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Fagging and Paedophilia amongst the UK Elite

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posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 01:47 PM
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Warning - This may be pretty mature reading in parts.

Fagging will no doubt be a familiar term to folk of a certain age from Britain, but perhaps not so much to other readers here - it was a very uncomfortable feature of many books and films about the early years of boys from rich and powerful families.

It is was a traditional, overt and well established process whereby the younger boys in top (and highly expensive) Boarding Schools would act as servants to more senior boys, thereby earning the younger boy who was typically around 10 to 12 years old the title of "Fag" and the older boy who may be 17 or 18 the title of "Fag-Master".

While the Fag was the general servant, gofer and dogsbody, the Fag-Master was responsible for protecting his Fag from harm or exploitation by other senior students as well as dealing with discipling the Fag and taking that responsibility away from the House-Master (an adult who would run the dormitory).



The duties undertaken by fags, the time taken, and their general treatment varied widely. Each school had its own tradition. Until circa 1900 a fag's duties included such humble tasks as blacking boots, brushing clothes and cooking breakfasts, and there was no limit as to hours. Later, fagging was restricted to such light tasks as running errands, bringing tea to the fag-masters' study and fagging at cricket or football. At many schools, fag-masters were expected to reward their fags for their efforts at the end of term by giving a monetary 'fag tip'.


source

So far, so weird....

There is naturally a lot more to this and it was a very sinister practice indeed.

For your delectation, a mild, recent dramatic portrayal



Now i'm sure we can all see where this is about to go wrong - Boys, Power, Bullying and Sex.

Boarding Schools were single sex and if i may make a personal judgement, no doubt had a great many boys brought up to believe that they would rule the nation and indeed large parts of the world, that they were better than others and the "The Rules" did not apply to them, being from the ruling classes as they often were.

Unsurprisingly, in many accounts sexual abuse was a common part of the fagging process.

I came across a page which has some information on this. I warn readers that it is from a site about what it terms "boylove" - i have only read this page and their home page and wish to look no further. No pornography is present though plenty of apologism is, but i feel that some of the detail here is relevant. I have chosen not to link the site i quoted from.



The English public (that is, private) school has been the exemplar boarding school in this aspect. The “prefect-fagging” system in particular, formally established by Thomas Arnold in order to enhance “character building”, quite accidentally, facilitated this bond between older and younger students. Under the prefect-fagging system senior boys (“prefects”, ages 17-18) “were given a major role in governing the school, wielding discipline, and carrying responsibility” while new boys (“fags”, ages 12-13), were appointed as servants to the prefects (Nash 1961). Their duties consisted “of almost anything” prefects cared to impose, from running errands, carrying messages, cooking, blacking shoes, kindling fires, warming beds and toilet seats, to sexual favours (Nash 1961; Wakeford 1969; Gathome-Hardy 1977; Chandos 1984; Hickson 1992). Fags were chosen among the “cutest” young boys and senior students often made “top 10” lists of the best looking ones. Cute boys were given feminine nicknames and, in cases where they welcomed the “attentions” of older boys, they were called “tarts” (Gathome-Hardy 1977; Chandos 1984; Hickson 1992). Prefects on the other hand, were chosen by teachers (“masters”) according to their performance in sports (“games”) which were highly idealized by younger boys (Mangan 1981) while their leadership and academic skills were taken into account only secondarily (Wilkinson 1964; Wakeford 1969; Gathome-Hardy 1977; Chandos 1984; Hickson 1992).
Relationships between older and younger boys (or between prefects and fags) were sometimes chaste (see Edward Carpenter’s The intermediate sex), sometimes overtly sexual (see John Addington Symonds’ Memoirs) but always sentimentalized (Chandos 1984; Hickson 1992). In turn, this tradition led to the creation and proliferation of romantic public school novels (most notably The loom of youth (1917) and The hill (1905)) and Uranian poetry.


So these sexualised relationships between young pubescent boys and near grown young men were an institutionalised feature of the education of the British Ruling Class. Puts a few current events in context eh?

Well known DJ John Peel, posthumously accused of sexual abuse related that he was raped at his expensive school:



"If for some reason my tormentor didn't require a hand job, possibly because he had already compelled another small boy to give him one, he loaned me to one of his two friends and I was obliged to service them instead.
"This man - and although it is tempting to name him, I'm not going to - was, I think, the only genuinely amoral person I've ever met. Towards the end of our time together, he compelled me to agree to meet him in a public toilet in the cemetery on the outskirts of Shrewsbury, where he raped me. Oddly enough, much as I hated the experience, I think I had become so accustomed to systematic sexual abuse that I wasn't especially traumatised by the experience.


I also came across accounts by some prominent individuals from a Guardian article:



Peregrine Worsthorne

Writer and former editor, Sunday Telegraph

I think rapes certainly wouldn't have been called rapes. I have never been raped. There was a system of sexual favours [at Stowe], but they never happened with violence. A lot of buggery went on, and things in that area - but I don't think there was ever anything that brutal. These things are so difficult, and it's not unusual for people to exaggerate after the fact. In my view [the John Peel case] would have to be very much a one-off thing. There was a lot of homosexuality at certain periods in English public schools, but I've never heard of rape.


edit on 6-9-2014 by skalla because: added wikipedia source for quote

edit on 6-9-2014 by skalla because: typos




posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 01:47 PM
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a reply to: skalla

Continued:




Derek Malcolm

Film critic

That sort of thing was very widespread. Not particularly at Eton, but at the schools that prepared you for it. I remember at my prep school there was a music master who fiddled with the boys. He once sat me on his knee in front of a class - we were listening to Mendelssohn's Fingal's Cave - and he put his hand in my pocket and fiddled with me. In front of a class! And the other boys were actually laughing! We also used to have cold baths, and he would stand outside and tap each of us on the arse with a switch as we went in. There was another teacher, a good teacher and a very nice guy - he must have fiddled with somebody because he was suddenly expelled.

At Eton, if you were a fag master you chose the prettiest fag from among the lower boys. You just liked to have a pretty fag - I suppose it was a substitute for girls. The funny thing was, if you shagged one of the maids you were instantly expelled, but if you had anything to do with boys you got a severe ticking-off. And you hoped that by the end of your career at Eton you didn't turn out to be gay. Eton produced a lot of people who had John Peel's experience - mutual masturbation and all that sort of thing - but nobody was raped in my day.

Francis Wheen

Writer

I wasn't raped at Harrow, though oddly, long after I left, I noticed that various masters and ex-masters were being done for paedophilia. We had fagging at Harrow, but when I was a fag I was never propositioned. I'd love to pretend I knew about these things, but I didn't. I ran away at 16, but for entirely different reasons.

At my prep school, Copthorne, there was a fair bit of leaping in and out of beds in dormitaries, comparing notes, and general exploration. I was sexually molested by a gym master called Charles Napier, who was always putting his hand down boys' gym shorts. He eventually attained the giddy heights of a treasurer of the Paedophile Information Exchange. The only thing I can remember from Harrow is a story about a veteran physics master who, according to legend, found a couple of boys doing something in his house, and said, "I don't mind mutual masturbation, but I draw the line at buggery." It was quoted from time to time as a bit of an accepted rule.




So sexualised relationships between barely pubescent boys and almost grown young men were an institutionalised part of the Education of the British Ruling Class.

Was this an emulation of Ancient Greek Practice, which was seen as quite normal at the time? It is far too sinister and related to the exploitation of power for me.

Like many others here, i believe that there is a paedophile conspiracy at the very top of British society, though i do not know the exact reasons for it, but here, for certain is the mechanic that perpetuates it - it is well known that many who are abused are damaged to the point that they become abusers themselves.

This has been a dark piece to write and i feel pretty grimy. Have some light comedic relief to brighten the tone:



Thoughts, ATS?



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:19 PM
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I went to (boys) boarding school in the 90's and this definitely did'nt happen, and it was a very posh school in the middle of no where - the bigger danger to young boys was the teachers to be honest.

Sure there was bullying, as there always is in every school, but certainly no 'fagging'. There may have been a few boys now and then that might fool around, but it was on even terms as far as i can gather. I could be wrong about that, its all private stuff really.


+6 more 
posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:22 PM
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a reply to: skalla


Thoughts, ATS?


Yes, remove the vid that makes a joke of this!
The very reason such tv programs are created is to make people laugh when they ought to be angry.


+13 more 
posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:29 PM
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a reply to: VoidHawk

Not happening, for me a little dark or so called inappropriate humour can work wonders. If you think i wrote this to make light of the subject then you didn't read it and must have rocks in your head.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:32 PM
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originally posted by: skalla
a reply to: VoidHawk

Not happening, for me a little dark or so called inappropriate humour can work wonders. If you think i wrote this to make light of the subject then you didn't read it and must have rocks in your head.


Actually I read it all, and yes I do think thats why you wrote it, the evidence is the vid in your post!


+17 more 
posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:37 PM
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originally posted by: VoidHawk

originally posted by: skalla
a reply to: VoidHawk

Not happening, for me a little dark or so called inappropriate humour can work wonders. If you think i wrote this to make light of the subject then you didn't read it and must have rocks in your head.


Actually I read it all, and yes I do think thats why you wrote it, the evidence is the vid in your post!


I worked in Child Protection for a decade and have done more to help the victims of child abuse than many here, your assertion is pretty filthy.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:39 PM
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This sort of thing happens up and down the social spectrum - not sure what the point is of the thread, really.

In the top end schools, we might have older boys abusing younger ones, while in the inner city where kids can barely read and sell drugs, the older boys sexually abuse the younger members of their group, while in between we have cases like Rotherham, the Church or teachers shagging pupils.

My point being, this is simply the darker side of human nature - those in a position of power, if so inclined, are likely to abuse those below them, ranging from mental torment, to physical assault right the way through to a full blown rape. Singling out the "elite" (I hate that term) is a bit disingenuous - humans as a whole are a sick, twisted bunch.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:43 PM
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Very, very true. I think your wrong though in your statement that there is a paedophile conspiracy in the top echelon of the establishment. I believe it's not a conspiracy but a fact. The conspiracy is the actions to cover it up. The furore seems to be more about the outing of the perpetrators than to the victims of their actions. THAT is where the shame aught to lie with the with the appropriate authorities.
edit on 6-9-2014 by crayzeed because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:45 PM
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a reply to: stumason
Star...But thank God you never said..Humans ON the Whole are a sick and twisted bunch,


+4 more 
posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:45 PM
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a reply to: stumason

Child abuse does indeed transcend class, but considering the current suggestion that there is a circle of paedophiles at the top of the British Establishment, I felt that this may add to the debate.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:46 PM
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originally posted by: skalla

originally posted by: VoidHawk

originally posted by: skalla
a reply to: VoidHawk

Not happening, for me a little dark or so called inappropriate humour can work wonders. If you think i wrote this to make light of the subject then you didn't read it and must have rocks in your head.


Actually I read it all, and yes I do think thats why you wrote it, the evidence is the vid in your post!


I worked in Child Protection for a decade and have done more to help the victims of child abuse than many here, your assertion is pretty filthy.


Your entire op is really just creating an excuse for those involved in abuse, and you end your op with a vid making jokes about the abuse!
And because I object you tell me I've got rocks in my head and I'm making filthy assertions.

I advise anyone reading this thread to think carefully!


+29 more 
posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:55 PM
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a reply to: VoidHawk
Stop bitching about the light-hearted vid for #s sake, the thrust of Skalla's post is pretty valid and worth consideration. Sexual abuse being accepted and ignored in boarding schools.
Never went to one myself, just a rough as # mixed comprehensive in a rough council estate, but the OP is interesting and all you appear to be doing is derail from the topic.

...I see you do it often in many threads, snarky one liners gaining stars but not contributing to the conversation. Give it a rest FFS, stick to the topic and stop being lame and derailing.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 02:58 PM
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a reply to: skalla

Agreed, in that context I suppose you're right. But there are circles of deviants everywhere.

I'd also take this opportunity to point out that abusing pubescent children does not make you a paedophile - it makes you a sick puppy, but shagging 13-14 year old girls/boys is not paedophilia. It's a term used a lot when not always accurate.


+3 more 
posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: VoidHawk

I'm actually suggesting that there was an institutionalised system created to bring the next generation of the ruling class in to this abusive behaviour. If you see me as an apologist then you have me very wrong indeed.

It is my belief that the reason for this may have been as a method of control. Child abuse is of course appaling and recognised as such and creating influential people who have a perversion that you can publicly out them for and shame or prosecute them becuse of, gives those even higher up the ladder than them a lot of control.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 03:07 PM
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a reply to: stumason

Yes, Ephebophilia (sp? On phone atm so a PITA to check) is possibly a more accurate term for both the behaviour described here, and many of the behaviours currently being discussed for members of the British media set and Political Establishment. I feel that the overall point is unchanged though and the term paedophilia is commonly used as a catch all term nowadays and more widely understood and accessible to readers.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 03:09 PM
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a reply to: skalla
I totally see the implication, learn the pecking order while in the fast-stream towards positions of power.
Comply when you are a minion, then control when you become the alpha.
If this is a common practice in some boarding schools then it certainly adds an explanation for why people of such a background may find it easier to dehumanise and abuse 'minions'.
Tragic if this is the case.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: skalla

Most forms of abuse are to exert control, aren't they? And those who were abused as youngsters, when they move up the ladder, are likely to continue that abuse to those who are now in the position they once where, as it is "their turn".

We used to do that at our school - the Year 7's get the beatings, get bullied, get bossed around but when you move up the school years, it happens less until, when you're at the top of the school tree, you're doing the same thing to those new Year 7's who have just started. Not that I am saying we buggered them, or made them give us handjobs but I did know of a few occasions where some older boys would do some very strange things to younger boys sometimes.



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 03:17 PM
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a reply to: stumason

a reply to: grainofsand

This is part of the point I am making, perhaps I was not obvious enough about this for some others and should have used caps and shouted about how much I hate paediatricians. Oh well



posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 03:22 PM
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a reply to: skalla

Why single out the "British ruling class" when it's quite
obviousLy the ruling class the world over. It really is hard
to imagine a decent human being among them. You know
what makes a human being decent?



edit on Rpm90614v342014u55 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



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