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Jesus is not god for four reasons

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posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 06:44 PM
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D/P
edit on 15-9-2014 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 06:44 PM
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sticky fingers T/P
edit on 15-9-2014 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 06:58 PM
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originally posted by: adjensen
a reply to: vethumanbeing


The Essenes were not "hyper-jews" at all, who said that?

Um... history, as well as their own writings. You've obviously never read the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Why do you think that anyone is going to take you seriously when you don't even get the basic facts right?


I don't take myself that seriously to expect anyone else to immediately conform to my thought process. Have you read the dead sea scrolls and intuited all of the missing parts and pieces (what a trial of patience ((Job)). Basic facts? How you would not know Jesus (and family) were Essenes is beyond me; why you believe them to be some "crazy arse" offshoot Sect is just as notable BECAUSE THEY WERE but for all the wrong reasons you say. They were very ahead of their time; their teaching by that Jesus person is all over the new testament (equality between the sexes, fairness in government).



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 07:15 PM
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originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

So Jesus is not God because WE are God? Wouldn't Jesus be God too then?
Darkness is not God. Jesus taught John that God is light and there is no darkness within him at all. THe flesh/body is not God only the holy spirit within us - the Love within.
It is important not to confuse the flesh with the spirit.


Just so, if Jesus as a human being is 'God' so say then we all are. We are no different in that we are all its expression. Why would Jesus be any different except he reached a point of enlightenment none of us bother to attain (even though we are just as capable believe me). Jesus was a perfect 9 dimensional being yes immediately on incarnation (without evil) one of the lucky ones that didn't have to work too hard. However; he also had to incur many lifetimes of karma in one lifetime (see the end/finality of it all resulting in an insane crucifixion. Id rather become enlightened the hard way bypassing a violent martredome occasioned by others and creating a religion that has yet to be determined its value. I can guarantee you this, he would have thought twice about all of this had he known the ultimate conclusion. Love is best but its not an emotion, its a very powerful energy force. Thanks everyone for your replies..



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 07:21 PM
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Scripture trumps Gnosticism...


“I tell you the truth, before Abraham was born, I AM!” ~ John 8:58

God was made manifest in the flesh. ~ 1 Timothy 3:16

...in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. ~ Heb. 1:2

For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. ~ Colossians 1:16-17

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" ~ John 1:1



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 07:40 PM
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originally posted by: Killeonidas
No no no! Gentlmen please,

What is the crux of knowing? Is it knowing itself? The gnosis of us the rhelm of man is but an opiate if the now. We are fleeting blossoms on the stem? Know that we do such feast on the bussom of pre-knowledge of life? If he Jesus of nazareth did not yern for children with Mary Magdelene, at the same time see that the state and church was corrupt so he turned the tables on those mofos? And 4th Buddha Siddhedartha saw that the opulence of a bubble did not seal him from suffering of the common man? So brothers and sisters can we not meet on the plane and the mountaintop that Dr. Martin Luther King did not speak of as the place we must so journe to talk softly about the human revolution against the ills that shake us most, materialism, racism, and militarism? Brethren, I call to you, heed me now that is not the time for a fervent systematic clandestine undertaking of the best overthrow now?


Though abbreviated I understand all you say and see your frustration; take off the yoke and think for oneself.



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 07:48 PM
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originally posted by: Murgatroid
Scripture trumps Gnosticism...


“I tell you the truth, before Abraham was born, I AM!” ~ John 8:58

God was made manifest in the flesh. ~ 1 Timothy 3:16

...in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. ~ Heb. 1:2

For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. ~ Colossians 1:16-17

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" ~ John 1:1


Scripture DOES NOT trump Gnosticism as the state of beingness "TO KNOW" does not need words written by others (without your own wisdom/journey in mind) to back it up. The enlightened state of being not something one can 'read' and instantly become enlightened even if agreed with; its just part of the process; as a discernment of YOUR TRUTH (reference 'Malkuth' in the first physical state of awareness first Sephira on the Tree of Life-PHYSICAL IS discernment of surroundings) your truth must vibrate with someone elses truth (BUT ONLY IF PURE) and are these words trustworthy or have a silent agenda?
edit on 15-9-2014 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 07:57 PM
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No human who ever walked this earth is GOD. Period.

God never takes birth, and has no need.

Todays society is worshipping Jesus, Muhammad, Shri Rama, Shri Krishna, Buddha etc. out of ignorance and stupidity.

Every human born today has exactly same potential as any of the dignitary above. However this potential is hidden due to absence of 'tapa'.

You cannot see God. No human can see God. Only soul in its purest form can feel (not see) God. God is formless (like energy) and we all live in God. God is everywhere.



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 08:08 PM
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originally posted by: GargIndia
No human who ever walked this earth is GOD. Period.

God never takes birth, and has no need.
Todays society is worshipping Jesus, Muhammad, Shri Rama, Shri Krishna, Buddha etc. out of ignorance and stupidity.
Every human born today has exactly same potential as any of the dignitary above. However this potential is hidden due to absence of 'tapa'.
You cannot see God. No human can see God. Only soul in its purest form can feel (not see) God. God is formless (like energy) and we all live in God. God is everywhere.

There is no physical 'God" (unless you count the four Melchizadeks or Abraham/Moses but then the flood gates give way to all sorts of false demi-Gods) it (God) is an energy form that is expressing itself and you cannot say to me we are not its byproduct of a process of its learning about itself (allowing for creation in all forms including the potential for both good and evil). You can only see God in its deeds or accomplishments. God is everywhere including within our DNA. Formless to a point but you seem to be drawing a line with the physical. Of course THIS world is not real is just "human school", the non physical is the real reality. Try explaining that fact to the children of your species, you will get blank stares (you are focusing in on a truth needing to be revealed).


edit on 15-9-2014 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 09:44 PM
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originally posted by: vethumanbeing
Well there is always that take on it all; and I don't disagree with you. I'm still not convinced he wasn't an "overlay" idea by 'others' that thought they knew better in how to 're-jump start' a horrible period in history (insert a potencial paradigm shift HERE).


Whether true or not, it does at least make some sense IMO. If not taken literally, without all of the religious nonsense, the allegory of Christ (like other saviour heroes) could be a beautiful one.



posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 10:11 PM
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originally posted by: vethumanbeing

originally posted by: GargIndia
No human who ever walked this earth is GOD. Period.

God never takes birth, and has no need.
Todays society is worshipping Jesus, Muhammad, Shri Rama, Shri Krishna, Buddha etc. out of ignorance and stupidity.
Every human born today has exactly same potential as any of the dignitary above. However this potential is hidden due to absence of 'tapa'.
You cannot see God. No human can see God. Only soul in its purest form can feel (not see) God. God is formless (like energy) and we all live in God. God is everywhere.

There is no physical 'God" (unless you count the four Melchizadeks or Abraham/Moses but then the flood gates give way to all sorts of false demi-Gods) it (God) is an energy form that is expressing itself and you cannot say to me we are not its byproduct of a process of its learning about itself (allowing for creation in all forms including the potential for both good and evil). You can only see God in its deeds or accomplishments. God is everywhere including within our DNA. Formless to a point but you seem to be drawing a line with the physical. Of course THIS world is not real is just "human school", the non physical is the real reality. Try explaining that fact to the children of your species, you will get blank stares (you are focusing in on a truth needing to be revealed).



Physical God is present everywhere. 'Veda' says that air cannot flow and plants cannot grow without God's power being present. The Universe works only due to God's powers working in it. However God is finer matter compared to gross matter that you can see. You just do not have the means to see or feel God's presence.

Veda says God is 'hidden' intentionally. This hidden part is a necessary component of Creation as God's power is so mind-boggling that no soul can function in the direct presence of God.

Children learn the correct facts in the presence of an able teacher. There are no blank stares.



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 07:58 PM
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originally posted by: Cogito, Ergo Sum

originally posted by: veteranhumanbeing
Well there is always that take on it all; and I don't disagree with you. I'm still not convinced he wasn't an "overlay" idea by 'others' that thought they knew better in how to 're-jump start' a horrible period in history (insert a potencial paradigm shift HERE).



CES Whether true or not, it does at least make some sense IMO. If not taken literally, without all of the religious nonsense, the allegory of Christ (like other saviour heroes) could be a beautiful one.


It was a case of lets do this or not do this; the fallout will happen as history unfolds. That being said, the pointing of fingers "blame game" for this inserted personality overlay will never be discovered (too ridiculous to contemplate); the other scenario, the accidental creation of a new religion that has legs/strength/endurance cant be denied as it has existed for 1700 years. I wonder why the literal interpretation of scripture is so prevalent; its obviously meant as allegorical or to be understood as a metaphor speaking personally to the individual whom reads it. It is a beautiful idea; but one that is not as open as Islam is to those that distort/warp the Korans words is subject to the same corruption; the iconic King James Version of Christian scripture being that poisonous toadstool mushroom that left all the doors of subjugation open.
edit on 16-9-2014 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 08:14 PM
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The find at Nag Hammadi did not only include Gnostic texts, but a copy of the Corpus Hermeticum as well as Plato's Republic, which were some of the most basic "learned documents" of the day.

The books of the modern "Bible" were not finalized until the 1400's and there are still disagreements about just which ones are "really" canon.

This fact is unquestioned: Humans chose which documents would be included; the decisions were mere politics.

The earliest scraps of physical evidence of the Gospels are from 150 AD. While Paul's Epistles have all been given "consensus dates" in the 55-70 CE range, that is just another way of saying that Bible scholars all agreed to tell the same story.

The actual physical evidence demonstrates a much later date.

Don't let troubling facts bother anyone though; carry on!

edit on 20Tue, 16 Sep 2014 20:14:31 -050014p082014966 by Gryphon66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 08:38 PM
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originally posted by: GargIndia
originally posted by: veteranhumanbeing
originally posted by: GargIndia

VHB There is no physical 'God" (unless you count the four Melchizadeks or Abraham/Moses but then the flood gates give way to all sorts of false demi-Gods) it (God) is an energy form that is expressing itself and you cannot say to me we are not its byproduct of a process of its learning about itself (allowing for creation in all forms including the potential for both good and evil). You can only see God in its deeds or accomplishments. God is everywhere including within our DNA. Formless to a point but you seem to be drawing a line with the physical. Of course THIS world is not real is just "human school", the non physical is the real reality. Try explaining that fact to the children of your species, you will get blank stares (you are focusing in on a truth needing to be revealed).



GargIndia Physical God is present everywhere. 'Veda' says that air cannot flow and plants cannot grow without God's power being present. The Universe works only due to God's powers working in it. However God is finer matter compared to gross matter that you can see. You just do not have the means to see or feel God's presence.
Veda says God is 'hidden' intentionally. This hidden part is a necessary component of Creation as God's power is so mind-boggling that no soul can function in the direct presence of God.
Children learn the correct facts in the presence of an able teacher. There are no blank stares.


Sure, God is hidden intentionally so that one will seek/sniff the subtle nature of its being out; why make it easy for you, its your purpose to understand why you incarnated, or more tellingly if you even care beyond knowing the parents you were 'accidently' 'born to are in fact your biological creators. God is of a finer matter than flesh as you say, yet we are still one of its imaginations of itself existing or 'playing' in the super heavy third dimension (we remain ITS imagination gone wild). You could call God a being I suppose or to my understanding A SYSTEM of forces combined that allow for a creation process to develop (good or bad/failed or succeeding). Not sure a physical being could withstand the radiation it eminates on such a high level, but a soul/star being (not made of matter) can. Correct facts explained to children would require a great teacher; but how so did these same facts somehow escape those parents of that child?
edit on 16-9-2014 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 09:32 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
The find at Nag Hammadi did not only include Gnostic texts, but a copy of the Corpus Hermeticum as well as Plato's Republic, which were some of the most basic "learned documents" of the day.
The books of the modern "Bible" were not finalized until the 1400's and there are still disagreements about just which ones are "really" canon.
This fact is unquestioned: Humans chose which documents would be included; the decisions were mere politics.
The earliest scraps of physical evidence of the Gospels are from 150 AD. While Paul's Epistles have all been given "consensus dates" in the 55-70 CE range, that is just another way of saying that Bible scholars all agreed to tell the same story.
The actual physical evidence demonstrates a much later date.
Don't let troubling facts bother anyone though; carry on!

Thank you for your post Gryphon66. Why would Plato's Republic be included I wonder, the Greeks had a better plan (to diseminate copies) than to leave everything to Alexandria's records keeping much less unaware of the lack of a "fire house' near its world class library. Unquestionably as you say, the gnostic texts posed to many problems to include in Pauls imaginative though highly edited version of what scripture (as a church entity) should be taught to semi-literate third worlders JUST ABOUT to be Conquerered by The Book of The Real God (in his OWN words ((but written by others to suit their politcal means/gains)). Totally a power move; as in Marx said a good opiate, if we can teach them to memorize sermons or fear the messenger; or god forgive us: they accidently learn to READ. There was collusion on what to tell the masses, Gnostic texts tell a different story (the truth). The main most troubling fact is: there does not exist a "gospel attributed to the writer JESUS on or about 33 AD". This is a total boomerang to Christian theosophy but NO ONE cares or thinks this is significant. It would be as if I could proclaim "Yes, L. Ron Hubbard is alive and lives on a yacht driving about the oceans of the world, REASON? to evade going to jail for tax evasion" and explaining why the Church of Scientology IS REAL and doesn't have to be taxed in a court of law.
edit on 16-9-2014 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 07:20 AM
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a reply to: vethumanbeing

I'm afraid I don't have access to your intuitive sources and insights, Vet.

I think it's important to remember that we find bits and pieces of documents and artifacts that have somehow survived the millennia, and make up our own stories about them so that they fit into our pre-existing narrative of what "is."

I have no opinion on what the monks in the Nag Hammadi desert may have been doing, trying to do, studying, believing, etc.

I would guess that the literary treasure was assembled much in the same way that almost every American household might have a copy of a Bible, a Dictionary, a Farmer's Almanac, and maybe The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn.

Burying those in the back yard to be discovered in 2000 years or so would generate all kinds of wild, incredible stories if our distant relatives tried to fit them all into a single explanatory narrative, that has nothing to do with the simple fact that those happened to be the books laying around in the house.

Your mileage may vary.
edit on 7Wed, 17 Sep 2014 07:28:40 -050014p072014966 by Gryphon66 because: Noted.



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 09:47 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

I'm afraid I don't have access to your intuitive sources and insights, Vet.

I think it's important to remember that we find bits and pieces of documents and artifacts that have somehow survived the millennia, and make up our own stories about them so that they fit into our pre-existing narrative of what "is."

I have no opinion on what the monks in the Nag Hammadi desert may have been doing, trying to do, studying, believing, etc.
I would guess that the literary treasure was assembled much in the same way that almost every American household might have a copy of a Bible, a Dictionary, a Farmer's Almanac, and maybe The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn.
Burying those in the back yard to be discovered in 2000 years or so would generate all kinds of wild, incredible stories if our distant relatives tried to fit them all into a single explanatory narrative, that has nothing to do with the simple fact that those happened to be the books laying around in the house.

Your mileage may vary.

Access to sources is up to you and your curiosity in finding answers is key. Those bits and pieces that have survived in a 'puzzle form' to be re-invented or interpreted will fit as you say a pre-existing or determined narrative that describes "WHAT IS" in that moment. I tell you that 100 years from now all interpretation will all be tossed out the nearest open window (as it wont fit the current paradigm that is playing itself out). I am in awe of the Nag Hammadi collection as it was so before its time and still not understood EVEN IN THIS DAY of one would think a better enlightened world, but for written religious dogma. I do as well have a dictionary, et al..and as you say, what would persons 2000 years from now make of them (actual physical texts of the greats, the classics) if they survived (all things being e-books and for whatever reason zapped into oblivion by a random EMF pulse; someone needs to bury a literature time capsule right along with all the seeds). I wonder how one would relate to such writings, we understand Copernicus, Plato, Socrates, Newton, Shakespeare as are timeless constant truths regarding mathematics or human nature. The wild stories might arise by finding a DVD of "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy"; "District 9", "Ben-Hur", "Jason and the Argonauts 1960 version ", "The Ten Commandments", "The Manchurian Candidate". Milage is good; the hair pin turn negotiation can be a problem at speed. Nice post.



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 10:20 PM
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a reply to: vethumanbeing

Our lord Jesus Christ, amen



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 10:35 PM
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originally posted by: warren408
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

Our lord Jesus Christ, amen


Hell yeah. Supposition is not the same as actually giving it all away (the truth) comes as a hard fought battle of wits and determination against all odds.



posted on Sep, 17 2014 @ 11:35 PM
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a reply to: vethumanbeing




Just so, if Jesus as a human being is 'God' so say then we all are. We are no different in that we are all its expression.


No, Jesus was and is the only perfect human to have ever lived. And as many people whom think themselves perfect I have yet to encounter one or ever hear of someone whom has encountered a perfect human being.

Pax



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