Navy removes destroyer's top three commanding officers mid-deployment

For an, "investigation into the command climate"
"On June 19, Boatswain’s Mate Seaman Yeshabel Villot-Carrasco, 23, of Parma, Ohio died aboard the guided missile destroyer while it was underway in the Red Sea. Her death, of non-combat injuries, is being investigated as a suspected suicide."

Strange indeed that the navy would pull the command crew mid deployment. Stranger still, it's not the first time the brass had to be replaced on this ship...

"It is also not the first time that the top three commanders of the Williams were relieved of command at the same time. In 2009, skipper Cmdr. Paul Marquis and Command Master Chief Timothy Youell reassigned to administrative duties at Commander, Naval Surface Force Atlantic (CNSFA)"

Navy removes destroyer's top three commanding officers mid-deployment

I don't know what it could mean. Probably nothing, but who knows. Either way, I thought it was an interesting article that others here may want to know about.

Ah probably a sex scandle brewing IMHO......They shouldn't put women aboard ships...

a reply to: InvaderSkich

fortuantly - I have only had the unpleasantness of one green suicide - but the CO , adjutant and chaplain asawell as key NCOs all came out of the inquiry badly

I suspect its pretty standard for the USN to look at key personel and ask WTF were you doing while one of your subordinates degenerated to " suicide is the only way out "

a reply to: InvaderSkich

For sometime now there was been a 'HUGE' anti/suicide awareness campaign ongoing throughout all branches.
you can't pick up a base newspaper or watch a military News without getting some kind of suicide is bad message thrown in your face...
"Your not alone, talk to some one, there is help"

pretty standard stuff right...

Well my experiences command officers are not... fluffy...touchy-feely...new age...
Half hearted attempts at suicide have been used as a 'Get Out' dodge forever... well before I came along and long after I'm gone too.

So with that in mind it's quite likely this Boatswain’s Mate, went to her CO's
"I think I might want to kill myself?"
and rather than get sent to the right people... she was dismissed, made fun of, told to tough it out...
that's what normally happens, even if's not openly talked about.

If it was in fact a suicide your likely right. But all they say is "suspected suicide" I'm sure these things do happen to people who can take the isolation of sea life, but on the other hand I wouldn't be surprised if they only called it that because they didn't want the bad press of saying she was murdered by her own shipmates. The article goes on to say,

"A Navy official who spoke on background to the Navy Times said there is a separate investigation being conducted by the Naval Criminal Investigative Service into a liberty incident that occurred in the Sixth Fleet area of operations, but declined to divulge further details."

So who knows...

a reply to: InvaderSkich

It's always a suspected suicide until the coroner and NCIS complete the investigation. Once they are done with it, then they'll determine whether it was or wasn't.

It's quite possible that the BMSN in question may have reported problems (harassment, etc), of which were being ignored by the chain of command, or were not being investigated properly.

If the CO, XO and the ship's Master Chief knew about these reports, but nothing was being done (IE investigations, reassignments, etc), then they failed in their responsibility to the command structure and chain of command.

As such, yes, they have to be relieved and replaced. Even in mid-cruise.

Ignoring possible problems with your crew on a ship is a very irresponsible thing to do (not to mention stupid). You need your crew in top shape, physically and mentally while underway. People can get killed by mistakes because they are too distracted or too depressed to be doing what they are suppose to do (many, many, MANY ways to get seriously hurt or killed onboard a warship).

On my last ship, after we came back from the first Persian Gulf War, we had a new chief assigned to our division. He was a total.....well, let's just say words to describe him would get me banned from ATS.
Myself (as LPO of the division) and the other junior chiefs expressed our concerns to our CMC (we had people in our division talking about knocking this man over the head and dumping him over the side late at night).

The CMC took what we had brought to him very seriously. He spoke to the XO and CO. Next thing we knew, our new chief was moved from our division and became the "Assistant to the Assistant Weapons Officer.

Any ex-Navy on here will know what that meant. Basically he was in charge of no one for the rest of the time on the ship.

A good CO, XO and CMC will keep an "open door" policy. You have problems and for some reason you feel that reporting it officially won't work, or you feel that you are being attacked because you did, will take the time out to let you simply come talk to them, privately.

I've seen many issues resolved because of having an "open door".

originally posted by: eriktheawful
It's quite possible that the BMSN in question may have reported problems (harassment, etc), of which were being ignored by the chain of command, or were not being investigated properly.

If the CO, XO and the ship's Master Chief knew about these reports, but nothing was being done (IE investigations, reassignments, etc), then they failed in their responsibility to the command structure and chain of command.

As such, yes, they have to be relieved and replaced. Even in mid-cruise.

Ignoring possible problems with your crew on a ship is a very irresponsible thing to do (not to mention stupid). You need your crew in top shape, physically and mentally while underway. People can get killed by mistakes because they are too distracted or too depressed to be doing what they are suppose to do (many, many, MANY ways to get seriously hurt or killed onboard a warship).

On my last ship, after we came back from the first Persian Gulf War, we had a new chief assigned to our division. He was a total.....well, let's just say words to describe him would get me banned from ATS.
Myself (as LPO of the division) and the other junior chiefs expressed our concerns to our CMC (we had people in our division talking about knocking this man over the head and dumping him over the side late at night).

The CMC took what we had brought to him very seriously. He spoke to the XO and CO. Next thing we knew, our new chief was moved from our division and became the "Assistant to the Assistant Weapons Officer.

Any ex-Navy on here will know what that meant. Basically he was in charge of no one for the rest of the time on the ship.

A good CO, XO and CMC will keep an "open door" policy. You have problems and for some reason you feel that reporting it officially won't work, or you feel that you are being attacked because you did, will take the time out to let you simply come talk to them, privately.

I've seen many issues resolved because of having an "open door".

Also as a former sailor myself, I fully agree. When I read a liberty incident is being investigated, I assume she was harassed and possibly raped or had a scuffle with a shipmate, and, knowing the stereo type mentality of BM's (aggressive and sexual) it is not a far assumption.

originally posted by: InvaderSkich
Strange indeed that the navy would pull the command crew mid deployment. Stranger still, it's not the first time the brass had to be replaced on this ship...

It is quite common.

a reply to: AllSourceIntel

knowing the stereo type mentality of BM's (aggressive and sexual) it is not a far assumption.

While it is stereotypical, there is a reason that they were called knuckle-dragging 'deck-apes'.... but I speak from 30 years ago. I wonder what they call Boatswain's Mates now?

a reply to: HardCorps

Not to make fun of it, but I used to say, "If I have to attend another mandatory anti-suicide briefing, death by power point and video presentation (The same on all the time) I was going to commit suicide right then and there just to prove them wrong." The only problem was I could not come back and say, "See I told ya!"

One of the problems in the military, and it is justified, is that Command see some one who is possibly suicidal as potentially homicidal as well.

Briefings aren't going to help, and only the rare Chain of Command will either. It takes friends and family to help the individual and all to often, even they fail to see the signs.

a reply to: butcherguy
It is still the same.
...

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
a reply to: InvaderSkich

fortuantly - I have only had the unpleasantness of one green suicide - but the CO , adjutant and chaplain asawell as key NCOs all came out of the inquiry badly

I suspect its pretty standard for the USN to look at key personel and ask WTF were you doing while one of your subordinates degenerated to " suicide is the only way out "

Well the saying is the Captain is responsible for everything on his ship.

So whatever happened he has some blame.

It must be a cursed ship that is doomed! They took a female or more on board and blah blah blah.

Anyways, thanks for posting!

originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: AllSourceIntel

knowing the stereo type mentality of BM's (aggressive and sexual) it is not a far assumption.

While it is stereotypical, there is a reason that they were called knuckle-dragging 'deck-apes'.... but I speak from 30 years ago. I wonder what they call Boatswain's Mates now?

It's still "Deck-Ape".

I was a "Twidget" or "Push-Button" (electronics).

You still have "Snipes" (engineering types), "BB Stackers" (Gunners Mates), "Spooks" (Crypto guys or intelligence), "Nuke" or "Glow-In-The-Darks" (nuclear engineers), "bubble-head" (submariner), "Skimmer" (surface sailor), "air-head" or "airdale" (brown shoe navy or aircraft carrier sailors).

Tradition of these nick names goes back really far. Doubt any of them will change for a very long time.
Traditions are hard to break

originally posted by: stirling
Ah probably a sex scandle brewing IMHO......They shouldn't put women aboard ships...

Really? The presence of women is the cause of the sex scandal problems? Maybe we shouldn't put women on Earth, and we wouldn't have this problem at all. Anyone who believes that it's the woman's fault that men disrespect them is in a deep state of mental failure.

There has always been a mariners tradition that says if a women is aboard then the ship is doomed.

originally posted by: eriktheawful
It's still "Deck-Ape".

I was a "Twidget" or "Push-Button" (electronics).

You still have "Snipes" (engineering types), "BB Stackers" (Gunners Mates), "Spooks" (Crypto guys or intelligence), "Nuke" or "Glow-In-The-Darks" (nuclear engineers), "bubble-head" (submariner), "Skimmer" (surface sailor), "air-head" or "airdale" (brown shoe navy or aircraft carrier sailors).

Tradition of these nick names goes back really far. Doubt any of them will change for a very long time.
Traditions are hard to break

I am a spook myself ... haha, glow in the darks, common sense evades them.
...

originally posted by: AllSourceIntel

originally posted by: eriktheawful
It's still "Deck-Ape".

I was a "Twidget" or "Push-Button" (electronics).

You still have "Snipes" (engineering types), "BB Stackers" (Gunners Mates), "Spooks" (Crypto guys or intelligence), "Nuke" or "Glow-In-The-Darks" (nuclear engineers), "bubble-head" (submariner), "Skimmer" (surface sailor), "air-head" or "airdale" (brown shoe navy or aircraft carrier sailors).

Tradition of these nick names goes back really far. Doubt any of them will change for a very long time.
Traditions are hard to break

I am a spook myself ... haha, glow in the darks, common sense evades them.
...

oooo.

I forgot one: Cranks.

Short for Mess Cranks. Mess Management Specialists (the cooks on the ships).

a reply to: eriktheawful

I was a hole snipe.... Main propulsion engineering.

originally posted by: stirling
Ah probably a sex scandle brewing IMHO......They shouldn't put women aboard ships...

Maybe we shouldn't put men on board either. I seem to recall my BFF in service telling me about a small scandal about "the ether bunny", a navy seamen who would ether his roommate and rape them; they would kick the roommates out for being gay - this was back in the 1990s. He was only found after an investigation of the room in which the ether was discovered in his foot locker and through interrogation he admitted he had done it.

Don't play the gender card.