In light of the Adrian Peterson fiasco, I would like to discuss corporal punishment of children.

originally posted by: VoidHawk
A poster above mentioned the word "Lazy"
I think thats partly the problem, it takes time and effort to explain to a small child about bad behaviour but most parents these days dont have the time, they're too busy recovering from their slave job, so its easier for them to give the child a smack.
I think the main cause of hitting children is because the parents were smacked when they were children.

A child does not need to be smacked, or even placed on a naughty spot, they just need parents who understand them!

If you don't have time to work, where does your child go? Around other children and influences, right?

originally posted by: XTexan
There is a fine line here, currently I agree that that spanking is not right for my child. But he is young and so its an easy decision for my family. But the question for me is, when to use spanking? Its such a delicate balance, but I believe your child should know that physical discipline can and will be used against them.

Poor example: Your 6-8 year old child is acting "disorderly" and talks back to you when you attempt to address their behavior, you calmly put them in timeout. Problem solved... at home.

What happens if the the next day the child is approached by a police officer and he acts the same way? Some LEOs will act rationally, some will not. Plenty of threads on here of children that age being tased or worse.

How exactly do you teach your child that out in the real world improper behavior can a will result in physical violence being used against them if they have never experienced physical discipline at home by you?

Its a good point but actually if the home discipline is done correctly they aren't going to be in a situation where they are being belligerent to an authority figure. They will know right from wrong and how to behave in a civilised society because you will have taught them without the need to harm them. Like an above poster said, I think half the problem is time. You have to be pretty dedicated to educating your child, and it is extra work. I have no doubt that it might work for some parents, but if there is a way of avoiding it, I would choose that path every time. Also, I think some parents think it is down to schools to discipline their kids. Big mistake.

a reply to: GrantedBail

There is abuse (both physical and psychological), and then there is discipline which teaches a child there are consequences to their inappropriate actions. I don't believe in abuse, but I do believe in teaching a child about consequences - and that those consequences are not always good.

My father spanked me with a belt - but he did not abuse me. I learned from that - and never once felt like he didn't love me, because I knew he would do anything at all for me and I knew he loved me more than anything in the world. He praised my good actions and disciplined me for any bad ones - the discipline ranged from a talking to, grounding, loss of privileges or a spanking - depending on the severity of the inappropriate action.

I think as parents we must teach about consequences, both good and bad - and levels of consequences as well. I think through all of it that we can show and express our love of our children. It's a matter of the effort you put into parenting.

But no discipline, no teaching of consequences is not good as it produces children who become adults with a sense of entitlement, and no understanding of consequence to one's actions. As parents we are slowly preparing and teaching our child to live as adults in the real world, and all of what we do has an effect upon the adults our children become.

a reply to: Briles1207

If a child hits or otherwise consistently repeats bad behavior, it means there is no consistency with the discipline in that child's home.

When something is inappropriate, it is ALWAYS inappropriate - no matter what. This is also where many parents fail.

Many parents will scold their child when they are finally irritated with something, and not before. This usually means that the child often doesn't really understand why they get in trouble for a behavior sometimes, and not others. Therefore, they have no real way of connecting the discipline to the inappropriate action - but rather, connect the discipline to the parent's frustration with them.

The key in parenting, is always and consistently correct inappropriate behavior - when you first see it. No matter how tired you are, no matter what. Discipline should never be put off - it should be immediate to the behavior, and it is ALWAYS better to correct your child BEFORE you get frustrated - and when you start getting frustrated, you are the one who needs a minute of time out!

Otherwise, you will simply raise a child who consistently repeats inappropriate behavior and doesn't truly understand it's the behavior itself which is wrong.

The consistent parent on the other hand - has to discipline less often, because when the limits were tested the limit was always on spot, therefore, the child learned, and learned quickly concerning the specific behavior.

I think parenting nowadays has gone to crap. Pepple no longer want to deal with kids or teach them now kids get drugged up. Somehow that is more acceptable than spanking.

There is a big diffrrence between dicipline and abuse. Compare a hundred years ago to now. Not only would parents spank but schools and teachers would have a paddle they would use. You know they had just as many kids that nowadays would be classified as ADD and drugged.

They listened though and paid attention because they learned of negative consequences if they didn't. There was far less child and school violence then and none of the gang problems in schools we have now.

I'm not saying we should go back tp paddling in schools or that anyone ever should paddle. Just saying spanking or hitting doesn't work or causes more problems is lazy and wrong.

In general I think parenting all around lately is bad. A smack on the butt can work wonders but you have to make sure they know why it is happening. I'm sure a lot of people know the old saying "this will hurt me more than it hurts you".

Well when raising a child you learn how true that is when you have to dicipline, There are many ways to dicipline, just because someone doesn't spank it doesn't mean their way is automatically better and vice versa.

One poster said it best when saying they spanked their son I believe but their daughter only needed a good scolding. No two people are the same and no two kids are the same. Dicipline has to be in a form that gets through to them. For some spanking is the best for others it may not be.

a reply to: Briles1207

I think another parental mistake many parents make when using discipline to teach concerning consequence to action - is that there is not as much positive consequence for positive action at the same time. (or the other way around, no discipline for the bad)

When there are both positive and negative consequences for actions, then the child has a choice before them as they age. The choice being what kind of consequence do they want, the positive and happy consequence, or the bad consequence. As a result of that choice, when they grow and realize more about the choice, they will choose for the positive result over the negative.

I used to love it when my dad would tell me he was proud of me or when he would do something special with me, even just curling up together to see a television program. As I grew, I strove for those positives and worked hard at doing those things that made him happy with me and proud of me - and worked just as hard at avoiding those things that didn't. For my kids those were the best moments of their lives too - according to them. They both strove for the positive - and worked at avoiding those negatives just to hear those words, "I'm so proud of you". I do think they can be overused, but with just the right balance, it works wonderfully.

And makes for a great adult!

originally posted by: GrantedBail
I am not going to respond to you anymore. Clearly you have issues that haven't been addressed. I wish you the best of luck in your recovery.

a reply to: OptimusCrime

You were awfully quick to call him an idiot and then paint him as psychologically damaged as a counter point to this image of yourself that you are trying to portray as well-rounded and sanguine. You were defensive and clearly spoiling for a brawl from your OP. You went on the offensive first with the first person that was not playing your game the way that you think it should be played and escalated the circumstance with name calling. You put out bait and then blasted the first person who came along and took it, although I agree that his response to your initial taunt has been excessive and I don't agree with his entire stance.

This entire pattern indicates a manipulative and not terribly introspective personality at least. I'm not sure how you handle your children, and if you are fair with them and never raise a hand then good for you but you have been pretty darned manipulative and abusive here. I will say that people that are so desperate to prove at the expense of others that they are better are generally just sneakier about their abuse. In fact, so sneaky that they will never be able to recognize that they are abusers themselves. Most abusers are excellent at setting up public circumstances to convince others that there is no way they could ever do anything so cruel and it also serves to convince the abuser that what they do behind closed doors isn't so bad. Emotional and psychological abuse still counts and can have more pervasive and difficult to deal with effects, long term, than physical abuse because the application is often so insidious. You are not above reproach or examination because you don't hit your kids.

a reply to: GrantedBail

This whole argument doesn't even apply to probably a lot of posters in this thread. I can tell who is not a parent by their replies! You have no way in knowing how you will react to a child breaking the rules. You have to maintain a good head.

I was beaten as a kid, not excessive but spanked when I did wrong, which was a lot! I learned valuable lessons from my dad, I have no problem in spanking my daughter when she does something wrong, but there is no abuse. In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with spanking a child...They not only learn lessons but also respect you for it, whether it is fear or whatever the child knows that you are the boss and they should listen to what you say.

If you don't reprimand your kids, they will not think there is trouble in life for any decision made no matter what. I have seen this with many of my friends, they never think they can get in trouble because they never did growing up. You learn great lessons in right and wrong as a child, so you need to discuss with your kids what they did wrong and why they were spanked. This will make them listen out of respect for their parents.

There is absolutely no reason to abuse a child, that is horrible parenting....But there is a need for spanking in my opinion.

originally posted by: OptimusCrime
My mom beat my butt, and by butt I mean my actual butt, when I did something wrong.

There's a big difference between a good (loving) spanking on the butt and a father holding one arm and "chasing" the kid around in circles with the belt in anger and leaving bruised and bloody welts on the legs that last for days. Welts that school mates see and ask about. And when you answer them, you see this sadness and sorrow in their eyes that makes you want to curl into a ball and die...

Not that being a bad kid would excuse such behavior, but I was a good kid. I don't even remember WHY I was beaten. That's how effective it was. All I remember is fearing my father. And to this day (I'm 57 today) when my husband removes his belt, the sound scares me.

Yeah, there's a big difference...

I don't know how I feel about corporal punishment for kids. I don't think I could do it. And I don't think it's necessary. Fortunately, I don't have to decide because I don't have any... But I have a feeling, I'd be against it because of my personal experience. I'm still getting over what my father did to me. If it had been a good butt spanking, I think I may feel very differently about it.

I'm fifty years old, and I was spanked as a child when I fubar'd excessively. I always deserved them, and I knew it at the time.

Actions have consequences. That is the lesson that a spanking teaches.

There is a difference between a spanking, and a beating. A beating teaches only fear.

There's a thin, thin line between the two, however.

Would I ever spank a child? No. I don't think it's necessary in most cases. But then the kids in my life never even approached the point where I thought it was ever necessary. Usually they figured out rapidly that I'm a lot easier to live with when they behave.

If someone else decides that a spank is necessary? That's fine.

a reply to: GrantedBail

I grew up with spanking. As I've stated before, I think it's fine. However I've been fortunate enough to never have to resort to something like that with my child.

Off topic in an on topic kinda way: Back in the late 80's when I was in second or so grade, I got sent to the principles for not doing my work in class. Well, I sat there doing my work when all of a sudden I hear tremendous crying with a "whack-whack-whack!" followed by a "Please sir! I'll be good!".

Shortly after, the vice principle came in with a big paddle and a red face asking me if I was next. I think that crosses the line. Use your hands, and the punishment should be left to the parents. This is something I'll never forget, primarily because I thought my butt was next! Haha.

a reply to: GrantedBail

I think there is a difference between chastising a child to beating them. I think this is wide subject and has lots of opinions. Mine is this.. I had a smacked bum if I was misbehaving as a child and i would do them same to my children. Its not because I am a bully or bad person. Its because there are consequences of actions.. please understand that my children are not beaten and they do not live in fear of me or their father and when i speak of smacking bums its not a regular occurrence but as with me and my sisters when we were children its used as a shock to the system, harsher than the normal punishment of being sent to room or taking away games etc is sometimes needed. I will give examples:

My daughter takes food into the living room when I have asked her to only eat in the dining room... this warrants in my house a telling off being sat away from everyone else for a while.
My daughter is disrespectful to me or another adult.. she sits alone for a while or is sent to her room for while.
My daughter is mean and hits her sister who retailiates. They are seperated and sent to their bedroom and arent allowed to watch tv that day.
My daughter hits a child at school with a book for no reason and then is disrespectful and wont apologise. no tv for 3-7 days.
My daughter (shes 7 by the way) lets go of my hand and almost get hit by a car when she runs across a small road..she gets a smacked bum... (please bear in mind that she understands the dangers)

punishment should be relevant to the situation, in this case the reason i would smack her bum is to yes, scare her, I want her to never contemplate doing it again because if she does the consequences could be deadly. I would not do it becuaue i want them to fear me but because i love her and don't want anything awful to happen, i want her to be safe.

I do not hate my mum for doing what she did. I am a good person and it did me no harm other than teach me to respect authority and think of consequences before I act.


***apologies for length of this and also any mistake i made punctually, I was typing in a hurry, I felt a point should be made.

It's too difficult for stressed parents in these times to separate their anger and rage from discipline. If the parent is driven by a moment of anger and rage to hit their child then the end result is child abuse. Most often it can be easily identified as such when the parent later finds themselves dealing with deep feelings of guilt.. If you feel it was wrong afterward, then it was.

NEVER ever attempt to discipline your child if you are stressed, or enraged. Nothing good will come from it if you do.

I can't believe that some people still think It's beneficial to beat children.

There has to be a better way...

originally posted by: OptimusCrime

originally posted by: Briles1207
a reply to: OptimusCrime

Well that's my point, If your child is hitting other kids, surely that stems from that child being struck by their parent? So you cant beat them to tell them beating is wrong as it was your fault in the first place ha-ha.

Its a minefield granted.

Also, most parenting is passed down the generations so I imagine its pretty difficult to break the cycle.

We have a little circular mat in our house. The naughty spot. Sounds lame. But what's amazing is because we used it from such a young age, no matter how much our 2 year old cries and shouts and moans during a tantrum, he will not move from that spot. (in the beginning we just kept putting him on it, even if it was 50 times in a row) until he realised that he had to stay on it for 3 mins (a long time in his world lol)

Now we just say "Do that again and you're on the naughty spot".

Whats even better is sometimes if he knows hes done something he shouldn't he goes and sits on it without us saying anything haha!

See, it doesn't prove the child is being struck. More kids hit other kids because they don't understand hitting is bad. When they get hit for hitting, they know it's bad.

I'm with you and understand what you are saying...
Not all kids can be handled with just a scolding and there are different means of discipline

As far as kids that hit others, it does NOT mean it's from their parents hitting them

Example, our friends have 3 rug-rats, yes unruly pain in the azz rug-rats!!

One person they hit on is their grandfather, which instantly pisses me off, they'll hit him in the stomach, break his glasses and NO they don't spank them
They have a problem with telling the kids no and haven't a clue to what discipline is
That time out crap is for the birds

We told them they need a good azz whooping and they are like 'Oh no, that seems to cruel, we can't do that'
And if the grandfather gets on them then it's 'Oh no, don't talk to them like that'

They are an embarrassment to be with in public because they have NEVER BEEN TAUGHT MANNERS so they go wild in a place
They are mean and nasty all because of fear, yes fear, of spanking/hitting them


Needless to say, it's the women in the family that can't say no and baby talk them even though the ages are 6-9
Christ what is with that baby-talk crap when the kid is no longer a baby anyway?
How the hell are they supposed to take Mom seriously when she sounds like a baby herself? Ugh....

To each their own I say
No kid is the same
They all need some kind of discipline, some more than others
What one chooses is up to them, no one else

And I'm talking discipline here, not abuse
There is a fine line, yes, but some people I can sense don't even like spanking a kid for bad behavior

They are probably the ones that run around the restaurant like it's romper room or up and down the isle in the store like it's a race track

Parents: Kids are to be seen, not heard
That was the motto when I grew up...definitely not of today

And yes, I've had my butt whooped plenty growing up and thank my lucky stars that I was taught manners & respect

I was given a handfull of spanking the duration of my childhood, I can remember maybee 3 times, probably a few more but other punishment were the norm.
One time sticks out for me..my brother who was 3 years younger than me, maybee 4 somehow lit the couch on fire whilst my dad was having a snooze on it..not sure why I got the spanking..lmao.
I don't have any children but if I did I probably wouldn't have spanking as part of the process, not that I believe there is anything terrible wrong if not overused and maybee a last resort, I think it depends on the child. I remember one of my friends getting a spanking and he was laughing..not sure what happened to him but spanking was not a usefull tool in his regard..lol
On a related note I guess there are more pics of one of Petersons kids with a headwound..what this guy did does not equate to a spanking.
Hopefully if he get some time his cellmates arrange a nice "blanket party"

a reply to: vonclod

I agree. A tap on the bottom is not quite the same as what happened here. Disgraceful!

originally posted by: OptimusCrime

originally posted by: GrantedBail
I appreciate your opinion. I respectfully disagree. Thank you for your reply.

a reply to: OptimusCrime

It sounds to me you were beat pretty bad, more extreme than myself. Were you bad?

I'll answer this as, like GrantedBail, I, too, was beaten pretty severely growing up. Also like GrantedBail, I find zero value in corporal punishment in children. I think it teaches the wrong thing (resolve matters with violence) and does nothing to teach a child to think critically about their actions.

Being a bad child is subjective. In my case, my being bad that would warrant corporal punishment would be parting my lips slightly so I could breathe (stuffy noses from allergies) and getting struck across the face for the indecency of momentary slightly parted lips while chewing the mandatory 25 chews per bite. These strikes would leave marks depending on how they were dished out. An open hand slap would leave a red handprint on my face for at least 6 hours and possible bruising. A fist--bruising and bleeding. If I had the gall to cry after being struck, then that would warrant more approbation. Crying was weakness. Despicable and intolerable. "Bad." That would start out with my face getting brutally clenched and then being shoved hard against a wall at which point I'd take the moment to try to make escape (another "bad"). If I failed to make an escape, then I would be slammed against a wall with my mother's hands wrapped tightly around my neck compressing my throat and her boozy mascara streaked face shoved into mine screaming at me about being so disrespectful and weak. According to my mother, I was "bad". From my perspective, I just needed a little air to breathe while chewing.

In regards to rearing "a-holes" if one doesn't beat their children: My now adult child was always considered to be wicked smart, precocious, and kind to others. My youngest regularly receives commendations for kindness. Both of my kids are deeply compassionate. In contrast, myself--the one who endured beatings--has a tendency of coming off as cold, robotic, and well, a bit of an a-hole. Except never towards children. Love kids.

I was whipped when I was little. Depending on how bad I was, dictated what form I would receive. If it wasn't anything too bad, but still garnered a butt whoopin', then I'd get the hand to the buttocks.

If my behavior got really bad, which it did at times, I got it with a belt or a switch.

To this day, I have no hate towards my parents for it. I understand why they did it and I agree with it. Me and my brothers would've LOL at that "time-out" crap. I've tried time out on my kids but it doesn't work. I don't like to do it, but when I have to, I will paint their back porch red. I haven't ever used a belt or switch, though. But if their behavior was uncontrollable then I'd introduce them to it.

Whooping is a common thing here where I live. There is a difference between it and abuse. My kids respect me. They do not fear me. And I know they love me above all else. Whooping their hind-ends hasn't had any effect on that. I would rather not have to do it at all but it's my duty to make sure that my kids are taught right and that they don't end up like the loser generation that is out there now(Not everybody, so no offense). I think it builds character and it teaches them that there is real consequences for their negative actions.

I think it's important to note that any discipline taken too far can be considered abuse whether it be physical in nature or not.

Growing up I was a pretty darn good kid. Never caused trouble, never hit by either parent.

I swatted my daughters butts a few times, but open handed and never hard.

Now for this Adrian Peterson guy to say he was just doing what was done to him as a means of justification, that kinda says lynchings are ok doesn't it?

I mean thats what they used to do.

So ask Mr. Adrian Peterson how he would feel about being lynched because thats what we used to do.

I won't go as far as saying there is never a time to hit a child... if a 10 year old is holding a knife to somebody's throat or drowning a puppy yeah i will hit him,

but there is never a reason to abuse a child.

Horrific punishments can do no good.