Lee County Florida schools opt out of common core testing.

I saw this just now in my Facebook feed.

n a 3-2 vote Wednesday, the district became the first in Florida to say no to Common Core testing that 45 states and the District of Columbia voluntarily adopted in 2010.

IMO this is a big deal. I think it's great they are standing up to the system and saying NO.

I'm not a fan of common core. I see my friends deal with it with their kids and it's just crazy especially the math part. They took basic math and made it very difficult and just stupid. I was helping a friends son years ago with his math. I was so confused at how he was taught to do basic subtraction and division. His mom said it was the new way they do it, little did I know this was common core math. I showed him how I was taught and he did just fine yet with common core the poor kid was in tears.

I do not understand why they came up with this common core method of teaching. It seems like it just stresses everyone involved out from the teachers to the parents, students and school period. I was never taught common core and we were never tested like kids are today. So much is put on testing and a specific curriculum that teachers have little time to actually teach. I know people who work in the schools and they all say things are so different compared to 10+ years ago when they started. All of them have complained how they don't feel like they are really getting a chance to truly teach. Is this a result of common core or something else? I do not know personally because my son isn't in school. What I do know is that I don't know one person who likes it, teacher or parent.

What are your thoughts and/or experiences with common core.

Lee County Florida opts out of common core

a reply to: mblahnikluver

The shortcomings of common core will be readily apparent as students move from elementary to higher levels of learning. Unfortunately, it will be very difficult to correct the mistakes of this 'experiment' on the subjects.

Rote memorization of basic math and speed of calculation are not trivial aspects of what a student needs to achieve to be accepted in society. Unless, someone believes evidence of retarded learning is a measured level of 'success'.

It's all pointless anyways. The real issue with our school isn't the curriculum. It's that early skills really need to be taught and reinforced at home. This is compounded by the culture in education of teaching to the test and the culture in society of valuing education only for utility.

The common core is definitely a step in the wrong direction though. They seem to be using a lot of unnecessary visuals and organized strict systems to about having to actually teach. The goal seems to be perfecting methods of teaching math to avoid any learning and focus on memorization and regurgitation.

I work as a tutor primarily in math and spend most of my time trying to explain concepts to which the response is "but my teacher said I had to do it this way". This would be fine if the teacher could teach the material but they rarely can. It's nearly impossible for teachers now. Between the severe lack of options for reasonable discipline and never being allowed to grade fairly or affect a childs path of learning it's the whole system is now designed to leave teachers and students equally annoyed and disillusioned.

I couldn't agree with you more if I tried to. My daughter is a junior in high school right now and I am hoping against hope that we can keep common core out of our district at least long enough for her to graduate. It needs to be done away with for good.

I put up this thread a bit ago - www.abovetopsecret.com...

I don't want people to go there to post, but there is a link to a video in my OP that I think people should see regarding math in common core. It will show in detail how doing something simple has now been turned into something a lot more difficult.

I just sat there staring at it the whole time, wondering WTF???? It would have never occurred to me to teach anyone how to add like that. There are many steps added that are just complicating something simple.

I don't understand it and I don't like that they are "testing" it on our children. What happens if they blow it big time? Nobody will care. What's done will be done and better luck next time. That is insane and coming from the government... Not a surprise at all.

a reply to: Kangaruex4Ewe

I had posted on your thread actually but there was no followup (my post was at the bottom of page 3). The way being taught in that video is much better for mental math. It's more accurate and it's quicker. There are a few additional steps involved in learning but it has a very high payoff. I'm old enough to have not been taught that way, I came to the realization of how to do it on my own when searching for ways to do math better. Trust me, it works. The usual group of people I hang out with are Computer Scientists, Mathematicians, and Bankers, I can compute practically any problem we come across in my head (most often, card probabilities in the games we play) faster than they can, and I'm usually faster than them getting out their calculator too.

What's being taught has a very high payoff for any of those students that will ever go into a STEM field.

I don't know if all aspects of common core are good, I truthfully haven't looked at it in depth as I only have so many hours in the day. From what I've seen though like this math system I'm all for it.

Also worth pointing out in your thread. The two of us who did some example math that way both highly recommended the method. The others said no because they didn't understand it. In the video itself, it was dismissed by people who admitted to barely passing their math classes, if at all. Surely they know what they're talking about then.

Anyways, the biggest flaw I've seen with this math program is that it has some messy dependencies. In order to add you need to know how to subtract. In order to multiply you need to know how to add, subtract, multiply, and in some cases divide. If there's anything to criticize right now it's that we don't teach the methods that function independent of each other, and then tie it together for better performance. Instead it looks like they just throw it all at students at once.

Check out Charlotte Iserbyt's the Former Senior Policy Advisor for the U.S. Department of Education, articles/videos/etc. Such as- Common Core Takeover, to see her take on what's going on with Common Core.

a reply to: Aazadan

Aazadan,

I see your point. It would be wrong for me to disagree with you. But, why don't we just go back to making kids learn to use an abacus?

So who here has actually had a child doing Common Core?

I would really like to hear a first hand account.

Yeah, to hell with 'Common Core'. I think of the poor bastards who have little to no opportunity to educate themselves. Common Core is way too structured, needs more space for 'free thinking'. But instead, why not feed and support those in need around the world? Oh wait, we're in the middle of WW3 right now. Order more guns.

a reply to: Snarl

An abacus is just an analog calculator. It's still relying on a machine for an answer rather than being able to determine it for yourself. The idea behind math isn't to learn how to get the answer, the answer is helpful of course but the purpose behind math classes is to learn how to set up your own equations to solve problems. Calculators aren't always trustworthy either, they like to round numbers off rather than express them outside of decimal notation.

Lets take one of my fields which is 3d modeling. Routinely I need to be able to use a mixture of geometry and trigonometry in order to make a polygon fit the needed dimensions. Alternatively when I'm programming a game (perhaps using that 3d model I've built) I need to be able to apply many forms of math to make the program run, more to make it run efficiently, and then still more to handle things such as the collision and light reflection of art assets like the 3d model.

Calculators are great tools but it's important to know how to perform math without them because the temptation with a calculator is to get the answer, which completely circumvents the process you need to use to get there. I admit that it adds more difficulty to their lives in the short term, but the payoffs will be immense later in life.

a reply to: Annee

My children are in "Common Core" right now, not to sound old LOL ...... but back in my day 7+7=14, simple, plain and easy ...... today 7+7 = 7+3= 10 and 10+4=14

I think it just makes things too complicated, IMO ....... especially with parents who were taught one way!

I think if "common core" is going to be implemented it should start when a child enters school, not after they've been there and taught to do things one way, then suddenly are taught a "new improved" way!

originally posted by: WhoDat09
today 7+7 = 7+3= 10 and 10+4=14

I'd have to know the reasoning behind that to make a judgement.

I'm raising my 6 1/2 year old grandson, who has some autistic behaviors, but taught himself to read at 3. The big issue seems to be that his brain is always in gear.

His school is Common Core. At least I'm at the beginning.

Already having problems on where he fits. He was in an assistant kindergarten last year. They're making him repeat mainstream kindergarten with an aide. He's already bored. Taught himself to read, but they're giving him sight words like To, The, And. Had a little pow wow today. Now, he is getting spelling words and seems much happier.

a reply to: WhoDat09

The biggest issue with teaching math from what I can tell is a loss of general number sense since children aren't being exposed to numbers. The best possible way to learn math is to understand numbers before you do any addition subtraction etc. Parents don't involve kids in shopping and I've seen a single lemonade stand in something like the last five years and I drive an average of 50 miles a day through suburbs (only at times with no school in session). Parents pay with credit cards and use calculators for the rare math perhaps to figure out a tip. Very few are shown or taught any value of math. That's what you get when the middle class is crunched. FYI, rich kids are doing fine. They have maids and nannies to free them up and hire people like me all the time. Middle class mom has to work
And hope the school does it. They aren't

a reply to: Aazadan

What you are saying is true about common core. I taught myself to do math this way also. The problem is two fold, the parents and teachers don't understand and they are pushing kids too fast.

They are introducing complex math concepts to kids before the kids understand the basics, which are known as "math facts".

Memorizing "math facts" is the only real key to math. The higher level thinking they are teaching is nice but not necessary. Pushing the kids past the basics before they have mastered the basics will leave them always 2 steps behind.

The education system is getting better at placing readers in the correct level reading groups. And the AR testing is helping the teachers and parents see the results.

It seems like they rushed to implement common core math without understanding If the teachers, parents, or students were ready.

The school system needs to approach math in the same way it is reading, allowing kids to move at a slower or faster pace bassed on ability.

90% of the world, If not more will never use math past basic 6th grade math, so why are we pushing it so hard? For most people they will be using a program or calculator that solves the problems for them.

The concepts they are introducing in common core are for higher level thinkers. I wouldn't start introducing these methods until 6th or 7th grade, when the mind is better equipped to deal with more abstract thoughts.

If we need to make 12 × 6,
10×6, + 2×6. For a child to find the answer we have lowered their ability.

If we teach a child to find the answer the traditional way in 4th and 5th grade, by the 6th grade we could introduce higher level thinking as the problems get more complicated.

Math facts need to be memorized, just like sight words.

For all of you who think we need more homework or more parent involvement, I'm sorry I can't agree. What we need is no homework. Why should I have to go to work, my child go to work/school just to come and do homework? Why are we rushing kids so fast that they need homework? A report, a project sure. But why math and reading homework everyday? Why is a child who is behind his peers a problem? Why not just let the slower child learn at a slower pace, with goals that are more obtainable?

My children go to school, do homework, soccer practice, dinner then bed. Why can't they just come home and be kids for a few hours?

No money for music, no money for the arts, but plenty of money to teach our kids worthless knowledge that will likely never be used in thier professional careers.

What they are teaching in common core is better seen as a step towards algebra, but for some/many kids it might be too much.

originally posted by: sacgamer25
What you are saying is true about common core. I taught myself to do math this way also. The problem is two fold, the parents and teachers don't understand and they are pushing kids too fast.

I can get behind this point. Like I said, this style of math has some dependencies. In order to know how to add you must already know how to add and subtract. In order to multiply you need to be able to factor. Essentially each type of math also requires knowing the next step up. That said, it is very much worth knowing. Maybe second graders don't need to know it, but by the time someones in lets say 7th grade they should. The problem comes in where it's going to be taught. I can point to homework volume as evidence, we simply don't have enough hours in a school year in order to teach students everything we believe they should know and the body of knowledge is growing annually.

Personally I like the system in the Netherlands... they don't treat school as a general body of knowledge but rather an enabler to help a student learn about what interests them. Part of me wonders if that's what we should be moving to. Rather than trying to make everyone reach a specific standard we let each student come away from school with the basic skills for the fields that interest them. While I disagree with the percentage, as you pointed out there's a portion of the population that will never use beyond 6th grade math... so why are we teaching that to them? Wouldn't they make better use of those school hours by learning about their field?

The main disadvantage I see to this system is that it's unreasonable to expect students to know what field they want to work in early in life and if they go down one path it may become difficult to change years down the road.

a reply to: Aazadan

So, how do you teach this from the outset?

If it depends on knowing how to do other skills, has dependencies, as you say, then it is pretty much impossible from the outset. I can't run before I learn to walk, and if walking is dependent on my knowing how to run, then I'm going to be SoL.

Now, there is a time and place for learning alternative strategies and approaches, but the alternatives that depend on you knowing the basics are not the place to start.

originally posted by: WhoDat09
a reply to: Annee

My children are in "Common Core" right now, not to sound old LOL ...... but back in my day 7+7=14, simple, plain and easy ...... today 7+7 = 7+3= 10 and 10+4=14

I think it just makes things too complicated, IMO ....... especially with parents who were taught one way!

Actually, it's teaching principals to shortcuts in mathematics. I intuitively learned these shortcuts growing up, and was able to rapid process arithmetically because of it. I think this is more of a "right brain" (don't like using that term usually) approach.

Laying the foundation for learning these principals will help out as the mathematics become more complex. Because of all these "shortcuts", I was able to crunch large numbers by simplifying them in my mind, and rapidly as well.

a reply to: tavi45

Your post remined me when I went to get my GED. I was always bad in math and was worried I would not pass. I was told at the summer school that they had one of the best math teachers in the school system who could teach properly. I had trouble with Algebra. The teacher had me learn a formula - I didn't want to just learn the formula, I wanted to understand why the formula worked. I asked this A-1 teacher, why does it balance? Why do you have to do this, balance each side to arrive at the answer. The A-1 teacher told me she didn't know! I was urged to learn the formula and be happy with passing the test. Since I didn't understand the math and she could not teach me, I choose to quit and did not get my GED. I never looked back, turns out I never needed that GED. This was around 1986.

I still don't know the answer and I don't gave a rats arse. I'm retired at 46. All I do now is enjoy my house and play video games.

originally posted by: pl3bscheese

Actually, it's teaching principals to shortcuts in mathematics. I intuitively learned these shortcuts growing up, and was able to rapid process arithmetically because of it. I think this is more of a "right brain" (don't like using that term usually) approach.

Laying the foundation for learning these principals will help out as the mathematics become more complex. Because of all these "shortcuts", I was able to crunch large numbers by simplifying them in my mind, and rapidly as well.

Thank you for explaining.

originally posted by: pl3bscheese
Actually, it's teaching principals to shortcuts in mathematics. I intuitively learned these shortcuts growing up, and was able to rapid process arithmetically because of it. I think this is more of a "right brain" (don't like using that term usually) approach.

Laying the foundation for learning these principals will help out as the mathematics become more complex. Because of all these "shortcuts", I was able to crunch large numbers by simplifying them in my mind, and rapidly as well.

You're joking right?

Common core is not about teaching principals to shortcuts in mathematics...it is about trying to tech shortcuts AS principals of mathematics,

The US is not the first to try it, and they are not the first to fail at it.