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Anti - Freemasonry

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posted on Jan, 23 2005 @ 08:08 PM
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also how can i except what they say as truth? I mean i have been talkin with people and most of what alot of there arguments are can be discredited just by using logic.




posted on Jan, 23 2005 @ 08:30 PM
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Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
sry but when most of the masons are on this sight are as ignorant as they are then i kinda have to question and try my hardest to discredit them.


Some "jewels" just need to preserved and displayed without comment.

Curator Monkeys, not just for the Crown Jewels anymore...



posted on Jan, 23 2005 @ 09:07 PM
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Originally posted by Mirthful Me

Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
sry but when most of the masons are on this sight are as ignorant as they are then i kinda have to question and try my hardest to discredit them.


Some "jewels" just need to preserved and displayed without comment.

Curator Monkeys, not just for the Crown Jewels anymore...


Doggone you, Mirth! You beat me to the punch again! ...and I've been worried about you lately.

...I'm also concerned (or is it konserrned?) about them ignert Masons...ain't you?



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 07:24 AM
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Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
also how can i except what they say as truth? I mean i have been talkin with people and most of what alot of there arguments are can be discredited just by using logic.


If you will not except the answers of those that are involved with Freemasonry why bother to ask a question.

You are getting answers from Masons from all around the world and the general answer is the same.

Do you know why I believe it to be true, because it is not exactly the same, Freemasonry is global and it is practised differently, even if only slight, everywhere. I have read through post after post on this site about the NWO, Skull and Bones, Freemasons and even reptilian master races, but the one thing I have noticed above all, is the mason's answers are different.

Nearly every conspiracy claim is a cut and paste from some where else, nealry word for word, and there are only about 8 different ones which are repeated over and over again. Which is probably why you get the impression of ignorance in some replies.

Every mason answers you personally in their own words.

You have to believe one or the other, your choice is it to be

1) an answer put in a person's own words, about their own understanding of a fraternity they actuall belong to and participate in

or

2) a friend of a friend who' uncle's dentist's daughter, who goes to school with a boy, who's father read blah blah blah which I found interesting so I have cut and paste the same article which I have not researched myself and you have already seen posted here, but not in the last 24 hours.

Again like I said, you have to believe one or the other and the choice is yours.



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 09:06 AM
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Originally posted by Bondi
2) a friend of a friend who' uncle's dentist's daughter, who goes to school with a boy, who's father read blah blah blah which I found interesting so I have cut and paste the same article which I have not researched myself and you have already seen posted here, but not in the last 24 hours.

Again like I said, you have to believe one or the other and the choice is yours.


what i dont get is how do you think that my info is that much bs as in the coment above? so im going to take the third option and just do what ive been doing. I research the topic and listen to both sides. that is where i get my info and that is what i believe!



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 10:07 AM
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Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
I research the topic and listen to both sides. that is where i get my info and that is what i believe!


You can research all you like. But if you question the credibility of those who are in a far better postion to research the same subject as yourself, you have to expect to be disagreed with.

Basically, all you have done is call the Freemasons here liars, when you state that their explanations are false. Do you really expect to be given big cuddles and covered in warm kisses for such an action? This is the real world dude. If you want to discuss a subject by making false statements and then get corrected by those who know better, don't go crying to mummy. Sure you can research. But make your mind up using logic and common sense. Not just "I lost an argument, so I'll disagree with them because they made me look stupid".



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
what i dont get is how do you think that my info is that much bs as in the coment above? so im going to take the third option and just do what ive been doing. I research the topic and listen to both sides. that is where i get my info and that is what i believe!


I have never said your info is BS.

The bit's I do not understand is the questions you have don't really make sense, in a researched argument point of view.

To give example, and reverse the situation. (no offense meant but see what tangible answer you can offer)

1) The church is a multi level organisation, with it's clergy and flock. No one is allowed access to every bit of scripture found to translate for themselves, so how can you be sure you know everything?

2) Just because a nice person hands you something on paper, don't believe everything in print, the bible is made up.

3) Okay you have talked to every Christian in the world and every member of clergy. Only then can you tell me there is nothing going on behind closed doors.

With regards to the wolf pack scenario, try the Conspiracy in Religion, you will find a similar scenario.

And as to try and discredit because you view something as ignorant, is ignorant in itself. You only discredit when you know something to be false.

As for how can you believe, easy rely on a source from the horses mouth.



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 09:34 AM
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how can i believe what comes from the horses mouth if they can not prove what they are saying? Show me some evidence!



posted on Jan, 25 2005 @ 11:04 AM
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Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
how can i believe what comes from the horses mouth if they can not prove what they are saying? Show me some evidence!


What evidence do you want?

If you make a claim, is it not up to you to prove it?
Or are you expecting those who disagree with your arguments to prove a negative? If so, maybe you should study up. As any logician with half a brain knows, it is impossible to prove a negative.

Your original claim in this thread is that masonic degrees denote rank. Would you care to prove that this is so?

[edit on 25-1-2005 by Leveller]



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 01:49 PM
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I just want some evidence that proves what all you are saying i dont whant your word or what you say. Every thing you say i can most likely do some digging and disprove it. This has nothing to do with ranking i get that now but every thing else i would like some evidence to back it up. Cause in todays world someones world even if they belong to the organization it still means nothing with out something to back it.

so every thing every one has been saying even what i have been saying means nothing without profe to back it!



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 02:50 PM
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Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
Every thing you say i can most likely do some digging and disprove it. T


Quite simply - No you can't.



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 04:14 PM
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very easily-yes i can!



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 05:46 PM
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Well then go ahead dude.
Let's see your "evidence" that Masonic degrees denote rank.

In fact, let's see the evidence for any of the claims that you want to make. I have the feeling that anything you provide will be pretty easy pickings.
As stated earler: you are the guy who makes the claims, therefore it is up to you to prove them.



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 06:39 PM
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ok i get the fact of degrees and stuff ! but still the stuff you all say the masons you guys dont give solid info either. all that you say is unproven!



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 06:55 PM
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It would be nice if you could give an example.
When confronted with misinformation, nearly all of the masons here at ATS try to tell the truth and supply all of the evidence that they can to promote that truth.
I can rarely think of an instance here where the opposite has happened. Because we know that many of the people that we are discussing Freemasonry with "demand" evidence, and the very fact that this is a conspiracy site, we try to give the most solid links to available information that we can.
If you read back though this forum, you will find that most of the Freemasons here use links to credible sources to back up their discussions.

And if you don't believe me, here is a link to prove my point.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Read the threads. I think that you'll find that you'll be suprised.



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 07:04 PM
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Aleister Crowley, the most evil man that ever was a 33rd degree mason.

[edit on 26-1-2005 by Shadow Ghost 7]



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 07:18 PM
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There may or may not be more significance to the 33rd Degree of the Scottish Rite, than many Masons claim; but please stop with the calling of, every significant person who's said to be a Mason, a "33rd Degree Mason".



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 07:23 PM
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BTW. I do agree that Aleister Crowley was "evil", meaning that his 'spiritual' practices would lead one into delusion and suffering; not enlightenment.



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 07:24 PM
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Originally posted by Tamahu
There may or may not be more significance to the 33rd Degree of the Scottish Rite, than many Masons claim;


There isn't.



but please stop with the calling of, every significant person who's said to be a Mason, a "33rd Degree Mason".


Oh if the whack-o Anti's would stop THAT! They love to claim that someone is a "33rd" so the average Mason who hasn't received that degree can't refute it. ....BUT the name of every Mason who has the 33rd degree conferred upon him is issued EVERY time the 33rd degree is conferred.

The most ridiculous part of Shady-ghost's most recent rambling is that Aleister Crowley was NOT A MASON AT ALL ... let alone a 33rd Scottish Rite Mason.

But, he can ramble on if he likes....and we'll keep shooting his nonesense down.



posted on Jan, 26 2005 @ 07:26 PM
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Originally posted by Tamahu
BTW. I do agree that Aleister Crowley was "evil", meaning that his 'spiritual' practices would lead one into delusion and suffering; not enlightenment.


...yet another reason he wasn't a Mason. Masons are taught to do GOOD...not evil...No matter what shady-spirit 9 (or whatever) and his ilk want to say about us.

An evil person would be pretty bored in our Lodges, our Chapters, our Councils, our Consistories....&c. &c.




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