It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

How Can Jesus Be God?

page: 9
20
<< 6  7  8    10  11 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 01:24 AM
link   
a reply to: ParasuvO

Source?




posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 01:31 AM
link   
a reply to: OptimusSubprime

You stated that Jesus is Jehovah; so tell me how Jesus is the Father of himself?

This is highly illogical - and goes against the Scriptures, which define God Almighty as the Father of the Son.

God Almighty existed before Creation, and yet the Son was the first-born in Creation [Colossians 1:15], so they can't be the same identity. God SPOKE creation into being, so the first thing out of God's mouth (so to speak), was His WORD.

Hence John 1:1, which if you take it as describing, in reverse, the process of speaking, you have: the Son being part of God, then with God, and then as, the Word of God.

Also, this would explain how 'before Abraham, I AM'. Note: he specifically qualified the 'I AM', with 'before Abraham'.

There's so much more...



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 01:45 AM
link   

originally posted by: Maigret
a reply to: OptimusSubprime

You stated that Jesus is Jehovah; so tell me how Jesus is the Father of himself?

This is highly illogical - and goes against the Scriptures, which define God Almighty as the Father of the Son.

God Almighty existed before Creation, and yet the Son was the first-born in Creation [Colossians 1:15], so they can't be the same identity. God SPOKE creation into being, so the first thing out of God's mouth (so to speak), was His WORD.

Hence John 1:1, which if you take it as describing, in reverse, the process of speaking, you have: the Son being part of God, then with God, and then as, the Word of God.

Also, this would explain how 'before Abraham, I AM'. Note: he specifically qualified the 'I AM', with 'before Abraham'.

There's so much more...


If you're looking for logic in myths, you won't find it. Quoting a myth in attempt to find logic is the ultimate in illogic.



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 02:26 AM
link   

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Logarock

The anti-christ isn't a demi-god. The anti-christ, rather an anti-christ is just a description of someone who is against Christ. It could mean anything from someone who isn't Christian to someone who directly opposes christianity. But at no times is anti-christ a singular entity. There are many, and even the bible says that there are many.

John 2:18
"Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time."



BTW This quote is from 1 John 2:18 for anyone trying to look it up.

If you read the whole verse, instead of just picking up antichrists (plural), you should pick up on 'that antichrist' (singular) - and 'there will be many antichrists' [images made of the Beast - Revelation 13:14 & 15 Also Matthew 24:5 & 24 - yet verse 26 shows 'he' as singular!] , and this is how we will know it is 'the last time' or 'end of the age', 'latter days, or end times.

The false Christ stands in place of the true Messiah - and is worshipped as God. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4, et al.

Hmmm... seems to be what we're discussing here.



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 02:29 AM
link   

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: Maigret
a reply to: OptimusSubprime

You stated that Jesus is Jehovah; so tell me how Jesus is the Father of himself?

This is highly illogical - and goes against the Scriptures, which define God Almighty as the Father of the Son.

God Almighty existed before Creation, and yet the Son was the first-born in Creation [Colossians 1:15], so they can't be the same identity. God SPOKE creation into being, so the first thing out of God's mouth (so to speak), was His WORD.

Hence John 1:1, which if you take it as describing, in reverse, the process of speaking, you have: the Son being part of God, then with God, and then as, the Word of God.

Also, this would explain how 'before Abraham, I AM'. Note: he specifically qualified the 'I AM', with 'before Abraham'.

There's so much more...


If you're looking for logic in myths, you won't find it. Quoting a myth in attempt to find logic is the ultimate in illogic.


Huh? The Bible - a myth? Nah... you have to be kidding me! That's your whole argument? And you 'think' that is logic?



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 02:39 AM
link   

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Because no man could, nor even would do what Jesus did.



Of course, people can do what the Son did - and according to his words, even greater works than he did (John 14:12) - by the very same means that he used, which is the Power of the Holy Spirit of God - indwelling in him! The Holy Spirit being a part or portion of the essence or substance of God Himself.

John 14:12 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 03:02 AM
link   

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Michaelfunction

Indeed. If Jesus was God, how come he didn't know about, or teach about germs and cleanliness? He insisted that he didn't need to worry about washing his hands after "healing" sick people. Well, maybe not if he was God, but the rest of us need to wash our hands after being around sick people. Why didn't he tell us? How many years later did we learn about germs and sanitation? How many people died for ignorance?






The Son was not healing people by conventional means such as operations or sewing up open wounds.. he was healing supernaturally by the power of God's Holy Spirit - no hygiene was necessary!



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 03:24 AM
link   
a reply to: Maigret

I agree with you, as I should have been more accurate and said,
no man in his current state, would've laid down his life for us.
No man could've redeemed us. In that respect it would take
more than a man to carry out Gods plan.



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 05:38 AM
link   

originally posted by: Jobeycool
When you qoute the bible scripture you cannot use certain ones to fit your idealogical views.Both the old and new testament cleary prove what the Trinity means if you would read them all.

People make the God and Jesus trinity thing like it is some kind of crazy madness to figure out.YOu have God in the old teatamnet with the propehcts telling of a messiah.You have Jesus teaching about God the Father in the new testament.You also have Jesus in the new testament teaching about the Holy Ghost.

It is called a Trinity when you need 3 seperate idenities of anything.
Cannot know God the father unless Jesus teaches who God the ftaher is through the Son Jesus.You cannot know the Holy Ghost unless you have Jesus telling you His Spirit is with Us.You cannot know Jesus or the Holy Ghost if you do not have God the Father.
Same as a egg had 3 parts to complete one Egg.Yolk,White and Shell.


By the way,Trinity can mean 3 of anything.Mom ,Dad and Sons and Daughters=Trinity.

Teacher,Students,Audtorium can be a trinity.People make this thing into some kind of bizarre idealogical argument about my God is better than your God.

Jesus was teaching that His ways are how you get to God the Father through the Son who became the teacher and the spirit is the Holy Ghost.


The Torah is in the Bible. The Bible consist of two things: In English, the Bible for Christians has the Torah, which is the Old Testament, and the Injil which is the New Testament.

First of all, let me ask you a question, 'What language are we talking about? Did Jesus speak English?' One Christian said to me (one of those "got the Holy Ghost in him"), he said, "Of course He spoke English, He could speak anything, He's God, He speaks every language and animal language, and everything!" OK? Thank you, have a nice day. Rational argument? Number one, out the door. You can't talk to this guy, I’m serious, don't waste your time, let him go talk to the animals. Do they have the original book? If they do, they have hidden it very well because they are not telling anybody about it.

All the years that I was a Christian we discussed those things many times, I have many books, by many authors, Jewish and Christian and atheists. When I came to Islam I got more books by Muslims. There are no original documents anymore. But they used to get "Wahi" revelation, the same as it came to the Prophet (Peace and blessings be upon him) through angel Gabriel. They used to recite it, and this is known for the Jews that they use to do that. They use to write their scripture and bury it, then dig it up every so many years, and somebody would hold the book and they would recite to see how close they are still holding it together, i'm not joking that's what they used to do, but that was thousands of years ago.

When the Christian religion started up, they had books, but they were all destroyed. Everything was destroyed at the council of Nicaea. After that, nothing survived except certain books and some of those the church took out and put back in over the next thousand years. The book of Revelations is one of those books they took out and put back in, and took it out and took it back in. There are other books, when the Protestants broke off from the Catholic Church, that they threw out. Then there are more books that the orthodox have. Protestants have 66 books, Catholic 73 books, and Orthodox 78 books. Tell me which one is right? And then when you look at the verses, they don’t match.

Every hotel on this planet has got the King’s James version, it's put there beside the bed in the drawer, placed by the Gideon Society. You can go to 2nd Samuel, which is also 2nd Kings, you can read in there real clear in chapter 13-20, so many things that they do and did, Absalom the son of David and how he is having sex with his own father’s wife and things like that. We don’t have things like that in our book, we never have anything like that in the Quran. But that is where you will find all the stuff in there, many things you’ll find in there you would be surprised. Except nowhere in there you’ll find that says worship Allah alone without partners.

Can you imagine that when we read the Quran, could you read 7 chapters of the Quran and not read something about Allah? It's not possible, because the word "Allah" is on almost every page, in fact there are only 2 pages out of 604 pages that I found that didn't have the word "Allah" on it. And the other pages have it 5-10-20 times, so many times. Allah and Rabb and His names etc are all there.

coran vs bible
bible vs islam



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 05:40 AM
link   
www.bibleislam.com...

edit on 13-9-2014 by simo002 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 06:04 AM
link   
a reply to: ParasuvO




Take a step back from your body, a step back from the World, keep stepping back till you can activate enough of the remaining SOUL fields to see , and realize it is time to punish the very ones who proclaim to be the Saviors.


Or, you could take this approach from Matthew 5:

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Being perfect is taking the Neutral and Positive attitude. This is the same as the Strong Nuclear Force in nature. It is Proton (+) and Neutron together in invariant symmetry. If you are looking for God in the image, this is it. He is with the Son, together in unity. The Father is the neutral and the Son is the Positive. The electron is negative and does not seek unity and symmetry. Hate cannot dispel hate. Only love dispels hate. This is where God is found. He is among the meek.

By taking the negative, you become the electron. There were two thieves on either side of the Son of God on the cross. One became the proton and the other remained an electron. The truth is in the polarity we yield to.


edit on 13-9-2014 by AlephBet because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 06:37 AM
link   

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: Murgatroid

Can you explain the verses I shared then my friend...
Because they seem to tell a different story!!!



God was made manifest in the flesh. ~ 1 Timothy 3:16




For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. ~ Colossians 1:16-17




But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. ~ 1 Corinthians 8:6






all the verses selected are from the New Testament writings which were screened/culled to reinforce the Trinity that the 'Church' decreed was doctrine... I bet that many early Christian writings were excluded from the compiled 'Bible' because those authors did not call Jesus God, or make the human named Jesus 'the Word made flesh'...
An "out-of-sight" "out-of-mind" exercise in conditioning



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 10:13 AM
link   
Trying to explain the true nature of things to humans is like trying to explain Trigonometry to a 5 year old. No matter how you try to word it, a large majority of the message will be lost on them. And the parts they do 'understand' will be misinterpreted.

'God' is everything, actual and potential. Opposition is the perpetual motion 'engine' that propels the universe. Jesus was a great prophet, but he was a human being just like Ghandi and Lao Tsu and Martin Luther King Jr and Mohammad. They were trapped in human shells, just like you and I, and we are all God. The human brain can't wrap itself around the concept of infinity, so to compensate it tries to break things down into smaller, easier to understand tidbits. God becomes Jesus because it's easier to worship the concept of a person than the concept of infinity. God becomes 'He' and 'He' starts doing human things like smiting and forgiving and punishing and rewarding and protecting when really we are 'God' and we make our own niche in the universe and everything that happens we are doing to ourselves because it is necessary.

Hope this clears things up for you a bit, but ultimately it's impossible to comprehend and even more impossible to relate to someone else.




posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 10:16 AM
link   
And the Bible was written hundreds of years ago....by humans. Translated multiple times....by humans. Edited multiple times....by humans. So arguing specific wording in the Bible is pretty futile. And anyone who believes the Bible WORD FOR WORD has got a loooooooong way to go in their spiritual journey. And I'm not trying to be cocky, I will be the first to admit that I've got a long way to go myself.




posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 10:45 AM
link   
a reply to: Maigret




no hygiene was necessary


Bovine excrement! How many people subsequently died because Jesus pushed the issue of NOT washing hands at a time when people didn't know about hygiene!?

And when Christian missionaries were planting blankets, infected with small pox and influenza to native, first nation people, I suppose they justified it like you too, "no hygiene necessary "... God's will if the heathen people live or die.

Here's another extremely dangerous and irresponsible teaching, supposedly from Jesus, (God) too.


18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.


We hear of people dying because of this scripture all the time.



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 11:26 AM
link   
It will all make sense if you come into terms that you are already part of god. We are all separated into pieces of the main god (not capital G). Evil, misunderstanding, cancer and issues are our way of experiencing this reality. The whole purpose is to learn. We all start as one, we learn and then we all merge back into one taking every path that we have taken - everything that we have learned back.

There are continuously two choices available to you. You either choose the spiral up to learn from the current experience or if you choose to do nothing, you will fall into hell - choosing to do nothing about a situation. Of course you can also choose to make a situation worse by forcing it to spiral down. Hope this makes sense. The first choice is to learn something from the experience and move on. You cannot just sit around, the nature of the universe is for everything to degrade to force you into a situation where you learn.

If you follow spirituality you will learn how to connect to the little g - god. The bigger G is too much information. "The constructors work for the translators". When I meditate I can connect to 1-God, 2-god- which is basically a much larger me and 3-guides. All three have different information for us. Jesus was part of the small g- god. He is a good translator between us and the big G. Makes it easier for us to communicate - that is all he is. Not to be worshipped. Our own g is the one to adore.

Once you know that we are all part of the same material that started and are just all parts that are confused temporarily - when we get back together all as one you will find how you have hurt someone else (another part of yourself).

so learn your lessons



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 02:11 PM
link   

originally posted by: Maigret

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: Maigret
a reply to: OptimusSubprime

You stated that Jesus is Jehovah; so tell me how Jesus is the Father of himself?

This is highly illogical - and goes against the Scriptures, which define God Almighty as the Father of the Son.

God Almighty existed before Creation, and yet the Son was the first-born in Creation [Colossians 1:15], so they can't be the same identity. God SPOKE creation into being, so the first thing out of God's mouth (so to speak), was His WORD.

Hence John 1:1, which if you take it as describing, in reverse, the process of speaking, you have: the Son being part of God, then with God, and then as, the Word of God.

Also, this would explain how 'before Abraham, I AM'. Note: he specifically qualified the 'I AM', with 'before Abraham'.

There's so much more...


If you're looking for logic in myths, you won't find it. Quoting a myth in attempt to find logic is the ultimate in illogic.


Huh? The Bible - a myth? Nah... you have to be kidding me! That's your whole argument? And you 'think' that is logic?


If it's not myth, what is it? It's certainly not fact. Let's start with the Bible's foundational claims: (1) God exists. (2) God created everything. (3) Jesus lived. (4) Jesus is a supernatural deity. There's not an iota of testable evidence proving any of those claims of fact. Therefore, they are not fact. All stories about supernatural deities are myths. That's the definition of myth used by mythologists. If you wish to dispute that the Bible is myth, cite the testable evidence that proves those four foundational claims.



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 02:46 PM
link   
a reply to: sheepslayer247

The trinity was just made up to help early christian belief be accepted by the masses , it made the new religion familiar. Same with christmas , easter and such , old festivals renamed for the new religion. Early on in the formation of the christian belief , people jazzed up the doings of Jesus so that the belief would be more attractive , just read the earliest gospel : Mark , then compare it to the others , the contrast being the later gospels making more of the miracles performed than Mark. I realize any religion is full of clutter in the form of myth and erroneous beliefs injected into the dogma and that is why I reject any religion at face value. Also I believe that Jesus never claimed any divinity and even the son of God moniker attached to him was claimed by others.



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 02:49 PM
link   
a reply to: Tangerine

Jesus has been raised from the dead, is invisible, immortal and eternal.. just as the New Testament declares.

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life John5



posted on Sep, 13 2014 @ 04:29 PM
link   

originally posted by: Rustami
a reply to: Tangerine

Jesus has been raised from the dead, is invisible, immortal and eternal.. just as the New Testament declares.

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life John5


I notice that you are unable to cite an iota of testable evidence proving your bizarre claim. No evidence=no fact.



new topics

top topics



 
20
<< 6  7  8    10  11 >>

log in

join