nothing after death of body, but doesn't actually require evidence to support that position. (because you already know any other possibility is just silly, right?) You also point out how those supporting the reality of something afterwards, are guilty of not thinking logically, except you arrive at that conclusion without using any logic in determining this yourself, only assumption. So, you are already breaking the rules of the scientific method by not showing anything except conjecture and assumption to support your position, while at the same time condemning conjecture and assumption being used by the other side, and relying on them entirely to support your position.

This happens because you are allowing a predetermined bias, (Your mind tells you: but it has to be true!) and the associated emotional attachments that comes with that bias, to override the need for substantiation based on a belief system. (You just know it can't be possible). (Hey, everyone has had thoughts like this before! It's okay!)

Come on, admit it, I don't think you can squirm out of it this time.


PS, were you aware that your belief system requires even MORE faith than those who believe something else waits beyond?



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 03:51 PM
link   
Well written…and holds water on the assumption that the human body is only a machine…and when the cpu spits it - computer and operator are 'dead'.

Research (anecdotal) is just that…anecdotal. Research (scientific) is the measurement of perceivable phenomena…you'd want to be confident that the machinery has a calibration able to register…indeed, parts of our own 'machinery' is flawed in exactly that way (with permutations and combinations of levels of flaw)…a spectrometer can register frequencies of light - but cannot give me the experience of 'red', or describe it in any adequate way, the way a red-seeing person can - and fail miserably in exactly the same way. A 'machine' that can do this would bolster my confidence that red exists to be experienced…not just 'able' to be measured. Being 'dead' to the perception of it (machinery-wise) does not necessarily discount its veracity as real.

When comparing strict machinery to strict machinery, you cannot be wrong.

A99



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 10:39 PM
link   
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I'm sorry but I strongly disagree with you as do many others. ((Most of us who disagree, do so because we've experienced something paranormal))

Who are you to say there is no after life? Yes you may have a nice writing style but that doesn't mean you are an expert on the subject & are all knowing.

For all we know, because everything is made of energy/atoms, we are the universe acting out every single possibility.

Or

Our souls go through a long journey(many lives) to achieve purity. Think of a water filter, water will keep going through the filter until it is pure & so will our souls. Each time our soul is in a vessel (and that doesn't mean that each time we'll be in a human vessel on Earth), we are there to learn important lessons in order to eventually achieve purity.

To me, pretty much anything and everything is possible & until there is proof to say otherwise, that is what I believe.
((I'm an Empirical Agnostic))



posted on Sep, 20 2014 @ 10:48 PM
link   

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: PlanetXisHERE


Ever hear of lucid dreaming? This is a fact. Your mind/soul can take you places and have you do things with no assistance from your physical body, how is this so different from life after death?


So what you dream while sleeping is reality? No, what you dream while dreaming is a dream.

I did laugh out loud at the diva comment. Very good. I cannot disagree.



I think you have an incorrect understanding of and fixed and narrow definitions of dream and reality. lucid dreaming is not dreaming per se. were you really once 5 years old or was that a dream???



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 12:03 AM
link   
a reply to: LesMisanthrope

If there is a afterlife.
Big if there.
But, I would imagine it would be like this.






edit on 21-9-2014 by HarbingerOfShadows because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 12:34 AM
link   
It's reasonable to assert death is organic decomposition, and to eliminate all supernatural or unsupportable explanations. If I'm watching TV and it shuts off on its own and does not turn on again, it's natural to assume it's broken and can either be repaired or junked. Why should I invent further explanation or conspiracy? There's no reason to suggest God or a spirit broke my TV, is there?

Why do we need further explanation than what we see around us? If a bug or a rat dies and doesn't have an after-life, as most assume, why should we? Do dophins or monkeys or pigs have afterlives? A number of them have been shown to be comparatively cerebral. For example, Magpies have passed the mirror test. What of all the non-human life on Earth? Our study of evolution and biology has uncovered a veritable amount of explanation for all we see, including ourselves.

We should not be anymore separate from all we see than any other creature. What reason is there to think we're not of this world or of this universe? How do we not follow its rules?

I am an animal. I will die like they do. And if they have an afterlife then I probably do too. If they don't then I probably don't either.

Someone told me the fear of death stems from the fear of life. I'm not exactly sure what it means, but I wanted to share.
edit on 21-9-2014 by jonnywhite because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 12:39 AM
link   
a reply to: jonnywhite

It's reasonable to assert death is organic decomposition, and to eliminate all supernatural or unsupportable explanations. If I'm watching TV and it shuts off on its own and does not turn on again, it's natural to assume it's broken and can either be repaired or junked. Why should I invent further explanation or conspiracy? There's no reason to suggest God or a spirit broke my TV, is there?


I disagree.
The reasonable assumption would be neutral.
Lack of proof is not proof of lack.

Are you talking about an afterlife or what causes death?


Why do we need further explanation than what we see around us? If a bug or a rat dies and doesn't have an after-life, as most assume, why should we? Do dophins or monkeys or pigs have afterlives? A number of them have been shown to be comparatively cerebral. For example, Magpies have passed the mirror test. What of all the non-human animals on Earth? Our study of evolution and biology has uncovered a veritable amount of explanation for all we see, including ourselves.


Who's to say they don't?
If souls exist at all why would any life be excluded?


We should not be anymore separate from all we see than any other creature. What reason is there to think we're not of this world or of this universe? We don't follow its rules?


Tell that to mankind's ego.
Which even manifests it's self in his science.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 12:48 AM
link   
Noticed a flaw i didnt cover. Although i do like to view to memories of someone as a sort of copy or part of them, which ive hear elsewhere before, but you failed to, in your rejection of someone seeing someone as in an afterlife, take into account a persons personal view and flawed memories do not perfectly represent them to begin with thus your own memories are a dishonor by your view as they can be somewhat fantacy in their own way. Yes it is better to think of someones life rather than death but if you dont beleive in an afterlife who are you insulting? Who would take offense? Its only particularly insulting if it highly violates their own beleifs thus offending their family or friends possibly although this complicated so there is no single one way to look at or deal with a person being gone.


[snipped]
edit on Sun Sep 21 2014 by DontTreadOnMe because: off topic material directed at a member was removed



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 03:47 AM
link   
 


off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 02:34 PM
link   
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed


So, you are claiming that your position observes only evidence, or the lack of, to support nothing after death of body, but doesn't actually require evidence to support that position. (because you already know any other possibility is just silly, right?) You also point out how those supporting the reality of something afterwards, are guilty of not thinking logically, except you arrive at that conclusion without using any logic in determining this yourself, only assumption. So, you are already breaking the rules of the scientific method by not showing anything except conjecture and assumption to support your position, while at the same time condemning conjecture and assumption being used by the other side, and relying on them entirely to support your position.


On the contrary, there is plenty to support what happens to us after the death of body. We can literally watch what happens to the deceased from the moment of death until the moment it reaches nothing but bones. So no, sorry, it is not assumptive nor unreasonable of me to believe this is what happens to us after death. It is not conjecture, for this process is repeatable and predictable every single time. Why do you think we embalm the deceased?

Is it conjecture to say we bury or incinerate our deceased? It isn’t. We bury our dead. This is literally what happens to us when we die.

I think the problem is you will not except this evidence, as I pointed out in the very first paragraph of the original post. Why? Because you have somewhere assumed otherwise.




This happens because you are allowing a predetermined bias, (Your mind tells you: but it has to be true!) and the associated emotional attachments that comes with that bias, to override the need for substantiation based on a belief system. (You just know it can't be possible). (Hey, everyone has had thoughts like this before! It's okay!)

Come on, admit it, I don't think you can squirm out of it this time.


Actually, by speaking about visible phenomenon and occurrences, I am allowing reality to speak for itself. There is nothing predetermined nor biased about accepting what any one of us can repeatedly observe and describe. It’s as easy as me pointing out the facts of the matter, and I can do this without speaking. Therefor it is quite apparent your refutation of brute facts is a predetermined bias based purely on assumption or indoctrination, and that in fact you are the guilty party when it comes to the very same emotional attachment to your bias as you so explicitly tried to condemn me for. But its ok; we are all hypocrites.


PS, were you aware that your belief system requires even MORE faith than those who believe something else waits beyond?


I wasn’t aware of that. I would be honored to hear your reasoning.



posted on Sep, 21 2014 @ 05:43 PM
link   
a reply to: Sabiduria


I’m sorry but I strongly disagree with you as do many others. ((Most of us who disagree, do so because we've experienced something paranormal))

Who are you to say there is no after life? Yes you may have a nice writing style but that doesn't mean you are an expert on the subject & are all knowing.

For all we know, because everything is made of energy/atoms, we are the universe acting out every single possibility.

Or

Our souls go through a long journey(many lives) to achieve purity. Think of a water filter, water will keep going through the filter until it is pure & so will our souls. Each time our soul is in a vessel (and that doesn't mean that each time we'll be in a human vessel on Earth), we are there to learn important lessons in order to eventually achieve purity.

To me, pretty much anything and everything is possible & until there is proof to say otherwise, that is what I believe.
((I'm an Empirical Agnostic))


There is nothing empirical or agnostic about your either/or propositions.

First, no one is all-knowing. Refusing to listen to an argument because the arguer is not all-knowing is like not riding a horse because it isn’t a unicorn.

Second, if anything is possible, then there is a pink elephant orbiting Jupiter. Saying so is like shooting an arrow in the opposite direction of the intended target in the possibility you might get a bullseye.




top topics



 
16
<< 1  2    4  5 >>

log in

join