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Race Issues Raised When Oakland Firefighter, Kids Detained By Police Officer

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posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 04:35 PM
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Source with Video


OAKLAND (KPIX 5) — A black Oakland firefighter has filed a complaint with the Oakland Police Department after he and his young kids were detained by a white police officer outside the station where the firefighter worked.

It was 10:45 p.m., after a recent Raiders game. Veteran firefighter Keith Jones and his two sons, ages 9 and 12, were walking back to their SUV at Station 29. A fire crew responding to an emergency had forgotten to close the garage door. Jones went in to make sure everything was secure.

As Jones walked out, he said a police officer, responding to a possible burglary in progress, yelled “Don’t move, put your hands up.”

“And his hand is on his gun. He was crouched, he was low, and he was basically in a shooting stance,” Jones said.


This must have been horrifying for these little children. This cop should be hung from the highest streetlight as an example!
Or, should he


Another Source


There’s only one problem with Jones’s story.

The officer in question was wearing a body cam. The rookie police officer was wearing a body cam that caught the entire thing on tape. It proves one thing. Jones was not telling the truth about his altercation with the police officer. In fact, some people might say he’s a liar.

Is this what things have come to – blatant lies that could end a man’s career and livelihood told just to push a race-baiting narrative?


There is always another side to the story, be it good or bad. I guess those body cams everyone wants the cops to wear really do work.




posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:02 PM
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I think the firefighter really was worried about his kids. They were scared. But I didn't see or hear anything that would lead me to believe there was any racial issue at all. And maybe the cop did have his hand on his gun. I think he should in that situation...

So, what did the firefighter lie about?



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:08 PM
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a reply to: retiredTxn

Here is the police video that was released on the incident! Other than the initial put your hands up, the rookie cop seemed reasonable and even apologized to the kids.....




posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:22 PM
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originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
I think the firefighter really was worried about his kids. They were scared. But I didn't see or hear anything that would lead me to believe there was any racial issue at all. And maybe the cop did have his hand on his gun. I think he should in that situation...

So, what did the firefighter lie about?


If you go to the 2nd source, the 2nd video is the officers body cam. In this video, the officer starts telling the kids it's ok, relax, I'm sorry. Basically, everything Jones said he should have done but didn't. Jones blew the whole situation out of proportion, and then filed a false complaint against the officer. Jones threw the racial twist in while talking to the news, but it backfired on him.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:31 PM
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originally posted by: retiredTxn
In this video, the officer starts telling the kids it's ok, relax, I'm sorry.


No, he doesn't. I watched both videos. The first thing on the body cam is "Put the bag down. Get your hands up! Get your hands up! Turn around!" Then the firefighter says who he is and the cop says, "Stay right there. Don't move." Then the cop proceeds to check the firefighters license, at which time he tells the kids, "It's all right". It's not until 1:45 in the video that he says "relax, it's OK, I'm sorry".

I think the cop acted 100% fine, but what I want to know is what did the firefighter lie about?



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:44 PM
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Seemed professional to me. Ran the plate, match the ID. The news clip said something like 'He should have apologized' but it sounded like he did.

If the firefighter is concerned about the station, why is he surprised the officer is after a call was made about the station.

Just a load a crap to stir up more.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:52 PM
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While the cop appears to have been doing his job in a reasonable manner, you cant help but imagine what it must have been like for the firemans children when a gun was pointed at them! If someone pointed a gun at my children I'd be more than a little bit annoyed! So I can understand the guy being pissed.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:54 PM
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a reply to: VoidHawk

The complainer said 'his hand was on his gun', not that it was drawn.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 05:57 PM
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I see NOTHING wrong committed here, the LEO secured the scene, checked plate and ID, apologized and everything was okay.
This FF is in the wrong; plain and simple.

From the OP's source:



Cameron also said the officer should have apologized to Jones and his children.


He DID apologize when everything was ok



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 06:00 PM
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The problem isn't whether he followed protocol or not. The real problem is that anyone can cause someone else huge issues by calling the cops and in a lot of cases the suspicion is triggered by race.

I went to visit a friend the other day and a black guy in a van pulled up and went into the alley ahead
Of me. I couldn't stop myself from worrying even though I assumed he was going into a nearby business with legitimate reason. I'm very non racist and I couldn't help it. The difference between me and a racist person is that a racist person would call the cops immediately. Or maybe take matters into their own hands (George Zimmerman anyone?)



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 06:32 PM
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originally posted by: HomerinNC
Cameron also said the officer should have apologized to Jones and his children.


Yeah, Cameron is the police trainer. The firefighter didn't say anything about apologizing... What did the firefighter lie about?



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 06:44 PM
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originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: retiredTxn
In this video, the officer starts telling the kids it's ok, relax, I'm sorry.


No, he doesn't. I watched both videos. The first thing on the body cam is "Put the bag down. Get your hands up! Get your hands up! Turn around!" Then the firefighter says who he is and the cop says, "Stay right there. Don't move." Then the cop proceeds to check the firefighters license, at which time he tells the kids, "It's all right". It's not until 1:45 in the video that he says "relax, it's OK, I'm sorry".

I think the cop acted 100% fine, but what I want to know is what did the firefighter lie about?


Jones tried to turn it into a race issue by stating “I think they view black males as a threat,” and going forth with a complaint against the officer. His statements that his children were traumatized, and their perceptions of police have changed due to this incident. He stated the officer should have apologized, not realizing the body camera was on and recording. Stating “And his hand is on his gun. He was crouched, he was low, and he was basically in a shooting stance,” Jones said. A shooting stance would require the gun be out of the holster, not in it.

The officer did what he was supposed to do, but Jones attempted to make it racial, and even filed a complaint against the officer. Now, he is not even available to comment, much less apologize to the officer. He saw a payday, and it is coming back to haunt him. Do you think the Fire Chief would have contacted the Poli9ce chief, if he felt this situation was as simple as it turned out to be?

ETA: Cameron stated to Da Lin he did feel the officer should have apologized to the fireman and his children. Where do you think he got this gem from? Jones statement to the reporter. Turns out he did apologize, at least 3 times.
edit on 9 16 2014 by retiredTxn because: Add some.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 07:01 PM
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I think, for once, there is an example of racism in this story. But, it wasn't the cop who was being racist. The cop was just responding to a call. The 911 caller was probably being racist. Nevertheless, this guy is an idiot for calling the police racist.
edit on 16-9-2014 by smithjustinb because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 07:55 PM
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When the policeman saw the two young children, perhaps he should have realized the firefighter was not a burglar.........one does wonder if it had been a white guy with two young children, would he have reacted the same?



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 08:07 PM
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originally posted by: frayed1
When the policeman saw the two young children, perhaps he should have realized the firefighter was not a burglar.........


Right. I lived in a neighborhood at one time where a lady and her kids where breaking into houses. Doubt if it is the only case.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 08:35 PM
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originally posted by: frayed1
When the policeman saw the two young children, perhaps he should have realized the firefighter was not a burglar.........one does wonder if it had been a white guy with two young children, would he have reacted the same?


Yep, kids are not ever used as lookouts...and we all know white guys don't commit burglaries.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 09:01 PM
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False accusations against the police happen all of the time.

I was the target of an ironic false accusation last year.

I had a parent at the high school complain that I stated that she was a horrible mother and was setting a bad example for her child because she had tattoos.

The funny thing is I never met the woman in person, nor did I know she had tattoos. I only had a brief conversation over the phone to inform her that I had reason to believe her son was using drugs. That was all. I just felt that I had an ethical obligation to share the information with her.

Oh and if she would of actually met me in person she would of known that I have absolutely nothing against tattoos seeing that both my arms and legs are covered in them.

That was one of many false complaints I have had to experience in my career. It is really disheartening.

The officer in this specific situation did absolutely nothing wrong and handled it all very well.
edit on 16-9-2014 by TorqueyThePig because: (no reason given)

edit on 16-9-2014 by TorqueyThePig because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 05:54 AM
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a reply to: TorqueyThePig
This is why every single interaction with the public needs to be recorded clearly. To protect against scumbags who shouldn't wear the badge, and to protect the few decent ones against unfounded BS like this case here.



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 09:07 AM
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originally posted by: retiredTxn
Jones tried to turn it into a race issue by stating “I think they view black males as a threat,” and going forth with a complaint against the officer.


That's not a lie. That's his opinion. I don't think there was a race issue, but not everyone agrees with me. That doesn't mean they're lying.



His statements that his children were traumatized, and their perceptions of police have changed due to this incident.


His children were crying with their hands up. They have made statements. They very well could have been traumatized, thinking their father was going to be shot. That's not a lie.



He stated the officer should have apologized, not realizing the body camera was on and recording.


He did not say that! Cameron (a police trainer) said that later in an interview. Read your own story.



Stating “And his hand is on his gun. He was crouched, he was low, and he was basically in a shooting stance,” Jones said. A shooting stance would require the gun be out of the holster, not in it.


That's not necessarily true. What does a firefighter know about a "shooting stance"? The officer could have been crouched with his hand on his gun and the firefighter thought that looked like basically a shooting stance. That is not a lie.



The officer did what he was supposed to do, but Jones attempted to make it racial, and even filed a complaint against the officer. Now, he is not even available to comment, much less apologize to the officer. He saw a payday, and it is coming back to haunt him. Do you think the Fire Chief would have contacted the Poli9ce chief, if he felt this situation was as simple as it turned out to be?


I agree that the officer did what he was supposed to do. 100%. And Jones thinks it was racial. That's not a lie, that's his opinion. Filing a complaint is his right as a citizen, whether he's right or wrong, and I think he's wrong. But he didn't lie about anything. Just because he thinks there's a racial element doesn't make him a liar. Your source claims that Jones told a "blatant lie". Just because we disagree with his opinion doesn't mean he lied.



ETA: Cameron stated to Da Lin he did feel the officer should have apologized to the fireman and his children. Where do you think he got this gem from? Jones statement to the reporter. Turns out he did apologize, at least 3 times.


You're assuming that. It's not a fact at all. You don't even know that Cameron talked to Jones. Cameron is not even involved in the case. Again, Read your story.

Jones did not lie. He has his opinions about WHY things happened (and I disagree with him), but he didn't lie.
edit on 9/17/2014 by Benevolent Heretic because: Change Smith to Jones



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 09:12 AM
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originally posted by: frayed1
one does wonder if it had been a white guy with two young children, would he have reacted the same?


And I think that's Jones' position. If it had been a white guy with two kids, would the cop have acted the same? I think so.

I personally think the cop SHOULD have acted just as he did. Especially a rookie cop should be extra careful and use maximum caution in approaching a situation alone. I think the cop did perfectly, but I don't like the idea of calling Jones a liar just because he has an opinion.



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