posted on Sep, 10 2014 @ 11:15 PM
Here's the thing about the bible:
Everything written in it has been translated and retranslated from many different languages and back again. So, even if it 'had been' the
literal, inspired (direct from God to scribe), which many Christians (not all, please remember) insist it to be - the reality is that, because
languages simply do not translate 'literally', the ideas within can only be approximations of the original material...
This is why people need to read it closely (and with an eye toward 'what makes sense' contextually) for themselves, instead of relying on what
anyone else claims it says.
Now, as far as "The Lord's Prayer", you need to understand that, even if we were to take it literally, the context in which it is written is not
that He is 'praying' that prayer at the time. What has happened is that one of the disciples has just asked Jesus, "Lord how should we
pray?"...So, He is giving an example of a 'good' prayer...
As to the question about how Jesus can be both 'himself' and God, (for what it's worth) I'll give you my take - sorry it's going to be long, I
hope you'll bear with me:
(Keep in mind, I don't know if I'm a "Christian" or not, as my 'Faith' is based on nearly 50 years of: open-minded research into all Religions,
much contemplation over spiritual ideas and ideals, and continual pondering over 'what makes sense' to me as to what the nature of God 'might'
First, consider the idea of a being of pure, formless consciousness - all alone in 'its' existence, who (for whatever reason, boredom maybe?)
decides to create 'creation', and does so in exactly the 'way' that science is discovering the universe to be 'evolving'...I mean, He (let's
say "He" for lack of a better pronoun) has all eternity to do it, so why not just start off with a (big) bang and watch how things unfold...
----- Fast forward to the beginning of man's self-awareness, the development of 'the spiritual' within him (inexplicable though it is), the rise of
civilization, and on up to the time of Abraham ----
At this point 'God' has been passing the time watching various 'peoples' worship the various gods they've come up with, and suddenly (for
whatever reason, loneliness?) He decides he'd like to interact with some of them, so He chooses a guy named Abraham (perhaps because Abraham has a
particularly 'spiritual' nature?), and includes everyone willing to believe in the 'God' that Abraham has developed a 'relationship' with...Et
voila - the beginning of Judaism.
(Fast forward thru all the 'stuff' that may or may not (probably it's a mix) have happened in the Old Testament)
Now, after thousands of years of 'getting to know' these people, God realizes (due to all their violence, bloodshed, and various 'inhumane'
behavior toward their fellow man/women) that they just really do not 'get' Him...
His 'intention', whether all along or arising over time', is that people relate to each other as He wishes to relate to them - in a relationship of
loving-kindness, like family, with God as Father...
The problem is that by this point, 'His' people are utterly attached to the religious dogma and "Laws" which have evolved over the millennia into
a form of 'worship' which is neither about 'relationship' or love - thus, they have no concept of 'who' their 'God' truly is (in other words,
they have no concept of the 'Love' that God 'is').
Now, we get to Jesus...and it is very important to understand that the 'Jesus' I am talking about is not the guy that militant, fundamentalist,
dogma ridden 'so-called christians' proselytize about...The Jesus I am talking about is the unconditionally loving, nonjudgmental, forgiving person
who is found in the heart's translation of the bible - not in the 'literal' translation the 'un'christians tend to quote.
So, we have God, who wants humanity (not just the Jewish people) to know Him as the Love that He is and to 'relate' to Him and each other with love.
The problem is that now, things are way different then they were in Abraham's (and Moses', etc.) days...See, the Jewish people are so indoctrinated
with 'The Law' as their religion that they have lost touch with 'the spiritual' within them, and since God is a totally spiritual being (formless
consciousness), it isn't possible for them to 'relate' to Him in a way that would enable them to be in communication with Him, so how can He tell
them they've got Him all wrong?
Unless...He becomes one of them. This is where it gets tricky, and you really have to find the 'insightful' part of your mind, the part that can
understand 'more' than mere words can express...
Okay...So, God can't just 'possess' some guy and start telling people who He is and how they should love each other, because no one would buy
it...Even if they believed the guy really was God, it wouldn't be enough. What good is it just telling people you love them (and no, giving people
everything they want - being 'Santa Claus' God - is not what 'Love' is) In order to comprehend God's Love for them, people would need to see that
He could empathize with them, that He could 'relate' to who they 'are'...
...This is why God would have 'incarnated' as a complete - wholly 'Himself', yet fully human - individual 'person', right from birth, with all
the trappings, trials, and tribulations inherent to the human condition...so human beings could 'relate' to Him in trust that He was able to
'relate' to them...
Of course, this still begs the question: How can Jesus be 'both' Himself (the son of God) and God the Father?
Have you ever had the kind of dream where you are both experiencing what is happening and 'watching yourself' experiencing it?
It's kind of like that - but not...
(Please keep in mind, this is all conjecture on my part - I am describing the concept in the way that I, personally, came to in pondering over it all
and working out a possibility that makes sense to 'me', and part of the 'making sense' is intuitive...I mean - I know what 'I' mean but there
aren't words to fully convey it)
Somewhere in the thread someone posted something about how since God is 'all spirit', He can be everywhere...So, it follows that He can 'be' both
Himself and 'lesser' than Himself at the same time, and being 'The Creator', He can also 'be'/have more than one perspective at the same
Kind of like when you play a video game where you 'see' out of your avatar's eyes, and at the same time (if the game has a split screen element)
you see everything happening 'from the outside', watching the avatar moving thru the game...
--------Okay...All done (been writing for 3 hours now) I'm really, really sorry this got so long - if you've made it all the way to the end, I hope
you found some worth in it...