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Here’s How the Price of Your Favorite Fast Food Would Change With a $15 Minimum Wage

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posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:02 PM
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Wait.. so you're saying if minimum wage in the USA goes up, the prices will rise to what every other country on Earth pays with less valuable dollars? I'd be all over that.




posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:15 PM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Quite easy to do.


In the past decade minimum wage has declined in value by 50%. Our economy has continually gotten worse the entire time. If what you say is true, then the opposite, that the economy will improve when minimum wage goes down must also be true. Why is it that the strongest economies on the planet both now, and historically have involved high minimum wages?

As for the article you linked, in 1955 minimum wage could fully pay for college out of pocket and a home mortgage AT THE SAME TIME. While doing this you could also eat like a king.

Were prices out of control back then?

What you suggest is not basic economics. Basic economics states that when more people have purchasing power, more people act as consumers throughout the economy. This creates more need for goods which fuels job creation.

The minimum wage right now should be atleast $24/hour and that's just for it to have kept pace with inflation. You could even step back a bit and move away from when we owned the worlds manufacturing economy and peg it to $19/hour (this is the rate had it kept up with minimum wage in 1995). Asking for $15 is still a bad deal, and anything less is a complete insult to the employee.
edit on 7-9-2014 by Aazadan because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:16 PM
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Anyone know a website that has 10-20 year data on cost of living for various cities?



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:21 PM
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originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Quite easy to do.


In the past decade minimum wage has declined in value by 50%. Our economy has continually gotten worse the entire time. If what you say is true, then the opposite, that the economy will improve when minimum wage goes down must also be true. Why is it that the strongest economies on the planet both now, and historically have involved high minimum wages?

As for the article you linked, in 1955 minimum wage could fully pay for college out of pocket and a home mortgage AT THE SAME TIME. While doing this you could also eat like a king.

Were prices out of control back then?

What you suggest is not basic economics. Basic economics states that when more people have purchasing power, more people act as consumers throughout the economy. This creates more need for goods which fuels job creation.

Is the world and our economy the same today as it was in 1955? No? Then what does it possibly have to do with each other?

Purchasing power is not increased, it's redistributed. You are taking purchasing power away from the middle class and giving it to lower class workers. When the price of all goods increases along with wages then purchasing power per dollar decreases.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:22 PM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Anyone know a website that has 10-20 year data on cost of living for various cities?


The problem with the data is it's calculated from CPI which doesn't track equal goods. Furthermore no one knows exactly what it tracks because it's a secret process that uses secret formulas. However we do know it doesn't track inflation, rather it tracks the change in price of consumer purchasing habits. Shopping at Krogers and switching to Walmart where you pay less for goods and buy fewer goods to save money registers in CPI (and our official inflation rate) as deflation because spending decreased.

Anyways for what you asked, these are tracking ratios in cost of living between cities
2010
www.infoplease.com...
2005
www.infoplease.com...



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:27 PM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Is the world and our economy the same today as it was in 1955? No? Then what does it possibly have to do with each other?

Purchasing power is not increased, it's redistributed. You are taking purchasing power away from the middle class and giving it to lower class workers. When the price of all goods increases along with wages then purchasing power per dollar decreases.


Purchasing power doesn't redistribute the same way. The rich consume more but they don't consume proportionally more. One person who makes 100,000,000 doesn't consume 100x what 100 people who make 1,000,000 do, and they don't consume 2000 times what people who make 50,000 do.

Increases in the minimum wage inherently mean shrinking the wealth gap which also means flattening consumption rates, this means those on the bottom of the income scale start consuming measurable amounts of goods while those at the top consume a little less.

The middle class actually do the best from a higher minimum wage. The middle class is most likely to start a business, when there are more potential customers there are more paying customers. In a society where only 10% of the population can afford your services, 90% of the population is automatically discarded as potential customers. When 100% of the population can afford your services however you get a much broader customer base which results in a higher volume of sales.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:30 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

I need back further than 2005. I need 2003 or earlier if possible.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:33 PM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Is the world and our economy the same today as it was in 1955? No? Then what does it possibly have to do with each other?


So you're discounting American economic history. As well as the economic present of areas of the world with higher minimum wages? Isn't this a bit like an ostrich putting their head in the sand to avoid the truth? If you're accepting that argument then aren't you essentially saying no one knows what will happen so lets not do it? You're putting supposition on a higher level than fact.

But as I said before, lets take the argument at face value. The numbers given in the very first page of this thread (which is meant to be an argument against increasing the wage) themselves say that prices will increase 37.5% while wages increase 100%. That's an increase in purchasing power among the poor of 46%.

That increased purchasing power means those people have more money for rent, food, and utilities which then shrinks the amount we have to pay on welfare, therefore lowering taxes.


originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: Aazadan

I need back further than 2005. I need 2003 or earlier if possible.


That I don't have offhand. There's ample studies of median wages and average prices but those are national averages and not area by area. Again, the only statistics I can think of for this that would be in a compiled database are CPI but that's not public information. The government argues those statistics can't be public because it would give businesses too much information to undercut each other on price.
edit on 7-9-2014 by Aazadan because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 08:44 PM
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a reply to: OccamsRazor04
Seriously, you're not very good at understanding simple requests, are you? He stated clearly that he had presented real world examples supporting his case, not hypotheticals. He requested you do the same, ie show places with higher minimum wages where the economy has suffered drastically as you claim the only possible result to be. You respond "ok..." and then spot off some made up hypothetical. Good job.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:06 PM
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a reply to: pexx421

You mean comparing us to 1955? Might as well compare us to 1755.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:12 PM
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a reply to: OccamsRazor04

That was one comparison. There were also comparisons to other current countries with higher minimum wages, states here with higher minimums, etc. I have yet to see any evidence presented of places with higher minimum wages and the drastic results you all predict. Because they don't exist, and all of your fear mongering is just rhetoric and corporate created talking points.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:14 PM
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And to add. You disparage his and our examples.....but like all the anti wage hikers on here, refuse to provide any examples of your own to support your side. Just hypothetical tales of doom and gloom which have never been borne out in the real world.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:38 PM
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a reply to: TDawgRex

Where in the hell can you still get a bigmac meal for five bucks and change? I don't trust this chart as far as I can throw my computer.

Simple math- take the number of meals they can make and sell per hour, divide the increase in dollars spent on wages by productivity. Assuming the worker now makes 7.50/hour, for a wage increase of an additional 7.50 to result in a price increase of 3.00 is effectively saying that the average fast food worker produces between 2 and three meals per hour. Nonsense.

They could keep prices where they are, cut late night hours, and reduce staffing redundancy. Skilled labor at a fair price, done. I just chased the natural gas boom to north Dakota, prices are roughly comparable to this chart and wages are better than 15/hr when you factor in hiring bonuses, and it's a windfall for franchise owners because they are gouging the crap out of the construction and gas workers. The only real effect is that it takes five minutes to get your food. This is what a good economy looks like. Everyone makes a living wage and only those making better than a living wage can consistently splurge on luxuries like fast food. It's doable, and it's fair. The only reason they can get away with charging less some places is because the working poor are on foodstamps and living in section 8 housing even in California where prices are already as high as this chart says. At least under a living wage you can not buy fast food and save your money. With low wages every tax payer gets gouged even if they don't go to McDonald's.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:39 PM
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originally posted by: pexx421
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

That was one comparison. There were also comparisons to other current countries with higher minimum wages, states here with higher minimums, etc. I have yet to see any evidence presented of places with higher minimum wages and the drastic results you all predict. Because they don't exist, and all of your fear mongering is just rhetoric and corporate created talking points.


Well I have already proven in other threads states with high minimum wages were slower to recover lost jobs after the 08 economic problems. That is not the point I am making now. What you are doing is comparing apples to oranges in order to prove strawberries are good. I am trying to show data but it's difficult finding the data which is why I asked for help in locating it.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:43 PM
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Oh no! It's going to cost me an extra dollar to clog my arteries! Make it stop! Their demand for a living wage is trampling my demand to fill by body with garbage! Wake up Americaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!1111111 1



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:43 PM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: pexx421

You mean comparing us to 1955? Might as well compare us to 1755.


1955 and 1967 were used because our golden age economically happened in the 50's and 60's, they also coincided with our higher minimum wages in terms of purchasing power. If you would prefer I could compare to 1981 which is notable as being the year before we changed how CPI is calculated to present a lower official inflation rate.

If you don't like that, how about we compare to 1995 which is well into the purchasing power decline of minimum wage, but still featured a wage with nearly triple the purchasing power of our current wage. Our economy seemed to be doing fine in the 90's.

This problem with declining wages didn't begin overnight and it can't be ended overnight. As I've said before our minimum wage at this point should be $24/hour, but even I don't believe we can just sign that into law overnight. Wages have to be built back up over time by a few percent per year (though we could do a one time small burst to start it off) just as they've been eroded by a few percent per year.

I think the problem is that you're viewing wages on a micro-economic level as to how they relate to any given business. Minimum wage however is a macro-economic issue.



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:48 PM
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The prices won't be that high. Why? Because there will just be one or two management types working to keep the automated food machines full.a reply to: TDawgRex



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:50 PM
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Notice how whenever the talk of raising wages gets mentioned the response is, "but then we'll have to raise prices..." and yet, when the price of gas goes up, nobody says, "but if we raise the price of gas, we'll have to increase everyone's wages so they can afford it."

edit on 7-9-2014 by spiritualzombie because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:53 PM
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Well ,I don't know about your other threads. But I do know for a fact that the state (Washington) with the highest wages and the city with the highest wages (San Fran)have consistently had the highest growth in business. Further, the rain for the 08 bust was the housing bubble and mortgage backed securities fraud by the banksters, which had nothing to do with wages, and which they are still perpetrating. a reply to: OccamsRazor04



posted on Sep, 7 2014 @ 09:54 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

What you are trying to do is show correlation and call it causation. Our economy was better and as a result wages and buying power was better. It's the same reason I am avoiding anything with 2008, because while I can get numbers to back me up, it's disingenuous. I still can't find cost of living info for 2000-2010 and it's annoying.




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