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Honolulu to move homeless people from tourist hubs into former internment camps/waste dumps.

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posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:36 AM
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originally posted by: Xtrozero
I live near Portland and Portland is a homeless friendly city, and so it is a magnet for them. With that said though I understand their plight it is a serious issue. Every corner has them with their nifty signs and you can not walk down any street without a group always there.

At some point a city needs to setup a camp of some kind because the main streets is not good for them nor everyone else. They already live in in rather nasty areas so what does the OP suggest?


As you no doubt know, there are several categories of homeless people including those just down on their luck and needing a hand up, off-the-gridders (I don't know what else to call them), serious addicts and alcoholics, and the mentally ill. Some fall into more than one category. I happen to believe that everyone should have a place to live but there's obviously no political will to do that yet and it's complicated when dealing with homeless people in some of those categories. There are some programs (although probably not nearly enough) that those temporarily down on their luck can use to get a foothold and get back on their feet. However, the off-the-gridders aren't interested and the serious addicts/alcoholics and the mentally ill can't get it together to make the available programs work for them.

What's to be done with/for the serious addicts/alcoholics and the mentally ill homeless who can't or won't cooperate in anything that will result in transitioning into "normal" society? I'm not talking about them becoming stiff-necked drones but at least being able to live in an apartment without presenting huge problems for their neighbors?

On the one hand, rounding them up and transporting them to a "compound' is probably a violation of their civil rights. On the other hand, other people have a right to go about their business without being subjected to the behavior several people have described.




posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:48 AM
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Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....
No matter which way you cut it......its getting to be dog eat dog and devil take the hindmost.....
Those that can still support their lifestyle do so with little regard for those who are destitute.
We look down on these beings as failures and somewhat less than ourselves....so it will be easy to ostracize them further....But I am sure we all have felt the hot breath of the social juggernaught on the backs of our necks as we ran pell mell just to stay a little bit ahead........One slip, one months unemployment can dig a hole no working man can fill sometimes....
Its no wonder we have a drug and alchohol abuse problem.....its almost a given....and id be willing to bet you the computer models show the bosses, just what to expect from people when they are driven beyond their stress ceiling...
Its all been predicted and planned for.....the controllers are re engineering humanity into something far less than human....



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 05:11 AM
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"""Movng them to a toxic waste dump? What's next, killing them???"""


Maybe not (Next) BUT SOON
edit on 11-9-2014 by aightism2 because: p



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 07:35 AM
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Finally!

I do think the homeless should be given a choice in the form of help they receive
If they want to work (many who I have met prefer handouts) then put them in the job programs

If they want a free ride then they should get two choices
A camp outside of the big city with their basic needs taken care of
The supplies needed and access to the large public forest land that has been set aside for undomesticated wildlife

I myself am about to apply to the later option, this place is crazy these days

x



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 08:39 AM
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originally posted by: LDragonFire
They say they are gonna try to come up with a plan to help the homeless.

Hmm livable wage jobs would fix this problem!

They should build a self sustaining community that grows there own food and manufactures textiles or light industry related to what they can grow. All voluntary and self governed they each get a share of whatever they sell. This absolutely doesn't support capitalism, but how long can we pretend that capitalism is a successful system?


Capitalism ain't the problem.

The Socialist/Progressive government policies are.

They are the failures that last for eternity.




posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 09:16 AM
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Have you ever been to hawaii!? you could put me where ever you want as long i get to stay there lol



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 01:37 PM
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a reply to: ArchPlayer

Interesting article, thank your for the link and topic.

Some people save up for half or more of their lifetimes to vacation in such places. They want before they get old, reach obsolescence vis-à-vis a chance brush with the hedonistic or die, to experience paradise on Earth beneath palm trees rustling to a tropical breeze. Resort owners, travel agents, and the rest of the tourism industries make a killing on their dreams. Dreams the homeless (the poor) never showed up in; dreams their unclean persons would surely despoil.

Too bad.

This article simply highlights another example the plutocratic manifest destiny entitlement of the haves over the have nots--at any expense. It mustbe the right of the wealthy to accumulate further billions by luring the working poor or middle class on the vacation of lifetime! Who are these homeless subhumans to interfere with that kind of fantasy and wealth accumulation? Who are they? Why should anyone care?

You should. That's who.

I've existed on so many ends of society. The one constant no matter my station in life: the inability of the majority of Americans (I've encountered) to empathize with each other because of stereotyped hype and or ignorance and apathy: the racial, cultural, religious, social class, language, physical fitness level ... difference. Because someone is different, less successful, perceived as less valuable to the Machine; then they must suffer because sense of superiority says so.

To the segment that espouses the line: some people just aren't equal to others, born equal, etc. I can only respond: figure out quickly which segment of society classifies you as less than their equal, and hope they do not one day relocate you to a former trash dump.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 02:57 PM
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originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
This topic has been posted numerous times here. Not Honolulu though. This is news to me. So far it's been rumors. Now it looks like the MSM is actually telling people.

Somehow I don't think the masses will be too concerned.

First they came for....


If you think this is mind blowing, look at ATS archives on Columbia South Carolina and their annexing of throwing people in homeless "camp" where they can't leave unless picked up in a vehicle by an individual with a verified address.


originally posted by: xuenchen
One of these days we will see suggestions like moving the homeless populations to semi-permanent camp areas.

Then somebody will get the bright idea to allow companies to try simple manufacturing or service staging in those camps.

Watch for this any time now.



Already happened in Columbia, SC.


originally posted by: dreamingawake
Not the first report of similar activity, other sources say L.A. and NC for example, are suspected of sending homeless to camp like facilities. Unfortunately, many will dismiss it because of "FEMA camps" being tied into it. To say the actions will go ignored, until it comes to their town, then it's likely too late. With the growing amount of homeless people it's not something to sweep under the rug nor send them off to other cities to "rid" areas of unwanted locals.

"...approved several measures that ban sitting and lying down on sidewalks in a popular area " reminds me of Santa Cruz mid 00's, California where I was nicely given a threat to be arrested for needing to sit down for a few minutes. Fun times.


Well, this is in the bunch of 1sts for dealing with the homeless that the PTB are admitting to. From spikes to keep people from seeking shelter and sleeping to hurling them off in camps , no one wants to stare the pink elephant in the room. But you are right, the social experiment is in full form and it is being implemented without protest, and as the ratio of homeless to the working occurs, this is going to be issue later.


originally posted by: Poppcocked
a reply to: ArchPlayer

So go and pick up as many as you can, bring em to your house and care for them.

You obviously care a great deal about this problem so im sure you will be more than happy to take my advice.



Mature attitude Poppcocked. Why don't I wait for them to come to your house, ransack it when folks like you deny them basic living needs and/or wait for you to become homeless and experience your life being out of control in a country with a dead economy. Then we can see how far your snarkinest takes you.


originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: ArchPlayer




Movng them to a toxic waste dump? What's next, killing them???

Pardon me?
Where does the article you quoted say that the homeless facility would be at a toxic waste dump?

www.kitv.com...


The MSM article I posted specifically says that "The city also is planning a temporary legal campsite on a remote, mostly industrial island far from resorts, parts of which were previously used as an internment camp and former dump." While I'm not familiar with the area in question, the fact that it was previously used as an internment camp and former dump in the mostly industrial island far from the resorts raises a red flag to me. news.msn.com...


originally posted by: rickymouse
What! Free room and board in the nice climate of Hawaii just by acting like a homeless person? Maybe it's time to break out the old clothes and buy a ticket to Hawaii. Hopefully I don't have to live on the streets around all those tourists for too long.
Minds a whizzing, hope they have open WIFI at that camp.

I wouldn't call living on a former waste dump a great tradeoff.


originally posted by: urmenimu

originally posted by: rickymouse
What! Free room and board in the nice climate of Hawaii just by acting like a homeless person? Maybe it's time to break out the old clothes and buy a ticket to Hawaii. Hopefully I don't have to live on the streets around all those tourists for too long.
Minds a whizzing, hope they have open WIFI at that camp.


do you believe homeless people are "acting like a homeless person"? do you think its fun to be homeless in a resort economy where the lowest house on the housing market costs $500,000? do you realize there is an indigineous population on Hawaii? do you believe the purpose of life is to be a sleazebag as you suggest, or accept that the situation is more complex?


S&F. Some people just don't get that being homeless isn't generally something sought by someone; mostly people have categorized homeless folks the same as "welfare queens" living off the dole.


originally posted by: LDragonFire
They say they are gonna try to come up with a plan to help the homeless.

Hmm livable wage jobs would fix this problem!

They should build a self sustaining community that grows there own food and manufactures textiles or light industry related to what they can grow. All voluntary and self governed they each get a share of whatever they sell. This absolutely doesn't support capitalism, but how long can we pretend that capitalism is a successful system?


A prevailing wage in Hawaii would be hard considering the industry there is tourism, plus the deals the government made with the indigenous back in the day just to take siege of the island. For anyone not a full blooded native Hawaiian its just damn expensive. Most paradises are though.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:12 PM
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originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
a reply to: LDragonFire

As soon as that community is built they'll be dispersed or arrested on trumped up threats and charges. You cannot make your own way without the system intruding in some manner.


Or they will nicely "dispose" of them. A former internment camp...lord knows what horrors the place is capable of. Remember when Bush bought all those guillotines? Where did they go? These people might find out and the public wouldn't be the wiser since out of sight out of mind.


originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

I'm sure lots of the material in the dump is toxic in some way. But I don't think the dump was specifically formed to handle hazardous or even radioactive materials.

S&F; plus I doubt they will clean it up if the contamination is that bad.


originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
There used to be a dump on Sand Island.
Sand Island covers more than 500 acres. Do you think the dump covered the whole island? How big do you think the facility is going to be?


Like I said, I have no idea how big they would make it but I would guess they aren't going to make a swanky Taj Mahal on the premises, and probably use the worst of the land with the minimalist of resources on the project. That isn't the article, just my speculation since we are dealing with a homeless problem and city government doesnt proactively help.


originally posted by: Snarl
If you've never enjoyed the first-hand experience, let me say, that the homeless people living on Honolulu are a major problem. You can't have anything nice if they're around. They'll steal it or piss all over it.

The homeless there are like a gang ... like those monkeys in India ... good for absolutely nothing, but protected from great offense by TPTB and political correctness. They 'hang out' in any area long enough and feel like it's their right to be there ... like they own it. The cops won't arrest 'em 'cause it's not worth the time, effort, and trouble. They'd be back a week later doing the same things anyway.

Those a-holes broke into my truck and ripped the entire dash out to steal a $40 stereo. Probably did well over a thousand dollars in damages and the passenger door was never the same again. I lost all sympathy for 'em and have recommended against selecting Hawaii as a vacation destination since (I wouldn't go back to Guam again either ... almost as bad).

I know you feel strongly about the homeless in Honolulu, but let me ask you this, why are they a major problem? What contributed to these people being unable to make a prevailing wage to be able to live and not be out there - government and big businesses in partnership with each other. At a point some of these cats are stuck in a cycle they can't get out of and develop a fck it mentality. Right or wrong, they have lost the will to be civil, because they have nothing to lose, being disenfranchised for whatever reason. I'm sure there are a lot of vets out there, unstable minds...circumstances vary.
Comparing them to monkeys is not going to win your case, as you have belittled them to nothing more than savage animals. Homeless are not protected from great offense by the PTB, they are scorned, ridiculed, and put into the public's mind as Savage Animal Beasts that will kill them. So what they hang out; most businesses won't let them use the facilities if they have to relieve themselves, but then you wonder why they piss in public. It wouldn't have killed the city to have public bathrooms. As far as cops arresting them....is this what we really want, homeless being arrested for being homeless and setting that precedent. Just beecause the vandals there give it a bad name, do we really want that type of reaction? I've seen cops kill a homeless guy, shot him up with multiple force after stealing his food. Bad juju there.
I'm assuming you know it was a homeless person that stole your radio, and if so, they are a theif, don't rope them in with the entire class of people that can't afford to live. Theif and homeless don't go together - a vast number of homeless don't bother nobody.
I will agree Hawaii should be abandoned as a vacation spot - let the entire economy collapse, make the whole island a homeless colony and then people can see for themselves their own prejudices while experiencing it. Ship em' off from the continental US at the bottom of freights and drop em off. #sarcasm


originally posted by: AllSourceIntel
a reply to: ArchPlayer
Yes, a growing and concerning trend in cities and states across the nation. While I can understand the concerns of public safety and to a lesser extent, beautification, the method is rather Orwelian. As noted, many disregard because they see internment or FEMA camp and dismiss it as half-baked despite its validity. Though I think we can all agree, our conspiracy minds wonder if this is part of a larger test bed.

That aside, I think this is another example of Government waste, we should consider, for example, that the Government has much land, States and Federal. So, we need to ask, why are homeless not offered room and board in return for maintaining, taking care of, and working these lands? If any Government program would be of use, one such as this could work wonders. Also, if I owned a huge ranch, I would do this myself.

Good post ArchPlayer.


We should all be concerned about the growing trend of discarding the homeless and now in official "former internment camp/former waste dump type facilities. The next step is Logan's Run. Kill em' off. Or as a friend of mine said, Soylent Green. Public safety in my opinion wouldn't be bad if people's attitudes toward the homeless wasn't so horrid and scornful that it makes an uneasy relationship on both sides in generalized terms.
The government would never ever let people live rent and food free to maintain land. They are too busy stealing it and eradicating the idea of ownership alltogether. See California, where people can't even bequeth farmland to their heirs (article is somewhere on ATS but you can look it up). Agenda 21 is in full swing, and many refuse to believe it. Even if you had a ranch and had hired hands, the government would figure out ways depending on where you live to come down on you hardcore.






edit on 11-9-2014 by ArchPlayer because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:20 PM
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originally posted by: stirling
Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....


Where is it illegal to be homeless? Cite the law to which you refer. I don't know why people make wild claims and think no one will challenge them.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: Xcouncil=wisdom
Finally!

I do think the homeless should be given a choice in the form of help they receive
If they want to work (many who I have met prefer handouts) then put them in the job programs

If they want a free ride then they should get two choices
A camp outside of the big city with their basic needs taken care of
The supplies needed and access to the large public forest land that has been set aside for undomesticated wildlife

I myself am about to apply to the later option, this place is crazy these days
x


You may be joking about the public forest land. Let's hope so. We need to preserve it not destroy it.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:24 PM
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originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: LDragonFire
They say they are gonna try to come up with a plan to help the homeless.

Hmm livable wage jobs would fix this problem!

They should build a self sustaining community that grows there own food and manufactures textiles or light industry related to what they can grow. All voluntary and self governed they each get a share of whatever they sell. This absolutely doesn't support capitalism, but how long can we pretend that capitalism is a successful system?


Capitalism ain't the problem.

The Socialist/Progressive government policies are.

They are the failures that last for eternity.





Then perhaps you can explain to us why there are so many homeless people in this capitalist country and so few in socialist countries like Sweden.

Any country that doesn't have universal healthcare can't remotely be called a socialist country.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:31 PM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: ArchPlayer




Movng them to a toxic waste dump? What's next, killing them???

Pardon me?
Where does the article you quoted say that the homeless facility would be at a toxic waste dump?

www.kitv.com...


HI Phage, nice to see you

That doesn't look to bad to me,



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:36 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: stirling
Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....


Where is it illegal to be homeless? Cite the law to which you refer. I don't know why people make wild claims and think no one will challenge them.


Google is your friend...

money.cnn.com...

www.la.unm.edu...



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:36 PM
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originally posted by: rbkruspe
a reply to: urmenimu

Yeah, homelessness isn't such a fun prospect. I'm only days from homelessness myself. That sort of humor isn't appreciated. Thank you for sticking up for common sense and reasoning. That sort of "humor" is part of what's wrong with the homeless issue in the US. People make light of it, ignore it, distort it, and are just glad it's not happening to them. Everyone is distancing themselves from anything to do with anything about reality they do want to face. I'm not too familiar with Hawaii or it's laws and this whole idea of camps, but it's becoming ridiculous that people can't find better solutions than to treat people like scum because of financial hardships that lead to homelessness. Or helping them get out of it. Sometimes people need a little kindness. When stuff happens, people show their true colors. People you thought cared, turn away, or they think it will turn out okay and won't happen.

Believe it or not, it does happen. Sometimes people run out of options.

It's happening to me. Everything I knew and loved will be gone, my safety and my chance at a future, being raped and beaten becomes a huge possibility. My mental health will suffer, it already is shaky as it is dealing with this situation. I can't relax, my anxiety is so high I cannot think about anything else, I panic, I wish to die at times. I'm alone. These are things I have to face whether I like it or not. Some people will tell me that's dramatic. I'm sorry but that's how it is. People are too sheltered from the truth of the matter. They assume too much. It's not funny. It shouldn't ever be. I'm not laughing.



I've been there, I've done a hard winter on the street no shelter in the coldest climate imaginable when you have no shelter. When you finally hit the street and the reality hits you, hold on to your sanity. Keep your wits about you. Live it like it is a war and develop a war mentality. Depending on your location, shelters can be your worst nightmare and cause more sickness and bitterness than its worth - also can be dangerous place for violence and rape regardless of gender so avoid them if you can. Consider it a tour of duty in the service in active combat, have a weapon of some sort with you at all times, and remember the enemy can't catch you if you keep moving. It's a hard life but if you are fortunate enough you can survive. With winter coming head to a warm climate.


originally posted by: Xtrozero
I live near Portland and Portland is a homeless friendly city, and so it is a magnet for them. With that said though I understand their plight it is a serious issue. Every corner has them with their nifty signs and you can not walk down any street without a group always there.

At some point a city needs to setup a camp of some kind because the main streets is not good for them nor everyone else. They already live in in rather nasty areas so what does the OP suggest?

Portland, Atlanta, and NYC are "homeless friendly" but that vibe is changing rapidly. Yes, the plight is a serious issue but the city shouldn't set up a camp. Leads to a bad precedent. Atlanta has a tent city with over 500 people living in them, and the state transportation workers tears their dwellings down once a week, but Atlanta keeps giving out tents. And one-way bus tickets (which is why the other cities broke off into counties and got mad at them). Its a spiral system that goes nowhere. NYC has cardboard land, and it is not uncommon to find people living in a cardboard box. They are largely ignored until big event time, then they are given a one way bus ticket out.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: rbkruspe




Believe it or not, it does happen. Sometimes people run out of options.

Living in a cardboard tent on a sidewalk is better than living in a place where there are showers, toilets, and health care readily available in a centralized location?

Of course, for some, the notion of a homeless facility is synonymous with internment camp. The people who take advantage of the site will not be trapped there. Yes, there will be curfews. Yes there will be rules. I've never been houseless but I think that situation sounds a lot better than living on a sidewalk and seeing the looks of derision and resentment from passersby. Better than crapping on my "floor".

What do you suggest? Buy them a house?


Living in a cardboard box or tent is better than living in a homeless facility controlled and dicated by a group of city administrators that don't give a damn and let the place go to pot. See most homeless shelters for more information. At least in the box or tent you are free, you are not being held captive, or dictated to with the craziest curfew hours that prevent you from seeking adequate employment. Some shelters make people leave at 5am. But you have to be already checked in by 9am and can't leave. What the hell is that? People are still adults. This is one step from a jail system. As a person that has never been in the situation you really just don't know how fcked up it is out there. Derison and resentment come in many different forms and I'm here to tell you most homeless folk do not look at others like that. They are too busy surviving the war to engage those types of thoughts.
And again, no one just goes around and craps the floor unless they got a mental problem. Most people are so conditioned to a toilet it is a hardship for them to go without it.


originally posted by: OptimusCrime
Decided to not get involved in this topic. But hopefully they can fix the problem.

Ha. Shocked.


originally posted by: Celestial1
The homeless in Honolulu and many other areas of the island are a huge problem. They are not like the homeless community I was familiar with in areas on the mainland. As Snarl said, they are destructive, often violent and I'm sorry but filthy. When you walk down most sidewalks in many areas of Honolulu you must often walk into the street because they have set up camp with truckloads of belongings, LOTS of (stolen) shopping carts, makeshift shelters and bags and bags of rubbish. Many times I've seen mice, rats, roaches and the like infested in the belongings that are just everywhere. They literally just pee anywhere they please and defecate right along the public walkways as well. It is a truly filthy town. They have no respect for property either and yes, often act like they own the place. Drug use like meth (ice) is rampant and often fuels attacks on other homeless people, passersby, people who confront someone peeing right next to the picnic table they are eating at, anybody really. Certain public parks at times are filled with people camped out with enough belongings to fill a small apartment.
Don't get me wrong, there are also a lot of good people just down on their luck. Those are the people who take advantage of the many shelters, programs and services that are readily available. If you really don't want to be homeless you can make it happen here moreso than other areas I've volunteered at. Sadly, for so many here it has become a chosen way of life.
I just wish that they could realize that if they really want to live a free lifestyle such as homelessness, they could do it by



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:43 PM
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originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: stirling
Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....


Where is it illegal to be homeless? Cite the law to which you refer. I don't know why people make wild claims and think no one will challenge them.


Google is your friend...

money.cnn.com...


www.la.unm.edu...


Here's a quote from one of the articles you cited, "Despite a lack of affordable housing and emergency shelter, many of these communities are implementing laws that ban homeless residents from sitting or lying down in public, loitering, sleeping in vehicles, and begging for money or food."

That's not a law that making it illegal to be homeless. I'll bet that law also bans you (I assume you're not homeless) from doing those things, too. I grant you that that law makes it extremely difficult to be homeless, however, I'll bet that it does not make it illegal for someone to sit on a park bench, for example. It probably makes it illegal to sit on one after a certain time of day. I'm sure you'll think the distinction is petty, but it's not.

There are two problems: (1) what to do with the currently homeless and (2) what to do to prevent homelessness.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:45 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: stirling
Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....


Where is it illegal to be homeless? Cite the law to which you refer. I don't know why people make wild claims and think no one will challenge them.


Google is your friend...

money.cnn.com...


www.la.unm.edu...


Here's a quote from one of the articles you cited, "Despite a lack of affordable housing and emergency shelter, many of these communities are implementing laws that ban homeless residents from sitting or lying down in public, loitering, sleeping in vehicles, and begging for money or food."

That's not a law that makes it illegal to be homeless, per se. I'll bet that law also bans you (I assume you're not homeless) from doing those things, too. I grant you that that law makes it extremely difficult to be homeless, however I'll bet that it does not make it illegal for someone to sit on a park bench, for example. It probably makes it illegal to sit on one after a certain time of day. I'm sure you'll think the distinction is petty, but it's not.

There are two problems: (1) what to do with the currently homeless and (2) what to do to prevent homelessness.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:46 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: Xtrozero
I live near Portland and Portland is a homeless friendly city, and so it is a magnet for them. With that said though I understand their plight it is a serious issue. Every corner has them with their nifty signs and you can not walk down any street without a group always there.

At some point a city needs to setup a camp of some kind because the main streets is not good for them nor everyone else. They already live in in rather nasty areas so what does the OP suggest?


As you no doubt know, there are several categories of homeless people including those just down on their luck and needing a hand up, off-the-gridders (I don't know what else to call them), serious addicts and alcoholics, and the mentally ill. Some fall into more than one category. I happen to believe that everyone should have a place to live but there's obviously no political will to do that yet and it's complicated when dealing with homeless people in some of those categories. There are some programs (although probably not nearly enough) that those temporarily down on their luck can use to get a foothold and get back on their feet. However, the off-the-gridders aren't interested and the serious addicts/alcoholics and the mentally ill can't get it together to make the available programs work for them.

What's to be done with/for the serious addicts/alcoholics and the mentally ill homeless who can't or won't cooperate in anything that will result in transitioning into "normal" society? I'm not talking about them becoming stiff-necked drones but at least being able to live in an apartment without presenting huge problems for their neighbors?

On the one hand, rounding them up and transporting them to a "compound' is probably a violation of their civil rights. On the other hand, other people have a right to go about their business without being subjected to the behavior several people have described.

The fact of the matter is there is a segment of homeless population that has become homeless institutionalized; they have been out there so long and so disenfranchised they are essentially war shell shocked and don't give a damn anymore. They cannot be saved and they are the ones you know got mental issues. They will never be able to transition back to society for society failed them and their bitterness consumed them.
If people showed more humanity, if employment went back to checks and balances, if the economy was stronger we wouldn't be having this discussion. However, people's ignorance to the country they live, the struggle for survival, the ignorance to more and more people being homeless because "if it isn't me the hell with it" narcissistic attitude all while being more concerned with reality television and the newest electronic product has put us here.


originally posted by: stirling
Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....
No matter which way you cut it......its getting to be dog eat dog and devil take the hindmost.....
Those that can still support their lifestyle do so with little regard for those who are destitute.
We look down on these beings as failures and somewhat less than ourselves....so it will be easy to ostracize them further....But I am sure we all have felt the hot breath of the social juggernaught on the backs of our necks as we ran pell mell just to stay a little bit ahead........One slip, one months unemployment can dig a hole no working man can fill sometimes....
Its no wonder we have a drug and alchohol abuse problem.....its almost a given....and id be willing to bet you the computer models show the bosses, just what to expect from people when they are driven beyond their stress ceiling...
Its all been predicted and planned for.....the controllers are re engineering humanity into something far less than human....


It's BEEN ILLEGAL to be a homeless person. Columbia SC was the first to put it out there, but just the laws being passed the last ten years let the country know that. Sad thing is, with the economy tanking the majority of the population will experience homelessness before they die. And yes, S&F for Those that can still support their lifestyle do so with little regard for those who are destitute. Sad thing is, they are one or two steps from the same fate and choose to ignore it. Survival distracts people from paying attention to the hologram that is this existence.


originally posted by: Xcouncil=wisdom
Finally!

I do think the homeless should be given a choice in the form of help they receive
If they want to work (many who I have met prefer handouts) then put them in the job programs

If they want a free ride then they should get two choices
A camp outside of the big city with their basic needs taken care of
The supplies needed and access to the large public forest land that has been set aside for undomesticated wildlife

I myself am about to apply to the later option, this place is crazy these days

x


Why not just bring back prevailing wage employment, force the governmenet to deal with its citizens born and bred, and rebuild our economy through manufacturing and labor versus digital and virtual desk jobs. Then the homeless population would significantly shrink 8 fold.


originally posted by: AphoticJoe
a reply to: ArchPlayer

Interesting article, thank your for the link and topic.

Some people save up for half or more of their lifetimes to vacation in such places. They want before they get old, reach obsolescence vis-à-vis a chance brush with the hedonistic or die, to experience paradise on Earth beneath palm trees rustling to a tropical breeze. Resort owners, travel agents, and the rest of the tourism industries make a killing on their dreams. Dreams the homeless (the poor) never showed up in; dreams their unclean persons would surely despoil.

Too bad.

This article simply highlights another example the plutocratic manifest destiny entitlement of the haves over the have nots--at any expense. It mustbe the right of the wealthy to accumulate further billions by luring the working poor or middle class on the vacation of lifetime! Who are these homeless subhumans to interfere with that kind of fantasy and wealth accumulation? Who are they? Why should anyone care?

You should. That's who.

I've existed on so many ends of society. The one constant no matter my station in life: the inability of the majority of Americans (I've encountered) to empathize with each other because of stereotyped hype and or ignorance and apathy: the racial, cultural, religious, social class, language, physical fitness level ... difference. Because someone is different, less successful, perceived as less valuable to the Machine; then they must suffer because sense of superiority says so.

To the segment that espouses the line: some people just aren't equal to others, born equal, etc. I can only respond: figure out quickly which segment of society classifies you as less than their equal, and hope they do not one day relocate you to a former trash dump.

Eloquently put. I'm putting this on the original OP if I Can.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:56 PM
link   

originally posted by: ArchPlayer

originally posted by: rbkruspe


Living in a cardboard box or tent is better than living in a homeless facility controlled and dicated by a group of city administrators that don't give a damn and let the place go to pot. See most homeless shelters for more information. At least in the box or tent you are free, you are not being held captive, or dictated to with the craziest curfew hours that prevent you from seeking adequate employment. Some shelters make people leave at 5am. But you have to be already checked in by 9am and can't leave. What the hell is that? People are still adults. This is one step from a jail system. As a person that has never been in the situation you really just don't know how fcked up it is out there. Derison and resentment come in many different forms and I'm here to tell you most homeless folk do not look at others like that. They are too busy surviving the war to engage those types of thoughts.
And again, no one just goes around and craps the floor unless they got a mental problem. Most people are so conditioned to a toilet it is a hardship for them to go without it.


I'm sorry you experienced homelessness. I know that the obvious solution to preventing homelessness for most people is a living wage, universal healthcare, and adequate low-cost housing, etc. but what, in your opinion, is the solution to dealing with the serious addicts/alcoholics, mentally ill who are homeless? In your experience, what percentage of the homeless that you encountered were in those categories?
edit on 11-9-2014 by Tangerine because: I don't know why this showed up as a quote from someone else. I wrote it.



posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 03:59 PM
link   

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: stirling
Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....


Where is it illegal to be homeless? Cite the law to which you refer. I don't know why people make wild claims and think no one will challenge them.


Anytime you live in a society that is going to forcibly remove you and tell you where you can or cannot go, where if you sit down or lay too long in one place you are harassed - any homeless person will tell you cops harass them and specifically target them regardless of doing anything, especially if they go to barnes and noble, the library, anywhere just to get a break from the elements, its illegal by another name.


originally posted by: Stormdancer777

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: ArchPlayer




Movng them to a toxic waste dump? What's next, killing them???

Pardon me?
Where does the article you quoted say that the homeless facility would be at a toxic waste dump?

www.kitv.com...


HI Phage, nice to see you

That doesn't look to bad to me,


If you are referring to the toxic waste dump...go live there for two months and tell us how your experience was.


originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: stirling
Its now illegal to be a homeless person......that's the upshot of the matter.....


Where is it illegal to be homeless? Cite the law to which you refer. I don't know why people make wild claims and think no one will challenge them.


Google is your friend...

money.cnn.com...


www.la.unm.edu...


Here's a quote from one of the articles you cited, "Despite a lack of affordable housing and emergency shelter, many of these communities are implementing laws that ban homeless residents from sitting or lying down in public, loitering, sleeping in vehicles, and begging for money or food."

That's not a law that making it illegal to be homeless. I'll bet that law also bans you (I assume you're not homeless) from doing those things, too. I grant you that that law makes it extremely difficult to be homeless, however, I'll bet that it does not make it illegal for someone to sit on a park bench, for example. It probably makes it illegal to sit on one after a certain time of day. I'm sure you'll think the distinction is petty, but it's not.

There are two problems: (1) what to do with the currently homeless and (2) what to do to prevent homelessness.


Okay lets break this down. You're homeless, and live outside. You have no viable shelter indoors. If you are a brave soul that goes to the homeless shelter (and hopefully not raped, robbed, or infected with bedbugs) you're put out at 5am. What do you do ALL DAY when nothing is opened. NO money, can't go into dunkin donuts and sit a couple hours. Library opens at 10am.
Sit on a park bench, get arrested. That is illegal or not allowed, but they know you homeless and target you.
5am, no where to go, find some isolated spot to sit on, nope, loitering, get arrested. That is illegal or not allowed, but they know you homeless and target you.
Ain't ate in a week, no soup kitchen. Want to get change to buy a candy bar for 50 cents panhandling, no license, arrested. That is illegal or not allowed, but they know you homeless and target you.
Someone donates food to you, get caught, arrested. That is illegal or not allowed, but they know you homeless and target you and them.
You live in your car, and work, but can't afford a place to stay. Or like the Dunkin Donuts chick, work 4 jobs and sleep in the car in between time. You get caught, arrested, car impounded. That is illegal or not allowed, but they know you homeless and target you.
SO here we have laws in place that prohibit your right to travel, rest, and overall just be. Sounds illegal to me, by a different name.
The 2 problems are what is the country going to do with the homeless population that exists now, and what is the country going to do with the homeless population that is forthcoming and one paycheck away.




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